I got burnt by this. My insider edition of Windows 10 refused to upgrade, so I did a clean upgrade, and now I'm stuck with a very limited Windows partition. I'll probably just wipe it -- I only used it for games anyways, and any game I care about is already on Linux or is coming to Linux soon (Witcher 3). I could reinstall my valid edition of XP, but Linux now has better game support than Windows XP.
I experienced something similar. I installed Insider on one partition. On launch day, I got it to upgrade to RTM. Thinking my machine was already activated, I did a clean install on another drive (SSD). When the installation completed, the one on that partition did not activate. To get it work, I took an image of the partition with the activated Windows 10, restored it on the SSD, rebooted and voila - it was activated. I then did a Windows reset on the SSD copy and it did reset with an activated status.
That's pretty much what I've come to. Linux is the way forward. Not Windows, and not Mac.
Most of my toolchain exists in Linux, and much of it is developed and tested in Linux before anywhere else. WINE allows most windows programs to run, and do so well. WINE plus X allows x tunneling like Citrix, but over ssh.
And if I need a Windows VM, I can spin one up relatively easily. Admittedly, I just get a recent TPB Win10 install with activation removed/emulated, so I can do whatever meager testing I need to do.
workwise, in many cases yes (mine included, it's even better!)
multimedia wise, NOK. most games somehow run != all games run without issue, 100% Win performance. for many devices drivers suck - not linux fault, but no user really cares.
It is definitely a case of "good enough," not "perfect." But Windows is not without its warts, so it's a question of which warts you are willing to put up with.
I've currently got the technical preview on an old Macbook Pro. Only used it for flashing an SD card for IoT core insider preview. I've since discovered a better way [0] but I'll probably upgrade to the public release once it's bedded in a bit.
The hardest part was convincing Boot Camp that it would install fine. Took a bit of trickery. Can write up if anyone is interested?
This article came exactly 1 day too late for me - I literally just blew away one of our test machines yesterday morning, only to find I can't activate it unless I re-install Windows 7. To make matters more fun I chucked the Win7 install disk in the trash thinking, I won't need this again!
This is why I always bought a full copy of Windows; because having to install the previous version in order to install the current version is bullshit.
Are you saying that Linux has the facilities for supporting more games now than Windows XP or do you mean that Linux has more games than Windows XP had?
Someone here yesterday stated that only about 15% of Steam games run on Linux. I'm not sure how accurate that is, but honestly even as a casual gamer I couldn't imagine having access to that low a percentage of games. If I were running games on Linux I would have missed out on Rocket League which is now probably one of my all-time favorite games.
So, I guess I just don't see the point of using Linux for games at all. The phrase "cutting of your nose to spite your face" comes to mind because I can't think of one reason that isn't purely ideological.
Anyway, the info about the Windows 10 upgrade has been out for some time. I managed to cleanly upgrade all of the machines that I wanted to without hassle.
1395 it says, but i could be searching incorrectly. My main point though is that I don't want to miss any of them, so I run whatever I want instead of limiting myself to one platform for ideological reasons. I love Linux, but just not for games and desktop stuff.
No, you are searching incorrectly because you didn't select "Games", just "Linux". If I do the same for Windows I get 13,112. So 2,629 is still only 20% of that.
We were discussing Linux numbers. Why would I select games for all systems? There's a neat drop-down at the top menu where you can select games for each category. You chose "Linux" AND "Linux/SteamOS", which artificially lowered the numbers. I'm not sure that was on purpose, but it was a rather convenient nerfing of the numbers.
Further, despite your attempt to move the goalposts, my original statement still stands: 50% of current releases have a Linux port.
You did say that "my numbers are old" after quoting your 50% number for a completely different statistic. So you moved the goal posts, not I.
But the search links speak for themselves, thanks. Not sure who you're trying to convince here.
(Thanks for putting your spin on it though - it's always entertaining to watch people twist numbers so that they sound good for their argument. 50% of current releases (probably of mostly crappy indie games) certainly sounds much better than 20% of existing titles.)
I guess I'd also like some evidence for your 50% number, which nobody has seen yet. Anyway - enjoy having half the games that I do because of your fanatical ideology!
Even with that, "about 15% of Steam games run on Linux" applies to the large, existing body of software on Steam. Many of those have been around for 10+ years.
Linux has more games I currently care about than Windows XP. That's a small list and doesn't consist of much more than Civ 5, Cities Skylines, Witcher 3. Witcher 3 doesn't run on XP.
Reasons to use Linux for gaming:
- I save $100 by not buying Windows
- I don't have to worry about administering two OS's
- I don't have to ever wait for Windows updates. I boot into Windows so infrequently that it upgrades pretty much every time I do so.
- I don't have to shut down all my work programs and windows that I have open in Linux to reboot into Windows
Frankly, it's the last one that's the biggie. My computer often has virtual desktops, windows, editors, VM's and browsers open for 3-5 different projects, and it's just annoying to start those up again.
They were doing that since XP's activation system. There are plenty of other things in Win10 that can be used by tracking and not only by MS but third parties too; as far as tracking concerns go, this is far down the list.
Windows 10 is all about being remotely patched and upgraded for the lifetime of the device, never having to install (or pay for) a new "big bang" upgrade, and never being left behind.
Which sounds like a good idea for a billion or so ordinary Windows users. Obviously there are plenty of geeks who will not like the idea of their PCs being remotely managed ;-)
Yeah, until a Microsoft update fries millions of computers into an unbootable state.
Search for "windows update" and "blue screen" or "boot loop" or crashing for numerous examples.
If microsoft would actually spend money and time (real time and serious testing, not a few months of continuous integration testing) rather that using that "good enough to release" philosophy, maybe there would be fewer open hanger doors for malware to fly through.
Yep, it's a big risk. (See reboot loop.) Nobody has attempted anything that big before....
Otherwise, I don't recall having a Windows Update problem recently -- certainly not this century -- and I haven't seen any malware either.
I'd be willing to bet that the malware problem will be significantly smaller with Microsoft doing the updating than it is at the moment, even though the majority of malware problems on Windows are down to human ignorance.
(I know I can run Windows 7 with no AV at all, and I'm certainly not the only one. I don't recommend it, but I have done it.)
Had microsfot paided the least attention to Dvorak back in the 80's, we might have been able to bypass all of those lovely "benefits" (read as "ugliness") that Mr' Gates's tight OS/App integration bestowed upon the DOS world.
I don't let MS do automatic anything on my windows box. I only use that box for a couple of apps, but when I need them, I really need them and can't afford to be blindsided by a box that won't boot.
I pick and choose the updates I apply and only then after they've been out in the wild for a month or so. I'm not going to let microsoft do any alpha/beta QA testing... errr... I meant "automatic updating," on my production box.
Refusing to install essential updates has cost some companies millions of dollars, conficker being just one example. I think it's better to install updates than not, and that someone who did the numbers could probably prove it.
Otherwise, real geeks keep backups that are tested as working. This is what separates the men from the boys.
FWIW I upgraded to windows 10 on my bootcamp partition 100% through vmware fusion using the official win10 iso.
I got the same error you linked until the latest rollup fix (which put my install into a boot loop due to nvidia geforce creating a phantom user but that's a whole different problem).
Once I installed the rollup it gave a different error and then took a day or two for the activation servers to finally work and activate the install. I only run windows natively to play games so it only runs for 2-3 hours at a time.
It took until yesterday to get it all sorted out. I installed win10 within a few hours of the iso going up.
Doing the same on Linux box with Windows 7: a partition with Linux and a partition with Windows 7 + NTFS partition for data that is visible on both. You can boot both systems or use the same Windows in a VM under Linux.
But it was tricky to build that VM. I followed instructions from [0], but don't remember if I had any troubles. Even if Windows itself when running in the VM, MS Office complains that it's not registered - I guess MS Office uses a different method to determine if it runs on the same hardware. Was not worth to bother for me because I have to use Windows only short times from the VM - and if I have to use it over extended periods I boot directly to it. But it would have been slick if it worked 100%.
Some versions of Windows (like Windows Server 2012 R2) will run for 6 months without activation, so if you can capture your setup steps completely in your Vagrantfile, it can be easier to rebuild your VM every 6 months than worry about activations.
Well changing the virtual disk UUID is enough to deactivate Windows 10 in Virtualbox. I've not tried changing NIC MACs
This means if you upgrade a retail copy of W7 uin a VBox and later clone, recreate or convert the hard drive image, you'll have to manually set the UUID.
There are articles where a guy hacks into it's hard drive controller, which I believe is the gateway to the drive ID and such, surely you can fake anything these days.
So let's spoof our hardware so that Windows still believes.
That last paragraph, if it's correct, answers a question I've had since the new Windows 10 way of doing things became public: If I have a retail copy of Windows 7 and upgrade to 10, will I be able to transfer my license when I eventually upgrade my PC (including motherboard). According to this, the answer is yes. So a retail Windows 10 license (which is what you get if you upgrade a retail copy of Windows 7 or 8) is apparently good not just for the life of the device, but for future devices as well. (One at a time, obviously.)
If true, the retail copies sound like a good deal. Especially while you can buy a retail copy of Windows 7 and upgrade it.
Keep in mind that the free Windows 7 upgrade period lasts for one year only. So if you upgrade your PC after that period and invalidate your license, you won't be able to reinstall Windows 7 and upgrade to Windows 10 again. You may be able to phone Microsoft and explain the situation though.
Exactly, so essentially you do NOT get a Windows 10 Retail licence by doing the upgrade!
You have a Windows 7 Retail licence and what could be called a Windows 10 "OEM" licence. The Windows 7 Retail can be installed to completely changed hardware, but the Windows 10 "OEM" is bound to the hardware you made the upgrade on. After the free upgrade period is over, you can't upgrade some parts of your hardware without buying a real Windows 10 Retail for the full price.
Well, if the activation process is the same as with W7, you ring MS, they ask you if the copy is still installed on only one computer, you answer yes and they activate the copy. Works even if you changed the motherboard.
That is incorrect. From the EULA [§4(b)], it is clear that upgrades from retail (stand-alone) versions stay retail - and transferable. No exceptions in there about the one-year qualifying period to upgrade your (now-perpetual) Windows licence:
4. Transfer. The provisions of this section do not apply if you acquired the software as a consumer in Germany or in any of the countries listed on this site (aka.ms/transfer), in which case any transfer of the software to a third party, and the right to use it, must comply with applicable law.
a. Software preinstalled on device. If you acquired the software preinstalled on a device (and also if you upgraded from software preinstalled on a device), you may transfer the license to use the software directly to another user, only with the licensed device. The transfer must include the software and, if provided with the device, an authentic Windows label including the product key. Before any permitted transfer, the other party must agree that this agreement applies to the transfer and use of the software.
b. Stand-alone software. If you acquired the software as stand-alone software (and also if you upgraded from software you acquired as stand-alone software), you may transfer the software to another device that belongs to you. You may also transfer the software to a device owned by someone else if (i) you are the first licensed user of the software and (ii) the new user agrees to the terms of this agreement. You may use the backup copy we allow you to make or the media that the software came on to transfer the software. Every time you transfer the software to a new device, you must remove the software from the prior device. You may not transfer the software to share licenses between devices.
According to Microsoft, almost all* upgrades are like for like. So, if you started with a retail copy then you end up with the same rights as a retail copy.
Presumably this is reflected in the kind of key that's generated, but at worst, it's a phone call....
* Where that's possible. Ultimate becomes Pro so you lose, or Starter becomes Home and you win.
Right, but you wouldn't want to do that anyway, because you can simply install Windows 10 directly and it will find your existing license online. As the article states, you will then need to call Microsoft to transfer the license to the new hardware in order to activate. (Something you would have had to do even if you'd stuck with Windows 7.)
The only downside...well _a_ downside to this: I repurposed my Vsphere machine for games. Do you have any idea how long it takes to update 4 year old Windows 7 install media enough that it'll take SP1, IE11 and qualify for the win10 upgrade? (about 350 patches and 6-7 hours)
You probably don't need to bother with 'reserving' your copy of W10 via the 'Get Windows 10' app. I've been told a fresh, unpatched install of W7 SP1 will upgrade just fine if you use an ISO.
FWIW, as part of trying to get some crap Sony laptop drivers working with Windows 10 I installed a clean copy of Windows 8.0, didn't install any updates, then upgraded to Windows 10 via an iso loaded on a USB stick. I didn't even have it connected to a network until well after Windows 10 was installed.
I had already performed the Windows 10 upgrade once on the computer, so it was registered. I would guess if you're doing it for the first time you may have to activate the copy of Win 7/8 first, but maybe just having a valid product key is enough?
Since Windows 8, Windows has used "virtual images" of the Operating System and has had the ability to rather than apply a bunch incremental updates instead just "build jump" to the higher build. You see this somewhat often in Windows Phone (given the way OEMs test and hold back phone updates, nearly every update seemed to be a "build jump") and up until recently not quite often in Windows. (8.1 and 8.1 Update 1, the "service packs" appeared to be "build jumps", but to my knowledge that's about it as far as 8 has used it in its servicing lifetime thus far.) With Windows 10 insiders have already seen a lot of "build jumps", particularly in the last few weeks leading up to the Windows 10 launch. I've got a feeling (and this is entirely supposition on my part) that one of the things we Insiders saw a Preview of and may not have realized it is that Windows 10 itself as a part of the "last version" thing will start to do a lot more "build jump" rollups of updates, even more often than the "service packs" of 8.
Haha, and that's if you have Windows 7 install media. A previous machine of mine was upgraded from Vista to 7. There's no way to reïnstall 7 on it without reïnstalling Vista first. 10 would be a nightmare.
You don't need to go through all of that, as long as you have an activated copy of Win7 you can pop in a Windows 10 DVD or USB flash drive and run the upgrade.
Let me share my upgrade story: I decided to upgrade my kid's computer from Windows 7 to Window 10 and also replace the harddrive with an ssd drive. So I replaced the hard drive and installed the Windows 10 (home) from an ISO. But the windows 10 doesn't recognize the existing Windows 7 (home)product key. So this weekend I will have to put back the old harddrive with Windows 7, upgrade that to Windows 10, and then put the SSD back in and hopefully the Windows 10 on the SSD will recognize my product key.
I would take another tac: Install Windows 7 on the SSD and then, transfer over the existing OEM activation[0], then upgrade it to W10, opting not to preserve settings and files.
It will only take marginally longer, and you can preserve the HDD in case it all goes awry
This new activation process didn't work for me. My Windows 10 upgrade started doing some weird stuff on my work laptop late last week, so I decided to do a full format and re-install. When reinstalling, Windows 10 did not automatically activate (and I couldn't use my old Windows 8 key), so I ended up having to get a separate Windows 10 key from our BizSpark account.
Well, I lost the key I used to install my windows 8 machine - I built it myself, it didn't come with a sticker. I was wondering if there was a way to recover it, but apparently I won't have to bother.
I expect to sell that machine in a couple of months, so it's a better deal for the buyer, than it is for me.
I'm one of those who experienced (and continue to do so) the useless "Something happened" upgrade failure on my laptop. I wonder what Microsoft are going to do closer to the end of the one year of free upgrades. After all it is their fault I can't upgrade to Windows 10, but unless the upgrade happens I can't get the free upgrade.
The article doesn't mention what I think is more of a problem than activation. It's the ongoing check to see whether Windows is "genuine".[1] This used to be called Windows Genuine Advantage, then renamed to Windows Activation Technologies.
Activating is a one-time thing. Either you succeed or you can try again. But the ongoing check is IMO a serious problem. Basically the software can deactivate itself on a whim (not really, but it's magic unless you understand exactly what's happening).
Does anyone know if this is still enabled? Once Windows is activated does it declare itself "non genuine" unless it's able to phone home? (excluding Win 10 phoning home for spyware reasons, let's not discuss that again).
If so, that's a problem. A Windows computer can degrade its functionality any time it feels like?
I don't want to install 10 right now, and may not want to switch fully in the next year, but I do want to have a free copy available for the future. How do I go about doing that? Do I need to fully install it on a spare drive, or can I make an install ISO that will still work after the one-year grace period?
I apologize for being obtuse. I'm sure this info is in here somewhere, but I'm not feeling well today and I can't quite wrap my head around it.
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[ 3.3 ms ] story [ 168 ms ] threadThat is probably only roughly true if you look at a small subset of the games market and limit it to the past few years.
Most of my toolchain exists in Linux, and much of it is developed and tested in Linux before anywhere else. WINE allows most windows programs to run, and do so well. WINE plus X allows x tunneling like Citrix, but over ssh.
And if I need a Windows VM, I can spin one up relatively easily. Admittedly, I just get a recent TPB Win10 install with activation removed/emulated, so I can do whatever meager testing I need to do.
I've currently got the technical preview on an old Macbook Pro. Only used it for flashing an SD card for IoT core insider preview. I've since discovered a better way [0] but I'll probably upgrade to the public release once it's bedded in a bit.
The hardest part was convincing Boot Camp that it would install fine. Took a bit of trickery. Can write up if anyone is interested?
[0] https://unop.uk/dev/windows-10-iot-core-public-release-for-r...
They used to have it on Digital River but it's been removed from there http://www.howtogeek.com/186775/how-to-download-windows-7-8-...
Someone here yesterday stated that only about 15% of Steam games run on Linux. I'm not sure how accurate that is, but honestly even as a casual gamer I couldn't imagine having access to that low a percentage of games. If I were running games on Linux I would have missed out on Rocket League which is now probably one of my all-time favorite games.
So, I guess I just don't see the point of using Linux for games at all. The phrase "cutting of your nose to spite your face" comes to mind because I can't think of one reason that isn't purely ideological.
Anyway, the info about the Windows 10 upgrade has been out for some time. I managed to cleanly upgrade all of the machines that I wanted to without hassle.
1395 it says, but i could be searching incorrectly. My main point though is that I don't want to miss any of them, so I run whatever I want instead of limiting myself to one platform for ideological reasons. I love Linux, but just not for games and desktop stuff.
2,629 games. You were searching incorrectly.
Further, despite your attempt to move the goalposts, my original statement still stands: 50% of current releases have a Linux port.
But the search links speak for themselves, thanks. Not sure who you're trying to convince here.
(Thanks for putting your spin on it though - it's always entertaining to watch people twist numbers so that they sound good for their argument. 50% of current releases (probably of mostly crappy indie games) certainly sounds much better than 20% of existing titles.)
I guess I'd also like some evidence for your 50% number, which nobody has seen yet. Anyway - enjoy having half the games that I do because of your fanatical ideology!
Reasons to use Linux for gaming:
- I save $100 by not buying Windows
- I don't have to worry about administering two OS's
- I don't have to ever wait for Windows updates. I boot into Windows so infrequently that it upgrades pretty much every time I do so.
- I don't have to shut down all my work programs and windows that I have open in Linux to reboot into Windows
Frankly, it's the last one that's the biggie. My computer often has virtual desktops, windows, editors, VM's and browsers open for 3-5 different projects, and it's just annoying to start those up again.
Which sounds like a good idea for a billion or so ordinary Windows users. Obviously there are plenty of geeks who will not like the idea of their PCs being remotely managed ;-)
Search for "windows update" and "blue screen" or "boot loop" or crashing for numerous examples.
If microsoft would actually spend money and time (real time and serious testing, not a few months of continuous integration testing) rather that using that "good enough to release" philosophy, maybe there would be fewer open hanger doors for malware to fly through.
Otherwise, I don't recall having a Windows Update problem recently -- certainly not this century -- and I haven't seen any malware either.
I'd be willing to bet that the malware problem will be significantly smaller with Microsoft doing the updating than it is at the moment, even though the majority of malware problems on Windows are down to human ignorance.
(I know I can run Windows 7 with no AV at all, and I'm certainly not the only one. I don't recommend it, but I have done it.)
I don't let MS do automatic anything on my windows box. I only use that box for a couple of apps, but when I need them, I really need them and can't afford to be blindsided by a box that won't boot.
I pick and choose the updates I apply and only then after they've been out in the wild for a month or so. I'm not going to let microsoft do any alpha/beta QA testing... errr... I meant "automatic updating," on my production box.
Refusing to install essential updates has cost some companies millions of dollars, conficker being just one example. I think it's better to install updates than not, and that someone who did the numbers could probably prove it.
Otherwise, real geeks keep backups that are tested as working. This is what separates the men from the boys.
Even trickier: on a Mac using VMWare Fusion, you can have a Windows partition that you can both boot into and run as a VM within OS X.
What has been reported to work is to buy Windows 10 license and then you can use the machine on bootcamp as well as via VM.
More details here: https://communities.vmware.com/thread/516838
I got the same error you linked until the latest rollup fix (which put my install into a boot loop due to nvidia geforce creating a phantom user but that's a whole different problem).
Once I installed the rollup it gave a different error and then took a day or two for the activation servers to finally work and activate the install. I only run windows natively to play games so it only runs for 2-3 hours at a time.
It took until yesterday to get it all sorted out. I installed win10 within a few hours of the iso going up.
Thanks for the heads up.
If possible please also post this at the forum thread that I referred to.
But it was tricky to build that VM. I followed instructions from [0], but don't remember if I had any troubles. Even if Windows itself when running in the VM, MS Office complains that it's not registered - I guess MS Office uses a different method to determine if it runs on the same hardware. Was not worth to bother for me because I have to use Windows only short times from the VM - and if I have to use it over extended periods I boot directly to it. But it would have been slick if it worked 100%.
[0] http://geekery.amhill.net/2010/01/27/virtualbox-with-existin...
This means if you upgrade a retail copy of W7 uin a VBox and later clone, recreate or convert the hard drive image, you'll have to manually set the UUID.
So let's spoof our hardware so that Windows still believes.
If true, the retail copies sound like a good deal. Especially while you can buy a retail copy of Windows 7 and upgrade it.
You have a Windows 7 Retail licence and what could be called a Windows 10 "OEM" licence. The Windows 7 Retail can be installed to completely changed hardware, but the Windows 10 "OEM" is bound to the hardware you made the upgrade on. After the free upgrade period is over, you can't upgrade some parts of your hardware without buying a real Windows 10 Retail for the full price.
4. Transfer. The provisions of this section do not apply if you acquired the software as a consumer in Germany or in any of the countries listed on this site (aka.ms/transfer), in which case any transfer of the software to a third party, and the right to use it, must comply with applicable law. a. Software preinstalled on device. If you acquired the software preinstalled on a device (and also if you upgraded from software preinstalled on a device), you may transfer the license to use the software directly to another user, only with the licensed device. The transfer must include the software and, if provided with the device, an authentic Windows label including the product key. Before any permitted transfer, the other party must agree that this agreement applies to the transfer and use of the software. b. Stand-alone software. If you acquired the software as stand-alone software (and also if you upgraded from software you acquired as stand-alone software), you may transfer the software to another device that belongs to you. You may also transfer the software to a device owned by someone else if (i) you are the first licensed user of the software and (ii) the new user agrees to the terms of this agreement. You may use the backup copy we allow you to make or the media that the software came on to transfer the software. Every time you transfer the software to a new device, you must remove the software from the prior device. You may not transfer the software to share licenses between devices.
Presumably this is reflected in the kind of key that's generated, but at worst, it's a phone call....
* Where that's possible. Ultimate becomes Pro so you lose, or Starter becomes Home and you win.
But how? Since you don't have the actual key, how does it work?
I had already performed the Windows 10 upgrade once on the computer, so it was registered. I would guess if you're doing it for the first time you may have to activate the copy of Win 7/8 first, but maybe just having a valid product key is enough?
HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10058346
It will only take marginally longer, and you can preserve the HDD in case it all goes awry
[0] Use ABR beta from http://directedge.us/content/abr-activation-backup-and-resto...
I expect to sell that machine in a couple of months, so it's a better deal for the buyer, than it is for me.
Brings you to this page: http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/product_cd_key_viewer.html
It pulls your product key out of the registry for you.
It helped me to create a USB installer and start the upgrade from there.
Activating is a one-time thing. Either you succeed or you can try again. But the ongoing check is IMO a serious problem. Basically the software can deactivate itself on a whim (not really, but it's magic unless you understand exactly what's happening).
Does anyone know if this is still enabled? Once Windows is activated does it declare itself "non genuine" unless it's able to phone home? (excluding Win 10 phoning home for spyware reasons, let's not discuss that again).
If so, that's a problem. A Windows computer can degrade its functionality any time it feels like?
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Genuine_Advantage#Spyw...
I apologize for being obtuse. I'm sure this info is in here somewhere, but I'm not feeling well today and I can't quite wrap my head around it.