Your page is a great read and they are as well, so thanks, had fun driving down history lane remembering all the various shenanigans MS went through to shove their browser down our throats.
Also - I'd like the same thing but not lightweight. I want a page of responsive js maps and graphs that look just like GA, but publicly displayed. I made one geo map, but it took a looooong time.
>And when you publish your own HTML to a server that you control; that's fucking powerful. Autonomy and independence are central to the web. We can't forget that.
>The world still needs some fucking webmasters. We might not all be making websites professionally anymore. But we should keep making websites. The passion, the freedom, the joy: we need to pass this on.
I appreciate the enthusiasm for wanting to empower people but the technology (e.g. simpler format of HTML, or open standards instead of walled gardens, etc) is not really the issue even though it looks that way. I've commented on this illusion before[1].
The underlying issue is the asymmetry between active participants and passive spectators. Most people don't care to make an HTML web page. On the other hand... Uploading a photo of a cat or plate of food to facebook or twitter? Or type a short response comment to a niece saying "love your new dress!"? Yes, a good percentage of people will conquer the threshold of complexity to do that... but it's still not the majority of users.
Even though I don't like it, I've come to terms with the fact that the human race is "wired" to make easy posts on Facebook rather than maintain an HTML web page on a server they control. Most people don't want to be "webmasters".
You would need a lot of patience to write an essay on a mobile phone, witch accounts for around 90% of all web "users". Hopefully we'll see inventions in the IO area, like virtual-keyboard-wrist-bands and voice-to-text.
Most people never wanted to be webmasters in the 90s, either. They'd spend their time finding fun apps to make weird characters or RTF-colored chat text, ASCII art, l33t speak, and flashy forum sigs. If they were really artsy, maybe some .gifs.
Creativity came in many forms, and still does. Webmasters were just the "left-brained" types (yes, i'm aware that's a pop-psych myth). Nowadays it's the "let's reinvent everything in a new language" types trying to shove an operating system into a web browser, versus the people making art, music, culture and community using technology.
Now that I think of it, I actually learned to program because my brother used Geocities' webpage-making template system to make his own site, and I wanted to know how he did it, so I read the source.
But if web sites were easier to make, more people would make them.
In the 1990s I had friends who literally knew nothing at all about computers but still managed to hack together their own sites with a text editor and some persistence.
It was so easy anyone of average and above IQ could do it.
Often the results were - let's say - not that great as graphic design. But they got the job done well enough to be useful.
So I don't think it's an illusion at all. I think the barriers to entry have become way too high. There's certainly
If the barriers were lower, I'm not convinced we'd need FB and Tumblr and the rest at all.
A fun read and trip down memory lane, of the times sitting with an HTML book open on my lap and trying to write code that would display what I wanted. Being one of those artsy-fartsy types meant that I could experiment with design. Seamless frames! Links to other pages that actually work and reference each other! Hitting the 'Preview' screen from the editor to test things...over and over...
...and of course, the ever lovely habit of "View Source" which leads to interesting things. Like finding the large "Never Forget" at the top of the linked page. Fun times.
But for sure, there was a certain aura and power around being able to not only navigate the web (OMG .WAV SOUNDS FROM MOVIES!) but put up a sign that other people could see. Then get good enough to get paid for work doing such things. A good reminder type essay methinks.
I can empathize with the message of this essay because I feel like it reflects the roots of my career, but I wouldn't share this with anyone I know because there is so much unnecessary cursing in this that gives it a really immature feel. You can totally get the message of this across without the crass language. It only detracts, not helps, in my opinion.
Disagree. For emphasis on the power of being a "webmaster" AND to capture what that meant in the cultural vernacular of various pipsqueaks who claimed that title when it was a thing, you could do little better than a qualifier like "fucking" or "motherfucking" or "goddamn". You could for instance, write this with a theme embodied like, "I am webmaster, hear me roar" or "webmaster of my domain or something", but I think you are simply sanitizing the ego-boosting high and kind of crass thinking that often came with discovering that particular power, at that particular time. For an ancient courtier who discovered how he can manipulate the realm, you could probably expect a much more refined if still ego-laden expression of that power.
It doesn't read that way to me, it just reads as an adjective to make the article more "shocking" and illustrate the role of a webmaster to appear more against the grain of our little IT/startup world.
I think the rest of the essay does a great job of explaining why and how webmasters were so important and how they were/are the ultimate problem solver. No ego boosting qualifiers necessary.
I don't see why you got downvoted. I 100% agree with you. It was simply not necessary. If you go around the web, even to large, reputable news sites, it seems more and more people are opting to not think about language and use whatever word first pops into their mind. To me, it's not about shock or ego boosting, it's simply mental laziness.
Mainly those who are indeed somewhat shocked (usually due to some still active puritan heritage) actually think that such words were meant to "make the article more 'shocking'".
The rest don't even blink when we see them -- especially from countries without a history of a prudish outlook on things.
One can see people getting slashed with knives and shot in the head on PG13 movies -- words like these are nothing compared to that.
The primary use of cursing is when one is frustrated or angry and wants to draw attention to an issue. I think it's safe to say that adding a swear word to a title is going to draw attention to the title simply because the use of the swear word.
I'm not shocked, I'm just bored of the "I'm a fucking <nostalgic or out of style thing>" or "This fucking <nostalgic or out of style thing>" trend. Just because swearing hasn't become so blasé to a person doesn't mean they have an "active puritan heritage".
Why are you worried people will think you're immature for sharing something interesting that has cursing in it? Immaturity is to be distracted by fuck to the point where you take to the comments and only contribute that you empathize before policing their chosen form of expression.
>We need to remember that at its core a web page is simple. That's the beauty of it. And when you publish your own HTML to a server that you control; that's fucking powerful. Autonomy and independence are central to the web. We can't forget that.
I absolutely agree.
People seem to forget that the fundamental nature of the web hasn't changed. Facebook hasn't destroyed the web, javascript and that framework you hate haven't destroyed the web, advertising hasn't destroyed the web (arguably, the web has destroyed advertising), the NSA hasn't destroyed the web (yet.) You can still open up the text editor of your choice and write some HTML and put it on a server. That still works, and it will probably always work - human readable, human writable, human accessible content. You can still write it all by hand if you want, you don't have to know how to code, you're not forced to conform to arbitrary standards, or use proprietary software.
In the end, no matter how much abstraction modern developers pile on to make it look and act like "legitimate" application programming, the web is just HTML, CSS, javascript and some embedded content, probably images, possibly of cats. Sometimes, in the midst of how homogeneous and corporatized the web can appear, I think it helps to be reminded of how revolutionary it still is because of its fundamental simplicity and accessibility.
I love nostalgia posts. I think all of us who were "webmasters" all have a differed "what we are now", but if everything didn't start this way for me, I don't think I'd be doing what I am doing today regardless.
I remember making a ball bounce in Flash with some elasticity and people wanted it on their website no matter what their website was about. The 90's were such strange times. "Can you put that bouncing ball on my site?" I guess, but I'm not sure what it has to do with carpet cleaning....
I still get asked to disable the right mouse button, add background music, a counter, or make something blink or scroll, and every now and then... an animated gif (usually of a U.S. flag).
Luckily I've been doing this long enough now to say, no, please don't do this to yourself or your business. You've spent too much money and too much time to throw it all away with a tiny design disaster. But they insist. Ohhhh they insist.
Remember huge Flash intros to sites? I overheard someone trying to add that to a site in 2015 and being adamant that it's what people need to see because they don't know what the site is about until they have a pretty intro.
I've noticed the people that insist on micromanaging everything like that with web technologies tend to not stay in business very long or don't want to do much besides pay for the website like people pay for refrigerators. Great for the web hosting companies that will take $30 / mo on a site that gets 1000 hits / month but terrible for web designers that need repeat business once in a while.
Today we have a huge generic image with one-three words not really stating much and sometimes an indication that you need to start scrolling to actually read something.
Do you have noticed that the most responsive web pages are sites without the CSS styles(or with just few rules)? I can run such web pages even on 10 year old mobile phone and also load a whole HTML document with a throttled connection to 10KB/s quiet quick. The sad thing is that modern webdevelopers tends to forget about it. Long time ago I realized the really good way of developing a webpage is just writing down some bare HTML (maybe just a grid and typography CSS) with only grayscale colors applied - if it will look bad then it is a bad design.
If we are speaking of memories of the "old-ways" of developing websites I remind mostly one thing - rounded corners. I remember how many web devs were trying to make a table (3x3) and put content in the center cell, and fill corners with some gifs. Nevertheless, it was not the only one method which some webmasters were using - a hacky VML file [1]
Well now blogs and feed based websites have mostly replaced the end-user need to craft their own websites.
The convenience does not come at zero cost, though. This is putting power in too few hands. A few people decide how the web looks like, what is possible and what is not.
Facebook is now the new Internet Explorer, an unavoidable entity that dictates what the web experience is like.
I remember when bandwidth was at a premium and 1200 baud was fast. There were pleas everywhere to use simple html, white text on black. Images were links to download if you wanted to view them and encouraged only if they added to the content. Nobody was trying to make the web into television.
When 1200 baud was fast there were no pleas to use simple html - there was no html!
You might have had me with 56k or even 28.8kbps (V.92!), but 1200 baud. When 1200 baud was fast - yes, everywhere was simple text on the screen (maybe ANSI colors), but more along the lines of Compuserve or a BBS. And yes, you had to download images. The best were the progressive scan ones where you could view the incomplete images as they downloaded.
I believe it, but that wasn't considered fast at the time. And your point is definitely valid - there were web page size optimizations done with dial-up users in mind. I even remember programs that simulated loading time at different download speeds.
But around 1980, 1200 baud was considered lightning fast! Imagine the jump from 300 to 1200 baud. But back then, HTML wasn't even a consideration and network connections were completely text-based sessions. If you were lucky, you had some control over colors. If you were lucky...
All I'm saying is that when there were 28.8 modems, people in rural areas didn't always see those. In 1995. When you could do simple tables, images, and font colors. I remember it well because I worked with a rural ISP to make their web page.
Cool, but disappointed his name at the end links to Twitter - he just undid everything he just said.
His name should link to his homepage or about page, of which he has no links to from the article. These pages are IMHO a million times more interesting than the frankly awful mess Twitter has made of profile homepages. What with the big fonts on some tweets - I don't know why some tweets have large fonts. A good interface would instantly make it clear why.
It's so refreshing to see good 'ol blue links, that are underlined and stand out accordingly from the rest of the copy. So many sites try to get too fancy with links nowadays and you can't even tell what is a link and what isn't.
Some people want to be left alone in their html `pages` club where they check for errors in the w3c validator. Some people want to make the browser usurp native applications and become the baseline for user interactions.
I don't look back at the 90's with rose-colored glasses. Web was often overlooked and we were considered 2nd rate citizens among `real` software developers. These days, the browser is a competitive alternative to native and it was years of struggle to get here. Over taking a decade of "web" understanding and convincing people that "web" is capable of more than just html.
The web is made up of people's decisions and their technology choices they choose to use. Which is basically written in every alistapart article since 1999. So let's not sit in nostalgia. Push forward with better technology because this thinking only makes it harder for those that invent and struggling for adoption from `thought leaders` who wish the world was just a series of hyperlinked XML pages.
68 comments
[ 386 ms ] story [ 2589 ms ] threadhttp://motherfuckingwebsite.com/
I wonder if it is the same guy.
Edit: Nope, @thebarrytone made mfw.com
https://justinjackson.ca/words.html
Seriously though, I loved reading this. Thank you!
Have you seen http://tomstrucking.net yet? ;)
(By which I mean: it's a thing of beauty!)
.. which ended up being the whole point.
Your page is a great read and they are as well, so thanks, had fun driving down history lane remembering all the various shenanigans MS went through to shove their browser down our throats.
>The world still needs some fucking webmasters. We might not all be making websites professionally anymore. But we should keep making websites. The passion, the freedom, the joy: we need to pass this on.
I appreciate the enthusiasm for wanting to empower people but the technology (e.g. simpler format of HTML, or open standards instead of walled gardens, etc) is not really the issue even though it looks that way. I've commented on this illusion before[1].
The underlying issue is the asymmetry between active participants and passive spectators. Most people don't care to make an HTML web page. On the other hand... Uploading a photo of a cat or plate of food to facebook or twitter? Or type a short response comment to a niece saying "love your new dress!"? Yes, a good percentage of people will conquer the threshold of complexity to do that... but it's still not the majority of users.
Even though I don't like it, I've come to terms with the fact that the human race is "wired" to make easy posts on Facebook rather than maintain an HTML web page on a server they control. Most people don't want to be "webmasters".
[1]https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10010540
Creativity came in many forms, and still does. Webmasters were just the "left-brained" types (yes, i'm aware that's a pop-psych myth). Nowadays it's the "let's reinvent everything in a new language" types trying to shove an operating system into a web browser, versus the people making art, music, culture and community using technology.
Now that I think of it, I actually learned to program because my brother used Geocities' webpage-making template system to make his own site, and I wanted to know how he did it, so I read the source.
In the 1990s I had friends who literally knew nothing at all about computers but still managed to hack together their own sites with a text editor and some persistence.
It was so easy anyone of average and above IQ could do it.
Often the results were - let's say - not that great as graphic design. But they got the job done well enough to be useful.
So I don't think it's an illusion at all. I think the barriers to entry have become way too high. There's certainly
If the barriers were lower, I'm not convinced we'd need FB and Tumblr and the rest at all.
Websites are as easy to make now as they ever were. HTML from the 1990s still works fine. The barriers to entry haven't actually moved at all.
...and of course, the ever lovely habit of "View Source" which leads to interesting things. Like finding the large "Never Forget" at the top of the linked page. Fun times.
But for sure, there was a certain aura and power around being able to not only navigate the web (OMG .WAV SOUNDS FROM MOVIES!) but put up a sign that other people could see. Then get good enough to get paid for work doing such things. A good reminder type essay methinks.
I'm saying this as someone who swears a lot, too.
I think the rest of the essay does a great job of explaining why and how webmasters were so important and how they were/are the ultimate problem solver. No ego boosting qualifiers necessary.
The rest don't even blink when we see them -- especially from countries without a history of a prudish outlook on things.
One can see people getting slashed with knives and shot in the head on PG13 movies -- words like these are nothing compared to that.
I'm not shocked, I'm just bored of the "I'm a fucking <nostalgic or out of style thing>" or "This fucking <nostalgic or out of style thing>" trend. Just because swearing hasn't become so blasé to a person doesn't mean they have an "active puritan heritage".
I absolutely agree.
People seem to forget that the fundamental nature of the web hasn't changed. Facebook hasn't destroyed the web, javascript and that framework you hate haven't destroyed the web, advertising hasn't destroyed the web (arguably, the web has destroyed advertising), the NSA hasn't destroyed the web (yet.) You can still open up the text editor of your choice and write some HTML and put it on a server. That still works, and it will probably always work - human readable, human writable, human accessible content. You can still write it all by hand if you want, you don't have to know how to code, you're not forced to conform to arbitrary standards, or use proprietary software.
In the end, no matter how much abstraction modern developers pile on to make it look and act like "legitimate" application programming, the web is just HTML, CSS, javascript and some embedded content, probably images, possibly of cats. Sometimes, in the midst of how homogeneous and corporatized the web can appear, I think it helps to be reminded of how revolutionary it still is because of its fundamental simplicity and accessibility.
I remember making a ball bounce in Flash with some elasticity and people wanted it on their website no matter what their website was about. The 90's were such strange times. "Can you put that bouncing ball on my site?" I guess, but I'm not sure what it has to do with carpet cleaning....
I still get asked to disable the right mouse button, add background music, a counter, or make something blink or scroll, and every now and then... an animated gif (usually of a U.S. flag).
Luckily I've been doing this long enough now to say, no, please don't do this to yourself or your business. You've spent too much money and too much time to throw it all away with a tiny design disaster. But they insist. Ohhhh they insist.
I've noticed the people that insist on micromanaging everything like that with web technologies tend to not stay in business very long or don't want to do much besides pay for the website like people pay for refrigerators. Great for the web hosting companies that will take $30 / mo on a site that gets 1000 hits / month but terrible for web designers that need repeat business once in a while.
Or was that last year.
> Do not do this. There are no shirts. This site is 20 years old. What's wrong with you?
https://www.spork.org/spork-gear.shtml
And this anti-IE site has some nice badges we can still add to our websites:
http://toastytech.com/evil/buttons.html
If we are speaking of memories of the "old-ways" of developing websites I remind mostly one thing - rounded corners. I remember how many web devs were trying to make a table (3x3) and put content in the center cell, and fill corners with some gifs. Nevertheless, it was not the only one method which some webmasters were using - a hacky VML file [1]
[1] https://code.google.com/archive/p/curved-corner/
The convenience does not come at zero cost, though. This is putting power in too few hands. A few people decide how the web looks like, what is possible and what is not.
Facebook is now the new Internet Explorer, an unavoidable entity that dictates what the web experience is like.
You might have had me with 56k or even 28.8kbps (V.92!), but 1200 baud. When 1200 baud was fast - yes, everywhere was simple text on the screen (maybe ANSI colors), but more along the lines of Compuserve or a BBS. And yes, you had to download images. The best were the progressive scan ones where you could view the incomplete images as they downloaded.
Ah, the memories...
But my internet connection was rural, and 1200 baud. It was possible.
But around 1980, 1200 baud was considered lightning fast! Imagine the jump from 300 to 1200 baud. But back then, HTML wasn't even a consideration and network connections were completely text-based sessions. If you were lucky, you had some control over colors. If you were lucky...
His name should link to his homepage or about page, of which he has no links to from the article. These pages are IMHO a million times more interesting than the frankly awful mess Twitter has made of profile homepages. What with the big fonts on some tweets - I don't know why some tweets have large fonts. A good interface would instantly make it clear why.
I don't look back at the 90's with rose-colored glasses. Web was often overlooked and we were considered 2nd rate citizens among `real` software developers. These days, the browser is a competitive alternative to native and it was years of struggle to get here. Over taking a decade of "web" understanding and convincing people that "web" is capable of more than just html.
The web is made up of people's decisions and their technology choices they choose to use. Which is basically written in every alistapart article since 1999. So let's not sit in nostalgia. Push forward with better technology because this thinking only makes it harder for those that invent and struggling for adoption from `thought leaders` who wish the world was just a series of hyperlinked XML pages.