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Love My Company but Feel Like My Salary Is Low

16 points by spellsadmoose ↗ HN
Like the title says, I love my company and everyone that works there.

It's a company with about 20 of us who are mostly developers. I generally really like it - I feel like I could be more challenging work (but I think that's a bit of the grass is always greener).

My friends in tech are giving me crap because they know I only make around 50k and I'm entering a mid level of experience as a Front-End Dev. My skill set looks like this: high levels of knowledge with OO Javascript, Angular.js/Backbone/Ember.js, Ruby on Rails, Postgres/Mysql, Grunt, Less/SCSS. I've been here for 4 years now. I'd rather have better quality of life than get paid a lot but I can't help thinking that 50k is feeling a little low for the Portland, OR area. Any stories of a good balance between salary and quality of life? Or in a similar situation?

22 comments

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andymoe
It's low and If you have been there for four years and are not progressing how you would like or are early in your career it's time to move on.
blackflame7000
Agreed, in fact I'd go as far as to say after 2 years you should have a pretty good feel for the environment and have an idea if there is room for growth. Some companies propagate a culture of mediocrity where everyone is just there to collect a paycheck and go home. If you can recognize that sentiment early on, its best to distance yourself to avoid getting sucked in and resigning yourself to the "do enough to get by" mentality.
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CyberFonic
Is everybody in your company paid low or just you?

If it is the latter and you are confident that you are making a solid contribution then you could ask for a raise. I'm no expert in this area, but I've seen posts on how to go about that.

spellsadmoose
To be honest, I'm not sure. Is it common to share salaries with your peers in this industry because I'm not sure what anyone else gets paid.
coryl
Use glassdoor.com to research salaries for similar job titles in your city.
afarrell
It is commonly believed that it is illegal to share salaries. This is false and in fact it is illegal for companies to prohibit sharing salaries.
blackflame7000
My best advice is to never stop learning and improving your skills. The larger your skill-set, the larger your leverage. If I were you, I would use the opportunity to start a side project to supplement your existing skills. As good as high-paying jobs are, they are often equally as demanding and can sap your will power if you don't have outlet to express your creativity.

As a suggestion based on your skills, perhaps in might be beneficial to learn some machine based programming languages (like java or better yet C). You seem to have a strong background in Web development, maybe a side project working with an Arduino would help to supplement your skills and give you a more rounded Computer Science background.

freestockoption
I usually encourage friends to never stop looking for opportunities to expand. Comfort and "stability" is worth something, but it's important to not stagnate (if you want a career). I would do a side project, consult, do something new at work, or find a new job. :) Do anything but let the status quo guide.

If you work for a reasonable company (and I feel most are), your quality of life is something you make happen or let happen. It is very easy to let the company guilt you into working 12 hours. Set appropriate boundaries and be in control.

qaq
That's about what you would make in Ukraine given the info you listed. So for US this seems really low.
scawf
Are you serious ? in Ukraine ? I make about 60k$ in Paris, and have a lot of friend making about 50k$.If Ukraine is like that, I'll be there in two months ! :)
qaq
I am totally serious a good Ruby dev with 4 years experience and really good english 4K/month is very doable. A good Senior Java dev would be 5K-5.5K (I had actually people turning down 5.5K/month for really nice remote positions). Can't say how tax/work permits work for foreigners but for citizens they operate under Private Entrepreneur thingy and basically pay flat 3% tax.
scawf
Do you have a number for C++ ? Thanks for the info anyway :)
qaq
For C++ only know that for DSP jobs it is in 4K/month range can't say what it in general.
dyeje
It seems pretty low for Portland. Try applying to jobs you're interested in. Get an idea of what you're worth. If you end up really liking a place you interview, take the job. If you decide to stay at your current place, at least you know what you're worth and can negotiate your next raise better.
afarrell
1) List out your accomplishments at the company from the last 4 years.

2) Try to find out which accomplishments grew revenue or cut costs for the business. Try to find out how much. If necessary, take one of the sales managers out to lunch and tell them you're trying to get a broader sense of the work you do from their perspective.

With that information in mind you can get a rough sense for the company's BATNA; When you go to them in a negotiation you now know that for you to leave would mean they lose a resource that generates $450,000/yr in value for the company.

It also means you have some great lines for your resume. "...which earns $4K monthly recurring revenue" is a tantalizing way to end a scentence if it is true.

Google [bingo card creator blog] for more on this topic.

android521
IS 50K before or after tax? What is after-tax salary? I have a friend who lives in South east asia country and his after-tax income (base+bonus) is 65K.
borplk
I have one piece of advice for you. Start looking for higher paying opportunities and when you get a nice offer that you are happy with hand in your notice and move on.

Don't hold out for a big raise at your current workplace, it never works like that.

jasonkester
Want the sad truth? You have to leave.

I was in this exact position once. Fun team, fun tech, lots of freedom to experiment and prototype new stuff just in case it became useful. Supportive management and sane working conditions. $37k/year.

Leaving that place was one of the toughest decisions of my young life. I had managed to secure the biggest percentage raise they were willing to give, at the end of a long negotiation explaining the state on the ground as it was in 1998 (when much like today developers were very much in demand and could essentially name their price), but that only got me up to the mid $40s.

So I took the leap. Responded to one of the mails in my inbox and took a job for another shop in town for twice the money. Folks at the old place were stunned and saddened. I wasn't sure it was the right thing to do.

But it was. Absolutely.

15 years later, I was on an even more fun team, with cool tech, respect, and all that stuff from above, but for 10X the takehome pay of that "Dream Job" from the 90s. To put it mildly, that's not where I would have been career-wise had I stayed put.

You have a whole life ahead. Even the best thing to ever happen to you will be something you look back at as a local maxima. It's not worth leaving millions (and I do mean actual real millions) of dollars on the table just to stay someplace fun.

Float your resume today. Future you will thank you for it.

advice_giver
Here's the thing: I seriously doubt you actually love your company or your job. Instead, you're comfortable.

You're not challenged and you're flagrantly underpaid in a great tech city. I would guess someone decent with your profile should make 2x what you're making. Think about that. Would you recommend such a job to a friend?

You need to move on. There are lots of companies as good or better as your current one, trust me. Take it one step at a time - start with updating your resume. Hopefully this will get you excited about the next steps.

When you give your notice it will be an amazing feeling. All your self-esteem will come rushing back. Good luck.

akulbe
I'm in Portland, and I'm not even in the same type of work as you (I do Systems Engineering work), and I know you're _woefully_ underpaid given the kind of experience you have.

Like others have said already, get out of there.

traviswingo
It sounds to me like you're comfortable and don't think risking the steady pay and fun environment for something you're not sure will work out.

This is the worst thing you can do for yourself!

Your potential is always more than where you currently are in life. You should always be looking for the next opportunity to advance your career and increase your worth. This is why a lot of people stay at a job for 2 year and then move on - they learn a lot, contribute a lot, then go sell themselves for a lot more money and repeat.

You could jump ship right now for double the pay. Your friends at the company won't blame you for it, and it's healthy for founders of a company to see that happen.

Good luck!