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Ask HN: I've invented / patented something powerful. Now what?

31 points by ipoverip ↗ HN
This is a throwaway account. My main account is over 6 years old with 5000+ karma. I've also sold a company before for a small amount. I only bring this up because I know how this might sound.

I've invented something powerful. It's software related, but nothing like what the patent trolls bandy about. I filed the provisional some months ago, but I'm having trouble making any progress with the business side of things.

I've noticed a common pattern:

1. I'll get someone I know and trust (like an investor, or business guy with a history of helping people sell companies) to agree not to share the idea

2. I'll explain how it works

3. They'll get really excited, some have even given me small amounts of cash to stop me from seeing anyone else "while we hammer out the agreement"

4. They'll _completely_ flake out. Their main business might have a couple fires, or they'll have a first day as a CEO of a company they took over, or they're just busy flying around the world giving speeches, whatever.

Frustrated with the lack of progress, I decided to try just warm / cold emailing a couple dozen VCs / angels and this is the pattern that emerges:

1. I contact them.

2. Nothing happens.

What am I doing wrong here? I'm 100% certain that Google or Facebook wants this and I'm 100% certain that they don't have it. In my head the only question is what price they'll pay and who I should get introduced to. I was hoping a connected angel or VC would help with introductions and negotiations for a cut of the sale but I can't seem to get past people's spam filters.

Has anyone here done something similar before? If so could you please tell me what I'm doing wrong?

35 comments

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Aelinsaar
Maybe you need to start by questioning the series of assumptions that have led you to have "100%" certainty in something? Presumably if you were correct, then you would be having a different experience by now.
ipoverip
Well I'm not certain in anyway about the process of selling patents. I'm a computer scientist though and I've consulted enough trusted colleagues to validate that the technology is valuable and works to solve problems real businesses need.

It's kinda like inventing a battery that is twice as efficient, and the same or better in every other way. You can be 100% sure Tesla or Toyota would buy the technology, without even being 3% sure where to start.

Aelinsaar
Got it, that make sense. In that case, I wish you the best of luck, and hope someone here can help!
jotux
Are you asking everyone to sign an NDA upfront?
ipoverip
My patent lawyer told me to, but generally no. If I know the person ahead of time I just ask them to keep it to themselves. Plus I know VCs wont sign NDAs, but I would get someone to agree verbally to keep it to themselves.
bind
Wouldn't it be better strategy to be as public as possible with this? To start a competitive situation where prospective acquirers would want to get to the tech first before their competitors?

Like Oculus did and got bought by FB.

convivialdingo
Second this. Spend some time getting a quality demo up and running, hire a designer to help if needed.

Companies aren't interested in ideas, they want something they can drop in or can see using in 6 months.

* I have over a dozen patents. Learned this the hard way.

jacques_chester
> My patent lawyer told me to, but generally no

I am not a lawyer, but in my understanding, once you file, you have a priority date.

I hold an Australian patent with a US one pending. Both trace their priority back to 2012, when I made an initial filing through WIPO.

For each national patent granted, my patent coverage is backdated to 2012.

Either your idea is patentable, in which case, you might as well brag. Or it's not, in which case, you might as well pretend to brag.

replies_to_all
OP sounds confused. Anyone should know that once you file your safe to discuss, so what kind of lawyer would make that mistake?
RaitoBezarius
Maybe what you invented is not that so "powerful".

Keep calm. At some point, if you want to get introduced to Google / Facebook executives and get them to buy your technology.

You will have to convince them it is a real game-changer. People are not willing to toss everything just because you're "100% sure" of something.

Write a plan, if you want to show how interesting is your technology, I think that you have to write some proof of concepts and MVPs to show off.

Maybe, it'll take a whole complete product for Google and Facebook to notice how interesting this technology of yours is.

Anyway, what you are doing wrong is that you are assuming that you can convince someone just by telling him how it works. I think it is reasonable to ignore someone who wants you to believe in something based on how it works.

As a software developer, when we have to scale, we don't do guesses or explain how it would work. We measure everything. So measure your powerful invention and check / validate with the reality.

alain94040
Contact me[0] and I can put you in touch with someone who can help.

[0] my email is on foundrs.com

malux85
If it's patented, then why not just tell us what it is?
murph
What evidence do you have to demonstrate the power of your invention? Is it usable, can you build a business around it and sell it?

I've got a lot of experience w/ the technology stacks used by big tech companies - a lot of time the value of things is not the idea but the execution and implementation.

cairo140
From reading your post, I feel the biggest issue you are facing is that there is nothing differentiating you from the common "wacko" inventor who thinks they have the next great thing. We'd get nowhere if we followed each perpetual motion machine, infinitely scalable database, and alternative theory of quantum physics. So the system is good at identifying those patterns and churning through them.

Your idea is good. Let's just say that.

What you have to do next is to differentiate yourself from the crazies. That means some of the following:

* Tech demo you can show someone in 30 seconds * A "shiny" frontend that the layperson can understand * A concrete value proposition, other than that it can be acquired

You don't want to be stuck in the following pattern, which makes you no different from the rest:

* Secrecy * Promises * Vagueness

Todd
Where are you located? Maybe you should add a throwaway email to your profile so people can contact you. It might also help if you mention the area that the invention relates to. If someone with an interest in that area happens on this post, it will make it more likely that they will reach out.

Also, if you're trying to contact VCs, you need a warm intro from someone they know, so tap your network.

ipoverip
I'm in the North East, but I can fly to California if I need to. It spans a couple areas of Data Science, but all that Google / Facebook would be interested in.

I added an email to my profile. Thanks for the suggestion.

maxxxxx
I haven't had a patent but a while ago I developed a pretty useful software for some industries. I wasn't able to get much traction when I talked potential customers myself. A friend of mine is an experienced sales guy so I asked him to help. He was much better at talking to people and keeping things moving. So my advice would be to partner with somebody who has a proven sales record and let him make some phone calls. It's a very specific skill set a lot of engineers don't have.
kyloren
Well how do you know that Facebook and Google doesn't have what you made? Companies keep things secret until they properly develop it maybe these companies are already up to it.

Also there is nothing called super awesome idea that no one hasn't come across at least someone somewhere must have had the idea you had just that they never pushed it to production or made it and never sold it or at least tried to make it.

I guess the best way is to share the idea with the community not in detail in how you do it but an idea in what you made so other can talk and comment on it. Only after that you will realize it is a grand idea that you think it is.

But on the other hand there are great inventions that went un noticed for a long time before getting traction. Look no further the mp3 Technology that we used today was not used because the bad mp2 technology was backed by big companies. Only after a decade or so with slow traction mp3 got popular. The developers gave up the idea of mp3 and even decided to stop developing it.

This is from a book called "How Music Got Free". I suggest you guys read it :)

ipoverip
> Well how do you know that Facebook and Google doesn't have what you made? Companies keep things secret until they properly develop it maybe these companies are already up to it.

Because it is detectable. Although I admit that although I cannot find prior art, it could be out there.

kyloren
I too have felt I had such ideas but when I look further I came across many more people have done it or have tried to do it :)
dragon_king
I don't have the expertise to help you with this specific situation, however I would love to know the approach that you took and the outcome of this endeavor. Please share it when you are ready.
petervandijck
1. Social proof. Can you find an independent party with a name/reputation to vouch for the value of your invention? It would be great to say: here's so-and-so, who works at X or teaches at Y, who looked into my solution and is happy to answer questions about it. Have like 2 or 3 people like that, people who have some reputation/name. That might help.

2. You might be better off turning this into a startup first, and then getting sold/acqui-hired. Does that apply to your idea?

sportnak
You sound like you're being flaky yourself. Realize you have the idea. If you sit down and establish a timeline with someone like that, it'll be more successful. If not, you should just go to market yourself. Don't let your idea flop because you couldn't find the right person to pursue you, make them regret they flaked.
samblr
This is how Masayoshi Son's (Softbank) handled and sold his first patent. (book 'aiming high')

He approached many companies - most gave him a cold shoulder. So he found a patent lawyer/engineer who once worked for Sharp after meticulous search (he was interested in selling to electronics company). So after getting hold of patent person - he got an appointment with Sharp director of research. Demoed it. Nailed it. Rest is raise of Masa. Good luck.

stevenwiles
I can assure you that what you have invented is not as powerful or as useful as you think. If you had something that provided value, people would desire that value.
blackflame7000
Often times with new products people don't understand the value until they start using it. Just because a product hasn't gotten attention yet doesn't necessarily mean the product is not desirable.
insoluble
Indeed a product often has value, but an idea without execution is an untested gamble.
fuzzfactor
If so, then promote the idea as an untested gamble, while scrutinizing the potential gamblers for an individual who is actually more of a wise investor than a risk-taker at heart.
erichocean
You seem to want a payout on too short of a timeframe. If it's that great of an idea, buy Four Steps to the Epiphany, follow the instructions therein, and build a business to extract the value.

Business is fairly easy to learn for an engineer in my experience. And congrats on the breakthrough!

JSeymourATL
> I decided to try just warm / cold emailing a couple dozen VCs / angels...

Your messaging might be subpar. These guys get approached everyday with 'powerful' opportunities.

Turns out there is a sequence to pitch a Big Idea to Croc Brains. On this subject, Oren Klaff is masterful > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=US0kkw6v5Zo

Mz
If it is radically different, you need some solid proof that it really works. Promises of huge jumps in efficiency are typically a whole lot of hot air. So, if you have something truly that powerful, it will inherently by difficult to sell people on the idea. You may need to downplay how awesome it is to get listened to at all.

As others are saying: One possibility is to build a business on it, then get bought out.

corobo
Isn't the entire point behind patenting something so that you can discuss it without worry of someone stealing it?

Cough up the goods or nobody will take you seriously. Every experienced techie has had at least one person with a "great idea" and that are "100% certain" their idea is the next big thing.

etendue
Assuming that you have only filed for a provisoional, the problem is that you have nothing that is of value.

The most valuable IP is a patent which has been successfully defended. Less valuable is an issued patent that has been licensed. Less valuable than that is an issued patent. Less valuable than that is a patent application. The quality of the patent is also major factor of the patent's value. Having a realized implementation is also a major factor in the patent's value.

A provisional patent (N.B., this is not an issued patent nor a patent pending) establishes a priority date, but there's a very long and treacherous road ahead. It's not fait accompli that your patent will be issued, nor that your preferred claims will survive prosecution.