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We're offering this $$$ opp, what would it take to make it worth your while?

10 points by donna ↗ HN
We have an Alpha version of our service, which needs the last 20% development push to get over the hump to begin generating revenues. We're looking to gather 4 more people.

- someone to help do business development - someone to help do PR & marketing materials - couple more LAMP programmers

We can't pay with cash, so how do we find people who are willing to take the risk? We're thinking of a dividend like model, where investment of time = percentage of revenue stream from the system at the get go.

Curious, what would it take to make it worth your while? Thanks!

45 comments

[ 2.9 ms ] story [ 113 ms ] thread
brk
"Worth my while" couldn't be reasonably computed until I knew more about your company, like:

-Anticipated viability of the company and revenue stream predictions

-Effort (in hours) that I would need to contribute to effect a positive outcome

-Financing model of the organization

-Compensation of other employees in a similar position to effect the outcome of the company

These things factor into the "risk", which affects the appropriate "reward". If I could make a major impact on your company by only needing to invest 8 hours per week, it wouldn't be a tough choice to make the decision to attempt to help out. If however it would take 20+ hours per week, then other things/tasks get requeued to make room to help with your startup, that changes what I would need/want to get out of it to make it worth my while...

donna
thanks, helpful input
Hexstream
If I may be so bold, it's not a chat room here. If you agree with some post and don't have anything more substantial to say, consider just upmodding it.
loumf
Usually, yes. But donna is the OP, so I think it's ok for her to acknowledge helpful comments rather than anonymously upmoddng.
rms
And this thread is bringing out a behavior on news.yc that I really don't like -- people downmodding recent comments of the OP because they're mad they can't downmod the post.
Hexstream
Do you think the fault lies in the practitioners, the system, or both? (This is not a rhetoric question.)

And how do you know those downvotes have all to do with the submission and nothing with the comments themselves? Personally I downmodded for lack of relevance.

mrtron
The last 20% tends to be harder and take longer than the first 80%.

Where are the developers from the first 80%?

donna
doing it.. making the architeture happen.. but require more help in debugging, and GUI implementation
tim2
Not the way that I develop. Usually I leave the last 20% for stuff that may actually be rather easy, but just isn't within my expertise or I'm not qualified to do. For example, I may save polishing the design, graphics, copywriting, publicity, and legal for the end since I can just contract most of that out anyway.
tim2
> what would it take to make it worth your while?

1. Alignment of goals - something I really want to see exist in the world?

2. Other people are excited about the product - I tend to feed off of others' encouragement.

3. Belief that this will pay off big.

4. Strong individual recognition for my participation.

5. Those guys already there have to be working at least as intensely as me.

6. Don't want to work with really clueless people.

donna
i agree, i'm looking to work with brillant, innovative people
jyu
you and everyone else
tim2
Personally, I value hard-working as more important. Smart would just be a side effect.
nostrademons
Be brilliant and innovative then. People like to work with people that are just a bit more brilliant than themselves...
mkull
80% of the time is spent in the last 20%. the devil is truly in the details.

Honestly, this post itself is a red flag to me. Please take this post for what its worth (I may very well be wrong), but IMHO if you do not already have the resources necessary to get your startup to market already I think you might be in trouble. Adding people onto a project at the end to get it done, usually ends up in failure. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mythical_Man-Month

Plus, your going to have to be wayyy more descriptive in order to get an accurate guage of interest. Why not talk freely about what/where your service is here? Doing that alone should get you some good feedback

donna
thanks for pointing me to the research, this concept is being modeled for exploration of a knowledge-base. ;-D
ghiotion
That's obviously and English sentence, but I have no friggin' idea what it means.
msiegel
:) The question was hypothetical. Besides being of interest to any small cash-strapped startup, your answers are being used in the construction of an AI system. Knowing the factors that are most important to a venture's contributors will help us determine an algorithm to value the contributions.
thaumaturgy
So, basically, you don't have an alpha version of anything, you don't need a 20% development push, and you're not looking to gather 4 more people. Do you folks have anything to do with YouNoodle, perchance?

Not cool.

[deleted]
(comment deleted)
ghiotion
We're offering this $$$ opp, sell vi@gr@ from home!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Seriously, why is this on the front page? I hate down arrows, but this post makes me desperately wish I had the option.

rms
What is your problem?
ghiotion
I was attempting to point out that this post has all the qualities of spam. It's vague, it uses symbol repitition ($$$), non-standard abbreviations (opp), and seems like a scam.
rms
Perhaps, but donna's been around here for a while, I give her the benefit of the doubt.
ghiotion
Thanks, but you'll understand if I choose not to take my advice from someone who misappropriates Richard Stallman's initials as his user id. Looks like Linus is available. Any takers?

http://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=linus

nostrademons
With linus, you could even claim you were naming it after the cartoon character or chemist and not the uber-hacker. ;-)
rms
It stands for "rupert murdoch sucks." It is an intentional coincidence that it is the same initials as the real rms.
aswanson
I always meant to ask you what it meant. You don't like his comedy "news" channel? It's great if you're into propaganda parodies.
rms
It's kind of a love/hate relationship with the idea that "sucks" is the highest honorific that can be bestowed on someone on the internet.
dcurtis
It's an unintentional parody, which makes it all the more entertaining!
ghiotion
It's confusing, at best, to view yourself in opposition to another human being. You've had an account on here for 369 days and still are comfortable viewing yourself in terms of what you're not. I'm NOT Rupert Murdoch --- 'cause he SUCKS!

It just seems a little... silly.

rms
Yes, it is a joke.
ghiotion
"Oh, I get it! I get jokes." -Homer Simpson
cdr
Reads more like a troll than spam, I think.
falsestprophet
I think that you would have to compensate these new partners with a reasonably large share of stock (of the same class as the founders). I think that you should shop around for people (or a person) who can handle as many of the roles as possible.

I would start by sharing your email address and talking to people who are interested. Good luck.

dualogy
"where investment of time = percentage of revenue stream"

So the longer I take, the higher my percentage? :)

curi
the same thing happens with hourly rates. known problem.
aikiai
It is, and this is one of an equity-driven startup's key advantages over institutionalized competitors. Seems like a bad idea to introduce it at this stage.
curi
it's not obvious which way is better. hours spent working isn't a great approximation of productivity, but it is one.

if you don't use it, you need to gage productivity in some other way. one way this is done is to agree in advance on a price for a certain agreed upon amount of work. but that isn't going to work (at least straightfowardly) for a startup that wants to work in an open-ended, semi-unstructured way.

you can also ignore it. if everyone seems to be working very hard, then that's probably ok. but if some people seem to be working more than others, then it can start causing problems.

jakewolf
Is this a service you'll be selling or are you relying on advertising?

Since you have no cash to pay, I'll take all the revenue generated from the time I start working with you up to 250k/yr. In addition, I'd like a significant equity stake.

The time I put in isn't important. What matters is how many dollars I help the site make.

msiegel
1. Does that mean if you spent 6 months working on it, you would expect $125K from revenues?

2. How would you determine how many dollars you helped the site make?

edw519
I really hate to say it because I like this forum so much, but this is the one kind of thing I DON'T like to see here.

If you're going to be in business with someone, get to know them.

This seems like a pretty good place to get to know people (especially if you can arrange in-person meetings).

Probably not a good place to be "making deals".

One step at a time please.

nostrademons
I'd need to know what it is, and it needs to be something that I believe really, really needs to exist. Usually, anything that's LAMP doesn't qualify unless the LAMP stack is just a backend or accessory to something more exciting.

(Speaking hypothetically, of course. I'm not actually looking for anything - I've just turned down offers from startups that are very, very attractive, because I believe my current startup needs me more.)

Kaizyn
There is a problem with this. All developers are not created equally. It may take me 100 hours to complete a task a more capable programmer only needs 5 to do. In such a situation, I'd acrue more value than the next 3 closest developers.