Ask HN: Do you wear ear protection or noise cancelling headphones while working?
I am considering purchasing Bose's noise cancelling headphones to block out constant street noise while I work. Is that overkill given that I do not plan to listen to audio ? Has anyone tried earmuffs worn at gun ranges instead and if so are they uncomfortable if worn for prolonged periods ?
Just to share, there is a loud traffic control device right by my office window that plays a cuckoo sound whenever the north/south walk light is on. It plays from 6AM to midnight at wildly varying volume levels. I find it comically ironic that I am slowly losing my mind to the sound of a cuckoo.
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[ 4.0 ms ] story [ 120 ms ] threadI've been playing brown noise or something similar through them on top of the active noise cancellation. I use my own command-line program [1] or Noisli in Chrome for this.
Yes, it feels kind of wasteful to buy premium headphones for the express purpose of not listening to music, but this is the best solution I've come up for working in an open office.
I'd be interested to hear how others handle this problem, as I've always been very sensitive to noise and can program way more effectively when background noise is minimal and consistent, like a fan.
[1]: https://github.com/tedmiston/zero-noise
Beyond that, it's hard to imagine a better reasonable solution than noise-cancelling headphones. I first got a pair in college, when I was editing and writing grant proposals while living with roommates who often (and reasonably) wanted to watch movies, hang out with friends, etc.
I ask because I've used some HD202s for five years now in the office, and when listening to low/normal levels of music, I literally cannot hear a person standing next to me saying my name loudly; people have to tap my shoulder all the time. Even with no music at all, they remove a lot of sound/noise and I have to take them off to talk to people.
I'm now looking to upgrade to the ~$150 AKG K271s, these are closed back recording studio headphones specifically designed to not bleed whatever you are listening to into the microphone you are singing into. I'm told they give a good comfort boost over the HD202s, which are a bit uncomfortable after 3-4 hours, as well as a sound quality boost.
The same goes for professional DJ headphones; imagine the need for sound isolation for someone doing live mixing of music at a nightclub. Neither DJs nor studio applications make use of active noise cancelling, which tells me you can get very far without it.
The main difference between my Beyerdynamic DT770 and the Bose QC25 are:
1. Without any music playing but with active NC on, the QC25 feel like open-back headphones. The feel is airy and like a weight is lifted from your ears in the QC25 vs. muffled/dull/pressured in the DT770. You can sort of hear your the blood in your ears pumping in the closed-back DT770, a bit like what you would hear in a seashell. If you turn off the NC, the QC25 is about the same as the DT770 without sound. If you go back to your HD202s after having used NC for an hour or so, you'll immediately notice the difference.
2. Sound quality is much worse in the QC25, it's not even close. No rich lows, no clear highs, it's just a mess. Still, it's usable.
3. However, the killer feature is that with the QC25 you can listen at extremely low volume (think 1 bar on the iPhone) and still hear the music clearly. On the DT770 you have to play the music louder, and I find that very quiet music is better for focusing.
Are you sure point 3 is not mainly that the QC25 has much lower impedance (I think 32 Ohms) versus the DT770 which is much harder to drive?
[1] Which for the DT770 is more bars on the iPhone, although I usually use a USB DAC/Amp to drive them.
There are a number of different types out there, including ones that can be custom-molded to your ear canals for maximum comfort and sound reduction.
For the price of a new pair of Bose headphones, you could buy hundreds of pairs of ear plugs or even a handful of custom molded musicians earplugs.
In any case custom tips aren't that expensive relative to the benefits, so it's something I'm considering.
I don't play in these kinds of situations often enough to warrant paying 200-800 for a pair of custom molds and drivers, but I know people who do. I have been told that the main benefit of custom molds is better (higher-fidelity) bass response and are typically more comfortable, and typically more expensive IEMs will also have more drivers for different bands in the audio spectrum.
As far as noise isolation, the Shure's are plenty good enough for listening to low-volume music while, say mowing the lawn.
Or, if the drummer is being annoying in a rehearsal I have unplugged them to great relief.
Isolation doesn't, I think, get much better-- there is a lot of conduction through other pathways than the ear canal.
After I played around with a couple different tips (these are very inexpensive) I found that my ear canals differ slightly in size ;)
Mainly I used the foam tips which isolated extremely well vs triple flange tips, but were very uncomfortable to wear for more than ~2 hours. Is that something you've noticed too?
I think that going with smaller is more comfortable, as are the foam ones. Yeah, they are uncomfortable for long periods of time, but I got used to it after a while and fiddling with the sized helped.
I am not sure how healthy it is to wear them for long periods of time.
The real difference is comfort. I can wear customs all day without experiencing any ear fatigue. Cable micro-phonics are also much quieter.
(Yes, gun range ear mufflers will work, but you might look awkward. I have a sets of those when I really need to concentrate)
Here's my recommendation:
Shure SE215-K. In ear studio monitor. amazing noise blocking ability, and, you can play some music to boot. I have literally wore mine down from years of office/motorcycle/road trip use. They have replaceable cables too.
Caveat: These can be uncomfortable for prolonged use (I'm talking ~20 hour road trips) as they're in-ear, but seriously get a set. Now that they're $99 on amazon, vs. the $299 I paid for them years prior -- it's a no brainer. In fact, I'm going to get another set this very moment.
Headphones without music (which apparently is the topic of discussion) should be fine.
https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=headphones+hearin...
The links you provide seem to all talk about excessive noise.
Do you have anything that talks specifically about reduced volume long duration headphone wearing?
Despite listening to a lot of music, some of it quite loudly, I've no perceived hearing loss. Can still hear whispers, distant conversations, and feint sounds that many people can't even hear at all.
Everything I've read on heading loss indicates that managing listening duration relative to the loudness of the source is critical. There's charts for this that'll tell you exactly how long you need to listen at a specific volume for damage to occur.
You can crank it up for a song or two, provided it's followed by a break or significantly reduced volume. Similarly you can very briefly remove ear protection close to the stage at live venues. It's all about breaks, protection, and managing duration.
If you listen to music all day at the same volume, I'm sure it's very possible to unknowingly build tolerance and do some damage. Fortunately my mind tends to burn out on music long before my ears do.
Slightly off topic, but there's a similar risk with live music. One of my first live shows, I forgot my ear plugs and ended up too close to one of the speakers. Didn't really bother me until the next day when I awoke to my ears ringing. Fortunately it cleared fast with seemingly no permanent damage, but I was lucky. I'd say 95% of people at live shows have zero hearing protection.
On that note, if you ever forget your ear plugs at a show, just periodically plug one ear at a time with a finger for 30+ seconds every few minutes (or whatever keeps you comfortable). You might look stupid, but it'll save you.
The noise cancellation is excellent, the audio quality is acceptable to me (perhaps audiophiles are more finicky) and it also works nicely as a wireless bluetooth headset for phone calls. It's replaced my audio 'phones and my phone headset, and I'm getting a bluetooth transmitter for my digital piano so I can practice the piano wirelessly :)
Most of the time I don't play any audio through my Bose 'phones but use them simply as a silencer during the working day; I can't really concentrate with music playing. It's a premium priced product, but well supported and seems to be good quality construction and top engineering. The design is over-the-ear and the ear cushions are very soft and luxurious.
They're rechargeable and last at least all day on a charge. This turned into a mini-review but that merely reflects my enthusiasm at having found a good silencing headset at last :)
I wore industrial grade earmuffs and earplugs most all day long when I did metal work. That's not the same as wearing them in an office environment all day but I didn't find earmuffs terribly uncomfortable and I just looked at few newer models that look pretty close in design and weight as the Bose headset for about $30.
Both plugs and muffs have pros and cons. Plugs are less conspicuous, and muffs are easier to get on and off.
My own experience is that they work about the same (if both are high quality) and I generally wore both when doing metal work because the loud hammering and grinding I did was especially damaging to our hearing and there was a very noticeable difference than when using only one of those.
The earplugs I used were made out of "memory foam" (like the bed mattresses use). There are other types I tried but they were not near as good.
http://m.homedepot.com/p/3M-Orange-Disposable-Ear-Plugs-80-P...
edit: forgot the link http://imgur.com/a/2ahUx
http://remoteaudio.com/products/hearing/high-noise-headset/
they seem to be available at several online stores and are fairly comfortable to wear, although at work I prefer simple foam earplugs.
edit: here's a similar pair: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PELTOR-ear-defenders-H61FA-/182424...
From HBR [2]:
> 3. Mask the sound by increasing background noise. It seems counter-intuitive, but adding more sound to an environment can actually make it seem quieter. Research suggests that noise itself isn’t distracting, but unwanted speech noise is. However, words that are incomprehensible are less likely to be distracting. By adding a continuous, low-level ambient sound to an environment (such as white noise, which sounds similar to the sound of airflow), sound masking can help make conversations for listeners that aren’t intended to hear them unintelligible, and therefore much easier to ignore.
It also raises the interesting point as to why I find it so easy to work at coffee shops in foreign countries.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_masking
[2]: https://hbr.org/2015/03/stop-noise-from-ruining-your-open-of...
My co-worker has them and likes them. They're basically earmuffs + audio
https://www.amazon.com/Ear-Defense-3000-Muffs-Earplugs/dp/B0...
They even sell some as pretty decent headphones:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004U4A5RU
Re: comfort, you will have to try a few pairs to see which ones are best for you; most seem to be designed more for safety and maintaining a seal than for wearing all day without fatigue.
I use such a pair at work: https://www.amazon.com/3M-Peltor-Over-Earmuffs-X5A/dp/B01MG1...
They are pretty uncomfortable at first, but I've gotten used to them. They are like focus pills for me -- I put them on, then take them off and suddenly realize two hours have passed.
I am interested in these "ex arm ear protectors" that roryisok mentions.
They are a combination of earplug and speaker, giving you the benefits of both. Good IEMs [0] will attenuate the surrounding sound by up to 25db (for comparison good earmuffs/earplugs are in the 30-35db range, closed back/over ear headphones with a good seal are in the 5-10db range), and provide high quality music when you want it.
The down side is that, like earplugs, they can be a bit uncomfortable to use until you're used to them. I tend to listen to either music or just pink/brown noise [1] through them, and I can't hear a thing going on in the office - even when they're doing construction.
If you really want to go all out, you can combine earmuffs with music - there are ranges from some inexpensive 3m ones (some of which include a radio, others a 3.5mm jack), up to those used by pilots and ground crew. They're also in the 25db reduction range; I have an old pair of David Clarks which are insane (though heavy, they're made to wear all day).
[0] Shure and Westone make some great IEMs; make sure to pick up some memory foam tips.
[1] I usually use the heavy rain sounds in the "White Noise" app, but there are free generation websites out there too.
No connection to the above but as a pleased consumer. I don't know if the above will suit audiophile purists--I love good music but more for the "intelligent conversation & expression" aspect than the purity of reproduction, so YMMV.
(I look forward to reading others' comments here...but it's been a day already so I'm posting first in case it's useful to anyone.)
This combo works for me much better than the friendly Bose noise-cancelling headphones I bought ~2000 (which, or others like them, also might be much better now). But I read that the noise-cancelling concept is weak for ambient (eg office) noise, because it is not constant enough for the cancellation mechanism to pick it up and block it all fast enough. So it is more like for airplane engine noise which is more constant.