If I'm reading this correctly, Comcast will charge someone if that have 2 boxes that can watch TV from their account, no matter what kind of boxes they are. Roku just happens to now have an app that can act as a cable box.
Except the whole idea was that they weren't supposed to be charging people bringing their own box. BYOD was one of many things the cable companies agreed to over the years, that was the whole point. You shouldn't be forced to rent a box from the company just to receive service. That was one of many reasons AT&T got smacked down so hard.
> But now it's pretty unlikely Trump's FCC will call them out on it.
Maybe at the federal level, but nothing is stopping the states from intervening.
When Comcast and Time Warner Cable were planning on merging, New York State hinted that they would consider blocking the merger (within New York) if it went through. Ultimately the deal fell apart before the FCC had a chance to announce their decision, let alone NYS, but it's definitely possible for that to happen here.
I think it's safe to assume that a greater percentage of Trump voters are cable TV subscribers than non-Trump voters. So I don't see the problem; the Trump supporters are getting what they voted for.
Voters. Trump was elected (indirectly) by the voters. Nearly half the electorate voted for him. The EC only meant that he didn't need a popular majority nationwide, just majorities in particular states where the EC gives voters more power due to lower populations.
As much as many people would have liked it, the EC did not go against the wishes of the voters in their states.
I think they would argue they are in compliance and actually give you credit for bringing your own box. They are instead charging for an extra endpoint that you can use to watch TV. That would traditionally be an extra $9.99 for an extra box, but will be $7.49 if you are using a Roku.
If you don't like the way the company treats you as a (potential) customer, then don't subscribe to their service.
This isn't like AT&T. For one thing, cable television is a luxury service, not a necessity for modern life like telecommunications (telephones back in AT&T/Ma Bell's days, cellular + internet these days). Secondly, the regulatory environment back then was rather different. These days, the government doesn't really believe in strong regulation, and we've elected a new administration and Congress who greatly oppose regulation, even more than the previous ones.
So again, if you don't like it, you don't have to buy it. And if you're mad that the government isn't reining in a monopoly, you can blame your fellow voters for that.
It only "makes sense" from the perspective that users are not allowed to have zero set top boxes from the provider themselves. And that's because the cable companies fought FCC's proposal to allow any set top box to act as the main set top box.
My point is, the same people who now use Roku likely don't want the Comcast box. They want to use Roku as the one and only box, but Comcast charges them "for having two", even though they leave these customers no choice but to use two since the first one is mandatory.
The worst offender I've found so far is that Comcast blocks HBO GO on Tivo. I can use HBO GO on one of the smart TVs, and if you have another cable provider you can use HBO GO on the Tivo, but for some reason, Comcast won't authorize HBO GO on Tivo. I'm pretty sure this is because Tivo actually supports Comcast on-demand which includes the full catalog of HBO GO, but it's frustrating because the on-demand app is very basic, and uses one of the tuners on the main system. Because it has to re-encode one of the live tuners, it tends to be a little bit more buggy on the Tivo mini boxes that we have spread around the house.
Overall, if it wasn't for Comcast on-demand being supported on Tivo, we'd just switch to FiOS and keep the Tivo system, which works marvelously. As it is on-demand is just too convenient for catching up on recent episodes of a show if you forget to Tivo it.
Assuming you have a router that you control (i.e. not the modem/router Comcast rents you), I don't understand how this is possible from a technical standpoint. How would your ISP know that a device on your network was a TiVO? Do they just blanket null route hbogo[dot]com? Does anyone have the details?
Edit: Do you know that you can set a 'season pass' on your TiVO for any show? Personally, I'm just aggressive and set-up any show as a season pass
Yeah the problem is you sign in to HBO Go through Comcast. HBO Go has the flow of going to the HBO website and typing in a ~5 character code that shows up on your TV. On the HBO Go activation page, it asks what your device is, and if you're signed in with Comcast, HBO won't let you activate a TiVO, but you are allowed to activate smart TVs, Apple TV, Amazon TV, etc.
I see. Thanks for explaining this process. It seems to me that this problem goes away if you were to simply sign up for HBO Go directly, instead of through your CSP. Then sign up for DirecTV or Dish instead (base package only).
I watch about 1-2 hours before bed and lately it's mostly netflix. I just like cable for live sports. Other than than I listen to it tv in the background while I play with my 1 year old. Can't really do much else 6 months of the year due to weather.
The only real reason I wanted to stream to chromecast is that my treadmill has a tv and use it during lunch.
Why does it matter to Comcast whether I watch on one, two, or fifteen TVs in my house? It doesn't cost them any more money (aside from the initial in-house cabling and splitters)
> Why does it matter to Comcast whether I watch on one, two, or fifteen TVs in my house? It doesn't cost them any more money (aside from the initial in-house cabling and splitters)
Because it's something that you value, and they have the ability to charge for it. So they do. It has nothing to do with their own cost function.
In an uncompetitive market (which largely describes the residential cable market, at least to a first-order approximation), there is no pressure for the price to converge to the average cost[0] of delivering the service.
[0] economic cost - ie, including opportunity costs
> ... there were 99.44 million cable plus households, which includes wired cable, telco and satellite subscribers, ...
I have a cable subscription that I never use. It's not HD so it doesn't even compete with my digital antenna. Why do I have a cable subscription that I don't use? Comcast continuously provides promotional packages with cable that are cheaper than regular internet-only packages. I think practices like this artificially inflate that number, quite a bit.
On the flip side, I have a Netflix subscription I use for less than a movie a month, and about a 20 hour burst when House of Cards is back. I tried looking for better data than I quoted but there's not much :(
Funny thing is, with MythTV and an HDHomerun attached to a broadcast antenna, I'm scooping up more TV than I can keep up with. Why pay for cable?
Of course, watching it this way does require some advance planning, periodically checking program listings for interesting things and setting recording schedules, but it's nice to be able to arrange TV to fit my schedule instead of arranging my schedule to fit TV.
Granted, I do miss out on some things (in particular, many Blackhawks games are on CSN) but that's their loss - for me, they've priced themselves out of the market.
That being said, the Mythbuntu distro is basically dead at this point due to developer attrition. [2]
I'd like to find something simpler that still had MythTV's editing and commercial flagging without the extra baggage. After all, it dates back to analog TV with V4L, and has a whole lot of extra cruft that Kodi renders redundant.
I was doing that too, until my dual-tuner ATSC capture box from Silicon Dust died. Fine, I thought, I'll just buy another. Nope! Not available for sale anywhere, and I haven't found a comparable product from another vendor (network-attached ATSC receiver).
I may break down and try out TabloTV, but that requires you to use their own apps. Sigh
Well, I'll be darned. That wasn't in stock anywhere the last few times I looked. That's the model I had which previously failed. I guess I'll give it another try.
One common problem with the SiliconDust boxes (though it hasn't happened to me, knock on wood) is wall-wart failure. No doubt another example of Capacitor Plague. (rant) I can't help but wonder how many tons of perfectly good electronics get landfilled because of crap caps. (/rant)
If you still have the old box, try the new power supply with it, provided it's the same voltage and provides sufficient current.[1] Merely checking the supply with a voltmeter isn't sufficient.
> the fees assessed will be the same as if you chose to bring your own CableCARD-compatible device to the service, like a TiVo.
I've looked into this before, and TiVo is the ONLY device that accepts CableCard and output to HDMI. There is no competition. Everything else is a tuner, that outputs to your network, which is not same because it requires a PC to receive the signal.
I have a used, non-subscription, TiVo box that allows me to watch Comcast TV through a CableCard. The benefit is that I can watch local channels in HD through the TiVo. If I used a Comcast box, I'd have to pay extra for HD programming and an HD box.
I guess this Roku app would now be an alternative to that hack.
Yeah, sadly there are limitations on "protected" channels and the FCC seems to be moving away from forcing a consistent and open set top box model. I just punted and cancelled cable altogether. I should probably sell that HDHomeRun Prime I have sitting around collecting dust. LOL.
Nope not the same. This, like all the other products, is a NETWORK tuner. Meaning, the signal comes out to a cat5. So you need a "PC" to receive the signal.
The TiVo has a HDMI-out, so you can hook it directly to your TV.
I won't trust it. Why? I want to watch NBA games and I do so via the NBC Sports Roku app. It is the worst streaming experience I have ever had. Some of the problems:
* randomly degrades to unwatchable resolutions at least once during a game (and immediately switching to Netflix or Amazon or doing traceroutes on my network show the problem isn't mine).
* it randomly goes back in time, sometimes 5-10 minutes and you can't FF.
* it both allows live viewing of games and replays. For replays, FF does not work. It pretends to work, but when you find your spot it randomly skips forward and backward.
* when you start it, it automatically plays a commercial (for me, for Honda). Even if you stop streaming and go right back in (to fix problems caused by the above), it plays the commercial.
* the commercials clip the game play. Often when live action is rejoined, a minute or two have been missed of the game.
Comcast is terrible. I hate them. They have a monopoly on the NBA team I love. I hate them.
I love the NBC sports apps (though mostly use with my chromecast which causes them to be delayed somewhat).
It's how I am able to keep up with the wizards/capitals while living in the bay area (where media monopoly actually helps me). I wish fox sports go worked the same way (but it only lets you watch what you can see based on geographic area, not based on what your cable subscription would give you access to)
the commercial thing hasn't bit me with the CSN-MA broadcasts though I see the commercials (thy might be better at syncing the commercials correctly), but I have seen it on things like MLB-TV as well. It's a function of how these streaming services sell ad)
So, basically you have to pay an extra fee to use a streaming app. No thanks. The STB rental fees must be a huge part of their income because they are so dead set on keeping them even when you aren't renting anything from them. Even the crappily-implemented CableCARD made some bit of sense to treat as a rental because you were essentially renting an auth dongle from them but a software application? You've got to be kidding me.
The main reason I stream torrents on my second TV (even though like 98% of the content is stuff that I could watch on the cable package I pay for) is because I don't want to rent yet another box just to watch something in another room. This is yet another example of how the box isn't just to address a technical need but rather a cash cow that you can't get around paying for.
61 comments
[ 4.5 ms ] story [ 143 ms ] threadSeems pretty normal to me.
Maybe at the federal level, but nothing is stopping the states from intervening.
When Comcast and Time Warner Cable were planning on merging, New York State hinted that they would consider blocking the merger (within New York) if it went through. Ultimately the deal fell apart before the FCC had a chance to announce their decision, let alone NYS, but it's definitely possible for that to happen here.
Obama and Wheeler had proposed a universal cablebox rule, but later decided having a device with an "app" was instead acceptable.
The FCC had tried to mandate a universal receiver box in the 1970s.
It is a Trump issue.
As much as many people would have liked it, the EC did not go against the wishes of the voters in their states.
Are you telling me an app on a Roku is the equivalent?
If we can buy our own DOCSIS modems, why can't we buy our own cablebox?
http://www.businessinsider.com/fcc-cable-box-vote-2016-2
http://www.businessinsider.com/fcc-cable-box-new-proposal-ap...
This isn't like AT&T. For one thing, cable television is a luxury service, not a necessity for modern life like telecommunications (telephones back in AT&T/Ma Bell's days, cellular + internet these days). Secondly, the regulatory environment back then was rather different. These days, the government doesn't really believe in strong regulation, and we've elected a new administration and Congress who greatly oppose regulation, even more than the previous ones.
So again, if you don't like it, you don't have to buy it. And if you're mad that the government isn't reining in a monopoly, you can blame your fellow voters for that.
My point is, the same people who now use Roku likely don't want the Comcast box. They want to use Roku as the one and only box, but Comcast charges them "for having two", even though they leave these customers no choice but to use two since the first one is mandatory.
It may be normal for a cable company to nickle and dime their subscribers, but it's still frustrating.
The "Comcast TV" app for iOS and Android is basically the same thing as the Roku app and doesn't cost extra.
Overall, if it wasn't for Comcast on-demand being supported on Tivo, we'd just switch to FiOS and keep the Tivo system, which works marvelously. As it is on-demand is just too convenient for catching up on recent episodes of a show if you forget to Tivo it.
I would overdose on blood pressure meds.
Edit: Do you know that you can set a 'season pass' on your TiVO for any show? Personally, I'm just aggressive and set-up any show as a season pass
Why almost? Do it. I haven't had cable for over 10 years. There are plenty of better things to do other than watch hours of TV every night.
The only real reason I wanted to stream to chromecast is that my treadmill has a tv and use it during lunch.
Because it's something that you value, and they have the ability to charge for it. So they do. It has nothing to do with their own cost function.
In an uncompetitive market (which largely describes the residential cable market, at least to a first-order approximation), there is no pressure for the price to converge to the average cost[0] of delivering the service.
[0] economic cost - ie, including opportunity costs
[0] http://www.broadcastingcable.com/news/currency/nielsen-pay-t...
I have a cable subscription that I never use. It's not HD so it doesn't even compete with my digital antenna. Why do I have a cable subscription that I don't use? Comcast continuously provides promotional packages with cable that are cheaper than regular internet-only packages. I think practices like this artificially inflate that number, quite a bit.
Of course, watching it this way does require some advance planning, periodically checking program listings for interesting things and setting recording schedules, but it's nice to be able to arrange TV to fit my schedule instead of arranging my schedule to fit TV.
Granted, I do miss out on some things (in particular, many Blackhawks games are on CSN) but that's their loss - for me, they've priced themselves out of the market.
That being said, the Mythbuntu distro is basically dead at this point due to developer attrition. [2]
I'd like to find something simpler that still had MythTV's editing and commercial flagging without the extra baggage. After all, it dates back to analog TV with V4L, and has a whole lot of extra cruft that Kodi renders redundant.
[1] https://www.mythtv.org/news [2] http://www.mythbuntu.org/home/news/mythbuntusolongandthanksf...
I may break down and try out TabloTV, but that requires you to use their own apps. Sigh
https://www.amazon.com/SiliconDust-HDHomeRun-CONNECT-broadca...
If you still have the old box, try the new power supply with it, provided it's the same voltage and provides sufficient current.[1] Merely checking the supply with a voltmeter isn't sufficient.
[1] https://forum.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=192...
I've looked into this before, and TiVo is the ONLY device that accepts CableCard and output to HDMI. There is no competition. Everything else is a tuner, that outputs to your network, which is not same because it requires a PC to receive the signal.
I have a used, non-subscription, TiVo box that allows me to watch Comcast TV through a CableCard. The benefit is that I can watch local channels in HD through the TiVo. If I used a Comcast box, I'd have to pay extra for HD programming and an HD box.
I guess this Roku app would now be an alternative to that hack.
1. https://www.silicondust.com/product/hdhomerun-prime/
Silicondust would like a word, sir: https://www.silicondust.com/product/hdhomerun-prime/
>Everything else is a PC-required tuner, which is not same.
"HDHomeRun streams to DLNA compatible devices on your network" - HD Homerun Prime website
The TiVo has a HDMI-out, so you can hook it directly to your TV.
* randomly degrades to unwatchable resolutions at least once during a game (and immediately switching to Netflix or Amazon or doing traceroutes on my network show the problem isn't mine).
* it randomly goes back in time, sometimes 5-10 minutes and you can't FF.
* it both allows live viewing of games and replays. For replays, FF does not work. It pretends to work, but when you find your spot it randomly skips forward and backward.
* when you start it, it automatically plays a commercial (for me, for Honda). Even if you stop streaming and go right back in (to fix problems caused by the above), it plays the commercial.
* the commercials clip the game play. Often when live action is rejoined, a minute or two have been missed of the game.
Comcast is terrible. I hate them. They have a monopoly on the NBA team I love. I hate them.
It's how I am able to keep up with the wizards/capitals while living in the bay area (where media monopoly actually helps me). I wish fox sports go worked the same way (but it only lets you watch what you can see based on geographic area, not based on what your cable subscription would give you access to)
the commercial thing hasn't bit me with the CSN-MA broadcasts though I see the commercials (thy might be better at syncing the commercials correctly), but I have seen it on things like MLB-TV as well. It's a function of how these streaming services sell ad)
The main reason I stream torrents on my second TV (even though like 98% of the content is stuff that I could watch on the cable package I pay for) is because I don't want to rent yet another box just to watch something in another room. This is yet another example of how the box isn't just to address a technical need but rather a cash cow that you can't get around paying for.
What is incentive to the consumer for using a Roku instead of a second set-top box then?