Ask HN: How to not bring emotion from work back home?
Even after working so many years. I still get moment that I want to snap. Any way to not bring emotion from work back home?
Workout usually will just make me more angry.
Meditation/music can only help when you are not at the edge point.
Talk to people helps. But one person can only bear with you for so much. Even though it is a good friend/love you very much.
Even tried chatbot. Again, not working when at the edge point.
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[ 4.4 ms ] story [ 278 ms ] threadIf you wrote it all down, do you think it would make logical sense?
Sometimes I'm just over emotional. Sometimes the place I'm working isn't a good fit. If it's not a good fit, I also find that my emotions get out of control as well.
If things are building, figure out what is building them and try to change that. Little things can make someone crazy for a few days, but if it's every day, it might be depression or burnout. If your stress never goes away and just keeps building on itself, it's likely depression or burnout.
Talking to a professional might help, very least it feels like you are taking action to make it better. They might be able to help you frame and understand what is bothering you.
You might also try working on this nutritionally. I have recently had good results with upping my consumption of vitamin C to get excess anger under control.
Sometimes it does just take some time to decompress, no matter what you're spending that time doing.
I don't think music will be particularly helpful, but meditation, specifically mindfulness meditation, will be most effective when you are at the edge. Try practicing for 10 minutes a day, and then when you are on the edge try your best to really feel the stress and experience it. Your goal is to build your tolerance to it, which you can only do by not running from it. It's just like working out: you need to practice and you'll get stronger. The 10 minutes a day of practice when you're not on the edge will help you build up to being able to be truly present when you are on the edge.
Having an enjoyable commute helps me a lot. A long walk or pleasant bus ride (with optional music) is time to process emotions and to create a mental break between work and home.
Meditation can also help -- not as a solution at the moment when you're angry, but as a habit that can improve your mindfulness and ability to deal with your own emotions.
My last resort is distraction - reading a book or watching a movie or TV show I know will be engrossing. An hour or two later, the frustration has usually dissipated.
That said, if you're experiencing rage that you can't control, or are on the edge of "snapping" - whether into rage or depression or whatever - I agree with the previous poster who suggested you seek mental health services.
A good therapist can help you come up with better outlets and coping mechanisms, or help you identify what in your life you need to change to avoid circumstances that trigger such frustration. It may take a few tries to find someone who works well with you, so don't get discouraged if the first person you try isn't a good fit.
You need to find a new job, plain and simple.
If it's your 10th job and you are feeling like this still, you have to figure out if it is bad luck (it does happen) or if it's something with you. Either way, it is sort of you, since you managed to keep finding and stepping into jobs you are unhappy at. Certainly, a hint or two during the interviewing stage was overlooked.
Or you could have just chosen the wrong career. Simply changing jobs may not be enough.
I think much of the bad stress we get in jobs comes from our deeper understanding that the work is pretty pointless or simply unimportant to us. The idea of that (pointless) thing being who we are for most of our waking life is maddening.
Also, few of us are in high status positions at work (simply because of the typical hierarchical structure) even if the job or company is prestigious. Being in a low status role creates significant fatigue, stress, and anxiety, and is often the hardest to shake off at the end of the day when we are around true equals such as friends or loved ones.
So the best thing to do is to find work that feels more like play. But if you can't manage to do that, at least force yourself to play a bit after work to take the edge off. I recommend against making it about food or drink, since indulging provides a psychological salve that mutes the stress but does not truly evict it from your consciousness the way play does.
For instance, I have had band mates who were voluntarily homeless, or who really just don't get the whole idea of showing up somewhere for regular paid employment. Some are certifiably crazy. The problems that are so urgent to me, they react with curious amusement, or just don't even give a rat's arse.
Noting another post in the thread, the regulars at the bar are probably another such culture.
If not, find a job that doesn't stress you out?
The only answer for me has been to find better jobs, or, better yet, taking long periods of time away from work entirely.
Here are a couple users who spoke about it
https://pavlok.com/blog/how-to-reduce-negative-thoughts-and-...
https://pavlok.com/blog/alex-t-kicked-anger-problem/
If all jobs make you feel like this then the problems deeper, either find something YOU want to do, like making a chatbot that would really help in this situation or maybe just forget about work, take early retirement, go see the world.
Life is too short to waste it on something making you angry.
My advice is see a therapist on a somewhat regular basis; we are quick to ensure that we always keep our bodies in check and healthy but rarely do we consider that perhaps mental therapy is also something we should do regularly. You've said it yourself, talking to people helps; my suggestion is see a therapist, it is their job to help you gain introspection and be your guide; and in general give you a safe space to express how you really feel and what's activating it (good or bad, ups and downs). It's helpful to have multiple people that you can lean on for this thing, a therapist might help guide you towards creating a community of people that you rely on.
Life coaching is just bad therapy from unqualified people. And they are often part of MLM schemes or associate themselves with (other) swindlers to part you from even more of your money.
From what I could tell, she basically operated like a personal cheerleader. She didn't have any particularly sage advice, instead she just would repeat mantras about motivation.
She was baffled that I accomplished my goals, since I'm such a cynical person that I had to be self-defeating.
Now I'm definitely extremely cynical, but I don't think it's particularly wrong to look at an entire industry based around masturbatory self-interest and think that it's not sustainable and mostly exists to justify a decision to live in continual near-poverty.
Here's a fun one -- go up to anyone at one of these digital nomad events and ask them how much of a balance they are carrying on their credit cards from month-to-month. I think maybe 1 in 10 people I met had more cash than credit card debt. Maybe 1 in 25 had anything saved for retirement.
I know, I'm a wet blanket.
Interesting how you know so much about things you cannot observe.
I think we should just admit that therapists have two modes - an acute mode for treating the mentally ill, and a "personal trainer" mode. With the latter, therapists do the same for the mind that personal trainers do for the body: they teach you to feel and occupy your mind so you best know how to gain strength, avoid injury, and move with economy and grace. They catch bad postures and minor twinges before they lead to strain and injury. They identify and strengthen weak points in order to keep the whole thing in balance.
You can live without a therapist-trainer just like you can live life without a personal trainer. But those lucky enough to have one will live a life with less injury and hardship, and have accomplishment and contentment within easier reach.
People in "life-long therapy" tend to be the objects of ridicule. But IMO many of them (maybe unconsciously?) are actually onto something - that lifelong therapy is actually a pretty good idea. Maybe they keep coming back not because they are self-involved and enjoy drama, but because they've found that, even though they can do without just fine, they do much better with.
I've seen a therapist, again for anger issues, for an extended period of time. Have never regretted it. A couple of points that I'd make in general that may or may not be useful:
First off, there's things you have a right to be angry about and things you don't. In the latter category, it's okay to feel angry, but it might be worth delving deeper into why that is. In the former, again it's okay to be angry but you want to think about what you can do to get yourself out of it. My wife just switched jobs for this reason.
Second, society pulls a real number on men's mental health. Plenty of emotions are considered weak and not appropriate for men. This gets re-routed to the acceptable emotions, notably anger. It's worth thinking about how this effects you.
Third, sometimes you're not angry about what you think you're angry about. Therapy really helps in these situations.
Fourth: it's ok to be angry. It's not okay to take the anger out on people. It's also really hard not to if you're constantly angry like I was. Apologise, a lot. The apologies will start to sound thin pretty quick unless you're taking concrete steps to do something about it, but in any event, always be sorry.
To be truly human, means to feel the entire spectrum of emotion; to allow yourself to experience the good and the bad and to be okay with that. Therapy is about introspection, gaining awareness, and understanding impermanence, and the built-in analogy machine we call our brain - driven by the fading memories and experiences of the past.
When you understand that memory is a physiological experience, and that your mind is an analogy machine, then everything you experience - good and bad - has some consequential association with something you previously experienced.
Therapy, at least for me, is about keeping pace with that analogy machine and giving some grace to what it means to be human.
My answer, when I've been in a situation like this, is to literally talk out loud to myself about what I value and what I care about.
We only get upset about things that we care about. And we only get the most upset about the things that we care about the most.
I had a much more angry, frustrated life when I was a professional violinist than I've ever had as a software developer. When I would play some bad gig for a few bucks and some clown conductor would show up and ruin this piece of music that I spent my life studying, it would make me rage. Or if one of the other violinists in the orchestra I was sitting next to was fucking up and ruining things. . . again, rage. WHY ARE YOU RUINING MY ART, YOU SICK, IRRESPONSIBLE FUCK?!
Or if I was playing a solo with an orchestra that wasn't so hot. Ugh. Why are you doing this to Brahms?
It's genuinely hard to figure this out when you really care about something.
I ended up quitting music as a profession and going into software. I care about the companies that I've worked for, and I care about my role in that and the quality of the code I write. But it's not my life. And I still play my violin with a few groups in NYC. That's not my life either.
I think it boils down to understanding the difference between the means to an end and the end itself.
If you love software the way I love Brahms, great. But don't expect to get that love expressed or respected at work. Recognize the role that work has in your life. It's a means to an end. It's not the end itself. It's a way to get to do the things you love to do with your family.
I decided a long time ago that doing the things that I love the way they should (in my opinion) be done, was up to me. For me that was music. And to a certain extent it has become writing software.
In my mind, a job is a thing that you do, and do well and passionately, for the purpose of supporting the things that you really care about. Maybe it's family, maybe it's writing a novel, maybe it's being a dancer. Who knows.
Again, I want to be careful about the way that I phrase this, but it sounds to me that you have a priority issue.
You need to decide what's really important to you. When you figure that out, I suspect everything else will fall into place.
I'm sorry you are going though this, and I hope you come out of it in a better place. I could be totally and completely wrong, but I don't think there's any little ritual that's going to fix this. You just have to make decisions about what is worth caring about.
Is it your current job, or is it your family?
Anger is caused by frustration is caused by desire.
People who dont give a damn about their jobs clock out at 4:56 and rest easy. The people who burn out or 'snap' are the ones whom take the most pride in their work. Learn to care less about your job.
If you already have the emotions built up, then simply recognize that fact and take them apart. Writing letters you dont send works pretty well.
This. This 100x over. Present your opinions, back them up with data / rationale, and if they don't go with them: water off a duck's back. It's their mistake if it works out poorly, or you learn something new if it works out great.
If you have employers that don't let you practice this "giving fewer fucks" attitude, or hold it against you wrt career progression, that's when you start looking for somewhere else to work. No employees should have to physically or emotionally harm themselves as a part of their job. If it's not your company (you don't have founder-level equity) then it's not worth your health. It's arguably NEVER worth your health, even if you are a founder.
However, I cannot stop noticing that all the worst traits of the software industry start with the talented professionals amoungst us "caring less" about their jobs; and then the bozos running the show are free to go around wanking their minds and fucking up everything for everyone. If you ask the authors of every monstrosity out there, they will claim the Nuremberg defense, pennies to peanuts!
The best way to "train" for this is to take a long cruise or other far away vacation. I took a transatlantic, 7 nights no Internet. Well I could have Internet paid in minutes at legacy modem baud rates, but "legacy baud" says enough.
If there's something alarmingly dangerous about the things that you end up doing, security concerns unaddressed etc, put the feedback in writing.
Don't clam up. Just don't let it eat away at you if you are ignored; dot your Is and cross your Ts.
It's a balancing act, of course. You have to get good at understanding and making the case for what's best for the company.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLmWUAHrZnM
For others, and this was very much me, the better contracts are those that last longer and are, really, much more like a full-time job, except it's typically just one project (and yes, there's the money aspect again).
The best contracts I had were greenfield projects where I was the team leader, had a lot of responsibility, and saw the project through from start to finish over the course of a year or more. The worst contract I ever had was three months - or, at least, it was that long until I quit - where I was paid better than I'd ever been paid before to produce total crap with a team of perms who were angry and aggressive and hated contractors, a horrible manager who hated everyone, and fellow contractors who either didn't care, weren't really up to the job, or were also miserable and quit - three in the space of a week at one point. I remember buying myself a sandwich one day, eating it, thinking to myself that the time I'd spent eating it had earned me more money than the sandwich had cost, smiling grimly to myself, and still being miserable because the job was so hateful. (In all fairness, I left at 5 every day and didn't give another thought to the job until the following morning, apart from a general sense of misery on the commute in. I'm sure I did complain bitterly about the job to anyone who would listen...)
Oddly enough, previously to that incident, I treated contracting no different to being a permie, I'd heavily invest, commit 110%, and push and push until stuff was delivered. I didn't know how to take my foot off the gas, even when I was only hired to do one specific thing.
I'm now in my second contract since my breakdown, and I have that disconnected attitude, when I can just walk away, and I try not to let the work issues affect me. I'm now a much calmer person (although that could be the daily drugs talking... I don't know).
It's all horses for courses at the end of the day, some people like to be neck-deep in work, and thrive on the stress and pressure, and others just want to be left alone to do what they are good at during 9-5 and then forget about work until the next day.
What is true though, is that stress will kill you, and no matter what your role is, it's not worth your life.
There's tons of things that happen at an employer that are wrong, and that are stupid and that are complete nonsense.
There are things that you must simply let slide. Things that truly do not matter. Very few things REALLY matter. Very few things, and none of those things are the day-to-day work life.
Speak to a therapist regularly for a few years. One that specializes in trauma survivors.
Isn't that kind of stress supposed to impair performance? I'd think that keeping not-stressed would be even more important if people's lives were in question.
I'd also recommend trying something like an intensive therapeutic seminar: https://www.themeadows.com/workshops/survivors-i-workshop
If you don't like therapy, maybe something like Landmark: http://www.landmarkworldwide.com
Some people put down therapy and taking care of themselves in general, my guess is because it takes alot of courage to actually address dysfunction with themselves. I've been that person at times too, in general though I've tried alot of these things and I don't regret having gone through them and I felt better coming through the other side of my own shit.
It's really nice to have someone to talk to who has no vested interest in any part of your life. You can vent to them without having to worry about pissing anyone off or it getting around to anyone. A good therapist or a coach can offer a fairly unbiased outside opinion and even strategies for dealing with things that come up in your life.
The biggest thing to remember is that it's important to find someone who is right for you. There are a lot of people out there, and each has his or her own personality and style. Finding a therapist is a lot like dating in certain ways, so don't be afraid to move on if it isn't working for you.