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Ask HN: Have you successfully moved away from Google search?

170 points by chatmasta ↗ HN
I'm seeing more and more people saying they've switched to DuckDuckGo. For me, 95% of my google queries are programming related. I'm wondering, for anyone who has switched, how has DDG performed in terms of surfacing the programming topics you're looking for? Does using it decrease productivity?

119 comments

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patrickbolle
I'm using Startpage since about 1.5 months ago. A tad slower but I like it and it gives me good results.
cJ0th
I also use startpage 99% of the time. It relies (entirely) on google, though.
[dead] biggerbistro
Isn't this OK though for most use-cases? Startpage will effectively act as a proxy for your searches, preventing Google from associating your searches with your identity. It still feeds them though, which I suppose is a problem.
absove
I've been using Startpage for a couple of years now. I'm happy with the search results.
lousken
I agree, I've been using it for 6months now. But it took me some time not to get any kind of additional results like weather info.
binarymax
I fully switched to DDG about 5 years ago. Specifically programming questions work great. I'd estimate about 5% of my searches I will revert to google, which sometimes doesn't help either because I'm searching for something crazy niche.
chillingeffect
Similar here. Dropped Google several years ago. when I do go back to google, I'm surprised how much it's changed. So little of its results don't have a little "Ad" next to them.
paulcole
> So little of its results don't have a little "Ad" next to them

Yes, Google is an ad-supported business. What confidence do you have that DDG won't go the same route?

chillingeffect
1. It's a private company so they don't need to swell profits quarterly to maintain position in the market

2. They already do sell their results. The difference is they don't attach names to them

3. And if they for some unforeseen reason do go that same route they're not there and I will continue to use them until they do.

mercer
That's interesting. I moved away from DDG, despite my ideological reason to use it in the first place, because I got sick of using !g for at least half my queries.

I'm not sure how to make this comment useful other than to ask: what kinds of queries do you find DDG performs better at than Google?

mttjj
I still use Google at work (software engineer) but I use DDG at home and for everything else.
maxxxxx
I have tried DuckDuckGo but for me Google is still much better. Unfortunately.
usrme
My usual setup relies on first using DuckDuckGo and when I need answers to a more esoteric problem or error that I am seeing and DDG isn't providing me with what I need, then I modify my search query by appending "!g" and try my luck with Google.

At the moment I'd venture it's about a 60/40 split with DuckDuckGo staying on top across all types of searches.

nannal
This is absolutely my experience, bangs are a game changer though, I would probably be willing to use DDG without it's native search just to keep using bangs.
notheguyouthink
I also like that I'm indicating to DDG that I'm unhappy with my search results. They get a clear feedback model of what I can, and cannot find.

I imagine that is very helpful to developers.

adam12
I wish I didn't have to use the bangs so much.
[deleted]
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ljcn
I switched to DuckDuckGo years ago. I use it in my work as a software engineer and find it satisfactory the vast majority of the time.

On the occasions that it isn't I either append !g, !s, or !sho to redirect the query to Google, Startpage, or SymbolHound, respectively. There are thousands more and they're huge productivity boosters (!w for wikipedia gets used a lot).

Spivak
I have DDG as the search provider in Firefox and it works great. If you already know what you're looking for it's quick and fast to use the bang syntax.

"Shoot, I need the docs for the user Ansible module"

> !ansible user

And it goes straight to the page.

I typically give DDG the first try on a search then I turn to Google/Startpage if I don't get good results. It's been getting way better over time.

LizMcIntyre
Spivak Do you bang into StartPage using the !s or the !sp ?
YCode
From a pragmatic standpoint, what do you gain by switching to DDG?
[dead] icemelt8
Self satisfaction that we are doing SOMETHING for a cause which we think is right.
jshevek
The convenience of bangs. (Other comments elaborate on the details)
[dead] no_none11111
Given recent events, I'm scared of using Google lest they build a database of persons who search for the non-pc terms or visit non-pc sites.

I'm not making this up. I didn't visit a link to a Thiel talk on youtube posted here for this reason.

worg
A extremely difficult thing to find nowadays: a bit of privacy (if you skip bangs) oh and bangs too
Cozumel
With Google I've found it impossible to turn off the 'safesearch' and also the results I get are incredibly irrelevant to what I'm actually looking for. DDG solves both those for me, Bing isn't bad either.
probably_wrong
I found two aspects of DDG very convenient: that I can search in Stackoverflow directly, and that if I still don't like the results I can always add "!g" and repeat the search in Google (useful for finding a very specific error message).

I only got a very small decrease in productivity at first, but I went back to normal pretty quick. So I'd say it went better than expected.

dpflan
I'm wondering: have you kept track of which site results you commonly find that answer your questions? For example, you query DDG a few times for different questions, and for each answer you find yourself on Stack Exchange. If you'd like to skip the "middle-man", it seems like directly querying SE may be the way to go for ~X% (X > 50%) of your questions (at least for those topics).

I think this is could be a good way to help pay more attention to what you're searching for and results because now that I think about Google searching can be really assumptive and get-the-answer-and-leave at times. Maybe digging deeper than top Y results can be a better learning experience.

leonroy
DDG is a bit US centric but despite that I use it for nearly everything. On the rare occassion it's not returning good enough results (images or certain UK specific stuff) I just use the aforementioned suffix g!.

Give it a go, takes a little time before you feel comfortable being away from Google's excellent search engine but I got fedup seeing adverts for things I'd previously browsed on other sites, so adios Google.

ninju
It it !g or g!

Just trying to understand the placement of the exclamation point

DiThi
Both work, but "!g" is less ambiguous. Also it works both at the beginning and the end of the search, so I can append "!g" to the end after searching, without having to click precisely or to add an space.
ljcn
Interesting, I didn't know that. Note you can put a bang anywhere in the query, not just the start or end (but your trick about putting it at the end to avoid typing the space is nice).
ljcn
Try r:uk or click the toggle for the UK (or whatever country you select/it gets from GeoIP).
mratzloff
I've used DDG for the last couple of years on all my devices. I switched for privacy reasons. It does everything I need it to do, and I get a lot of use out of the search shortcuts (especially !w).

Commit to switching for a couple weeks and you'll find that you rely on Google less and less.

zitterbewegung
Yes , here is how I did it.

1. Put duck duck go as the default browser on your phone

2. Learn the bang paths. Realize that you still may have to fall back to google .

3. Once you have mastered the bang paths start targeting your search queries

4. Realize you can’t live without bang paths

5. You should now be motivated to use duck duck go exclusively .

fosco
I have been using DDG for quite some time now.

I am now interested in bang paths and feel woefully ignorant. can you elaborate with an example? the definition [0] I found for bang paths tells me I found the wrong item.

[0] https://www.techopedia.com/definition/6138/bang-path A bang path is a mostly obsolete kind of address function that shows each server in a message trajectory over a complex network, for example, the Internet. It is called a bang path because each designated server is separated by an exclamation point, also known as a bang.

EDIT: Question answered [1] I was searching for an alternate meaning and should not have. thank you!

[1] https://duckduckgo.com/bang

diegoperini
My personal split is probably around 30% DDG, 70% Google. DDG go fails on local searches (Turkey, Turkish sources) and sometimes very long queries like stacktraces does not retrieve effective results.
brainopener
I've sort of switched...

DuckDuckGo has !bangs. If you search for "!so javascript", then you just end up on stackoverflow.com with a search term of "javascript". There's dozens (hundreds?) of these !bangs -- including !g if you want to run the search on Google.

So I've installed this extension below for Safari. I use the !bangs in the address bar if I want to go somewhere specific -- !so (stackoverflow), !a (amazon), !y (stock quotes). And, otherwise, it just uses Google search.

http://tbastos.com/project/safari-bangsearch/

electriclove
Interesting.. I do something similar with the Search Engines setting in Chrome using Keywords which applies to what is typed in the omnibox.

a iphone -> searches for iphone on Amazon

w tiger -> searches for tiger on Wikipedia

You can also set up a new search engine/keyword. Example to set up Stack Overflow with the s keyword: https://stackoverflow.com/search?%s

So I can now type 's sort a string in python' and it will take me directly to https://stackoverflow.com/search?q=sort+a+string+in+python

SirZimzim
I tend to use the tab complete feature. Works on pretty much every site I ever use search . Just start typing the url and press tab.
jshevek
To answer the title question: I discovered this week that Bing has radically improved in recent years. Between them & DDG, I don't see that I'll need to rely on Google search ever again.
kevlar1818
I switched to DDG from Google about one and half years ago. DDG is my daily driver.

DDG is excellent for programming questions/how-tos. It shows popular StackOverflow questions inline[1]. For Python, it shows Python/NumPy/SciPy documentation inline as well[2]. It may do this for other languages, but I have not witnessed it.

DDG also has a great inline weather "app" using DarkSky (which is an underrated weather site, IMO)[3]. Searching for businesses/restaurants shows a mini map ala OpenStreetMap (or other providers if you choose) and business information from Yelp[4].

DDG also has a community-driven program to add more search features, called DuckDuckHack[5]. I believe all (at least most) of the features I shared above came through that program. A list of all "Instant Answers" can be found here[6].

Need to fallback to Google? (I personally never have.) There's "bangs" for alternative search engines and popular sites[7].

Make the switch. You'll be pleasantly surprised how easy and refreshing it will be.

[1]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=python+sort+a+list+of+strings

[2]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=numpy+sum

[3]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=weather

[4]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=exploratorium+sf

[5]: https://duckduckhack.com/

[6]: https://duck.co/ia

[7]: https://duckduckgo.com/bang

peller
I too switched over to DDG around the same time, and I mostly agree - but I've had the exact opposite experience specifically with programming questions.

I can't even count the number of times I've searched for something (usually semi-obscure errors) on DDG and come up dry, only to enter the exact same query on Google and the first or second result will have the answer I needed :(

imsofuture
Exact same experience here. Search for an error message or unique name and DDG comes up with very little, if anything.
kevlar1818
When in doubt, bang (!g) it out.
g5d3
or just !so ...which will take you directly to stack overflow
Ntrails
Problem is that's my default ddg search at this point. I have no faith in DDG to actually give me the thing I want, so I rarely give it the change. It'd make more sense to just make google my default at this point..
epalm
Same here, for obscure programming questions. Sometimes I do eventually find good results on DDG if I keep scrolling, but on the Goog it's front and center.
notheguyouthink
I often fall back to Google as well, but I love that 80% of my questions/searches never touch Google. DDG is well worth it for me.
oAlbe
The inline documentation works for a number of languages. C++ for example shows inline info from cppreference. Javascript shows inline results from MDN ecc.

Moreover, you can type in things like "git cheatsheet" or "tmux cheatsheet" and it will show you inline a whole lot of basic commands with short descriptions that you can just keep there and reference.

odabaxok
And.. do not forget it shows inline cheat sheets for programming languages [1].

However, it is way behind Google in localized searches. Unlike you, I am not satisfied with its results for finding places in my location, but this can be also related to localization.

Other problems I have experienced are with ambiguous search phrases and or with special formattings. Google is smarter on understanding the context of the search, but unfortunately I cannot give you an example now.

[1] https://duckduckgo.com/?q=python+cheatsheet&ia=cheatsheet

mercer
Thanks for the comment! I'll definitely give DDG another try because of it.

About a year ago I tried switching to DDG, but I ended up using the !g operator so often that I just moved back to Google. I never felt comfortable about being so lazy in relation to my convictions (which drive me away from Google), and this is a good impetus to give DDG another serious try.

BlackjackCF
I try to use DDG when I can, but my problem is when it comes down to searching for GitHub stuff. Google is much, much better at handling that.
Bucephalus355
Make no mistake, Google Search is absolute shit. The larger issue though is that in general search is absolute shit.

I have a sizable library in my 1 bedroom apartment. It's about 1500 books. For the record I'll say if you find a local carpenter to work with, you can store a ton of books no matter the space you have. Also use Thriftbooks, I love Amazon but it's amazing how cheap things are on Thriftbooks.

Anyway I am also a DevOps Engineer which means I live and breath technology. I have every Apple product, including Carplay and an Apple Router (hah i view those as pretty niche), I also have a Windows computer because I think the Surface does some cool things. Despite all this tech, I am CONSTANTLY AMAZED how much faster I find answers in books, and particularly reference books. It will really shock you and make you question your world once you realize how much info Google hides from you.

A GREAT field to look into is "Information Architecture". These people are really amazing and you'll see all of them, the entire field (which is extraordinary for an academic discipline) look down on Google. The analogy that comes up time and again is Google is to information what McDonalds is for food, a poor / quick substitute.

Additionally you need to realize that unlike your local library or other sources, Search has been so polluted by marketers (which to be fair is understandable, they go where the customers are) that you really have to question all of the info you've found. Literally every time you search there are literally 10 million marketers trying to get you something else than what you wanted.

I had a friend tell me the other day that "the real Google is Google Scholar". If you're looking for high quality info you can't go wrong there, and you can then head over to www.sci-hub.io or whatever it is and pick up the PDF. Google Scholar gave me tremendous respect for the research colleges and universities put out, and the benefits they've accrued by taking the business out of information.

icedchai
Are you old enough to remember Altavista or Excite? I'm guessing not.
RUG3Y
Using a search engine used to require quite a bit of skill to find what you were searching for. I got pretty good at crafting my searches.
Zenbit_UX
Are you actually saying you can find the answers to questions in your single bedroom library/apartment than just about any human using a search engine?
kakarot
Interesting. I have had the opposite experience with DDG and tech-related queries (which are most of my queries) and find the UI is clunky and often gets in the way. I have also on more than one occasion went looking for software by name and found that a malware / scam site sat higher in the results than the real source. This is something I have contacted DDG about before.

I have been looking into Searx but it doesn't seem that great, either. I really need to ditch Google though.

_-david-_
>DDG also has a great inline weather "app" using DarkSky (which is an underrated weather site, IMO)[3]. Searching for businesses/restaurants shows a mini map ala OpenStreetMap (or other providers if you choose) and business information from Yelp

Do you know a way to get inline dusk and dawn times (like weather has) for a specific zip code?

grimgrin
Those who use DDG, do you miss dates in results? Having a date present definitely helps me think about the results:

https://www.google.com/search?q=dcss+branch+order

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=dcss+branch+order

This isn't a case where I _know_ I only want 2017 results, and so I do the syntax to filter it down automatically. I want all results, but I want to be aware of the timeline of whatever I'm going to click.

naibafo
Now that you say it, yes. Seeing the date right away is helpful and offers a nicer workflow.

You can filter by date though or sort by date in DDG, so making the date visible is probably possible somehow or might be in the future.

DanBC
Mostly. I do a lot of searching of English NHS websites and Google or Bing still seem better than DDG for that.

But the rest of the time I use DDG, and I use DDG before trying something else.

brandonwamboldt
Personally I have no interest in moving away from Google Search, as I specifically use them because Google learns from previous searches I've made and shows me more relevant results. Searching "unzip" shows me the Linux command, not unrelated materials for example.
naibafo
I would search for 'unzip linux' ;)
LizMcIntyre
You can use StartPage.com to get Google search results in privacy. Even Edward Snowden has recommended StartPage no-logging privacy: https://www.startpage.com/eng/#home-video.

StartPage.com is also recommended by privacytools.io

vanderreeah
It's kind of rude to advertise while giving the false impression you're a disinterested punter. It's also tiring to read the same comment plugging the same product after half a dozen posts on this page.
jszymborski
That search bubble effect is part of the reason I switched to DDG. I have no interest in being stuck in a single echo-chamber. My searches cross-over many domains and interests.

Also, the first result for unzip in DDG is winzip, followed by 7zip. It' not as ambiguous as you think, since almost nobody is curious for the general definition of a semi-common word.

Also, Google keeps me in a Canada bubble which I also dislike.

dlanphear
I switched to DDG probably 3 years ago, I use it all the time. I wish stackunderflow didn't dominate the results in any SE over the primary sources, but I understand it's popularity based... Tired of the tracking, use the duck.
tchaffee
Yes, pretty much. DuckDuckGo usually surfaces the best StackOverflow answer. Rarely I'll feel like I need a broader search so I'll append "!g" to my search and look at the Google results. And once in a while I get something useful from that broader search. If I had to get by with only DuckDuckGo I would be fine.
bluGill
Yes. I tried duck duck go 10 years ago when I first heard about it, and decided it wasn't anywhere near as good as google. A few months back I was convinced to try it again, and surprise, it is just as good as google.

I recently did a few queries where I didn't find anything so I tried google and it got the same irrelevant results (as a category, not the same pages)

Jdam
No, why?

A friend of mine is using DDG and whenever I'm over and we search for something on DDG, what we were searching for doesn't show up. Maybe it's Murphy's law, but I'm always mocking him with "search for it on Google" and that usually delivers the result we were looking for.

veidr
No. And, literally just today I (again) disabled the DuckDuckGo extension in my browser, because I felt ridiculous for having done this more than 20 times in a single day:

1. search (via the browser's URL/search field)

2. sigh

3. press ⌘L to return keyboard focus to the browser URL/search field

4. press ⌘← to move the cursor to the beginning of the text

5. enter "!g" and then ↩︎ to re-execute the search using Google

I really do like the idea of a non-creepy search engine. I periodically give DDG another chance. But even more, apparently, I like finding pages and blog posts responsive to my search.

(EDIT: Wow, I learned from this thread that step 4 isn't necessary; the !g can go at the end of the search query. :-D Still doesn't really change anything, though.)

oAlbe
You can append the bang at the end of the query, the result will be the same. And you don't need to use cmd+L to focus the address bar of your browser, you can just type 'h' and the focus will go to the DDG search bar.
charlieegan3
I've found that you can put the "!g " string anywhere and it'll work - does seem to need a space after it if it's not at the end though. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=thi%21g+ngs&t=hq
LizMcIntyre
Right, but no privacy. Better to go to StartPage.com using the !s or !sp

StartPage delivers actual Google search results without the tracking and without the filter bubble.

charlieegan3
Only if I'm signed into Google or allowing it to set cookies right and not spoofing my user agent right? ;)

I don't know if you're still affiliated with StartPage.com but the done thing is to mention that in any posts promoting your company.

LizMcIntyre
Privacy alert: Banging into Google is like going there directly!

If you want Google search results in privacy, use the !s or !sp from DDG to get StartPage.com.