Ask HN: Food hacks for eating well?

81 points by haliax ↗ HN
I keep getting cravings for foods (chocolate, nachos, soda, you name it) that I'm trying to avoid because I know they're unhealthy, and their more nutritional replacements aren't hitting the spot. I know that junk food is engineered to be craved, so I'm wondering if anyone has managed to make the good stuff crave-inducing.

167 comments

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My best tip is to equate the foodstuff to exercise equivalent. Ask yourself: How much exercise would I have to do to not gain weight by eating this junk?

A chocolate bar is roughly equivalent to, say, a 30 minute jog. If you think that what you're about to eat is as bad for you as a 30 minute jog is good (or that they basically cancel each other out), it doesn't seem quite so appealing. Then if you choose the apple instead, you've done the equivalent of a 30 minute jog better than the quantum-choice-alternative-less-disciplined-and-slightly-fatter-you.

Before you eat any junk snack, take a long look at the nutritional information and think about what it is going to do to your body.

10 minutes of jogging burns an apple.
Okay, then you've done the equivalent of 20 minutes of jogging better. You know what I mean.
Downvoted? I honestly don't understand - what was jules' observation supposed to mean? I wasn't being snarky - I was trying to make sense of it!
At what time do you get the food cravings? I've struggled with food cravings at night all my life, and i see many go through it. I've tried lots of different things, but in the end a chinese lady told me that, it was because i wasnt eating enough for breakfast.

She told me to fill breakfast with protein and carbs and to eat like a king at breakfast time and like a prince at lunch.

Since i started doing that, my cravings at night have dissapeared, and i haven't had to come up with some formula to avoid junk food.

Try it ;-)

Your body craves what it is used too. It takes some length of time before your body adjusts what it's used to. In my experience this is 1-2 months depending on how radical the change. Every month you go on with a given diet seems to amplify the effect.

So the real trick is to spend 1 month suffering (don't eat a single bit of candy) and then make the much easier choice to limit yourself to some reasonable amount (1 per week, for instance).

A few years I cut out all processed/fast foods and at first it was hard. My Body was used to easy to digest, high fat, high sugar, high salt foods. Now I find those foods unpalatable. I'm sure over time I would get used to them again.... and maybe even crave them.

BTW I'm not claiming I'm healthier now, I'm just saying it's easy to get addicted to those foods but as you say a month or so of avoiding it helps to break the cycle.

Not about cravings directly, but what works for me to reduce hunger pangs is to eat a spoonful of any kind of butter or milk fat. It gives me a nice base level of satiety until the next meal.

Anything sugary is only good for 45 minutes at which point the hunger returns in strength.

Now if only I can remember to do this every time.

edit: And no, my weight doesn't increase as a result of the fat-gobbling. It's the sugary stuff that does the damage.

I have heard a lot about not having your biggest meal last in the day. Something I do when I have late sleeping hours is get up in the afternoon, have some coffee and toast. Then have dinner at the same time as the rest of my household who have much more normal hours, so the biggest meal is halfway through my day. Then later on I try to fit in some exercise and either have a health shake or fruit, something light later on.

My biggest problem now is probably energy drinks, have cut back but still enjoy them regularly.

From the foods you describe I'm guessing you are used to eating quite a large amount of sugar. You don't mention, for example, craving steak. (Mmmm....steak :)

If "nutritional replacements aren't hitting the spot" it might just be that you're ingesting fewer calories and are hence hungry. Junk food tends to be very energy dense so you have to eat a larger volume to maintain the same amount of energy coming in.

One way to blunt sugar cravings is to exercise. Particularly if you're a lard arse your insulin response can go out of wack. Exercising depletes muscle glycogen which can help bring things back to normal. You can find out a whole lot more here: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/training-the-obese...

Another way to blunt sugar cravings is to fast. You'll find various people promoting "intermittent fasting". Basically, don't eat for about 12 hours. Fairly simple to say; may not be simple to do.

Also, make sure you're eating plenty of protein and fat. Don't just replace one pile of carbohydrates with another (e.g. nachos with bread). If you do this you'll stay on the sugar treadmill.

I hope that is useful.

My method is to cook well. A large variability of dishes of different national cuisines can help you to avoid junk food. Eg for today's dinner I had a nice rizotto with fried onion, sweet pepper, aubergines and semi-milled rice (don't forget soy sauce though). It's tasty, it gives energy and after eating dishes like that it's hard to call nachos/soda 'cravings'. They really taste like junk.
A good place to start is to remove "junk" from your diet. In the past, chocolate/candy etc was considered a treat and we should all go back to thinking that way.

Next up is hydration. If you are dehydrated, evenly slightly, it is easy to think you are hungry.

I also echo the views of those saying that sugar is worse than fat. Very refined carbs, such as white bread, are terrible due to the speed at which you metabolise it. Look into the GI of various foods and you may be surprised.

When you do have a meal, consider timing. The old saying "Breakfast like a king, lunch like a prince and have a paupers dinner" is apt.

Also eat plenty of low carb, bulky foods such as onions, carrots, mushrooms etc. This will fill you up for longer, as well as giving numerous health benefits

I think what makes food so difficult for hackers, in general, is having to think about it all the time. We hate anything that constantly demands our attention and isn't a core interest. Such things will always seem impossibly difficult and ultimately be neglected.

Thus, the general strategy is to form mindless habits that are healthy. Supplements are made for this kind of habitual consumption. They are simple to prepare, come in bulk, and are so boring that after a while, you don't even think of them as food; but you do crave them every day due to the healthy feedback loop.

In your case, you probably want some kind of meal replacement shake that gives your body whatever it is craving with maximal collateral healthiness. I don't know what that is though, so you'll have to turn to science.

IMHO exercising more is always going to be easier than eating less, and the trick to that is the same: form monotonous habits. Repetition, obsession, and ultimately sweet oblivion.

my diet is basically corn tortilla+black beans+chicken\salmon\eggs+lettuce\avocado\tomato. DIY mexican is the most efficient thing I've come up in terms of cost, time, health, & taste. I add lime, cumin, and red pepper for more flavor.

If you have sugar cravings just eat fruit instead, mangos kiwis or clementines are the best IMO. Any other effects junk food has besides a blood sugar spike is simply a psychological association you automatically retrain over time.

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A simple tip: add fresh locally grown veggies to processed foods. For example, before making a can of soup or some HN-friendly Ramen noodles, chop up and cook veggies for a few minutes in very little water and then add the soup or noodles. Same with heating up a frozen dinner.

In my personal experience, when I go for long periods eating lots of healthy food, it is easy to fight off any cravings for crap-foods. Then if I am traveling and not eating so well, I find myself buying a occasional candy bar, etc.

Hmmm, where to start:

- Switch out junk food for healthier snacks (dark chocolate, nuts, (dried) fruit). Over time your tolerance for junk food will go down and you will want less of it;

- If you really want a hit of junk food, just have it. There is no point dwelling on it. I will have one piece of sugary food with my coffee at around 10:00, which keeps me satisfied. Sometimes I binge out after not having a lot for so long (months), but when your tolerance for processed food goes down you will stop much sooner (through a mixture of guilt and physiological repulsion);

- If you want sugar, eat 'good' sugar, i.e. fruit;

- Have a bowl of healthy nibbles lying around to munch on when walking past. I always have grapes and nuts in the kitchen that I pick at;

- Always eat breakfast. I have mine as soon as wake-up;

- Cook your own meals and don't eat processed food;

- Drink water rather than carbonated drinks;

- Eat smaller meals more often. I try to eat something every three hours;

- Follow the Japanese (I think) philosophy of eating until only 80% full, not bursting at the seams. For me the ideal amount of food is a cereal bowl worth of food;

- Have a drink about 30 - 60 mins after you have eaten, not during a meal. This helps to top-up the fullness feeling and also allows food to be digested more efficiently before the digestive enzymes get diluted by a drink;

- Don't try and justify eating rubbish by doing exercise. You are what you eat.

The end result is that people always tell me I am too skinny even though I eat a lot. I don't need to do that much exercise because my diet is good. When I do go out for dinner and/or drinks I can indulge without guilt.

I have to second the drinking water rather than anything else point. Thats one of the easiest changes (so easy in fact, that its the only one I currently can stick to) to achieve, and you will feel fantastic for it (give it a few weeks for the caffeine fuzziness to fade).
> Have a drink about 30 - 60 mins after you have eaten, not during a meal. This ... allows food to be digested more efficiently before the digestive enzymes get diluted by a drink

I hear this claim a lot and it always sounds simplistic. The most reliable refutation a quick google turned up was:

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/digestion/AN01776/

from a gastroenterologist at the Mayo Clinic. I quote:

"There's no concern that water will dilute the digestive juices or interfere with digestion. In fact, drinking water during or after a meal can actually improve digestion. Water and other liquids help break down the food in your stomach and keep your digestive system on track."

Food stays in your stomach as long as 5 hours. Water must get absorbed/passed on much more quickly. (I couldn't find numbers.) I imagine your stomach is pretty smart about maintaining a proper environment for digestion.

I am not sure if it's 100% true or not. I was told to do this by a nutritionist because I was drinking a pint at a time. I would drink this all in one go, but I imagine sipping would be fine. But drinking later ensures that I don't feel uncomfortably full.

But surely a large, sudden, water intake will dilute the stomach (not intestine where most of the nutrients are absorbed) juices and pH?

As I hope the tone of my post made clear, I'm not sure either, but I am very skeptical of the claim.

There seem to be two issues here: how full you feel (which I don't have an opinion on one way or another) and whether drinking water impedes digestion by diluting stomach acid and digestive enzymes.

Yes, it would seem plausible that a large intake of water would dilute the stomach juices. However, it also seems equally plausible that the stomach regulates pH equally quickly by passing along the excess water to the small intestine (where, I believe, water is typically absorbed), just delaying digestion temporarily.

I imagine different foods (whole grains vs. pasta vs. steak) must need different amounts of time to break down in the stomach. Is the stomach sensitive to when foods are ready to be passed along to the small intestine?

doc here: anything remotely close to normal water intake will not effect the efficacy of the digestive process. A big slug of cold water might be a skosh uncomfortable, but I've never heard of water intake causing diarrhea.
> A skosh uncomfortable

Are you military or ex-military, by any chance? They're the only other people I've ever heard use "skosh" (from the Japanese skoshi, a small space or time). (I'm an Air Force brat and Navy vet.) EDIT: Looks like you might be a Navy doc?

Good advice on drinking water only after about 30 minutes after the meal. A useful side effect of this optimized digestion process is significantly reduced burping! :-)

Also don't eat anything at least 3-4 hours before you sleep. This creates a period of extended fasting while you sleep, which helps with weight loss.

> The end result is that people always tell me I am too skinny even though I eat a lot.

Umm... Doesn't being too skinny mean you're not eating well? (I'm asking because I'm in the same situation).

I am not too skinny; that is just others peoples opinion. I am of normal weight for my height and age, and I feel great. It seems worse than it is because I went from 12 stone to 10 after I stopped weight training. Also, I am Indian, so everyone thinks that being over weight is healthy and a sign of wealth. They just don't learn from all the heart attacks and diabetes.

I think I eat very well. I believe in getting the best, freshest food I can, having a well balanced diet (which includes fats) and in the traceability of food. I do have a gluten and cow's milk intolerance, so I guess I don't eat that much, if any, refined carbs; however, I do eat other flours and other sources of dairy. If you're eating well, feeling good and are 'skinny', I think you should be okay. If you're worried then you should probably go and see a doctor or nutritionist.

"eat 'good' sugar, i.e. fruit;" -- even that may be contentious. This video on the dangers of fructose was posted not that long ago: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM
Lustig says fruits are good. It is the artificially added fructose (ie HFCS) that he says is dangerous.
I find herbal teas helpful in reducing my craving for sweets. A homemade herbal iced tea (something with berries so it's somewhat sweet) is a good alternative to water all the time too.
I replaced ice cream with soy smoothies. Frozen fruit, vanilla soy milk, vanilla yogurt, and vanilla bean paste. I put all of the ingredients in a large glass and mix them with a hand blender. Easy to make and clean. The bean paste makes it taste more like an ice cream shake. I also combine peanut butter, cocoa powder, chocolate syrup, soy milk and yogurt for a chocolate alternative.
Buy organic chips. Figure out WHY you are craving specific things and address that underlying issue.

Some examples:

For me, drinking lots more sodas at work is usually due to an allergic reaction to something at work that day. I have generally gotten myself healthier and generally consume less caffeine because of it, which is something chocolate and soda have in common. A craving for chips can be due to a craving for salt which can suggest adrenal problems. A good quality sea salt and other nutritional support for the adrenals and thyroid can help.

> A good quality sea salt

Is there often a difference between various sources of NaCl? ;)

You don't exactly get pure substances in the world. Soo, very much so, there are differences. Get a couple sorts of salt. Dead sea, Mediterranean, and the generic stuff, and you can certainly tell. Whether or not they have health benefits...
So the body is craving for salt, or craving for impurities?

Feed it the one it needs. If the body needs impurity x, which is tastily packaged with salt product y, advising to eat y seems like the sort of behaviour the OP is trying to avoid.

Yes. "Table salt" generally has things like anti-caking agents. A good quality sea salt has things like an assortment of 80-some-odd micronutrients found naturally in sea water. I have found it makes a big difference for me.
Only eat food at meals. Eat as much as you like at first, just do not eat except at breakfast, lunch, and dinner. You may have to start taking a little more time for breakfast.

Within a couple weeks your body will be very acclimated to this schedule, and you will not want to eat except at meals. Once the cravings have stopped, focus on improving the quality of what you're eating. When you're cooking for yourself (and you should) play with how little oil and salt you can use and still enjoy your meal. Reduce portion sizes.

If the cravings return, maybe you eat a little more at your next meal. Maybe they're small enough (and you used enough to your new schedule) that you just don't. Habit is a very powerful thing. Right now, you're habitually snacking. Turn that on its head.

Oh, and it helps if you're eating with other people, especially if they eat quickly, because you will feel social pressure to wrap it up.

-always eat breakfast

-never eat too much

-never add sugar to anything

-don't use too much salt

-eat your salad with nothing but a little olive oil

-eat as little processed food as possible

-eat as little sugary food as possible

-never drink soda

-never go to mcdonalds etc

-never go to starbucks

-enjoy what you eat! :)

Why starbucks, what is wrong w/ coffee?
It's not the coffee, it's the gallon of milk they add to it
Three words you need to remember at Starbucks:

"Tall coffee, please"

Tastes better than any of their espresso drinks, too (though that's not difficult.)

I recommend "short americano." Espresso+hot water, and as a short it's about the same price as a tall coffee for the same kick. Their espresso beans and pulls are pretty reliable; their coffee, not so much. Except for Tully's, I've never experienced a coffee chain with such a habit of failing to put in the drip filter correctly and handing out cups of sludge.

And their light roasts are overly acidic, but that's just the Peet's fan in me being a bit prejudiced.

Last I heard, there was significantly less caffeine in a shot of espresso than in a cup of drip coffee.

Besides, then you wind up in the Espresso queue, which takes longer. But hey, whatever floats your turnip.

What is wrong with milk ? .
nothing, imho. Imho the problem is all the sugar they add to their frappuccinos etc, not milk.
Unless you order a plain old coffee, everything else is 300+ calories.
The answer to this question tends to greatly depend on whether you overeat / eat in an otherwise unhealthy way such that it's causing you harm or if you merely don't like the idea of eating junk, so you want to cut back.

For instance, I'm just finishing a medically supervised protein-sparing modified fast where I lost 70 pounds in 5 months by eating only prescription liquid foods and only about 800 calories a day. This has the effect of "rebooting" your cravings. I can't tell you how much I'm looking forward to some fresh vegetables and fruit right now, and I used to be a big junk food craver. Having said that, you'd think 5 months of not eating anything except protein pudding would be difficult, but it was incredibly easy, and I enjoyed it a lot. And it mostly unscrambled the signals to my brain that said, "Eat all the cookies you can find," that ran 24 hours a day.

If that sounds like you, and your weight or other stats like triglycerides / cholesterol / liver enzymes / blood sugar are unhealthy, you should see a doctor and ask about medical weight management right away. I can tell you from experience that it's a lot easier to lose 20 pounds than it is to lose 70, so you can't win by waiting. Also, a great book on the subject is David Kessler's "The End of Overeating." He goes into great detail on the psychological and chemical triggers that induce hypereating.

Now, on the other hand, if you're just prone to snacking on junk in fairly moderate ways, you ought to exercise a little environmental control:

- Shop at farmer's markets for veggies and corner grocers for milk and staples.

- Don't go to the supermarket. If you do go to the supermarket, only shop the aisles with wholesome foods, and never buy anything on the eye-level shelves (the worst, most processed stuff).

- Don't bring junk home. If you buy something junky, buy only one serving. If it only comes in multi-serving packs, take one serving out, then freeze the rest. Make it harder to dig into.

It's also useful to keep records of your eating. If you have an iPhone, I had a lot of success with the app LoseIt. Studies show that people keep off 50% more weight when they keep records than when they don't. If you're mindful of what you're eating and how you're eating it, you create brief openings in which you actually have a choice to eat or not rather than to just eat mindlessly. It also helps to know what macronutrients (fat, sugar, protein, fiber, salt) you're consuming and in what balance. If it's out of balance, shop in a way that balances it out.

Consider foods that induce satiety. Protein has the highest satiety value - if you have to snack, try a protein pudding or shake first, let it settle in your stomach, and see if you're still hungry. Add water on top of that, because thirst often feels like hunger.

Finally, if you seem to be resolving your hunger, but you still feel an overwhelming urge to eat in spite of not being physically hungry, see a doctor or psychiatrist who specializes in eating behaviors. Most people who compulsively eat have no idea they're doing it because A) it snuck up on them over a number of years and B) everyone around them does it too (consider how many startups we've seen full of thin young folks who turned into chunky folks while they worked together).

Good luck!

Try to buy foods with only one ingredient, avoid packaged foods with more than five ingredients, and don't buy anything with high fructose corn syrup (HFCS). Those three tips alone will have a profound effect on what ends up in your shopping cart if you currently buy a lot of unhealthy processed foods.
Keep a spreadsheet of everything you eat. Include the total calories. Pick a max calories per day. This will make you start to think in terms of good taste per calorie- "that snickers bar looks nice, but I'd rather have an entire meal".
Personally, I have to have clear, simple, and hard-edged rules when it comes to my eating diet. If I give myself any wiggle room, I find myself wiggling more and more until I'm back where I started.

I've had great success cutting back on junk by following Reinhard Engels' "No S" diet. http://nosdiet.com/

  No Snacks
  No Sweets
  No Seconds
  Except, sometimes, on "S" days
(Where "S Day" is defined as "Saturday, Sunday, or special cultural or religious event)

--

If that doesn't work for you, here are some other hacks I or people I know have used with success.

- remove all junk food from your home

- don't buy any when you go grocery shopping

- stop hanging out places where there are a lot of snacks

- Set up a Seinfeld chain http://lifehacker.com/281626/jerry-seinfelds-productivity-se... (Personally I use http://joesgoals.com and keep a chart widget on my igoogle page)

- if you simply must snack... then figure out what snacks are compatible with your diet and put them on the top shelf of your fridge and in the deli drawer... the first place you look for a snack when you open the door.

- tell all your friends that if they catch you eating junk food then you will give them $1,000 (or some other painfully large amount). (Just remember Inspector Clouseau and make sure you have a halting condition)

- if your friends try to sabotage you then drop those jerks. It's not funny, it's not "a joke"... it's getting backstabbed by someone you thought you could trust. Life's too short to put up with that shit

As a doc, glad to see some people in the community thinking right about this. This is overall pretty good advice. I would add the best snacks are nuts and cheese, or other high-fat, high-protein, low carbohydrate foods.

I like the idea of a chart widget.

I would avoid most bread, including flat breads and crackers. The occasional tortilla for a wrap is ok. I would definitely avoid rice, pasta, and potatoes. If you eat sushi, consider sashimi.

Don't ask your spouse to provide the negative feedback, ambivalent co-workers might be best.

>I would definitely avoid rice...

Ever live in a Chinese household? If rice is so bad why do so many of the hundreds of millions of people who eat it 2 or even 3 times a day remain skinny and trim (Rice. Not the things that can go with it, not the ways it can be prepared or abused... just rice)? This is such a non-starter I don't even know where to... start.

While the whole "people did it for ages" argument never works I must admit I'm rather puzzled how one would give up potatoes, rice _and_ bread.

How exactly are they evil? What is so dangerous about carbs? Aren't snacks to blame? In a typical Russian home one of which I grew up it's a loaf a day or more. Italians and French eat even more bread. And as the OO mentioned, Asian nations consume unimaginable amounts of rice.

Yet America remains one of the most overweight nations. It just seems to me like it's a mosquito bite and you're asking to chop off the arm.

1) glycemic index

2) the unbelievable number of calories you can get before triggering a satiety signal

3) the social norm of scientifically huge portions. My wife and I have gotten the point of ordering a single entree and splitting it, sometimes we can get away with a single appetizer.

4) Two billion people in Asia do eat a lot of rice. They also do more physical work and probably don't eat as much rice per serving as Americans.

5) I should also add corn to the list.

Of all these, the universal problem is only number one, and still only due to the amounts of food. Portion sizes have nothing to do with carbs being evil on their own, and are definitely something one can restrain self on. Anything in large amounts is detrimental.
Because Chinese people (at least the skinny+trim ones) have a single, small bowl of rice and eat tons of veggies and then a few pieces of meat.

Not the Amero-Chinese style half-plate of rice with a heaping of fatty meat cut, slathered in some sauce composed of half-salt half-cooking oil, with a few veggies thrown in for "color."

If the problem is fatty meat or oil and salt or other junk people eat with rice then why tell people "Don't eat rice"?

It isn't the rice that's bad, it's the stuff people eat with it yet I repeatedly see people say "don't eat rice" and frankly, I think that's a load of bull. Don't blame rice for bad American eating habits.

Why do I drink 2 or even 3 bottles of Dr. Pepper a day and still stay skinny[1]? As always, one little piece of information doesn't tell the story. The fact is, almost all rices have a high glycemic index, thus cause a blood sugar spike, thus produce an insulin response, thus cause fat storage and other problems when you eat too much of it. Rice is about exactly as "bad" for you, physiologically, as white bread.

Obviously, rice can be consumed in moderation, especially in combination with other foods that lower the rate of metabolism.

[1] Cos I work out tons, don't overeat, and have a naturally fast metabolism.

how old are you that you have "stayed skinny"? What sports do you participate in? Your picture is incomplete.
Because the typical Chinese household doesn't eat too much food. It's all about portion control and they eat a ton of veggies. Rice is just a side dish to them, and they only eat it once or twice a day.

Also, you need to take into account that the typical Chinese peasant family is out farming or working hard all day. They need a lot of carbs to work that hard. Now that they have a significant population living in large cities and eating "American" fast food, working in office jobs, they are beginning to have a lot of the same health problems (obesity) that we do.

You're right. I should have included corn.

If I look at an American plate, half-covered with two giant scoops of fried rice, and an entree of Kung Pao chicken, and was told I could remove only one ingredient, I would remove the rice. If only I could remove the rice and give them the sauteed vegetables, they would be full faster and and experience a substantially smaller, slower, glucose spike.

One of my best friends in high school was Chinese. I used to study at his house because his mom's cooking was awesome. Her idea of a serving of rice, and the average American-chinese restaurant's serving of rice are two different things.

Why is high fat, high protein, low carbohydrate better? Aren't fats a sort of "permanent storage" whereas carbohydrates are more likely to be used instantly and then stored if there is extra?
Consumed fats induce a broad range of hormonal satiety signals, so your total caloric consumption is often less. The French and Mediterranean countries are famous for a few things, two being healthy living and high fat diets (butter in France, olive oil in the Med). Know any fat French people? Butter is not the problem.

Carbs are rapidly burned, or rapidly converted to fat. Fat in the blood stream can still be metabolized, what's especially hard is liberating fat from adipocytes once it's in them.

Among carbs, fructose is a particularly nasty problem. Fructose entirely bypasses the insulin pathway, which is the only major inhibitory signals for monosaccharides, but is is easily converted to fat, and there's some evidence it induces some inflammatory markers along the way. Observational studies of my two kids suggest they could eat oranges or candy all day without pause.

Here's a little experiment: pick a day where you're not going to be exposed to huge external stimuli to eat (eg, it's not the company picnic day). Weigh out 3 oz of unsalted nuts and 3 oz of cooked rice. Eat the rice for breakfast. Time yourself until you're hungry for those nuts. Eat the nuts. All of them. Time yourself until you're hungry again. I'll bet you make it past lunch. Eat 3 more ounces of nuts. You'll probably make it until dinner.

I'm pretty skeptical of traditional calorie counting, but wouldn't your experiment be simply explained by the 5x difference in caloric content between the two?

http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=3+oz+walnuts http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=3+oz+white+rice

Wouldn't it be more fair to compare equal calories rather than equal weights? I'd have to guess that eating 15 oz of rice might have a significant appetite suppressing effect as well.

Or maybe I'm not understanding the point of the experiment. Are you simply suggesting that by eating a strangely distributed 1200 calories you can 'make it until dinner'? :)

1 oz ~ 15 g

1 g carb ~ 3.4 kcal

1 g fat ~ 9 kcal

3 oz fat ~ 405 kcal

3 oz carb ~ 153 kcal

405 / 153 ~ 2.65

That's assuming the nuts are pure fat. They're actually about 1:1:1 fat:protein:carb => 246 kcal, or a ratio of about 1.6

Ah, wait, yes, fair enough, the cooked rice would be much less calorically dense. Do let me withhold the water. Please cook 3 oz of rice.

My basic point remains: fats satisfy, calorie for calorie, faster than carbs.

  My basic point remains: fats satisfy, calorie for calorie,
  faster than carbs.
OK, I'd agree with that. I wasn't sure if that was the point you were trying to make, or whether you were saying something more subtle. And obviously there is a limit: eating 1250 kcal of cooked white rice (1 kg) would be rather a feat and would probably physically prevent you from eating any thing else for a while, whereas the same number of calories in the form of nuts (200 g) could sneak up on you!

ps. Your numbers above are quite a bit off, as 1 oz is actually closer to 28 g, but you are forgiven as I'm guessing you are European and don't use ounces that often.

Thank you for this explanation, I've always wondered how this whole deal works. This also sort of explains why "eat whatever, but just in reasonable amounts and with reasonable variety" sort of diets seem to be a good approximation.
Thanks for the links! I had seen the NoS diet before, but forgot about it. I hadn't seen Joe's Goals before. I was impressed and I created an account.

While I was looking around, I noticed that Reinhard Engels has his own information tool for keeping track of things like the NoS diet:

http://www.everydaysystems.com/habitcal/

I also find his alcohol "glass ceiling" interesting, and it looks to me like habitcal is better suited for tracking things like that than Joe's Goals, though Joe's Goals has a nicer UI and seems better to me for tracking things like the NoS diet.

Here's a couple of things I've done over the years to make seemingly boring foods tasty:

-Make shakes. Almond milk, protein powder, berries and sugar free Jello. Buy like 5 different flavors and you can have strawberry cheesecake, dark chocolate, and butterscotch all for a snack without any of the guilt!

-Sauces will save your life. Pesto, hummus, sugar-free marinara, mustard, lemon, lime...mix and match all of these on various meats and vegetables for truly delicious meals.

-Lots of water. Water satiates you and is good for you. Always drink a ton of it to limit cravings. Green tea and mint tea are also shown to curb cravings.

Any personal experience you can share?
I've been enjoying a paleo lifestyle for the past three years. I'm leaner, stronger, and healthier than ever. I find it easy to fast for 18 hours, and do so most days, then I eat my fill of meat, veggies, and a bit of fruit. While fasting I have good concentration and energy. I tend towards a high fat, low carb paleo diet, but in the summer I increase my fruit and veg intake. Given that I don't eat out at work, I make the majority of my meals myself. My mainstay protein is ground beef which is cheap and delicious. I don't follow any fitness routine, but often go for lunchtime walks and sometimes I swim on the weekends. The most understated benefit in my opinion is the freedom from modern dietary dogma. Many of my family and friends are also doing amazing with this way of eating. Feel free to me ask specific questions. Take care.
9 months in. Almost back to my good-old-days weight after losing 19 pounds, without hunger, without fatigue, exercise while still enjoyable and have more energy for it I do little (High-intensity short duration infrequently, but not chronic cardio), no more feeling bloated. So my personal anecdotal evidence, my echo-chamber of positive feedback :), my results, all have me happy. YMMV.

BTW, seeing that this thread has over 100 comments just confirms that when it comes to advice, especially nutrition, a lot of us think of ourselves as quasi-experts. We're all oh, so bright, and have the key to success right here! I doubt the OP will be able to make up his mind from this.

When I was about 10 until the time I was about 15 or 16 I would have 2 big cups of chocolate milk with extra sugar. I woke up one morning and decided I couldn't continue doing that or I would have some serious health issues down the road. The next morning I stopped drinking my milk that way, every couple of days I would cheat and have 1 glass, but then I would feel guilty and stop again. I'm 19 now and I drink one glass of 1% milk every breakfast, work out 3 times a week and I stick to a healthy diet that fits my goals.

Perhaps what you need is a lifestyle change and a new way of thinking about those cravings. I firmly believe in the saying "healthy body, healthy mind", and that shy's me away from anything unhealthy.

Of course I'm no saint so I choose 1 cheat day a week and I eat as much junk food as possible, after the day's over I don't want to look or eat any junk food until the next cheat day.

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I should also mention that at around 16 I became very interested in fitness and nutrition so I spent most hours reading up on it. It made me more aware that our bodies are just really REALLY beautiful machines, in order for it to run at full throttle you want to feed it the proper nutrients or else it will just chug a long.