HN Explorer

Launch HN: Promise (YC W18) – Cost-effective, more humane alternative to jail

912 points by dfrappier ↗ HN
Hi HN,

We are Phaedra and Diana of Promise (http://joinpromise.com/). We provide a cost-effective, more humane alternative to incarceration.

We work for government agencies to monitor and support individuals who would otherwise be in jail or who are under some form of community supervision.

There are almost 2.3 million people behind bars in the US and another 4.5+ million people on probation or parole. Almost 450,000 people are in jails pretrial, meaning they have not been convicted of the crime for which they were arrested. The majority of these individuals remain in custody because they cannot afford to pay for their release. This is costly for governments and devastating for the individuals who remain in jail who can lose their job, housing, children and more while incarcerated. Believe it or not, many of these people never even end up being charged with or convicted of a crime.

Phaedra had a background in politics (she ran the South Bay Labor Council) and Diana had a background in law (as a criminal defense attorney and co-founder of the Ella Baker Center). We then worked together at a non-profit (Green For All), in the music industry (for the musician Prince) and in technology (at Honor). We decided to start Promise because we saw a huge need for innovation in the criminal justice system and wanted to use what we had learned in tech to build something that actually helps change lives for the better and can scale.

Here's how Promise works: We work in partnership with governments who release people from jail on condition that they work with Promise as an alternative to being in custody. We also provide support to people under community supervision. We use an intake assessment to create an individualized plan that is based on the risks and needs of each participant. We provide each participant with an app and a wearable tracking device (only when required). Our goal is to always use the least restrictive means necessary and to use a step-up, step-down approach: that is, we reduce restrictions when possible and increase only when needed. While there are still restrictions on freedom, participants will no longer be in custody so that they can return to their jobs, families, and communities until their case is resolved or they no longer have any required supervision.

We then monitor and support participants to help them succeed with their plans. We provide an intelligent calendar of their obligations (court appearances, drug testing, substance abuse treatment, etc.) and adaptive reminders to help them meet these obligations. Research and experience have shown that simple intervention like this does work: for example, it makes people more likely to get to court. We also provide referrals and support so participants can receive services that may help (job training/placement, housing, counseling, etc.). We provide reports to courts or other involved parties as needed. We also allow the participants to easily view their upcoming obligations, overall plan and progress on their plan.

We believe this approach can support participants' needs, keep communities safer, and provide a cost-effective and more humane alternative to incarceration in the US. Our business model is simple: we charge governments a fee. Incarceration is so expensive that we can make a profit and still save governments—and ultimately tax payers—money.

We would love to get feedback on Promise and in particular to hear about your ideas and experiences in this area, whether working in government agencies, selling to such agencies or as individuals who have been impacted by this system. There is a huge amount of work to be done here!

Thank you!!

421 comments

[ 2.8 ms ] story [ 226 ms ] thread
rsweeney21
I want this to be successful more than any other startup I've seen in recent history. Our reform system is so outdated and broken.

Do you have a plan for how to help addicts and people with mental illness? Or is that outside your scope?

dfrappier
Thank you so much! We will not be providing direct treatment services to participants. Our goal is to find the best each county we work in has to offer and to refer people to the best programs we can find.
nhoehn43nue9
Do you have any stance on quasi-religious treatment programs with suspect outcomes like Alcoholics Anonymous, or the Scientology front Narcanon?
eof
unfortunately we don't have a reform system, but a punishment system as if the suffering of the offender is important
RubenSandwich
It's not just the suffering of the offender, but the idea that justice to the offending party can only happen if the offender suffers like the offending party suffered. It's "An eye for an eye", just a few layers of abstraction over it.
sizzle
force drug addicts to get on Naloxone for lower recidivism rates and better outcomes.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/inmates-heroin_us_56966...

troncjb
Suboxone is the one you are thinking of. Naloxone is used to reverse the effects of an OD. Unless they are functionally similar and I am misinformed.
andymal
Suboxone usually contains some Naloxone.
sizzle
Naloxone is used to curb drug cravings as it blocks opiod receptors so you can't get high when you take it and thus weaken the reward pathway circuit in your brain's reward system. This has been studied in prison systems to lead to less repeat offenders for drug related offences (dui) when given naloxone in prison. I wish I could find the study.
jhull
the article talks about treatment with Vivitrol which is similar to suboxone, except it can't be abused (and therefore has no street value) and is a monthly injection instead of a daily.

Naloxone/Narcan is for immediate treatment of an overdose

codingdave
The idea sounds terrific - I'd be interested in hearing how the response has been from governments? Also, what goes into the decision making process to manage the risks for specific cases?
dfrappier
The response has been good so far. We have had some pushback based on general concern of replacing humans with technology. But, overall positive. We use an assessment tool to measure risk based on everything from employment to past conviction.
ceejayoz
> We use an assessment tool to measure risk based on everything from employment to past conviction.

Could you speak more to this? There are serious concerns with software being used to evaluate the risk of criminal behavior. Are these being considered?

https://www.propublica.org/article/machine-bias-risk-assessm...

phaedradiana
We love these questions because they are at the heart of why we founded this company. I am a woman of color whose family members have been in the system and Diana is a criminal defense lawyer by trade. We have spent a lot of time looking at assessment tools. At this point, we need both qualitative and quantitative analysis.
ceejayoz
I appreciate that it's being thought of, but I'd love more detail on what concrete steps you've taken to address these sorts of biases in the tooling, which you indicate already exists.
ladybro
I really respect what Promise is trying to do. Genuinely, thank you for taking on this challenge.

What do you think are the top one or two obstacles that you face in on the way to achieving your goal?

Mononokay
This feels like one of the more ambitious startups YC has funded in a while, I love it.

Has Promise been used in a real-world setting yet? I'd love to see the results.

dfrappier
We are in our first pilot. Will update when we have more results.
acoleman616
I'd love to follow your progress! Any chance of an email newsletter?
dfrappier
Yes. I will add you to the list. Thank you!
burntwater
Can you link to somewhere we can add ourselves to the list so you aren't inundated? Not to add to your work load, but this kind of organization is, IMHO, exactly the kind that could benefit from a general purpose newsletter for people who want to follow your progress, but aren't actually involved.
efields
> We work in partnership with governments who release people from jail on condition that they work with Promise as an alternative to being in custody.

What does it mean for the person to "work with Promise?" Are they performing a service or labor, or simply a subject of the administration protocols mentioned later? In other words, Promise offloads the management of the individual while they await trial from local gov't to a third party?

dfrappier
They will not be performing any service or labor for Promise. They will work with our team. Our team with get them set up on the app, do an intake to refer them to appropriate support services, work with them to make sure they know about court dates and other obligations, etc.
efields
Case management! Got it.
FabioFleitas
Wow! This is an incredible challenge to tackle. It seems like right now you're planning to cover the U.S. Is your goal to provide this globally or keep it entirely focused on U.S.?
dfrappier
Our focus is on the U.S. at this time, but we are definitely open to expanding beyond the U.S. in the future.
gingerbread-man
Are you guys initially focusing on a specific subset of those awaiting trial? I imagine the needs of those charged with, say, drug offenses, would be very different from the needs of those charged with, say, domestic assault.
dfrappier
You are correct. Needs of those in the criminal justice system vary widely. This will depend on the government partners in each jurisdiction that we are in. Some clients will assign us participants and some will give us guidelines on who we are able to work with. In any case, once we get individuals into the program, our intake is what really tells us what services would be beneficial to them. We will then work to connect the with the best services in their area given their specific needs.
IAmEveryone
There’s this story of a private company working with big retailers to offer shoplifters some useless online “tutoring” instead of calling the police.

The shoplifters, often the poorest of the poor, had to pay hundreds of dollars for this “leniency”, often without knowing that the police wouldn’t even have come for the low-value crime.

Don’t do that.

drak0n1c
Mediated solutions are better than the alternatives of the perpetrator getting a criminal record or the shopkeeper deciding to break the shoplifter's fingers. These systems can and should be improved to avoid life-ruining spirals (bad for society), but there has to be some form of consequences for the perpetrator. Otherwise, victims would have to pay the costs of their victimization while the abusers learn nothing (also bad for society).

Promise should "do that" if they can improve the process relative to the status quo.

ihackalot
I believe this is a great idea, only a bit ahead of its time. I don't think it's going to be successful until you address some cultural, educational and ethical issues first. Remember you are still the country who elected Trump for president.

Anyhow... I wish you the very best and I hope you can prove me wrong!

maxerickson
It's already a thing for decades:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_probation

ihackalot
Doh, nobody assumed they "invented" anything. I did assume though that even the average Joe would be able to understand that what they are doing here is applying the concept at a different level. I'm sorry, I thought you would get that.

Find this "Promise extends the scale and effectiveness of community supervision by balancing human touch and technology to improve long-term outcomes." http://joinpromise.com/#how I can't find anything like that on Wikipedia. Can you help?

[deleted]
(comment deleted)
dev_throw
This sounds very (pardon the pun) promising. The prison system in the US is skewed to punishment rather than rehabilitation and utilizing tech (intelligent calendar) will help reduce prevent people missing court dates. My only concern is how will Promise be audited? Is there going to be some way of being transparent while also protecting private information?
leggomylibro
What a fantastic idea - it's really refreshing to see people working on problems like this and I hope you find success in supporting people to overcome their issues!
ceejayoz
It sounds like this is a for-profit business. I'm very leery of the trend towards private prisons. Was a non-profit considered here?

Are participants required to have a smartphone to install the app to be a part of the release program?

criddell
That was the first thing that I thought as well. This is another program like private prisons.

I have a hard time seeing how you can align the incentives of a business like this with greater societal interests.

stouset
That said, I'm hoping they can. I too am skeptical that a for-profit model can work here, but as long as the incentives are appropriately aligned (they profit when incarceration rates drop and recidivism rates decline), there's a possibility it can work.
maxerickson
It'll almost certainly be a fee for service model.

(municipalities simply won't write contracts with big rewards tied to incarceration or recidivism rates)

grivescorbett
There is such a thing as for profit for good. Perhaps they believe they can be both better and cheaper than prisons at the same time. That allows them to provide a compelling pitch to governments and convince them to direct funds to Promise instead of prisons. The government wins because it's cheaper, their users win because they are not incarcerated, and they win because they have cash flow. These types of businesses are not impossible to create.
criddell
> There is such a thing as for profit for good.

Their association with Y Combinator doesn't help with that impression. How many other venture funded start ups exist to provide a societal benefit while making only a modest return? Isn't the goal a big exit?

They might not be venture funded yet, but they aren't at Y Combinator for the coffee, right? I know this sounds super cynical, so please tell me why I'm wrong. Why is this a good thing?

ceejayoz
> How many other venture funded start ups exist to provide a societal benefit while making only a modest return?

YC has a non-profits program. https://www.ycombinator.com/nonprofits/

I don't see any indication that Promise is going non-profit, though.

grivescorbett
Who says anything about a modest return? How much does the U.S. spend on prisons? How much does the world spend on prisons? Say they operate at a 30% discount, how much revenue is that? Off the top of my head, a lot.
gt_
>These types of businesses are not impossible to create.

This is amazingly uninformed. Let’s stop pretending private businesses were born yesterday and just consult history. Privatization of human rights is despicable and this is not a lesson that needs to be learned again. Do you know why we never had private prisons before? They incentivize corruption of the most vulnerable fabric of our society. No excuse.

grivescorbett
I agree that for-profit prisons are not good for society. But does this one (granted, massive) mistake mean that we can no longer try to innovate in this space? Does it mean that the only model is publicly funded rehabilitation? That's obviously not worked either.
Jemmeh
Exactly. I think there's a lot of things to consider around it all, for-profit prisons have a LOT of problems. But if we found that microwaving food for prisoners saved a lot of time cooking and thus also the amount of time we had to pay for people to cook for prisons that would be a good thing...at least it would be if that money gets funneled back to the point that a taxpayer is paying less. As it is I assume it just goes into the pocket of whoever runs the for-profit prison.
criddell
> does this one (granted, massive) mistake mean that we can no longer try to innovate in this space?

No, but we should learn from those mistakes, right?

When a company makes money from prisoners and more prisoners mean more money, then the incentives are a problem.

dragonwriter
> Do you know why we never had private prisons before?

You mean, before 1852?

dminor
A profit motive can lead to perverse and unforeseen incentives, even despite the best intentions of the founders, who someday will not be running the company.

The private prison industry routinely lobbies for higher fines & longer sentences because it is to their benefit to have more people go to prison. Promise appears to have a similar incentive.

smw
This aims to be much closer: http://benefitcorp.net/faq. Companies with the ability to operate for-profit, but without the obligation for maximizing shareholder profit.
jpdb
Would it be more ethical to only profit based on recidivism?

Eg, Promise is only paid if the prisoner doesn't go back to prison?

ceejayoz
Not necessarily. That gives them a financial incentive to send people their algorithms deem "iffy" to jail instead of accepting them into the program.
maxerickson
The read I have is that they are aiming downstream of the detention decision, providing services related to probation and parole.

I wouldn't be real surprised if their initial targets are places that have large, established probation systems, offering the tech as an aid to government employed probation officers. Easier than taking on legal responsibility for the probationers.

gt_
For anyone wondering, this is definitely sarcasm.
adamsea
Well, it wouldn't be recidivism, but rather if the accused committed another crime prior to their trial date. Or, if they missed their trial date.

It's easy to keep getting confused around if we're dealing with accused criminals or convicted felons, as both are in jail. Sounds like Promise is focusing on the accused.

grivescorbett
Yes this would be a very interesting and ethical incentive model to explore.
phaedradiana
We love this! Right now the incentives are wrong. Contractors are paid per person, per day, which creates the wrong incentives.
recidivated
Consider a business model based on per day an individual did not recidivate, pro-rated by a prediction model for initial likelihood of recidivism, and severity of crime.

This would perhaps ascribe a number for level of difficulty, and an initial estimate for how hard the case is.

Keep in mind that a convicted offender on the streets may suffer from a potential for revenge and retaliation, and thus is possibly safer in jail, however horrible jail may be. This would augment a recidivism predictor further, if you cannot isolate them from their victims, should victims be bitter about the perception of your service lacking punitive action.

module0000
Want to sell bonds that mature when the group of monitored individuals is NOT incarcerated? I’m asking about the payment logistics... it’s a boring but important($$$) part.
cpfohl
It sounds to me like this is for profit on purpose. That's not a terrible thing: it's not a prison...

The smartphone question is important. I wonder if an inexpensive device custom built can replace it.

ceejayoz
> That's not a terrible thing: it's not a prison...

I think that's splitting a lot of hairs. If working with Promise is a condition of release, it's possible (and likely) that Promise now has the power to send you to prison if they deem you non-compliant with your release terms.

We have pretty clear examples of how for-profit criminal justice can go wrong: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kids_for_cash_scandal

phaedradiana
To date, 90 percent of the population we are working with in our current counties have smart phones.
phaedradiana
We agree on general concern about for profit prisons. Diana and I met working at a non profit. She founded the Ella Baker Center and I worked in the labor movement. However, we created a company with those values because we believed this put us in the best position to scale the solutions we believed in.
frgtpsswrdlame
What is your general concern about for-profit prisons?
decebalus1
> However, we created a company with those values because we believed this put us in the best position to scale the solutions we believed in.

You could just have created a non-profit and reinvest all money - way easier to scale. Values mean shit to the shareholders who invested in you :) They care about returns. I can only image what kind of monsters are born when blindly hunting for profit. Actually, I don't have to imagine, I just need to look at the current for-profit rehabilitation industry. Not saying you're the same, you're probably not but you will at some point yield decision power to the for-profit interest of the company. And let's assume this picks up and becomes immensely successful. What's stopping the company from hiring lobbyists to support legislation which keeps people 'in the system'?

evolve2k
Addressing some concerns here (which I don't think will go away as you become more successful), consider registering as a Public Benefit Corporation or at least announcing that that is in your game plan.

Ref: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-benefit_corporation

For background:

A Public Benefit Corporation makes it explicit legally for corporations to act morally, ethically and responsibly in regard to society, the environment, the natural world and the world at large.

The Certificate of Incorporation must list the company's altruistic goals and overall mission statement. However, in every other manner, the structure of a Public Benefit Corporation can mirror the structure of any type of Corporation.

alex_young
This is a pretty weak line of reasoning IMHO. There are plenty of non-profit organizations which scale very large and address large societal problems. For instance, most hospitals.

Why couldn't the same thing be done to solve this problem, especially given your concern for eliminating perverse incentives in the justice system?

module0000
Are you offering hospitals as a good or as a bad example?
heyyyouu
This is a great point -- it should be required to be at least not-for-profit, if not non-profit.
dfrappier
We spent most of our professional lives in non profits and the last 6 years in for profit. We believe the business will better serve people with the structure for many reasons, such as hiring, not having to deal with foundations or individual donors, etc. We believe good people can run and create good companies.
ismail
First it is great you are tackling a real social issue.

If it works it looks like it could have a positive impact. How ever I have a few concerns/questions

1. How will the incentives be aligned? More people standing trial = larger potential market.

2. This is a false dichotomy. “Not having to deal with foundations”

There are other models that do not require you to take donor funding. Take a look at the model by Muhammad Yunus[0] or writing by Porter on shared value [1]. For e.g one could generate cash flow for expenses without having investors looking for a return.

3. While a profit motive can be useful to encourage innovation and competitiveness, this can have negative consequences. For e.g in this case what is good for business is not necessarily good for society.(more suspects)

4. Would you consider this a fundamental solution?

5. What outcome are you after?

6. Is there a way to prevent people even Being suspected of a crime? Preventing them committing a crime?

7. Using leverage points from Donella Meadows [2] Where does this fall?

8. Have you looked at systems theory? Very useful for really complex social challenges like the one you are trying to tackle acumen has a free course. [3].

8. Is this solution a short term one with a more long term(fundamental) plan for the future?

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grameen_Bank

[1] https://hbr.org/2011/01/the-big-idea-creating-shared-value

[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelve_leverage_points

[3] https://www.plusacumen.org/courses/systems-practice

walrus01
To me this looks like a for-profit parole system. It's essentially the same thing as various state and county level governments' parole systems are already intended to do, but implemented by a private contractor. Much the same way that private prisons accomplish the same function as state-owned prisons.

If you were recruiting new staff positions for this startup I don't see how the job functions for the persons interacting with the "clients" are much different from a parole officer. Just with more "web 2.0" technology, IoT tech for ankle tracking bracelets, etc.

ethiclub
>It sounds like this is a for-profit business. I'm very leery of the trend towards private prisons.

(I completely agree, and sare the same concerns - Especially given the precedent of US incarceration and private entity involvement, which many would consider slavery. However...)

On a long term scale, I believe that Capitalism will become more trustworthy and aligned with demand than government.

Or at the very least, Capitalism will 'pave the road', and hand off to a socialist system upon maturity and consensus.

While the free market is (in its pure form) money driven (ignoring externalities), we appear to be in a new age of enlightenment. I believe that this is bringing about a new form of capitalism which provides a platform for ethics.

In essence, this boils down to "Government is too slow to legislate and bring about change, and doesn't accurately reflect views. The people are tired of waiting and not being listened to, and will turn to the free market for the supply they want".

If Promise and other companies are able to hold themselves accountable to their customers, governing bodies (eventually), but most importantly the population at large (contributing in a meritocratic way), I can see this a) working very well, b) far more quickly than any other system, and c) innovating and maturing components ready for adoption by government.

The alternative could be waiting 50 years or an entire lifetime to get the change people want. Plan B to me would be governments launching online platforms for democratic (and later, technocratic/meritocratic) referendum systems on a local/small level, then with trust delegating decisions more and more to citizens.

Hard to justify all the above succinctly, so I presume this will not be convincing to all. Would love to hear Promise's opinions on this.

datamingle
What happens when Promise loses an individual? Who pays the cost for them to be tracked down and returned. I'm assuming existing systems will be used such as bounty hunters to do this job.
dfrappier
We will not use bounty hunters like bail bond companies. We will have a plan with the local jurisdiction that we are in. That will be county specific but will involve us trying to get them back on calendar if they miss a court date, but ultimately the Sheriff or local law enforcement picking them up if they have an outstanding warrant.
UncleEntity
> ...but will involve us trying to get them back on calendar if they miss a court date

Isn't that inherently what bounty hunters do?

portofcall
So you’ll use the local PD as bounty hunters, without the bounty. I’ve read through this whole thread, and I wonder if you’re aware of just how smarmy and evavise you’ve been throughout? As PR goes, silence would serve you better than your comments in the aggregate, and where you stop responding.

For example!

It’s understandable that you have no good answer to this, because the answer is clear. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16631983

Cavalier indeed https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16632252

Ugh https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16631560

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16631723

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16632770

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16632329

It just goes on.

It’s a bit too clear that you’ve identified a place where yet another middleman can profit without solving a problem directly, or rendering services, as a for-profit company in a space which should not be producing profits.

Cyberdog
Who pays for this service? The suspects, or the governments?

Will you only be working with suspects pre-conviction, or will you also work with the convicted as part of a sentence that would otherwise involve time in prison or county jail?

dfrappier
Our current plan is to do contracts with government agencies. There is no plan to charge the participants directly. Our plan was to start with pre-trial individuals but in speaking with potential clients, we do have interest in working with individuals who are on probation, parole and those who can serve their sentence in the community.
wavefunction
Sounds like a very dynamic and interesting start-up mission.

My experience is that smaller jurisdictions try to wrangle monetary fees and levies using the threat of jail-time and the disruption it causes to a person's life so you may be facing some perverse incentives from some of the audience of 'customers' you're trying to reach in smaller jurisdictions.

But what you're doing is great and I applaud yCombinator taking a chance on such a vital and excellent venture!

SJMosley
This idea is fantastic. I look forward to following the updates on Promise.
foolinaround
I will be rooting for this startup to succeed!

You need to identify the least riskiest of cases, identify numbers, what the current scenario and the projected outcome would look like. It does not need to be a dramatic change. At this point, what you need to be seeking is a mindset change from just jailing folks.

dfrappier
Thank you for your support! We agree that a big part of the solution is changing mindsets.
mrguyorama
As a company that will make money from people committing crime, what is your incentive to reduce crime or otherwise prevent repeat offenders?
dfrappier
We really appreciate this question because we believe that the incentives in the criminal justice system are often wrong. Our goal is to get people out of jail and keep them out. Our program is set up for the purpose of getting them out of custody. We will also evaluate ourselves based on how we do at reducing recidivism.
mbel
You appreciate the question so much that you avoid the answer?

What is your business incentive to reduce crime rate? How reduction of the crime rate is making your business more profitable?

jhull
What is a dating websites incentive to couple people up? They have seemingly reverse incentives too. The better a dating website is the less potential users it might eventually have.
nrmitchi
I don't think that anyone here is trying to say that this is the only industry in existence that has reverse incentives (in that their success could limit their future).

I think it's a bit of a stretch to compare online dating to an industry which, quite literally, destroys peoples lives and often unfairly targets disadvantaged groups.

lprubin
One possible business incentive is that if Promise's outcomes actually cause an increase in crime, governments will be far less likely to hire them.
petethepig
That's clearly not the way it's working out for private prisons.
freedomben
You didn't really address the incentive, just simply stated your goals. I think clearly there is a financial incentive for a for-profit company to keep people in the system.

If you have ideological views that people > profit (which I suspect you do, and I completely agree with), then that can be an incentive. But I think it is important to recognize that people and the systems they build can be corrupted over time. What happens when people that don't have the same ideology take control? The profit incentive won't change, but the ideological one may.

I wasn't the one that asked the question initially, but it's possible that's what he/she was getting at.

dfrappier
We have introduced recidivism as part of our performance metrics. Currently, contractors are paid per day, per person. We believe it creates the wrong incentive. The best way to correct is to incentivize companies to have people not reenter the system.
treis
How are you paid?
smw
Doesn't your board have the obligation to maximize shareholder value? Is it possible that would conflict with the metrics you mention as the driving force of your company? Is it possible that a Public Benefit Corporation might be a more suitable entity to serve this sort of need?
scrozier
This doesn't answer the question. Getting people out of jail is already rewarded as part of your business model. But you would also benefit by more people being tried and found guilty. I wonder if there is an answer. What about something like establishing a fund that is...funded based on recidivism? If recidivism is high, you cannot distribute profits, they must be channeled back into R&D to improve your services.
kearneyandy
Perhaps repeat criminals on Promise are not eligible to use it in the future. All a repeat criminal in this case does is lower the governments trust in the product.
indigochill
I think this is a fantastic concept. I'm hopeful that this is a step towards putting the "justice" back into "criminal justice system".
PostOnce
Nothing says justice like private equity. Remember the cash for kids scandal?
sitkack
What is your sales pipeline like? Who is your initial target? I have _no_ experience in this area, but I think very small muni that dont have facilities, that have to contract out to counties or other towns could be a first good target. Esp places that know the burden that incarceration places on the rest of the people and services in those towns.

Could it also be applied to halfway house use cases? I assume you will require the user to carry a smartphone and it will have geofencing, in and out. I also assume you will be using face recognition to semi-randomly authenticate the user.

This is the first YC HN post I have ever opened, I think this is great idea, esp because most of these businesses are started by unethical leaders motivated purely by profit.

dfrappier
Thank you for opening and sharing your thoughts! We have been speaking with sheriff departments, district attorneys, public defenders, probation departments, judges and other parts of the criminal justice system. They have slightly different motivations but most agree that Promise could benefit individuals going through the system. Thank you for your idea. We will definitely look into that.
ForrestN
This is an extremely politicized area of society—do you have opinions about existing policy, and where you would like policy to be changed? Do you see this business as part of the existing political movement against mass incarceration, or as an alternative to it? Do you plan to participate in the political system directly, for instance by lobbying congress?
JabavuAdams
Kudos for having the courage to work in this area! Are you planning ahead on how to deal with recidivism? This seems like a highly politicized area and no doubt there will be lots of people who would love to point to your failure(s).

All it takes is one repeat offender hurting someone while on your program. Cue the pitchforks...

blang
Let me preface this with me declaring that what I know about the US penal system comes 90% from television.

How is this different from parole or a halfway house?

phaedradiana
Those are both post conviction. We are focusing on pre-trial. Primarily, people who would be incarcerated while waiting for a trial because they cannot afford bail.
blang
I think I understand now. Isn't that how things are already run in Washington DC?
sparrish
If you're focus is only pre-trial persons who can't make bail, I don't see how you'll stay in business.

Bail is to be set based on the seriousness of the charges and the likelihood that the accused will skip out on further proceedings.

If your clients don't have enough assets to 'make bail', either the charges are very serious or they have made very poor financial decisions (maybe both). Either makes them a flight risk and there is a reason they'll stay in custody.

Your program will essentially take in the worst of the accused and try to get them to the court on-time. I don't see anything in your well-meaning plans that gives proper motivation or incentive for them to follow through and not just skip the county/state/country.

To work, your candidate selection will have to be very vigorous and my guess is there isn't a large enough user base to make all the red tape of working with local and state governments worth it.