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Ask HN: "Interesting" Job Contract

3 points by znt ↗ HN
This question comes from an unexperienced young hacker who is at the beginning of his professional career. Recently I had an interview with a local software firm and was offered a developer position. But there's a little quirk: The employer told me that the developers were entitled to half of their salaries and had to earn the other half by turning in coding assignments throughout the month. He made his point by saying "This way slackers and hardworkers get what they deserve, and it is possible for a hardworking developer to earn twice his salary".

Also there's another important condition in the job contract: If I sign it, I'll have to work for a year. If I ever try to leave the job before that I'll have to pay a compensation to the company for every month that I won't be working.

So here's the question: Is this a "normal" kind of contract that software firms generally offer? Or is this a sign of danger?

TL;DR:

Job offer with half normal salary, must earn the other half by creating code. Can't quit for a year when started. Is it a Trap?

14 comments

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spooneybarger
I've never seen anything like that and would be very wary. You have no idea what will happen during that year. It could turn out to be an awful place to work that people are dying to get away from. It certainly doesn't sound like a great shop. There are better ways to deal with slackers than not paying as much as hard workers ( like not paying them at all, not hiring them to start with, weeding them out as quickly as possible ).
nolite
sounds like a wtf.. turn and don't look back
sgt
I've never heard of this. It could be a trap. Talk to others who are currently working at the company, and who might have been working there for over a year. Personally I wouldn't do that for a whole year, maybe 6 months though.
elbrodeur
Do not accept this offer. Do you really want to work with someone who A) Doesn't trust you to work hard and B) Doesn't believe their work environment or product is good/fun/exciting enough to keep you around for only one year?

We all have to start somewhere, but this sounds like a situation that will leave you feeling deflated, powerless and bored.

dpavlenkov
Please, can you share the name and location of this firm? Just curious, hahaha.
znt
It's a Turkish firm which creates hospital automation systems. Actually they just sell a basic program to all hospitals and tweak it a little bit for each case. It's been in the market for 20 years but I doubt it has many loyal developers.
dpavlenkov
If you can negotiate, then sign a contract that isn't a trap.
znt
Unfortunately, it's a standard contract. Only negotiation factor is the salary and that is as high as it gets in my current situation.
andrewtbham
This strikes me as very odd. I have worked places where you got a bonus... that was contingent on performance or the company's performance. but i had a decent base salary.

i also worked at one place as a consultant where you had to give "6 months notice"... the spirit of the agreement was that you wouldn't work on a project and quit near the deadline. however, the only penalty was refunding your last bonus.

this deal seems pretty bad... unless the 1/2 the base salary is actual decent and i thin there would need to be very clear criteria for getting more money... it seems like that would be difficult.

the paying if you quit... that seems pretty crazy, how much would you have to pay?

znt
Half of the base salary is about $650. Probably I'll have to pay at least that much for every month short of contract period to the company if I quit.
_pius
Don't ever let someone play games with your compensation. You're a professional.
skowmunk
Based on your location (Turkey) this is what I would do if I were in your shoes:

Rather than decide on yes or no based simply on the terms (which might appear ridiculous to those in US), I would check the track record/references of the company.

Do they use these terms to drive the programmers as slaves? or is it simply a defensive strategy (in response to local job market/legal environment) meant to ensure employee productivity and stability in the company?

Obviously its a no-no, if it is the former and an ok-yes if it is the latter.

-----------------------------

Why I say this: (the long of it for those interested) (All these refer to developing companies with high growth rates, high inflation, high competition and low number of truly qualified professionals - this is the reality of their job market/legal/economic environment)

Such contracts are often common in developing countries, where the turnover rates are ridiculously high. ( how about employees jumping every 6 - 12 months as sort of a norm among the non-mncs? - for a different reality)

Often, some employees join a company, complete training for a few months and then jump to another company showcasing that training. And latter companies often don't hold it against the employees for jumping so soon, because they dont' have to spend time and money on getting that employee trained - this is the nature of competition in those countries.

It is also a sort of protection for the company so that employees come in, get to know their good ideas (if they are worth) then just jump to other companies with those ideas or start their own companies based on them - the legal protection against this is ridiculously low or non-existent in almost all countries (even the democratic ones) except for those in NA/EU and Japan.

There is also this problem of prospective employees putting up fake certifications and experience, and claiming higher salaries in many developing countries. Systems to verify educational and occupational records of prospective employees are almost non existent, if at all.

Fyi,I am not pointing fingers at the employees, they are also under tremendous pressures to maintain a decent standard of living in environments subject to very high inflation ( against the typical 1-2% in the US, how about around 10%? and those are the 'official' rates which are often watered down for the international press). So they have to keep getting higher and higher salaries to maintain the same standard of living. Often that job hopping is the best way to ensure that increasing salary.

Either way, good luck.

znt
Thanks for the informative response man. I had a bad feeling about the contract when they explained the conditions. Later I read at a local message board about someone else's experience's with the same firm and how he was advised to not work for that firm by an inside developer. That is why I started this thread and now I realise the direness of the situation I may get myself into.
skowmunk
I guess you did your homework right!