Curious what you mean by this (especially since no one had even commented when you said it). Do you mean because the article was up voted? Isn't what makes HN great is that we look at the data and seek empirical evidence, and not just take action based on emotion?
This article is a clear refutation of a commonly held misbelief (or worse). Unfortunately it was dropped from the front page almost immediately, without commentary.
> Isn't what makes HN great is that we
> look at the data and seek empirical
> evidence, and not just take action based on emotion?
That isnt what makes HN great nor what it does.
The article is refuting a strawman, the complaints about the gender pay gap are primarily around the lack of career advancement options for women, workplace discrimination, being asked to do the work of a senior without the relvant title / pay etc.
This article gets upvoted on HN, similiarly to the article about the sexist scientist yesterday[1] so the 90% 20-30yo white males can talk about how discrimination / sexism doesnt exist and women obviously just arent interested in highly paid careers while ignoring the years of painfully obvious data and research to the contrary.
It gets taken off the front page because HN mods arent that fussed about Hacker News being a blatantly sexist community, they would just prefer to not actually be seen as such
> The article is refuting a strawman, the complaints about the gender pay gap are primarily around the lack of career advancement options for women, workplace discrimination, being asked to do the work of a senior without the relvant title / pay etc.
I've been in many discussions where people tell me that women get paid 70 cents on the dollar for the same work as a man. That's the common argument, not a strawman.
Did you ask for clarification in those discussions whether the 70 cents was adjusted or unadjusted? or are you assuming the one that you believe you can disprove?
This is simply not true. How often have you heard the phrase "equal pay for equal work"? That phrase literally implies that for the same work, women are paid less. That is what people mean when they say it, and because it is so common, it is a very worthy myth to debunk.
Some evidence it is not a strawman:
1) College Humor video strongly implying that a woman is being paid significantly less than all of the men around her.
2) President Obama in a 2015 SOTU address saying that a law should be passed saying that a women should be paid the same as a man for doing the same work.
Moreover, this myth is actually deleterious, because focusing on trying to ensure equal pay for equal work will be futile and a waste of attention so long as the real causes of disparities are ignored.
The complaints about the gender pay gap are primarily around the idea that women make less than men. And that's it. Just wholly the idea that women as a whole make less than men as a whole.
It's not sexist to question that assumption. It's not sexist to look into why that assumption exists.
It's literally science.
Furthermore, the blame for the wage gap is placed unduly upon the shoulders of men, and most of us - especially here - are powerless to do anything about it in any meaningful way. Despite that, we are painted as bad or negative in some way, and that feeling sucks.
It isn't sexist to not want to be seen as the cause for a societal symptom. It's not sexist to want to dive deeper and find an objective truth that we can point to.
It's not sexist to want to treat a situation as "us vs the problem" instead of "me vs you".
>the main problem today is not unequal pay for equal work, but whatever it is that leads women to be in lower-ranking jobs at lower-paying organisations
If only this was the conversation we could have, we might actually make some progress.
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[ 3.1 ms ] story [ 38.1 ms ] thread(actually do change, please)
This article is a clear refutation of a commonly held misbelief (or worse). Unfortunately it was dropped from the front page almost immediately, without commentary.
That isnt what makes HN great nor what it does.
The article is refuting a strawman, the complaints about the gender pay gap are primarily around the lack of career advancement options for women, workplace discrimination, being asked to do the work of a senior without the relvant title / pay etc.
This article gets upvoted on HN, similiarly to the article about the sexist scientist yesterday[1] so the 90% 20-30yo white males can talk about how discrimination / sexism doesnt exist and women obviously just arent interested in highly paid careers while ignoring the years of painfully obvious data and research to the contrary.
It gets taken off the front page because HN mods arent that fussed about Hacker News being a blatantly sexist community, they would just prefer to not actually be seen as such
[1] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18112125
I've been in many discussions where people tell me that women get paid 70 cents on the dollar for the same work as a man. That's the common argument, not a strawman.
As I said, keep on fighting the good fight.
This is simply not true. How often have you heard the phrase "equal pay for equal work"? That phrase literally implies that for the same work, women are paid less. That is what people mean when they say it, and because it is so common, it is a very worthy myth to debunk.
Some evidence it is not a strawman:
1) College Humor video strongly implying that a woman is being paid significantly less than all of the men around her.
2) President Obama in a 2015 SOTU address saying that a law should be passed saying that a women should be paid the same as a man for doing the same work.
[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bm3YfMtgEdI
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayO4vl6YZoo
Moreover, this myth is actually deleterious, because focusing on trying to ensure equal pay for equal work will be futile and a waste of attention so long as the real causes of disparities are ignored.
It's not sexist to question that assumption. It's not sexist to look into why that assumption exists.
It's literally science.
Furthermore, the blame for the wage gap is placed unduly upon the shoulders of men, and most of us - especially here - are powerless to do anything about it in any meaningful way. Despite that, we are painted as bad or negative in some way, and that feeling sucks.
It isn't sexist to not want to be seen as the cause for a societal symptom. It's not sexist to want to dive deeper and find an objective truth that we can point to.
It's not sexist to want to treat a situation as "us vs the problem" instead of "me vs you".
If only this was the conversation we could have, we might actually make some progress.