Ask HN: What is (is there something) wrong with me?
Back in school I thought I knew what I wanted to do, but now I am utterly clueless. I interned for a big company last summer, and utterly hated the experience, so much that I quit 5 weeks into the 10 week program. I was just uncomfortable with the whole experience, and I was very self conscious all the time, even though, I was working more efficiently, and delivering better work than my co-interns. (not to sound cocky, but true).
Here is my problem. I am a junior in college now, and I have no idea with regards to what I want to do. I have lost interest in classes (this actually happened a while back), but I do not want to/ cannot drop out, because I have no clue as to what I would do, so basically I am just dragging through school, and it all seems kinda pointless. I am Indian (expected to take care of my parents, sister, and be a responsible son) so a lot is expected of me, another reason that I cannot quit school. I haven't really been able to talk to my parents, and such about all of this, and other than that I am an introvert, and don't have much friends that I can talk to. I have a few friends in college from clubs, etc. but that is it, and I liked spending time alone, but now every-time I am by myself, I keep thinking about all of this ^^. that I have no freaking clue as to what I am doing with my life, and am essentially bleeding time. I do not enjoy my major, and my self esteem / self worth is at an all time low. I guess I could say that I am even losing all motivation to go to classes, and that isn't helping either. I run / workout for 45-60 minutes everyday, and that is the highlight of my day, because for a while I am able to feel good, but then this whole viscous cycle kicks in.
I have been to the college counseling center and that wasn't much help either because the lady I talked to the first time was just either stupid or trying to just waste my time. It wasn't beneficial, so I did repeat this process again with some other counselor, and though he was better, his suggestions still didn't help much. He suggested that I join the group counseling for international students, which was an utter waste of time.
Thing is that I am in control of most of my actions, just that my motivation is not there to kick in when I start to lose the grip on the situation, and start reassessing myself, and start the process of re-evaluating what I need to do. I don't know whether something is wrong with me, or whether this is something that is part of the process of entering adulthood, but life is in utter chaos, and I could use some advice/help. If you have been in a similar situation, or could help me figure out a process to get my life back on track, I would really appreciate it.
Thanks in anticipation.
*throwaway account
EDIT: US College
71 comments
[ 3.4 ms ] story [ 166 ms ] threadStop thinking that "what to do with your life" is a choice that you have to make. Just do stuff. When something doesn't make you happy, drop it. When something does make you happy, double-down on it. When it stops being fun and starts being work, find something else to do.
The one thing that jumped out to me is that your daily exercise routine energizes you and makes you feel good. Why not pursue that? Find a way to do more of what you love and less of what you don't. Instead of being paralyzed by feeling like you're being pressured to make choices, be excited that the world is open in front of you and you have the ability to do whatever you want, everyone else be damned.
>Stop thinking that "what to do with your life" is a choice that you have to make.
Further, your major doesn't lock you into a particular career the rest of your life. One of my best CS mentors majored in film. He graduated, got a job in the film industry, and couldn't stand it. A friend gave him a job swapping backup tapes in a server room, and he got into computers from there.
Your experience with the job was a great way to find out a path that you don't want to head down. Don't think of it as a failure on your part.
>Instead of being paralyzed by feeling like you're being pressured to make choices, be excited that the world is open in front of you and you have the ability to do whatever you want, everyone else be damned.
It sounds to me like The Future is ruining your present. Instead of asking "What can I do to prepare myself for tomorrow?" ask "What can I do to make today better?"
Luckily, a college campus usually has tons of answers to that question, especially outside of classes. Go to one of those billboards plastered with announcements, and see if there's an event that strikes your interest. Then go to it! Student groups are a great way to dabble in all kinds of things without making a lifelong commitment to them. (If you still don't know what to pick, I find if I help others, my own problems mostly work themselves out.)
Living in the present isn't being irresponsible. It's taking care of yourself so that you're prepared for whatever comes in the future.
I should also note that counselling is far more effective if you continue to meet with the counselor on a regular basis. A counselor's main value isn't giving out advice, it's helping you to understand yourself differently. A good counselor isn't always easy to find, but if you think there's some hope, it may be worth a few sessions before you give up on them.
A lot of us have been where you are. Things will get better. And please do follow up with us. We care.
_In the context of the quarter-life crisis, however, they occur shortly after a young person – usually an educated professional, in this context – enters the "real world".[1] After entering adult life and coming to terms with its responsibilities, some individuals find themselves experiencing career stagnation or extreme insecurity. The individual often realizes the real world is tougher, more competitive and less forgiving than she/he imagined._
So I think I'm facing a Quarter-Life crisis. I feel its' effect and it's really stressing at times. I'm 19 and 4 years away from graduation. When this crisis will end? Can I do something about it?
If this major doesn't interest you, if you can switch to one that does. To have these thoughts at your age is strange to me, you sound like someone imprisoned rather than a young person with their life ahead of them.
Look after yourself first, then worry about looking after others, and don't take social pressure created in different days than the current ones as limiting your ability to choose your own life.
The days of arranged marriages and career paths laid out by family are over. As an Indian person you will have to probably over come a significant amount of resistance in order to even be allowed to attempt to chart your own path, but even that permission is not theirs to give.
When I dropped out of highschool my family lamented that that was the end of my chances on a life worth living. I didn't hear my mom complaining when I put her on the payroll of my company to tide her over after she got ill (stroke) and was not able to work a normal job for a while.
Your life, your choices. There is nothing wrong with you.
best of luck!
It's... not that easy.
Most people would agree that parents have a duty to take care of their children. India has a value system where children are expected to reciprocate when they grow up. Parents sacrifice a great deal for their children in India, and I'm not just speaking of financial aspects (though that can be substantial). In most families, the children, their education and their future success are the "grand projects" that the families' day to day lives revolve around. Even as a human unconditioned by any cultural idiosyncrasies, I think you do have a responsibility to treat them kindly.
However, this doesn't mean that you have to blindly adopt their notions of success. In my case, I had to negotiate with them to redefine their ideas of a meaningful, fulfilling life so that I could be free.
The #1 concern of Indian parents is their values and their kids' success.
Your career path is simply one value. Many Indian parents want their kids to be engineers and doctors. You can try explaining them you're not interested in that. And finally, you can tell them to f-off and go do your own thing.
But does that mean you HAVE to abandon all your values? HELL no. I still believe that my parents have as much right to any wealth I created as I do. I still believe I need to care for my parents when they age. I still believe in many of our quirky customs. In fact, if you can reassure your parents that you still care for some of the values, it can lighten the air. Parents think that because you are going away from one of the values you are breaking away from all of them. It may be true. But not necessarily.
In my case, I told my parents that I wanted to take time off from school and move to San Francisco after I finished our summer at YC. My Dad was well primed about this. And yet, he could not come to terms with me actually doing this. So he asked "why do you want to goto San Francisco?". I was already upset and the general tone on the dinner table was pretty heated. I carelessly replied "because I feel like it." At the time, it came across as rude though I didn't mean it that way. Over time, my family understood the innocent nature of those words.
The next day and over time, it made a lot more sense to my family about where I was coming from. Likewise, at the time I did not understand my family's concerns. Over time, I did. I realized that I did not so much want to abandon all my values; that I still cared very deeply for my parents; and that my parents had some legit concerns.
Just because I want a career different than what my family wants does not mean there are deeper value differences. Oh, and when you are broke and need money, you can mostly count on your Indian parents to bail you out if they are slightly capable to:) Time. And again.
--Child of two Indian doctors
But make sure that they're YOUR values.
Sometimes we don't have that luxury. Entrepreneurship is a risky proposition in that there are no guaranteed returns, after all. Supposing your mother is not working and your father is a low-income earner and your grandmother is a stroke patient and you have a choice between "fuck it, it's my life, I'm going to go do another startup" and getting a day job to help the family make ends meet (and maybe spend the best years of your life doing work you dislike), what would you do? I've made that choice, and while I remain somewhat bitter about lost opportunities and the like, what am I going to do? You have to take care of your own.
Similarly, the OP may be in college on a scholarship and the family may be poor, pooling all their resources into getting him through college and hoping for better days after the OP gets that well-paid, boring engineering job.
I'm not saying I totally disagree with you, you understand. If it's solely about your parents' opinions on what kind of life you should lead, I would wholeheartedly agree, but sometimes it's not just about what you want. :)
Also, I have a problem with the automatic 'you owe us' rule that some societies impose on their children. No children ever asked to be conceived or born. If you want to be grateful to your parents that's cool, I know I did my bit. But there should not be an automatic assumption that that will be the case, nor should there be undue pressure.
I understand you hated the whole experience, but what specifically made you feel that way?
Also I couldn't stand being in the office for 8 hours, dressed up in clothes that I'd rather not wear. It was pretty stuffy. And most of the other interns were just too satisfied with wasting their times.
The allocated work could be completed in less than half of the time. Initially, I would ask my supervisor for more work, but I guess he got irritated, and instead of assigning more real work said go hang out with the other employees, and learn from them.
I initially tried talking to random employees, and try to figure out stuff to say, but after 5-7 minutes I'd run out of things to say, and go back to doing my own stuff.
* Unfortunately internship does not reflect real work environment. In a "real job" there's always that 20% of stuff we hate to do but it needs to get done (this is also true in start-ups), while 80% is moderate-to-cool stuff. In an internship pretty much 100% sucks, but maybe you were expecting a lot more of cool stuff to do?
* It sounds like your supervisor didn't have enough time to handle/train you. Assigning work to new employees (not only interns) always require a certain amount of internal training. The job of an intern is not to complete work, but to learn. It looks like he asked you to see other employees so you could learn from them first, before getting more work. This is a common practice, it's called "shadowing". Did you learn anything from the employees you observed?
* The clothing and stuff... It's stupid but sometimes it's necessary to follow certain rituals so you "fit in" (that's also true for start-ups or any other social structure). Eventually you will earn the "privilege" to dress-up as you wish.
Also, for what it’s worth, you might want to look into counseling for depression. From the description of your life it seems like you’re a likely candidate (unhappy except when you workout and have endorphins racing through your body). Depression can make you lose interest in even stuff are interested in so before you decide your previously chosen major is not interesting you should make sure it isn’t depression talking.
I understand that you may not be able to drop out. But could you defer your studies for a semester? Go for a cheap holiday. If your family are being difficult and don't support you then you can tell them your health and sanity are more important than not disappointing them. Stress that you are not dropping out, just doing some "field work".
Note: This will solve none of you problems. But it certainly won't be boring either.
Additional note: Whoever convinced you that your life has a track and you need to figure it out did you a serious disservice. It is your life. Loving and serving those dear to you can be an amazing thing. You'll be no help to them if you are miserable.
Or a boy.
And "with a girl" seems oddly specific. Assuming he's straight, he's probably not going to fall in love with a guy, and if he's gay, this is terrible advice. Or do you mean with a girl as opposed to a hobby, career, field, etc.?
If you fall in love only when things are going well for you then that may be a significant reason you believe that the median love interest won't work out.
If your perceived sense of self-worth doesn't improve or worsens, your brain will undergo physical changes that result in a state of clinical depression, which is defined far more by a lack of passion/engagement than by feelings of sadness. You will remain entirely in control of your actions, but the pool of available actions will become smaller and smaller as this continues. Eventually you will reach a point where you no longer can keep up the facade of control and your academics will shift from something that you don't enjoy doing to something that you can't keep up with. As someone intelligent you are likely to rationalize this disengagement / drop in grades by saying that the classes aren't worth your time (or other self-defeating thoughts). If this happens, you need to find an counselor who can be the mirror that tells you what a self-handicapping idiot you are being.
Or maybe this won't happen and you will graduate with honors and receive job offers from multiple companies. Things will likely change that will lift you past your current opinion on life. Often one good thing leads to another and you would be amazed at how quickly your perception on your future can shift after meeting a remarkable new friend(both guys AND girls). If something academic comes into your life that interests you, embrace it and do not let go.
In my opinion you should take a year off, or at least a semester. I did that after high school and it was the best decision of my life. Find a place to get started, tap into your webdev skills, there is great demand for them. I found a webdev job on craigslist for a company in Costa Rica where I had a hour-long surf-breaks at hightide. This experience of work as both productivity and play redefined how I defined 'success' in my own life. Pick a place that you have a passing interest in visiting, go to craigslist and look for internships/jobs that will pay enough to cover your room and board there and get the hell out of dodge.
You will go back to finish your degree when you are ready and want it or you will be happier in your new place. Win either way. Your family wants you happy and successful, neither of which are correlated with regretful career decisions.
I hope all goes well for you.
Your family is afraid because they don't know that little screen. That's their culture. But since you make money, it doesn't matter. If you make money and spend for your family expenses they won't really bother you and your choice will just be "their".
People in your social circle. They really don't care about you (okay, unless the old high school friend, may be one or two). Nobody really care whether you are a high school drop out or a ph.D. If you have money, you'll buy anything you can afford and you'll please yourself and your family with it. Don't care about what others say. Do they have an extensive Internet culture and knowledge to speak about decisions?
Take the most secure path. Think well before making decision not to regret later. Don't be afraid and don't care about what other people are saying.
I too found myself in the school's counseling center at 19, depressed, with assignments due, feeling physically and mentally ill. I got my idea for the next startup few days later and soon entered some of the best time of my life. A similar pattern repeated few months ago(I am now 23).
I too am Indian so I understand some of the "cool" things we inherit from our culture :) Happy to chat with you if you'd like and help you figure out how to get out of this crappy zone.
I lost motivation in my ME classes as well and the best thing I did was cut down in course load, it gave me a break and was well worth it for an extra semester added on to the degree.
Other than that engineering coursework sucks, you do it because you like learning and you like solving problems, sometimes it takes extra time and sometimes you burn out but if it is what you want to do you keep at it. Just be aware that a single internship isn't necessarily what a job will be like.
I don't know how much help that all is but maybe something good will be in there.
The expectation to provide, the expectation to have more friends (possibly, obviously I'm reading into your comment), the expectation to follow-through with whatever you're currently doing...
Life is definitely supposed to be chaotic at this point on your journey- it's genetically built in- it allows you to do things no one has ever done before- it's a steady pull away from mediocrity. Some people let it pull them into prisons and homeless shelters, and others let it pull them into great things. What you're currently doing is basically trying to ignore it as best as you can.
It _will_ pass eventually- that pull to go out and chaotically find your own passion (note I'm not talking about being hedonistic or bumming around Europe - I'm talking about making things or doing things that you feel tap into your very best qualities and things that stretch them). Don't get to the point in your life where the drive to strike out in your own direction starts becoming silent only to think "well, why _didn't_ I?"
I've never met anyone that regretted trying to live life more fully (except for those with poor definitions of fully. Hint- if it feels wrong at a deep level it's a less fully lived life). Sooo.... Channel the urges, embrace the chaos, do something amazing. And, ironically, your family may be fine with the support you end up giving. Anyway, we're looking forward to what you can make of this.
Have a look at Steve Jobs's Stanford commencement address on YouTube. The theme is "connect the dots".
Are you still able to use the skills you picked up and make a decent living out of it? Why not develop that further?Depression can come in response to specific ("depressing") circumstances or events, and it can come from hormonal or biochemical conditions. Depending on cause, different professional routes may be helpful.
Other contributing conditions (e.g., social isolation; career confusion) may be addressed well be a counselor worth their salt. [ Keep in mind that how 'loudly' you complain about how awful you feel will affect how much the counselor accelerates (or not) getting you more significant/experienced assistance. ] The 'right' counselor should be able to convey to you that they take your issues seriously and that they genuinely care about you and finding solution(s) that work for you.
Friends can provide some of the support and perspective that a professional counselor does, but usually not enough when you've really got yourself into a clinical depression. Plus a professional will have guidelines to know whether you are a candidate for referral to someone who can consider whether an anti-depressant might be worth trying. I'd encourage you to keep looking until you find a professional who's really an effective ally during these trying times.
Thinking of you
I'm the kind of person that hates taking any pills or medications for anything, but 100mg of 5-HTP (turns into Serotonin) and small amounts of L-Tyrosine turned my life around at one point.
Vitamin D is another one that people are surprisingly deficient of--even if you get enough sunlight.
I really think that sometimes a person gets into an anhedonic state first, and then misattributes the feeling to "not liking my major/career/job/friends/etc."
I don't have a lot of advice, but I'm fairly certain that this is extremely normal, so don't get too down on yourself about it. At least you figured that out at 20 years old, instead of 40+.
Now, I'm basing what I'm about to say on my own experience. It looks like, in part, you may be experiencing burn out. The next break you can safely take (Christmas break? Summer break?), relax. Just ... stop.
Also, what happened in this corporate work environment that made you hate it so much?
It's coincidentally one of the reasons I don't, unlike my friends, strongly miss my childhood. It was cool and all, but dude- I didn't have a motorcycle.
— Mary Schmich
Quit school. You can always come back later. Try new things, meet new people. Move. Keep searching until you find IT. And then pour all your soul into becoming the best.
I got out of school a few years ago, and I'll tell you that my sophomore year was hellish, too. Nothing seemed to make sense and I felt very distraught.
It's good that you're exercising, keep it up. That will help you from sinking in too deep.
It does sound like you're at a real crossroads. You're seeing the limitations of what your parents handed down to you, but it's hard to know what to do instead.
I'm not Indian, but I know how you feel about family pressure...it's one of the most miserable things to be going through. I won't say "tell your family to get lost", because that's pretty hard for most of us to do. But, I can tell you from my own experience that it IS possible to love your family very much without living up to all their expectations. At times, it may look and feel like you're breaking hearts - and you may be - but it's well worth it in the end. That's been my experience.
It's easy for me to wax poetic about things you may not read, so feel free to drop me a line if you want to chat. It's this username at a well-known mail service provided by Google. :)
Be optimistic - always be positive! If you feel that good things are about to happen to you, they will.
I'm curious why this was so.
Sometimes I try something and hate it because of the social experience that accompanied it. Like if you go to a big company, and nobody reaches out to you, and you spend the time alone, it can form a very strong mental association: big company = loneliness. But maybe it's just that company. Maybe you'll later try working at a new company, and make a couple of great friends, and decide that mechanical engineering is your life calling and this new company is the home/family you were born to have.
Quality of life has very little to do with the exact type of work you do. On the other hand, it can have a lot to do with the lifestyle constraints entailed by that type of work, like the amount of travel or face-to-face interaction involved.
The point is, look at factors surrounding the work the you love or hate. If you have a particularly good day, look back at what happened that day. Did you have a big stretch of quiet time? Did you get to be around certain people you like? What did you eat? Did you get recognition for something you did? These perhaps seemingly-irrelevant details have a lot more to do with your motivation and job satisfaction than your job title or salary.
This comes up every couple of months here on HN:
http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1449823 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1537461 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1246200 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=680054
It gets better. Really.
So we can get past this, and then look forward to mid-life crisis, right? Joy! :)
I have advice on a couple of different fronts.
As for college, your major, whatever.. if school is free / heavily subsidized then I would go ahead and stick it out until you have something else you'd rather be doing, then weight the cost/benefit of not having a degree vs how long it would take you to get it.
However, if school is costing you money, unless you're at a very good school and/or planning on doing graduate level work, just drop out. Degrees just aren't worth that much, especially if you don't know you are going to use it.
You absolutely have to drop the social pressure thing. You definitely can quit school. You can be weak about it now and wake up when you're 50 and realize you wished you had done your own thing, or just realize at some point you have to make your own decisions.
You're 20, you are allowed to be a kid. Take care of your body and mind, don't do any permanent damage, but beyond that man, fucking live it up.
If the main thing hanging over your head is the social/family pressure, just shrug it. Be loving and warm to your parents as much as possible, but ultimately you are going to be better off drinking beers for two years as a beach bum than spending two years trudging through some major that bores you.
There is a considerable value to life experience that you can get as a young independent kid who has a pretty open mind sort of wandering around. It doesn't happen often, most of the really smart people either go insane or take the express route to being successful through traditional channels.
Obviously as an entrepreneur there is a third option, but unless you have that drive you won't succeed anyway. If you have that drive, follow it, otherwise loaf around, learn what's interesting and be poor.
Like I said, I am 27. I dropped out with very disappointed friends and family, some of whom still hold it against me to varying degrees. Starting less than 6 months ago I got my first 'real' job, a devels salary, etc. I pretty much let every burden I felt I had completely get ignored. To some detriment to be sure, and I don't recommend you exactly do that. But because of my experiences I think I fundamentally react to authority, bills, social pressure, etc etc in much healthier rational way than I did before.
What I want to express is the intangible benefit to having thrown tradition to the wind and being independent.
What you lose in $$ not pushing forward hard in life on some relentless path to success you gain in wisdom. As you get older, maybe get a wife, get more expensive tastes, get used to nicer cars, nicer places to live, your monthly nut gets higher and higher, that rat race gets tighter and tighter.
Many people go till they have a midlife crises to even take a step back and consider their lives, most people in their mid 30s couldn't do it even if they wanted to.
But, you, you're young, you probably have little to no responsibility, and you're a smart kid. Get some wisdom, see if the rat race is even for you at all, take some lsd in the woods and hang out with gutter punks spanging your pocket change.
Most people don't even have happy lives.. if you feel yourself going into a shitty one, take a step back and just stop for a bit. See what happens.