I read the whole article and until I read your comment, still thought it was a missing letter of the alphabet in the address of the postal letter that never got to him. Lol
It's impressive that 17 years after the founding of Atlassian and post IPO, Mike Cannon-Brookes and Scott Farquhar still control a combined 56% of the company (28% each).
>To help do this he is working with the Australian government on how to best bring in more talent from overseas. He also wants to build a new technology precinct in Sydney, a hub he hopes will act as "the lighthouse" to attract people to Australia
There's probably enough talented workers in Australia, just not enough who want to live and work in Sydney.
It does seem a stretch to be bumping against the limits with a global head count of 3061 [1], with about 40% in Sydney [2]. To name two (of many) other tech heavy Australian employers, CSIRO has 5500 employees and DSTG has 2500, so it's not like Atlassian is some behemoth that has sucked up all the local talent.
The Atlassian founders have come out against Australia's draconian refugee policy and are calling out xenophobia in local politics (for which I applaud them on both fronts), so maybe they are engaging in a bit of hyperbole to back these causes?
I've lived in Melbourne and Sydney, and Sydney is a pretty excellent place to work and live on an Atlassian salary, I'm not sure it's the city where I'd be focusing improvements.
Sydney compensation could use a bump in compensation to justify moving from places like Melbourne and Brisbane. In my limited experience they sometimes don't pay enough to cover the increased cost of living, particularly rent.
Otherwise I'd agree with Scott that Australia needs overseas talent. At Canva, where I work, the strong majority hired are overseas talent. Australia's software industry is too small for these companies' appetites, and its universities aren't producing a large enough supply of talented grads.
I’d describe Atlassian’s Sydney pay as fair if you enjoy working there but on the lower to mid end of the market so you wouldn’t join on a purely financial decision. They have also stated they’ll never attempt to be one of the big payers.
Australia’s problem, in general the Australian born devs are very good, Computer Science must be done right here (i’m not Australian). However the quantity of good interesting software jobs isn’t great compared to other countries, when you have easy migration to the US as an AU citizen, and jobs offering more money and more work opportunities it’s hard to overlook. Maybe catch 22, for good devs to stay you need good interesting jobs, for jobs you need devs.
We all have stories. I can tell you a dramatic story about micro decisions and events that led to me founding an infosec consulting firm. We just magnify these stories in really successful people. That’s the thing. Most billionaires don’t have stories that are much more interesting than the average persons. There are a lot of people that risked everything and lost, many of them lost despite making better decisions than many billionaires. That is just how luck works.
Most of the interesting stuff about how companies grow come down to a relative small period where some key decisions get made (in the tech world at least). Anyhow, this is normal and people love to try and parse the lives of the wealthy to see if any of it can be applied to their life to capture some of that success. There are a lot of things to increase your luck potential, but it still takes grit+luck.
>Most of the interesting stuff about how companies grow come down to a relative small period where some key decisions get made (in the tech world at least).
I really don't think so. Case in point - The article describes a 17-year growth path for Atlassian, including many reversals along the way.
What you're describing is the exception. E.g. Minecraft. Most successful tech businesses (like all businesses) are built on a combination of luck and sustained good decision-making and hard work.
It’s probably a little of column A and a little of column B. A lot of good small decisions and probably 4-6 major ones, even in a 17year journey. If I had to guess. Who your business partners are. Major strategy shifts (cloud). Etc.
I’m sure if you got some serious alone time and trust with other billionaires you could fill a book with these stories.
Around 1983 my mom was dating a chef at the restaurant she worked at. One night he was out carousing and got himself killed. Fast forward a year and my mom meets the manager’s brother, thinks he’s an asshole and blows him off. He’s visiting from out of town and gets wasted, mom helps him to the brothers place and the guy turns out to be hilarious and a great story teller. They agree to a date, it escalates to marriage and we move. A year later now step-dad’s employer offers him relocation to either Chicago or a sleepy suburb in another state. Mom convinces him to take the latter on our behalf. Fast forward ten years I ask a cute coworker out to see Earnest Scared Stupid. That escalated to marriage four years later and on to two beautiful kids that are now almost out on their own.
I sometimes wonder if I should tell them that if some guy didn’t die in a crash they would never have been born. When they become billionaires that can be their story.
My wife asked me out to her friend's company holiday party, but refused to give me her number because she'd had problems with stalkers before. I was like "I'm just going to trust that you're not a stalker and give you mine." We ended up having to call each other 4 times before we finally found each other, 30 seconds before the Caltrain arrived at the platform.
As an additional irony, the number she called me on was her Google Voice number, so when she actually started using her real number 2 months later I was like "Who the hell is this?"
I started seeing them after realizing that adding a 30s quick answer to a short question of one eam probably earned me .5 to 1 point in a total score of hundreds ones. Happened to actually up my ranking for 1 or maybe to spot. Lead to me entering a waitlist that after some weeks turned into admission into one of the best engineering school my country has. After that, my next four years followed the track that opened.
Eventually, when wondering how my current life could possibly unfold towards our current reality, I'm then reminded how having once written some sentence that felt right, added half a point to some score that turned out to shape one's life...
I put off starting college for a semester because I had just lost my father to cancer. I just couldn’t face starting class a week after that.
I did end up starting in January, and on the first day of orientation, 25 hours after arriving there I met one of the handful other people also starting in January, who later became my wife. I hand never really even dated someone else first.
It is all so unlikely. Rare event stacked on rare event.
If I hadn't got myself dependant on methamphetamine, I probably would never have got charged with drug trafficking, and I wouldn't have moved to Tasmania, learned to ski, taken up pole dance / fitness, got in to rock climbing, bought a house, adopted to beautiful pups, and landed the awesome job I have.
It's still very weird to think about how many tiny details will deflect your life 0 or 180.. who decides which class you'll be in as a kid for instance
Same here. Happy for the guy and his billion, but I can't understand why the product is so successful, despite being painfully slow –at every single page load it makes me want to cry. Does anyone here actually choose to use it, or like me, you happen to work in a company that settled on it. Can anyone offer perspective, am I missing something?
Agreed, it's painful to use and much more so since they rolled out the UI update a few months ago. On the other hand, it's so ingrained in our company's workflow that it's hard to replace.
It's called enterprise sales. Focused politics and sales pressure to precisely influence and sell through to decision makers who are far from the actual users of the product.
I've always been happy with JIRA, using it successfully in large enterprises and in my own 2-person startup. But I know you have plenty of company in your hatred for it. As a tool for quickly entering an issue I want to track and having simple drag and drop across swimlanes for my development workflow, it does all I need it to do.
We went from excel to vsts and it had been working great for a couple of years. We got some new product owners who forced us to move to jira. It’s done absolutely nothing but cause problems, cause friction, frustration. The user experience is non existent and inconsistent. Things don’t work in any logical sense. And it’s horribly slow. What used to be quick and easy in vsts is now painful slow experience. This is the first job I’ve had where we moved to jira. The last 2 places I was at were moving away from it.
When Jira first came out, it was awesome. Way better than most other ticketing systems. It was soo good that the entire company that I worked for switched to it. Suddenly a phonecall from a customer could turn into a ticket created by the support department, which turned into a ticket for the dev, which eventually got put through development and back to the support department to notify the customer that their problem was fixed. Our whole company communicated through Jira. This was before all the "agile" fluff that got added onto it.
> JIRA is still the product i hate using the most on a day to day basis.
several years ago a very big super-duper-EVP of our BigCo happened to be in our cubicle and noticed how my colleague was agonizing with the JIRA (visible to the EVP slowness plus invisible to him yet scorching our brains utter pointlessness of what the colleague had to complete there). The EVP had a epiphany right there and then - "wouldn't it be a huge improvement in our developers' life if those JIRA issues were to be solved?". At that moment he looked like he was feeling himself pretty much a god who is about to give gift of fire to those dirty mud figurines. It was so hard to not burst into laugh right into his face... Anyway, it happened to be that extremely rare case when a such high EVP did ultimately deliver on his words, even if indirectly - he left the company pretty soon and with him out all that JIRA/Scrum/Agile stuff just totally disappeared almost immediately.
Regardless of our own personal opinions towards Atlassian, it should be more talked about in the startup ecosystem. Not only for there stock doing well (Up over 340% since January 2017), for the ownership the founders still have and much more.
Whenever Atlassian is mentioned on HN, at least 75% of the comments are complaints about the product - it’s crap, it’s slow, buggy, whatever.
But the company behind it has turned into a juggernaut.
Lesson being that
- product isn’t nearly as important as distribution and sales strategy
- be wary of asking HN for business advice (flashbacks of “No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame.”
The only way I've been able to stomach having to use an Atlassian product is through 3rd-party tools that expose it all to a command line interface (jira-cli, for example).
I think there is $45bn worth of unexploited value to be had in fixing the problems with Atlassians' UI designs - the productivity to be gained by not using Jira, and instead training ones staff to be better at standard thing - like, you know, sending emails - seems to me to be a huge opportunity.
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[ 77.3 ms ] story [ 1524 ms ] threadThere's probably enough talented workers in Australia, just not enough who want to live and work in Sydney.
The Atlassian founders have come out against Australia's draconian refugee policy and are calling out xenophobia in local politics (for which I applaud them on both fronts), so maybe they are engaging in a bit of hyperbole to back these causes?
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlassian
[2] https://www.smh.com.au/business/small-business/mike-cannon-b...
Sydney compensation could use a bump in compensation to justify moving from places like Melbourne and Brisbane. In my limited experience they sometimes don't pay enough to cover the increased cost of living, particularly rent.
Otherwise I'd agree with Scott that Australia needs overseas talent. At Canva, where I work, the strong majority hired are overseas talent. Australia's software industry is too small for these companies' appetites, and its universities aren't producing a large enough supply of talented grads.
Australia’s problem, in general the Australian born devs are very good, Computer Science must be done right here (i’m not Australian). However the quantity of good interesting software jobs isn’t great compared to other countries, when you have easy migration to the US as an AU citizen, and jobs offering more money and more work opportunities it’s hard to overlook. Maybe catch 22, for good devs to stay you need good interesting jobs, for jobs you need devs.
Most of the interesting stuff about how companies grow come down to a relative small period where some key decisions get made (in the tech world at least). Anyhow, this is normal and people love to try and parse the lives of the wealthy to see if any of it can be applied to their life to capture some of that success. There are a lot of things to increase your luck potential, but it still takes grit+luck.
I really don't think so. Case in point - The article describes a 17-year growth path for Atlassian, including many reversals along the way.
What you're describing is the exception. E.g. Minecraft. Most successful tech businesses (like all businesses) are built on a combination of luck and sustained good decision-making and hard work.
Around 1983 my mom was dating a chef at the restaurant she worked at. One night he was out carousing and got himself killed. Fast forward a year and my mom meets the manager’s brother, thinks he’s an asshole and blows him off. He’s visiting from out of town and gets wasted, mom helps him to the brothers place and the guy turns out to be hilarious and a great story teller. They agree to a date, it escalates to marriage and we move. A year later now step-dad’s employer offers him relocation to either Chicago or a sleepy suburb in another state. Mom convinces him to take the latter on our behalf. Fast forward ten years I ask a cute coworker out to see Earnest Scared Stupid. That escalated to marriage four years later and on to two beautiful kids that are now almost out on their own.
I sometimes wonder if I should tell them that if some guy didn’t die in a crash they would never have been born. When they become billionaires that can be their story.
As an additional irony, the number she called me on was her Google Voice number, so when she actually started using her real number 2 months later I was like "Who the hell is this?"
I started seeing them after realizing that adding a 30s quick answer to a short question of one eam probably earned me .5 to 1 point in a total score of hundreds ones. Happened to actually up my ranking for 1 or maybe to spot. Lead to me entering a waitlist that after some weeks turned into admission into one of the best engineering school my country has. After that, my next four years followed the track that opened.
Eventually, when wondering how my current life could possibly unfold towards our current reality, I'm then reminded how having once written some sentence that felt right, added half a point to some score that turned out to shape one's life...
I did end up starting in January, and on the first day of orientation, 25 hours after arriving there I met one of the handful other people also starting in January, who later became my wife. I hand never really even dated someone else first.
It is all so unlikely. Rare event stacked on rare event.
Who knows what might happened instead!
And you may tell yourself, "This is not my beautiful wife."
JIRA is much better than they are.
Can I ask what your preferred alternative is?
To me, the Azure DevOps way of doing this doesn't work in any logical sense, I can't find the simplest thing in the mess of an UX they have.
> Unable to communicate with server. Saving is not possible at the moment.
How does anyone actually /like/ atlassian products is beyond me. I honestly cannot think of any other software that makes me as frustrated.
IMHO JIRA is more of an platform you use to build your own process. And I believe it is the process that sucks most if the time.
several years ago a very big super-duper-EVP of our BigCo happened to be in our cubicle and noticed how my colleague was agonizing with the JIRA (visible to the EVP slowness plus invisible to him yet scorching our brains utter pointlessness of what the colleague had to complete there). The EVP had a epiphany right there and then - "wouldn't it be a huge improvement in our developers' life if those JIRA issues were to be solved?". At that moment he looked like he was feeling himself pretty much a god who is about to give gift of fire to those dirty mud figurines. It was so hard to not burst into laugh right into his face... Anyway, it happened to be that extremely rare case when a such high EVP did ultimately deliver on his words, even if indirectly - he left the company pretty soon and with him out all that JIRA/Scrum/Agile stuff just totally disappeared almost immediately.
Whenever Atlassian is mentioned on HN, at least 75% of the comments are complaints about the product - it’s crap, it’s slow, buggy, whatever.
But the company behind it has turned into a juggernaut.
Lesson being that - product isn’t nearly as important as distribution and sales strategy - be wary of asking HN for business advice (flashbacks of “No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame.”
I think there is $45bn worth of unexploited value to be had in fixing the problems with Atlassians' UI designs - the productivity to be gained by not using Jira, and instead training ones staff to be better at standard thing - like, you know, sending emails - seems to me to be a huge opportunity.