I have seen that idea popularized here on HN for sure - it seems almost every physical or mental health and diet related post gets a comment about "the gut microbiome" which either mentions or is replied to by a comment that claims diet soda "destroys" it. The frequency with which this is mentioned is definitely pretty high, but I've not come across any links to studies or further reading on the idea.
EDIT:
Here is what I believe to be a source of many such claims, a 2014 study suggesting that artificial sweeteners can alter gut flora in mice to lead them to being glucose intolerant: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4615743/
I'd be interested if there's anything more recent or conclusive about this - plenty of sensationalistic articles seem to be out there either extrapolating from or challenging this study, but I'm not able to deduce anything further.
My low-information read of the current state of knowledge is: we've established at very high confidence that the gut microbiome really is very important.
And that's it; we don't know anything more detailed than that.
But intuitively eating unprocessed foods that are not made with artificial or chemical anything (including artificial sweeteners) is probably a good start.
Fasting is probably another good way to reset your gut.
I don't think "resetting your gut" is a good way to think about it. Taking oral antibiotics will "reset your gut", in the sense of killing most of the existing biome and leaving space for new flora to grow into, but that can lead to problems as the biome that develops from a clean field isn't the same as the standard biome. To the best of my knowledge, you normally inherit your gut flora from your mother during birth and nursing, and then your gut hopefully stays stable over time. "Resetting" is more likely to give you a worse biome than a better one.
There's also a probiotic called visbiome (formerly* known as vsl #3, which is the name the research literature uses) that has shown a lot of effectiveness for IBS and similar issues. I don't feel like digging up the studies for that unfortunately but there's quite a bit of evidence.
* vsl #3 is still marketed but is supposedly a different manufacturing process now. thus visbiome is now the "real" one
Is it because diet soda doesn't provide nutrition to gut bacteria, but still takes up the space actual nutrition could have been in, and thus the gut bacteria don't get access to as much nutrition?
Edit: poor wording above. I meant to ask whether the artificial sweeteners could take the place of nutrition for the gut bacteria but not actually provide enough nutrition.
Ah, I should've written a more generic "takes the place of" instead of space. I meant to ask something along the lines of whether the artificial sweeteners of diet sugar might be confused for nutrition by the gut bacteria. Basically, I was picturing a situation where the gut bacteria might try to "eat" the artificial sweeteners, but then don't end up getting enough energy from it and can't do the things they need to do.
Good point. I worded it very poorly and your answer would definitely fit. I meant to ask whether the artificial sweeteners in diet soda were taking the place of nutrition for the gut bacteria, but don't end up giving the bacteria enough energy/resources to live on.
Kimchi - full of pro-biotics and good for your gut, apparently - is what makes my farts smell worst of all. Worst incident was a freshly-home-made batch, played bass in a show the after eating it at dinnertime and the smell actually made the drummer vomit :(
Yup. It's called a fecal microbial transplant (FMT) and it works for several problems, notably C-diff infection. (Unfortunately it isn't the first-line treatment for that nasty bug, it is usually preceded by weeks of antibiotics and only used when they fail. Source: personal experience.)
I worry that there may be currently unknown compatibility issues between donors and recipients, and that a recipient could be worse off after the wrong donation.
You better eat the Evil Itself, Magnesium powder, then eat literally Shit. But maybe is a hard choice between Magnesium and shit (literally, poop) and Magnesium powder or even Almonds, that contains Magnesium, in my eXperience, like in a federal good wife´s court, your Honor
I noticed a huge lift in my mood when I switched to a completely plant based diet but if that’s too radical for you I think you can get a lot of the benefits by just massively increasing the amount of fresh fruits and vegetables you eat and sticking to whole, unprocessed carbs. Adding some fermented foods like natto or kimchi should help too.
kinda should eat coconut water and drink 1 little shot of sea water directly from the ocean , no bottles, no cups, no using your hands to drink the water, must imerse your head in the ocean water and drink the shot of sea water directly in the Ocean
I get your jest, but as someone who struggles with depression and uses food as a coping mechanism, this is sadly not the case. My personal experiences also make me acutely aware of others in food courts who really aren’t enjoying the food they are consuming.
What follows is purely anecdotal and just my experience, but protracted fasting had obvious changes on my general mental health.
My experiences were a month of 3 day water fasts followed by a meal (whole foods like plants and steak), and since then (this was 2 years ago) I do a 3 day fast every 1-2 months or so.
I also was able to stop craving sugars (sodas/ candy, etc) after that first long fast.
I have nothing conclusive, but I suspect that the changes in my mental health and dietary cravings have to do with killing off chunks of my microbiome in the first long fast. Could just be either placebo or other life changes (I turned 40, my wife had left me a month before, and I gave up drinking for 6 months during and after the fast).
So your milage may vary, but if your question is sincere, it might be easier to modify a biome by trimming it back rather than adding to it.
I'd be super stoked to have contradictory / corroborating evidence, though.
I do 16:8 intermittent fasting and my energy levels are a lot better. Basically I just eat my last meal around 19:00 and skip breakfast. Lunch around 11:00.
I may have a sugar free energy drink in the morning to pick me up (my poor stomach doesn't approve coffee any more, too much of it in my younger days... =) )
I’ve been doing this too and I was skeptical but it does seem to be making a significant difference. My blood sugar levels are a lot more stable and I don’t get hungry and shaky anymore. I can easily skip another meal now too if needed and it’s no problem.
The changes to my general modes of dealing with stuff were pretty dramatic. I don't think that my wife leaving made it easier to not eat sweets, but who knows?
I was still pretty upset, I just wasn't suicidally depressed, which was a fair improvement. And as I have continued with the fasting through the months, I have felt better around those times when I'm fasting.
I am not scarecrowbob, nor the mages og game of thrones ,
who can see with the eyes of crows and Condors, but...
in my eXperience of leaving life around 30 days ago the facts that affected my mental health , yaeh...
but you know the movie Blue Immensity , like my previously private known as immerseintheimmensity,
the guy was immerse in the Only One Ocean, the One...
that connects all seven Seas and five Oceans, As For they are One, freaking All Only One Onipresent Ocean...As the Skyes and the One Sky
the guy did not die Nor it was The End of the Movie...
when he goes swimming with the Dolphins or dancing with the wolves...
nor had the deer died, the deer is as alive as fire, in the mouths of people in the names of children that birth right now in this very second, like poetry
like the legacy of The Spirit of The Forest of Princess Mononoke and the legacy of Hentaro Miyazaki and his drawings of light and paintings of brightness
like Wu Ze Tian , previously known as Wu Zhao currently known as The Brightness and The Light
I had to ask because the tone of the article is beneficial microbiota that corresponds with happiness. To kill microbiotas by fasting seems to go against the article...
I imagine, if there's any relationship to fasting at all, it's that the fast doesn't so much kill all bacteria but changes the population profile in a beneficial way. For example, perhaps bacteria that subsist on refined sugars can't tolerate starvation so easily.
It depends on how you see it, half full or fully full, your mood is much better, you run and jump and play and make sports like a champ like better then Ever and you enjoy the life the beach and the sun, so it sounds like your mood have changed for much better, but...
you speak with the birds and the trees around the streets the parks and the beaches, so it sounds like the mental health changed for worse, but...
anyway, no matter how you see it , it changed for a much happier life
they conserve snakes in alcohool in jars of glass snakes poisonous most probably that they capture around their houses in my Patria Mother Brazil thanks...
well so it not conserves the snakes very well there is a Argentinian music band named Conservados En Alcool yaeh but I think keeping away from alcohol, Away , mind you what I write , not always , is Away , keep walking to yeah keep walk journey daily yaeh io cool...
keep cool too too 22 .. ..
look trough two two glasses .. .. to to keep your Vision Beyond Reach
as for two two glasses are three and equals 3 as helps the memory forgets what your Vision see or at least keep out of reach...
~look trough 2 too you , look to trough a pair of glasses hand tailored for you and a glass of jonie walker fully full or half full how you like it and it makes 3 makes indeed 3
it makes three, as you Sea
it makes three makes tea makes thee as you Sea on the See
Purely anecdotal but, I've been expirmenting drinking and making kefir and fermented veggies (mostly spinach). After a few days, my digestive system was the most regular it's ever been. I feel happier too but correlation vs causation and what not.
True, and people are investigating new ideas about dietary fiber thinking that perhaps it's not just for "bulk" and helping keep things "regular":
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29902436
"In this review, we will focus on dietary fibers, which interact directly with gut microbes and lead to the production of key metabolites such as short-chain fatty acids, and discuss how dietary fiber impacts gut microbial ecology, host physiology, and health."
I though it was already known that soluble fiber contributes to microbiome health (and not much to motility) and insoluble fiber is mostly helpful for bulk and motility.
Does this study address the role of insoluble fiber in microbiome health?
Spinach is great but don’t overdo it. The high oxalate content can cause problems for some people. Good to get a variety of different greens, of course including spinach.
68 comments
[ 3.1 ms ] story [ 136 ms ] threadAs a clueless person, I'd think the quantity and stomach acids would make it a negligible risk but worth studying.
EDIT: Here is what I believe to be a source of many such claims, a 2014 study suggesting that artificial sweeteners can alter gut flora in mice to lead them to being glucose intolerant: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4615743/
I'd be interested if there's anything more recent or conclusive about this - plenty of sensationalistic articles seem to be out there either extrapolating from or challenging this study, but I'm not able to deduce anything further.
And that's it; we don't know anything more detailed than that.
But intuitively eating unprocessed foods that are not made with artificial or chemical anything (including artificial sweeteners) is probably a good start.
Fasting is probably another good way to reset your gut.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096098221...
Here's a random study about vaginal microbiota:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4178329/
There's also a probiotic called visbiome (formerly* known as vsl #3, which is the name the research literature uses) that has shown a lot of effectiveness for IBS and similar issues. I don't feel like digging up the studies for that unfortunately but there's quite a bit of evidence.
* vsl #3 is still marketed but is supposedly a different manufacturing process now. thus visbiome is now the "real" one
https://www.nature.com/articles/nature14232
http://www.israelscienceinfo.com/en/medecine/weizmann-israel...
https://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/23/2/367
Edit: poor wording above. I meant to ask whether the artificial sweeteners could take the place of nutrition for the gut bacteria but not actually provide enough nutrition.
Coke Zero doesn't do that, but I still try to stay away from diet sodas.
But in general many different kinds of plant based foods to promote biodiversity. According to ( https://youtu.be/-LUuqxQSaFQ )
That sounds like I'm making it up, but unfortunately I'm not.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fecal_microbiota_transplant
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clostridioides_difficile_(bact...
You , my friend, didn´t made it up. I am sure.
I am sure someone else made it up.
You better eat the Evil Itself, Magnesium powder, then eat literally Shit. But maybe is a hard choice between Magnesium and shit (literally, poop) and Magnesium powder or even Almonds, that contains Magnesium, in my eXperience, like in a federal good wife´s court, your Honor
Digestion issues didn't go away completely, but everything is noticeably better now.
kinda should eat coconut water and drink 1 little shot of sea water directly from the ocean , no bottles, no cups, no using your hands to drink the water, must imerse your head in the ocean water and drink the shot of sea water directly in the Ocean
My experiences were a month of 3 day water fasts followed by a meal (whole foods like plants and steak), and since then (this was 2 years ago) I do a 3 day fast every 1-2 months or so.
I also was able to stop craving sugars (sodas/ candy, etc) after that first long fast.
I have nothing conclusive, but I suspect that the changes in my mental health and dietary cravings have to do with killing off chunks of my microbiome in the first long fast. Could just be either placebo or other life changes (I turned 40, my wife had left me a month before, and I gave up drinking for 6 months during and after the fast).
So your milage may vary, but if your question is sincere, it might be easier to modify a biome by trimming it back rather than adding to it.
I'd be super stoked to have contradictory / corroborating evidence, though.
I do 16:8 intermittent fasting and my energy levels are a lot better. Basically I just eat my last meal around 19:00 and skip breakfast. Lunch around 11:00.
I may have a sugar free energy drink in the morning to pick me up (my poor stomach doesn't approve coffee any more, too much of it in my younger days... =) )
The changes to my general modes of dealing with stuff were pretty dramatic. I don't think that my wife leaving made it easier to not eat sweets, but who knows?
I was still pretty upset, I just wasn't suicidally depressed, which was a fair improvement. And as I have continued with the fasting through the months, I have felt better around those times when I'm fasting.
who can see with the eyes of crows and Condors, but...
in my eXperience of leaving life around 30 days ago the facts that affected my mental health , yaeh...
but you know the movie Blue Immensity , like my previously private known as immerseintheimmensity,
the guy was immerse in the Only One Ocean, the One...
that connects all seven Seas and five Oceans, As For they are One, freaking All Only One Onipresent Ocean...As the Skyes and the One Sky
the guy did not die Nor it was The End of the Movie...
when he goes swimming with the Dolphins or dancing with the wolves...
nor had the deer died, the deer is as alive as fire, in the mouths of people in the names of children that birth right now in this very second, like poetry
like the legacy of The Spirit of The Forest of Princess Mononoke and the legacy of Hentaro Miyazaki and his drawings of light and paintings of brightness
like Wu Ze Tian , previously known as Wu Zhao currently known as The Brightness and The Light
you speak with the birds and the trees around the streets the parks and the beaches, so it sounds like the mental health changed for worse, but...
anyway, no matter how you see it , it changed for a much happier life
well so it not conserves the snakes very well there is a Argentinian music band named Conservados En Alcool yaeh but I think keeping away from alcohol, Away , mind you what I write , not always , is Away , keep walking to yeah keep walk journey daily yaeh io cool...
keep cool too too 22 .. ..
look trough two two glasses .. .. to to keep your Vision Beyond Reach
as for two two glasses are three and equals 3 as helps the memory forgets what your Vision see or at least keep out of reach...
Keep The Vision Beyond Reach Keep cool Keep walking please thanks
~look trough 2 too you , look to trough a pair of glasses hand tailored for you and a glass of jonie walker fully full or half full how you like it and it makes 3 makes indeed 3
it makes three, as you Sea
it makes three makes tea makes thee as you Sea on the See
equals three you see you sea you see...
"In this review, we will focus on dietary fibers, which interact directly with gut microbes and lead to the production of key metabolites such as short-chain fatty acids, and discuss how dietary fiber impacts gut microbial ecology, host physiology, and health."
Does this study address the role of insoluble fiber in microbiome health?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LUuqxQSaFQ
It sounds ridiculous, in my opinion, like in a federal good wife´s court, your honor