Ask HN: How do you overcome Weltschmerz or fatalism about our future?

74 points by preya2k ↗ HN
I‘m currently having a hard time motivating myself to do anything, really. How do the people of HN overcome the sensation of Weltschmerz, which translates to the feeling that the world is hopeless and lost. While yes, I am not denying that there are positive things happening every day, they all seem vastly unremarkable and small compared to all the horror that is happening every day. Famine, murder, terrorism, climate change, radicalism, fake news it’s all just too much for me currently. How do you motivate yourself to go to work every day, (presumably) coding for some hyper capitalistic company, that somehow feeds the whole downward spiral?

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Enjoy the decline!

But for real:

1. Stop watching news 2. Go hitchhiking for 2 weeks

When you're hitchhiking, you stop worrying about world. You focus on stuff around you. People know they will never meet you again, so they truly open up. They help you. Some don't, which makes the good people evrn better.

When hitchhiking you will see beautiful things around you and it will change your perspective. It did for me. Anectodal, so you can dissmiss :D

1 makes most sense and doesn't require too many sacrifices :-) .It's amazing how well my mental wellbeing has improved after I stopped watching news and being on Social Networks.
Nothing that is worth doing can be achieved in our lifetime; therefore we must be saved by hope.

Nothing which is true or beautiful or good makes complete sense in any immediate context of history; therefore we must be saved by faith.

Nothing we do, however virtuous, can be accomplished alone; therefore we must be saved by love.

No virtuous act is quite as virtuous from the standpoint of our friend or foe as it is from our standpoint. Therefore we must be saved by the final form of love which is forgiveness.

Reinhold Niebuhr, The Irony of American History

I find comfort in, at least, spotting the cyclical nature of things. A despairing rant from, oh, the 14th century, (or 1950-odd) shouldn’t be as cheerful as it seems now, but it kind of is.

Reading good history books really helps. It's amazing how hard and terrible life was for 95% of the world's population just 150 years ago.
Contemplating the misery of others is a true joy
Try to find something you can do that you have control over and will make things better.

E.g. I've been working in free time with local group to get safer bike infrastructure built in Cambridge. One of results of our efforts was on front page of HN yesterday. It was a group effort, but I did a little bit, and it has actual impact.

Will it solve all the world's problems? No, but it's a small step in the right direction. And it's at a scale where I can have an impact and see results.

You also have the ability to find work elsewhere that is more meaningful, some companies are much better than others in what they do (e.g. in similar realm to above, https://www.remix.com/ seems great.)

I've found that reading history gives me hope because at every point in mankind's past, so many people would have had the same fatalism that we have now.Things have turned out OK after all :-)

Second, reading stoicism helps , too. I come from India where we have a similar school of thought which emphasises that the work at hand is the only thing you can control. This helps, too.

YMMV

Why do you concern yourself with all that stuff? I see no problem with _being aware_ of it, but it doesn't directly affect you.

Look outside!

There are trees! Animals! People!

Isn't that crazy? Seriously. How does that stuff exist?

I think you can be - as I am quite often - genuinely dumbfounded and inspired by the complexity around us everyday. There's a lot to appreciate right in front of you. Why overlook it? There's so much.

Relevant Bill Hicks video[0].

[0] - https://youtu.be/tGjuPJskNRE

And he died 15 years ago, this bit was from the 1980s probably. Things have ALWAYS looked terrible. In the 70s and 80s we grew up worried that at any moment the world would literally explode (USSR Nukes) and we made it.

I felt the same way in my 20s, eventually I realized that people have been worried about the same stuff for decades. I guess the only thing I can recommend is thinking about historical context. Somethings are worse now, somethings are better. Focus on the better things. Turn off and tune out "the news" for sure, especially TV news.

Civilisation is doomed, but it will take a good few decades, maybe over a century, to completely collapse. Just focus on stuff you enjoy personally. You personally can still have a really fun life. I wouldnt recommend going to work every day though, unless thats what youre into. I pass the time making frivolous computer games, which is a hobby I enjoy.
Maybe scientists and engineers should isolate themselves in walled communities and shun the complexities of the outside world to allow them to focus on their studies.

Perhaps different parts of each community could choose how long to be isolated for (say 1, 10, 100, 1000 years). Clocks would be important too....

Not all tech work is concentrated in "hyper capitalistic companies". Try to work on something that inspires you.

For example, most of my clients are in the healthcare space.

* One is a wearable device (think watch/bracelet) that allows senior people to get in touch with family or medically trained phone operators in case they have an issue (fell down, can't get out of bed, etc). The same device is also used for locating runaway Alzheimer patients in medical facilities.

* Another is a medical device that detects certain heart conditions.

* Another is a gamified platform that employers can use to motivate employees to live a healthier lifestyle.

Yes, they are all startups, and their goal is to make money. I don't work for free either. That is how the world works right now, but that does not mean the result needs to be net-negative for humanity.

I can go to bed each night knowing that my work helped people, and in some cases even saved their life.

The perceived downward spiral is factually incorrect. Read Steven Pinker for the full breakdown. By any and every measure human beings enjoy better lives than in the past; health, violence, leisure and more. This trend is continuing.

Secondly, your thought patterns of demotivation sound more like the patterns of depression. Focus on finding your own happiness and meaning. On that note, I recommend "Man's search for meaning". The author could find his meaning whilst in a concentration camp. Powerful stuff.

I minored in history, reminding myself how things always go in the grand scheme of things, has been a tremendously efficient way of keeping myself optimistic about our future. At least in terms of our civilisation, because the climate is fucked.

Anyway. If you look at the big picture of human civilisation, then it’s really been one long line of progress. Some times there are set-backs, and sometimes those set-backs last four a century, but over all, it’s an endless line of progression toward a better world.

Yes there is famine, but poverty is decreasing. Yes there is murder and terrorism, but we’ve never been less violent. Yes there are fake news, but we’ve never been more educated. Yes there is totalitarianism, but we’ve never been more democratic or free.

Another thing I do that helps a lot, is that I select my sources of news carefully. I don’t really care what happened today if it isn’t important enough to remember tomorrow. I do like to keep up with current events though. As a solution to this predicament I found a high quality news paper that only comes out once a week. I buy it as paper and I digest the weeks events over the weekend. Other than that I stay away from news unless something drastic happens. I also avoid social media (with HN and LinkedIn being the only exception).

The last thing I’d suggest is finding a hobby, and spending time on that instead of worrying. The less useful it is the better, because if your hobbies are about self-improvement, then you’ll end up getting stressed about them.

Personally I think it is not a good idea to assume that the world/universe is supposed to have some kind of meaning or direction. At some level, none of this really matters. Humanity will be gone in due time, and none of that will have any meaning anymore. We just need to be able to enjoy the ride and focus on the good parts.
A little exercise, a little relaxation/meditation will make you feel a lot better.
Your question reminds me of a Bill Hicks joke about watching too much News.

https://youtu.be/tGjuPJskNRE

On a more serious note, this learned sense of hopelessness is nothing new to humanity.

>Would you like to save the world from the degradation and destruction it seems destined for? Then step away from shallow mass movements and quietly go to work on your own self-awareness. If you want to awaken all of humanity, then awaken all of yourself. If you want to eliminate the suffering in the world, then eliminate all that is dark and negative in yourself. Truly, the greatest gift you have to give is that of your own self-transformation.

Lao Tzu

Knowledge is half the battle which helps, I found reading the Bhagvad Gita about the modern age (Kali yuga) helped
You might “just” be depressed. You may also be in a bad place socially or professionally.

“Before you diagnose yourself with depression or low self esteem, first make sure you are not, in fact, just surrounded by assholes.”

Change your environment and habits if you can. Go outside more, preferably somewhere with greenery and wildlife. Parks are great, places with few people are even better. If you don’t have an exercise habit, try and build one. Do things you enjoy. Hang out with people you like. If you can combine the two. Consider seeing a therapist or getting on SSRIs or done other drug. If you don’t see much of the sun you could just need more sunlight.

Read old philosophy on how to live the good life and apply its lessons as much as you can, whether it’s Seneca, the Enchiridon, Lucretius, Confucius or Xunzi. You are not alone and others have wrestled with these feelings. You can wrestle with them by yourself or you can do so with the help of those long dead, professionals, family or friends.

If your work feels meaningless and you want more meaning seek it out. Do work that means something. 80,000 Hours has a job board for people who want to do things that matter in their life and want to help people, lots of people. If that floats your boat look at their job board.

https://80000hours.org/job-board/

It would be a good start if you can work that inspires you. You can do some part time stuff or volunteering on weekends, these activities will recharge you and make you feel less overwhelmed by this dystopian scenarios. May be these small gestures of you, will make a better place for someone else.
I think and feel along the same lines. Stoicism helps. As do various forms of escapism. Every time I felt overwhelmed by these feelings, it (in hindsight) turned out to be a symptom of depression.

I really, really, very strongly urge you to go and speak to your doctor for some further assistance. Don't let the black dog pull you down.

Ignorance is a bliss, really. We are badly wired to agonized over the the future. It 's comforting to know generally that the future is pretty much deterministic , in fact it is already there waiting for our timelines to cross it, mechanistically. Thinking of an idealized future on the other hand is quite self-serving . It makes one feel good, but it's not real , it s just a fantasy like any other.
Frankly, the world is hopeless and lost. Physicists don't debate so much that the universe will end someday as how it will end. Each and every one of us is destined to be dust. Ultimately, all creation is ephemeral, but that doesn't make it less valuable.

Suffering is just a part of living and, more importantly, a requirement of growth. Think back and ask yourself if at any point in your life where you grew significantly as a person there wasn't suffering involved. It is the same with humanity as a whole. We have challenges set before us, in order to grow we'll have to deal with them. Think of it as a selection pressure, many paths are attempted and the ones that fail are ultimately trimmed, but they were necessary none the less. We may not succeed. Humanity may ultimately be unable to overcome the challenges presented by this stage of its development, but that's ok, the universe is a big place and it is likely that someone out there will, and even if they don't, well, the end result is the same anyway.

I wish there were a simple model I could give you to work with, but the problem with simple models is that they're inaccurate abstractions. The map is not the territory and all that. Navigating the complexities of what you should and shouldn't do is something you'll have to work on, but let me offer this as a starting point: You're going to die some day, therefore mere survival is a meaningless goal because you've already failed. Knowing this, presumably there is a world in which you would rather not live. Imagine what that world looks like and ask yourself "am I contributing towards creating that world?", and if the answer is "yes, definitely", then maybe you should stop.

Hyper-capitalist companies (naturally) make the most money and therefore often offer the best compensation, but compensation isn't everything. Life isn't about achieving the high-score, because you still die in the end and eventually you'll be forgotten. You are ephemeral, just like everything else. Why subject yourself to the misery of knowing you're helping make the world a worse place? You can find another job. You likely won't be compensated as well, and as a result will have a less comfortable life, you may even be mocked by your peers for not being as successful, but so what? You don't have to win. No one is handing out medals at the end of all this.

There are things in this world you cannot control. In fact there is probably just one thing you CAN control, and that is yourself and how you react to everything else around you. Focus on that. Everything else is out of your control anyway.
Step away from "news" and read Better Angels of our Nature by Stephen Pinker: https://www.amazon.com/Better-Angels-Our-Nature-Violence/dp/...

Not only is the world better than ever, it is getting better faster than ever, and it's accelerating.

The news is getting more negative as the world gets better. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/1461670X.2018.1...

This is happening because as subscription revenue dries up, the media is incentivized toward click-bait, and the human brain is biased toward negativity. As a hunter-gatherer, a negative incident can have much worse consequences than can a positive one, so we've evolved toward a negative bias for survival reasons.

I haven't read the Stephen Pinker book, but it sounds similar to one of my favourite books "Factfulness: Ten Reasons We're Wrong About the World--and Why Things Are Better Than You Think" which sounds like it covers similar topics.

As douglaswlance says, the world is getting better faster than ever!

There are two main problems with Pinker's thesis.

First, he claims to show a tendential decline in war. But most casualties of war are the result of a small handful of apocalyptic wars: the sixty years wars, the Napoleonic wars, and the world wars. Each of these events has been bigger than the last. The consistent pattern is for there to be fewer wars over time, but for these apocalyptic wars to become more destructive. Clearly, that's the result of technological progress. If we extrapolate this trend forward, it would suggest that there will be an apocalyptic war in the next century that will destroy most of the world. Pinker acknowledges these long-tail events, but minimises or ignores their significance.

Second, his case is built on the back of a few remarkable trendlines: fewer wars, declining violence, better governance. Pinker does this very well. It's convincing and insightful. But these are data without context. Pinker's argument has no historical or sociological depth. If you want to understand what's taking place in the world, you have to recognise how the forces of modernity - capitalism, nation-states, techno-science, individualism - have led to both everything Pinker celebrates (pacified populations pursuing commercial gain in well governed centralised states in a globalised world) and a whole host of dangers (increasingly destructive technology, competition between nation-states, inequality and Darwinian economic competition, decentralised capitalism, climate change, and the destruction of nature, etc.).

Is there any good news for the natural world in that book? Specifically mass extinction of species cute and not.
Get a bike.

Ride it.

Think about things you can do.

That’s what I do. I try to focus on things that I can do that helps people in some way. I also focus on making my own life and those I love better.

Fixing your own life is usually the cure for worrying too much about the world and everyone else. Give it a try, go see a therapist and find out what the root issue is. A minor depression isn't something to be ashamed of, wasting your life without identifying and getting rid of it, might be.
Two practical suggestions:

1. Avoid reading bad, sensationalist news about things you have no control over. Staying informed is good, but if it makes you sick you have to reduce your information intake.

2. Get checked for clinical depression.

Weltschmerz isn't a bad thing as long as it doesn't paralyze you. I my experience, as long as I have something positive to contribute I'm good. My family, my job and my hobbies demand so much attention from me that I actually miss basking in sadness like a teenager sometimes.

Also, be thankful that other people's suffering makes you feel strong emotions. As I said, tune out for some time if you feel like you can't take it anymore.

Hi preya2k,

I know what you wanna say, and I think its only a "point of view"...

So for example: Murder You think there is more and more of "murdering" going on? Well, that's a subjective point of view. In fact, the murder rate is going downwards https://ourworldindata.org/homicides#usa

Also, just looking at the dark side is not helping much ... take a look at the dark side AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

ALSO: Have a look at the bright side: Life Expectancy is climbing year by year in almost all countries. Dying of cancer is also declining https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cancer-death-rates-by-typ...

I'm not saying that all these bad things are not terrible itself, but it is YOUR subjective point of view that leads to a pessimistic or optimistic world. This means, you can choose your point of view and you personally can change the world. It does not matter if it was you directly changing the world, it's enough if you once meet someone and change his point of view, which in turn might change the world 10, 20 years later on.

About climate change: Currently it looks like we are directly heading into hell. But again, its your point of view AND your personal action to do something about your concerns. Don't use a car, just use a bike. I think this would be enough to change the world. If everybody choose to do this, there would be no more problems with climate change.

To say if differently: There are no alternatives to being optimistic!

Best wishes for the future,

Chris

Bad things happening all over the world less and less is uplifting and we should be more optimistic because of that.

Well, I think this is pretty bad advice for times when things keep on getting worse, and it is all about perception. Feelings are pretty subjective and asserting that some objective numbers ought to change someone's perception of the world is not helpful. Maybe it is what floats your boat, nit necessarily everyone else's.

I would look at two things to see if they may be causing a big part of the feeling: personal health and external stimuli

1. "Mens sana in corpore sano". You do not need to be a fitness nut, but do make sure you get enough sleep and enough movement outside. Sleep at least 8 hours (unless you consider yourself middle age or older). Walk briskly outside (in an area you like at a time it is pleasant) for an hour a day. Or play soccer / beach volley / whatever you like.

2. Remove gloomy external data feeds, such as news. Currently most news outlets seem to sell gloom, disasters and anger. Read a book instead. Talk to people. Travel. If your job environment is toxic, change jobs, even if it means lower salary initially.

YMMV, but those two simple things may be all that you need to get that feeling of hopelessness out of your system. My 2c. Good luck!