"Expect to either make a major investment in developing your own financial and tracking software that works with Basecamp to make it do what you need (37Signals provides an open applications development toolset, so this is certainly possible),"
Was just thinking the same thing. How hard would it be to use the API to pull data into a csv format? That seems to be what his main gripe was, after all.
Interesting article. It pointed out a lot of flaws in 37signals software that are clearly intended. Whether a lack of features and a strict conformance to bare software is a net positive or negative for small business is another conversation, but this does point out a need for features that they are missing.
This also comes along with 37signals' post on the permanent nature of features, and the importance of getting it mostly right from the beginning.
On that topic, the idea of providing business services in the mindset UNIX tools is beginning to be really attractive to me. Provide a limited set of features in a small bundle that plays well with other services, along a similar mindset. A billing component, a collaboration component, etc, such that each one can play with another very well. That should make offering new services more painless and intuitive.
It pointed out a lot of flaws in 37signals software
It pointed out the major flaw in the 37signals philosophy: they're frozen. Sure they moved apps from the desktop to the web and simplified them greatly, two very appealing propositions for many small businesses. But OP presents a clear example of the flaw: What do you do when you have grown and your app can't?
Apply all the perfume you want, but if your app can't scale or be customized, in the end all you have is what you started with: a canned package.
Not to mention you are creating an artificially low barrier of entry to your market. Like what happened when Google AppEngine was released with a /sample/ app that mimicked theirs.
I would have to disagree with you on this matter - Basecamp on its own provides enough features for most users, and their API is powerful enough to allow for nearly limitless expansion. Where I feel the company fails is in promoting this API to consumers. If the company had a directory of third party tools, a job board for Basecamp API developers, and built a few extension tools of their own I feel they could appease the nay-sayers while sticking true to their philosophy
Jason Fried sez: we'd prefer that you outgrow our software, because we still have your fucking money. Hah!
In 37Signals' defense, they don't have time to bend over backwards for each and every little customer whim, especially enterprisey-type crap like this customer wanted. You have to be utilitarian or else you're dead.
We've been using Basecamp + Campfire for a few weeks on our project, and I have to say that I really like it so far.
I AM really concerned about the amount of content in our Basecamp site growing out of control -- already, I have to scroll several pages to add a note to an old, seldom used message... we already have fifteen or so writeboards. If there's a way to archive this stuff, it's not readily apparent to me (although I am a bit of a dolt).
For those who have used (and enjoyed) Basecamp, has this been a problem for you as your project expanded?
As an aside, did anyone else find the embedded headlines for other stories in this article dreadfully confusing?
I used to use Basecamp as part of an eight-member team for web projects. After a few weeks, it had so many rabbit holes of data in it (each one created by different users who created different organization systems) that I stopped using it because I had no idea where to look any more.
But that's not really a fault with Basecamp itself - it's just as much of a problem with any system that allows users to create their own categories or folders, like SharePoint.
It was doubly annoying that I was forced to use two systems for communication - Outlook and Basecamp. First someone would go into Basecamp and write a message - and because they had subscribed me to it, I'd get an email with their note included.
To reply to it - instead of using Outlook, which normally would be dead easy since I could just click "reply all," I'd have to figure out where to go in Basecamp to reply to it - which was so difficult to do that I never did. Instead, I'd typically just reply to the message using Outlook, which of course defeated the purpose of Basecamp.
I think the premise of the article is misguided. If they need time tracking with accounting software integration, have they tried Harvest?
Linda sounds like the problem not basecamp. If Linda was doing a good job she would have researched problem and turned up Harvest-- at least as an option to try.
Instead she fell into the 'this is the way it's been done before mindset', that doesn't recognize the benefits of collaboration or web services.
In my experience, Linda's approach may make her feel like every penny is accounted for, but that will only be true in her books. Everyone else will be left with a print out of a week old, outdated gantt chart, and less certainty about what to do.
This is a great quote "every penny is accounted for, but that will only be true in her books." One of the strengths of a collaboration app, in particular if you grant customers acces to the workspace, is that you are better able to focus on the value that you are delivering, not the hours you are working. Clients pay for results not hours: I question why the strict focus on hours. We use CentralDesktop and are happy with it, but I would never confuse it with a time tracking system.
12 comments
[ 4.5 ms ] story [ 41.9 ms ] threadBusiness opp, anyone?
This also comes along with 37signals' post on the permanent nature of features, and the importance of getting it mostly right from the beginning.
On that topic, the idea of providing business services in the mindset UNIX tools is beginning to be really attractive to me. Provide a limited set of features in a small bundle that plays well with other services, along a similar mindset. A billing component, a collaboration component, etc, such that each one can play with another very well. That should make offering new services more painless and intuitive.
Any takes on a venture? :)
It pointed out the major flaw in the 37signals philosophy: they're frozen. Sure they moved apps from the desktop to the web and simplified them greatly, two very appealing propositions for many small businesses. But OP presents a clear example of the flaw: What do you do when you have grown and your app can't?
Apply all the perfume you want, but if your app can't scale or be customized, in the end all you have is what you started with: a canned package.
In 37Signals' defense, they don't have time to bend over backwards for each and every little customer whim, especially enterprisey-type crap like this customer wanted. You have to be utilitarian or else you're dead.
I AM really concerned about the amount of content in our Basecamp site growing out of control -- already, I have to scroll several pages to add a note to an old, seldom used message... we already have fifteen or so writeboards. If there's a way to archive this stuff, it's not readily apparent to me (although I am a bit of a dolt).
For those who have used (and enjoyed) Basecamp, has this been a problem for you as your project expanded?
As an aside, did anyone else find the embedded headlines for other stories in this article dreadfully confusing?
But that's not really a fault with Basecamp itself - it's just as much of a problem with any system that allows users to create their own categories or folders, like SharePoint.
It was doubly annoying that I was forced to use two systems for communication - Outlook and Basecamp. First someone would go into Basecamp and write a message - and because they had subscribed me to it, I'd get an email with their note included.
To reply to it - instead of using Outlook, which normally would be dead easy since I could just click "reply all," I'd have to figure out where to go in Basecamp to reply to it - which was so difficult to do that I never did. Instead, I'd typically just reply to the message using Outlook, which of course defeated the purpose of Basecamp.
Linda sounds like the problem not basecamp. If Linda was doing a good job she would have researched problem and turned up Harvest-- at least as an option to try.
Instead she fell into the 'this is the way it's been done before mindset', that doesn't recognize the benefits of collaboration or web services.
In my experience, Linda's approach may make her feel like every penny is accounted for, but that will only be true in her books. Everyone else will be left with a print out of a week old, outdated gantt chart, and less certainty about what to do.