Ask HN: How to develop accurate self-understanding?

29 points by bambataa ↗ HN
A question prompted by end-of-year reflection. Perhaps HN can solve the eternal question!

How does a person accurately assess their strengths, weaknesses, good habits, bad habits etc. when they only have their own subjective experience of these things?

Explicit feedback can be useful, especially in a professional setting, but relies on good communication and for the person receiving feedback to appreciate (in both senses of the word) what is being said. I'm sure we all have examples of advice we didn't fully understand until we were older (and had made the mistakes we were warned about).

In the past I have found meditation useful, but it is obviously subjective too. Personally, I have found it too easy to slip from self-inquiry to disproportionate self-criticism, though perhaps that is a stage on the journey.

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I really like the book The Four Agreements.

My favorite agreement by far is don't take anything personally.

For example a really good friend of mine, was having a bunch of trouble in her home life but she couldn't exactly afford to move out. So if you're working with her and she's rude to you, it has nothing to do with anything you did. 99% of how someone reacts to you is based upon what they're going through. And plus getting upset over someone else doesn't improve anything.

I also have some Buddhist leanings, which are so important to me I told a girl it wasn't going to work when she said that Buddhism was satanic.

Finally learn to appreciate and love yourself, this is by far the hardest lesson I continue to learn. It's very easy to look at maybe a job you didn't get or a relationship that didn't work and think that you're some type of broken thing. But you realize no one really has it figured out we're all just trying to get through the day, you can make peace with who you are

> For example a really good friend of mine, was having a bunch of trouble in her home life but she couldn't exactly afford to move out. So if you're working with her and she's rude to you, it has nothing to do with anything you did. 99% of how someone reacts to you is based upon what they're going through. And plus getting upset over someone else doesn't improve anything.

Not to over criticize your friend, but as an example: this pattern of behavior is what separates mindful, good people from jerks - imo. Everyone gets less controlled as they get stressed, but controlling how you express that is hugely important.

I've found that not only is it a thing in myself i need to be very vigilant about, but cutting out the people in my life who immediately lash out rather than behave constructively did a lot for me. It's a good indicator to the person behind the facade that we all wear.

And again, nothing intended to your friend. Just an example. I also think we can still have "those friends" around if we think they have promise, or perhaps offer other benefits that outweigh the toxic affect their behavior can have. It's just super mindful to be aware of toxic indicators, in ourselves and those around.

Everyone's going to have a rough day from time to time, and then when you interact with them they might be a bit rude. It's much easier to just shug it off, versus over analyzing how you did something to piss them off.
Well to be clear, i didn't say anything about hyper analyzing yourself. Rather i was saying that for the people in our life whose first action in the safe of frustration is to lash out we should take note of that. And not let their toxicity drag you down.

Putting up with toxic people because it's not your fault is not healthy, imo. One bad day does not a toxic person make.

edit: Another way to word it is simply: don't underestimate the affect toxic people can have on your life. And fight to not be one (a toxic person) yourself.

You're not 100% wrong, let's just say there's a reason she's always remained just a friend.
I don't feel i'm saying anything controversial haha, so i'd be curious what percent i'm wrong regardless.
Well, I'll be someone's friend if they're going through a really rough patch. I'll provide emotional support from a distance. But I've been down this road before, and trying to date someone who's not in a stable living situation is never going to end well.
Yea and i think your statement is meaningfully different than what i described - which is to say you're a friend during a _rough patch_, it has an end.

However we've all seen people who have "rough patches" repeatedly. It's a never ending rough patch. They're the people who think everyone else is a jerk, but not realizing that maybe _they_ are.

Regardless, i think we're in agreement, i just could have worded everything better haha. Carry on friend :)

As a last point.

This is more economical, but I've met tons of young adults in their early twenties who simply can't move out since rent is outrageous. The issue here is if your parents are abusive, You're simply screwed. I would never judge someone for having a nasty attitude towards life, towards everything if trapped in that type of situation.

At the same time my biggest red flag when it comes to dating is if the person has a stable living situation. If someone's 28 and fights their parents every morning, I don't judge them but I know their mind won't be right for a relationship. Once upon a time, I was going through an eviction and the girl I was dating broke it off for the same exact reason. My mind wasn't in a good place.

> Not to over criticize your friend, but as an example: this pattern of behavior is what separates mindful, good people from jerks - imo. Everyone gets less controlled as they get stressed, but controlling how you express that is hugely important.

People are capable of maturing, and being a more cool and stable presence can help. I used to tutor in high school and college, and I experienced a lot of people expressing their frustration with the material through some degree of anger (sometimes directed at me). Over the course of the term (and often this only took a couple weeks), by being a calmer presence and letting them air their frustrations, nearly all of them stopped reacting this way.

Stepping away from them was not necessary, and would have delayed this maturation process. Instead, I let their actions reflect back on them by my cooler reaction. Usually they were embarrassed and somewhat ashamed, I'd say it was cool, I understood, but do better. And over time they would.

If they don't mature, then it's time to step away.

Personal and professional relationships:

Without explicit feedback, by being attentive to the reactions of others. Not just their words, but their physical reactions and body language as well. If you've disappointed a manager, you may not get a statement about it from them. But you'll see it in other ways:

- Do they greet you like they used to?

- Do they give you the same kind of assignments/tasks? More responsibility, less responsibility?

- Do they, unprompted, solicit advice or ideas from you more often or less often?

- Watch their facial expressions when they see you coming down the hall of the office (obviously easier in years other than this one). Do they "put on" a pleasant face or does it seem to come naturally?

Same thing when dealing with other people in this regard. Romantic partners, family members, friends, acquaintances.

And be willing to solicit feedback. If something seems off, ask about it. But be open to potentially negative feedback. You cannot be defensive if they say something hurtful, you solicited it.

Habits and productivity:

For things like habits or productivity, you can gauge yourself fairly well with a logbook/journal. Write down a "daily activities" note. "What did I do today?" Then review it at the end of each week to make a weekly activities summary, and review that monthly for another summary. And compare the weeks and months against each other. "Hmm, these were 5 simple tasks and that's all I accomplished this month, but in prior months I finished harder ones. Was the work lighter this month with the holidays or did I do something different?"

Self-criticism versus self-inquiry:

Look into CBT (cognitive behavior therapy). That turned my life around from suicidal depression to actually being (mostly) satisfied and happy with myself and my life (mostly because there are areas I want to improve, but I'm not loathing or hating myself anymore). Find a therapist/counselor with the specific goal of working on this skillset.

I think empathy helps (the ability to look at a situation from someone else's point of view). Reading things written by others (especially fiction) can help hone this skill.
What I think works for me (though I might be deluded) is journaling. And it took years to get beyond how I had learned to think about the world and to stop reinforcing my habitual patterns of forcing my way.

I think journaling works for me by externalizing my thoughts in concrete form. Immutability sucks in the short term but dealing with it is beneficial for me in the long term. Rereading a cringe inducing past entry from time to time is Pavlovian conditioning against doing so again.

Journaling creates a linear narrative from my thoughts. It is the opposite of mulling it over in my head in circles and spirals. It runs beside me not around.

Of course for a long time there was much more ruminating than today. And there has always been a meditative dimension to writing.

But for me meditative behaviors are about reminding myself I have access to an inner state of calm. Not a road to trivial insight (enlightenment I heard is a much bigger deal).

Journaling because writing is thinking with meeting minutes.

You can either get information from other people you trust and you think would give you accurate feedback or by trying to develop a clearer sense of how your own mind works via ego dissolution.

For the former, its probably ideal to pick someone you trust and respect, and try to be clear with them you want critical or constructive feedback.

For the latter, meditation, therapy, and Vedanta-style self-inquiry can all trigger more self-awareness and self-dissolution. As the amygdala shrinks and prefrontal cortex gets more activated, the fear-based, survival-oriented self erodes and you start to be able to see more clearly and objectively.

I can relate to some of what your trying to communicate.

Much of my questions about the quality & persuites of my habits where answered when I read Carl Jung's "Structure & Dynamics of the Psyche".

I also found an online community[0] that studies philosophy & focuses on how to apply it to daily habits.

Much of what philosophers like Carl Jung & the Academy Of Ideas articulated might not be scientific fact, but what I can confirm is that almost everyone will find them very therapeutic and helpful in a sense. It has become sort of my "church"

[0]: https://academyofideas.com/

It's suggest therapy. You cannot lift yourself up by your bootstraps. You need someone out of your head to be a mirror that is asking the questions.
A solid mindfulness practice. Being able to take a step back - even if only a bit at first - and see that we are all quite often over-reacting, or responding in ways that are inbuilt / learnt - is a really good starting point IMO.

I've been interested in how quickly this comes about. I'm not claiming to be any kind of guru (I'm about a decade into a fairly irregular practice and maybe 2-3 years into something more routine/structured) but even after a few months, you start to become aware of how you immediately react to things.

This doesn't mean that a meditative approach makes you become some kind of sage - you still get cross, still react in bad ways - but it's more fleeting, less likely to affect your whole day or cause longer term anxst.