"The company will prohibit users from posting any sexually explicit conduct, starting in October. Creators will still be allowed to post nude photos and videos, provided they’re consistent with OnlyFans’ policy"
Interesting. Does this means that there is a business to make companies like OnlyFan and Patreon for adult content and then dropping it once you get big, and start again?
What is it called when your greed for investor money ends up giving a giant opening for your competitor and destroying your business? Also how come even the most profitable company can't compete with deep SV pockets? Is this capitalism?
It is, but it's not a very good one. Think about the billions that have gone into reinventing the taxi industry, the hotel industry and the food delivery industry. We don't call it 'picking winners' however, because it's not the filthy public sector doing it. And also because none of Uber, Airbnb or DoorDash can really be considered a 'win'.
State-backed capitalism has its faults, but they usually try to move billions into a strategically important area that benefits a large enough section of the economy.
Maybe it's not investor money but issues with payment processors. Credit card companies don't like porn for some reason, and they're in a position where they can enforce such limits on many platforms.
So, serious question because I know very little about OnlyFans other than the general knowledge flowing around the internet: What does this leave of the site? Because my impression was certainly that this was the purpose of the site.
Not necessarily. Discord is a pretty popular platform for exclusive access to selected people, e.g. Patreon supporters. As long as OF allows this kind of link it might stay relevant.
Except they have the reputation of porn, but now they don't have the porn. I wouldn't go sign up for an OnlyFans account in order to follow a SFW creator, simply because the reputation OnlyFans has. However I would join their Discord or Patreon.
Now their in this weird uncanny valley of "adult content" combined with "no adult content". Seems hard to shake that image.
Patreon already exists for exclusive SFW content, and with exclusive Discords you can also interact with other fans of the same content. Not sure where OnlyFans would fit in other than "different Patreon".
Did you know Pornhub has a social network-like function and achievements? But if a coworker wanted to connect with you by asking you to add them on PornHub, you'd probably not think that this is about a casual coworker friendship.
It's going to be similar if people link to OnlyFans instead of Patreon (or Locals).
Very helpful video. Also mentions their sister site myfreecams. That's probably where the x-rated videos will remain. Seems like they're splitting the brand to have one NSFW and one SFW.
I'd like to note, though, that this video also treats OnlyFans as a porn-only site. It literally starts with asking "Why do people spend money on OnlyFans?" when what they're asking is "why do people spend money on porn".
That's my question, too - I thought OnlyFans was a hosting platform for personal porn sites; I remember there was a big uproar a few months back when some TikTok influencer joined the site and started posting non-adult content. People were upset that they were diluting a site that's specifically for adult content.
Not quite accurate. Bella Thorne joined Onlyfans and promised "no clothes naked" content in exchange for her $200 subscription fee. She made millions of dollars but then only sent clothed and obscured pictures to her subscribers. After thousands of people demanded refunds, Onlyfans changed their policies to heavily limit how much subscribers could be charged for content, how much they could pay, and increased the creator payout wait time from one week to three weeks. This heavily damaged the incomes of thousands of people overnight.
While we allow nudity and for creators to push the boundaries of art, we also have guidelines against funding pornography on patreon. In our community guidelines: We define pornographic material as real people engaging in sexual acts such as masturbation or sexual intercourse on camera.
Interstitial pages are pages that pop up when you intend to go somewhere else, but need to complete an approval process, like the “I agree to the EULA” page
Edit: an 18+ interstitial would just be one that asks if the person is 18+
I watch several channels on YT, and I think they have excellent value (educational like 3Blue1Brown, entertaining like Davie504, musical like Ichika Nito and so on). I really enjoy watching/listening to them especially when I do something around the house like cleaning. But the moment they said they go OnlyFans and I have to pay $10 in order to watch them, I can't imagine I'd switch.
Is it OnlyFans or paying money for things that's the issue? Would you pay $10 on Paetreon or for YouTube premium? Would you pay $1 to OnlyFans? How about paying $10, but no one would know you were paying OnlyFans?
It's the immense hassle involved with paying small amounts of money to many different people. Sites like YouTube (and presumably OnlyFans) fix that problem.
...for how long? There were rumors they were getting rid of adult and then they put out an announcement saying that they would always be inclusive of sex workers. Then they just announced this.
What Credibility - They are 75% owned by Leonid_Radvinsky.
He puts the sketch in sketchy (porn click farms in the 90's, sued by Amazon and Microsoft working together for spamming emails by the millions in the early 2000's).
It's gotten taken over by celebrities. They don't promote content from girls selling their nudes anymore.
Even dead ones get it better. I took one look at it recently and saw lil peep on there. My first thought was wow they're really putting a dead rapper's meat out there like that? But nah, it's like unreleased music videos and shit. Gotta wonder who is milking that.
It's a huge win for PornHub which already has a robust amateur porn monetation platform. I suspect most explicit OF users already use PH for teasers and free content. Most likely they will move all content to PH and leave OF behind
Had. PornHub are still blocked by MasterCard, Visa and Discover and since American Express was never an option, that’s a lock, no credits cards for PornHub.
> That popularity also brought with it additional scrutiny, and OnlyFans is positioning itself more as a forum for musicians, fitness instructors and chefs than sex workers. While many of its most-popular creators post videos of themselves engaging in sexual behavior, several mainstream celebrities like Bella Thorne, Cardi B and Tyga have also set up accounts.
Are you sure? Another user posted this elsewhere in this thread, a few posts below yours:
>Not quite accurate. Bella Thorne joined Onlyfans and promised "no clothes naked" content in exchange for her $200 subscription fee. She made millions of dollars but then only sent clothed and obscured pictures to her subscribers. After thousands of people demanded refunds, Onlyfans changed their policies to heavily limit how much subscribers could be charged for content, how much they could pay, and increased the creator payout wait time from one week to three weeks. This heavily damaged the incomes of thousands of people overnight.
Yeah. She was there because of “no clothes naked” which is explicit. She ended up being deceitful and hurting others. Still means she was there because of explicit stuff. in other words, there’s a reason she made millions on onlyfans in no time and not with a brand new Payreon.
I don't know where to find a trustworthy list, but I've read that several of the biggest ones are fitness influencers and personal trainers who do preview videos on Instagram/YouTube/Twitch and use OnlyFans to post the full routine/program and provide individual consultation. Granted, there's not exactly a bright line between fitness content and softcore porn, but they're typically not put in the same category for administrative/policy purposes.
I'm a cryptocurrency advocate, but for the average person transacting with crypto is still insanely intimidating and a pain to set up properly. Maybe paying with stablecoins could work but that is still a lot to ask of your users who are accustomed to paying for things with a credit card.
Want to buy something? Open a Coinbase or Gemini account, hook up ACH or wire transfers, wait a week for the deposit to be made, then send 'dollars' to this really long and complicated looking address. If you send it to the wrong address you are SOL.
Yeah I'm saying you'd have a service that does that for you, moves the money from credit (OF sub) to crypto back to fiat for the user (OF creator). I also realize about costs too... but like with CBP if you transact a lot of volume the fees go down so you could build it up.
Well... I guess ultimately you still need that thing between the credit card and the service eg. stripe... idk if the porn thing is like a blanket protection against CP or something?
I think the most important thing would be wrapping the destination address around an easy to view label. Maybe only allow transactions to trusted/verified addresses for partner companies and services.
Crypto payments hasn't taken off yet. It's beyond the scope of most people's ability to pay in crypto.
To reach the masses you probably have to go with "know your customer" (KYC) requirements that are going to scare lots of people away when they have to upload photos of their passport and stuff like that to a website.
And governments and banks are going to impose the same restrictions somehow.
Unless they use a coin that is private, all transactions are going to be recorded in the blockchain and publicly viewable to everyone. Nobody wants their porn purchases to be public knowledge.
It will probably eventually get there but probably at least 5 years out.
Ostensibly, payment providers block this type of thing because it has higher fraud risk, but this makes me wonder: do countries where credit is less fundamental to payments have the same problem? My understanding is that in the UK, for example, you could make a deposit to a betting site with the same payment card you use to buy milk, since it's more secure than a credit card and the counterparty assumes less risk.
That should be a myth by now. Would be interesting if e.g. Stripe could share the fraud statistics for onlyfans. The banks probably do this purely to keep up appearances and avoid potential bad PR.
I don't understand who appointed the banks became the keepers of puritanical propriety. They're terrified someone might see a boob or buy some weed, and the weight of the world rests on the banks to prevent that from happening.
> I don't understand who appointed the banks became the keepers of puritanical propriety.
Congress, for one. There's a history of bills that are meant to target trafficking scooping up consensual practices as well (see also the Mann Act, SESTA/FOSTA). I'm not sure how influential the threat of something like this was here, but it can't help:
Same here in the Netherlands, we pay with a debit card. In stores as well as online.
May people do have one (55%) as it sometimes comes with a payment package, but they are generally frowned upon as tech from the stone age and insecure.
The ability to tip and unlock content in DMs as well as tip on posts makes OF different from patreon. Tips bring in ALOT of money to popular creators, way more than the monthly subscription.
I've seen them brag about revenue, and it looks amazing. That said the porn industry if filled with liars, and I don't believe anything w/o and audited results.
That is a lot of people who are suddenly going to need to find work...but I think a lot of the sexually themed OF's will migrate to other cam websites. I wonder how much money OF will lose because of this decision?
This question isn't necessarily directed to you but your comment made me wonder: How do other cam sites handle payments and what makes them different than OF?
They use payment processors that specialize in adult content - who charge exorbitant fees for the privilege. Adult payment processors charge 15-20% vs the 2.9%+30¢ Stripe charges, and is nowhere near as nice to use.
Yes, and the South American and Eastern Europe sex slave cammers will follow them, like what happened with Chaturbate and CamSoda. OnlyFans didn't have to worry about this because nobody's going to subscribe to an account of three gay Colombianos half-heartedly diddling some poor girl, or an anorexic Russian getting anal for six hours straight. OnlyFans succeeded by not being part of that race to the bottom.
It seems like for any crowdsourced funding platform there is a volume cap for NSFW content imposed by the need of those platforms to seek wider audiences and funding sources.
I assume this will lead to Onlyfans's effective death, much as Tumblr's porn ban seems to have led to, or hastened, its death.
Reddit seems to have resisted whatever calls it must be getting to eliminate porn. So far at least. It will ban or quarantine some heretical ideas, but porn is still there.
Reddit's gone to lengths to hide it, so casual users aren't hitting it by accident two clicks off an unrelated Google search result page, not on "/r/all", which gets advertisers what they want, without the uproar that banning porn would cause.
> Reddit seems to have resisted whatever calls it must be getting to eliminate porn
Not entirely. They purged all NSFW subreddits from the r/all and r/popular meta subreddits. They also go on a purging binge whenever a remotely taboo subreddit makes the news.
What "remotely taboo" subreddits were banned after making the news? The ones I recall weren't "remotely", they were "extremely". As in, sexual images of children, pictures taken of women without their knowledge, legitimate hate subreddits, ones dedicated to spreading misinformation re: COVID, etc.
But they also spent years promoting racism, hate, dangerous conspiracy theories, a neo-nazi rally that resulted in murder, etc. It's hard to look at all of that and think it was just "kind of taboo".
I went to the Donald all the time to get a different perspective and if there was racism and hate any worse than /r/politicalhumor or /r/politics I never saw it.
I started doing the same after the Pulse Nightclub shooting when literally the rest of Reddit was censoring and preventing discussion because it was almost immediately known the shooter was Muslim. It was the only place you could go for a live thread and actual info.
Over time, the signal to noise was low. But occasionally there was a good point or funny meme.
I can't say for sure I saw any racism worse than anywhere else. I really don't like when people use whatever this is ((( ))) to talk about Jews, saw that a couple times on t_d, but I've definitely also seen it on /r/politics /r/atheism etc
It's equally as possible that some people have become so overly sensitive to the idea of dog whistles that they see them everywhere, even when that wasn't the intent.
The provided reason for their quarantine was the users were linking to other content on Reddit too much. Your word salad of emotional, baseless claims is not only meaningless but irrelevant, yet you would have us take your word for it on who should be censored.
> The excuse I think was that they did "organized brigading" or something like that.
It was actually for "violence against police". Hillary Clinton's MediaMatters group found a few comments and made an article on it, this was pushed as far as possible, presenting Reddit with enough cause to "quarantine" them.
The specific anti-police messages were about a congressional walkout in Oregon, and threats to use the police to bring them back for a quorum. A rep replied "Send bachelors". This was the cause and theme of the comments MediaMatters focused on. None were made by mods, their own posts, or even upvoted (under 20 or so). Reddit used this to say the mods there were not removing extremist content, eventually forcing the sub allow only mods "approved" by Reddit Inc. They shuttered the sub before allowing this to happen.
The big joke to is that these anti-police messages were before the summer when it was non-stop ACAB, Kill The Police, etc, in practically every other sub-reddit as part of the riots and protests. Standards applied evenly, Reddit would be left with a knitting and a windsurfing section.
Reddit wanted the_donald gone, end of story. MediaMatters helped, and the reason was surface level deep, but they didn't need some iron clad reason. Interestingly, Reddit removed the "violence against police" reasoning, and replaced it with a more generic cause, as the hypocrisy was warming up.
I'm sure there is some law for the most ridiculous example you can think of off the cuff, someone will find has been true somewhere. :)
I never saw that back then, that subs would ban you for that, but recently I posted a negative comment to No New Normal. I was instantly banned from almost every popular reddit sub.
A couple of them sent me a think saying they might unban me if I promised never to post there again. It wasn't a supportive comment, I was mocking one of them. How insane is it that the people that admin and mod Reddit are so fragile that they literally ban anyone who talks to people they don't like?
This can't continue. I suppose I appreciate their acceleration.
For starters, the comments got considerably more explicit than "Send Bachelors". I'm unfamiliar with this specific event, but researching it, I see:
“none of this gets fixed without people picking up rifles” and
“[I have] no problems shooting a cop trying to strip rights from Citizens.”
Perhaps these are what you meant by the "theme", but those seem considerably more explicit, especially for a subreddit already linked to an event that resulted in someone being murdered.
>Reddit wanted the_donald gone
Then why didn't they get rid of them until a year later? The event you're referencing seems to be part of the quarantine, not part of the banning. The banning took place after the mods of the subreddit tried to evade the quarantine by moving to another sub and continued to support breaking Reddit rules.
> Then why didn't they get rid of them until a year later? The event you're referencing seems to be part of the quarantine, not part of the banning. The banning took place after the mods of the subreddit tried to evade the quarantine by moving to another sub and continued to support breaking Reddit rules.
Except that what actually happened was they had moved off Reddit, locked the sub down as an archive, and then finally banned when they refused to accept the Reddit provided mods.
They tried to move to a non-quarantined subreddit first, but yeah? We're not in disagreement on that.. The scenario you just described is very different than the one you were talking about a post ago, which is why I called it misleading. They weren't banned over the Media Matters story.
I just checked, and it looks like the website they moved to lasted only months, before the operator shut it down over concerns about racism, concerns from their host, and FBI inquiries. Painting it like it was just media matters picking up on one thing is far from the whole story. The place was septic.
I actually don't think that Reddit wanted T_D gone - the Subreddit had a massive amount of subscribes and generated activity all over the site. It surely was controversial, but in the end it probably helped Reddit more than it damaged it.
It just seems that Reddit has a policy of cutting subreddits loose once they get mainstream media attention, in order to avoid overly negative press. It happened to T_D, WatchPeopleDie and quite a few other Subreddits; basically all bans came after they went into the spotlight despite existing (in some case, peacefully) for years. To me it seems that Reddit is totally fine with hosting controversial opinions as long as it doesn't generate press.
All of the porn subreddits that still exist banned domains that serve "unverified" content. The amateur porn scene has been leveled, most of which was legitimate content. Also a lot less user submitted content simply because the hassle of verification and also you have to formally identify yourself at one point. Claims of Reddit hosting illegal content is hugely overblown.
Somehow they manage to get away with DMCA violations however. Lots of 'reaction' channels (where people watch along with a TV show or Youtube clip) now only post heavily truncated preview videos on Youtube. The full videos, which include the copyrighted content, sits on Patreon.
It's a dollar cap - process enough dollars per month or per year, and Visa/Mastercard takes notice (as mentioned by Vice). For all the furor, taking payment via crypto's not viable outside of specific niches. Or rather, OnlyFans did the X vs Y of kick x-rated content off the platform vs get kicked off Visa/Mastercard's "platform", and is going with option 1.
So basically this just begs for the owners to create two clearly differentiated brands: (1) the current one will probably die like Tumblr but they have some high-profile non-porn creators so I think they will keep going for a while, (2) the second one geared towards porn mainly and accepting alternative payment methods like Webmoney, Paysafecard and others. They can start accepting credit cards and Paypal initially to gain users, and when the pressure builds up, drop the banks and hope that the users are so attached to their content they'll use the alternative methods.
Patreon went one step further - if you post content against Patreon's rules anywhere else, even if you don't link to it, if Patreon finds out, they'll ask you to stop doing it, and threaten to suspend your account if you keep doing it.
This is why many people who post fetish-y art (even stuff like mind-control kink) moved from Patreon to SubscribeStar. Even erotic roleplay site F-List moved to SubscribeStar.
Patreon went one step further - if you post content against Patreon's rules anywhere else, even if you don't link to it, if Patreon finds out, they'll ask you to stop doing it, and threaten to suspend your account if you keep doing it.
That sounds outrageous. Is there a link to more info about this policy?
Not generally about the policy, but there is one famous instance I'm aware of: Sargon of Akkad. It was something to the effect of him calling the neo-Nazis the N-word on someone else's Youtube channel. To be clear, he used the slur AGAINST the neo-nazis. Then Patreon dumped him. Here's the first Google result I found about it, no guarantees of accuracy.
The only example I remember was a little less bad, but still pretty bad in my opinion - the artist in question uploaded contra-TOS artwork on his Twitter account, and had a link to his Twitter account from Patreon. However, Patreon's own terms of service state that they look where traffic is coming from to see what kind of things you're funding with the money, and can ban you on that alone:
>Because you are raising funds on Patreon, we may be held accountable for what you do with those funds, so we may also look at what you do with your membership off our platform. As a result when we talk about “On Patreon,” it means the creations you are funding on and through Patreon. When reviewing a page, we look at how creations are shared, where the page is linked to and where the traffic comes from. No matter what happens, we always give creators the opportunity to appeal a decision by contacting us and sending any relevant information they believe was not considered. We may not change our minds, but we will always listen.
Further, Patreon has communicated to artists that regardless of the age of a fictional character, certain art elements common to anime/manga style drawing (even of adults - "big head, big eyes, short height") may be considered as marking the artwork as a child - and even adding adult-like proportions such as large breasts may not be sufficient to evade Patreon's ban: https://twitter.com/Waero_Re/status/1238408555507539968
Another artist in the thread noted that Patreon decided their content was "violent" because their drawings featured people not smiling during orgasm.
There's clearly some sort of opportunity here for an Audius like decentralized application/protocol (with the UI figured out), or just applications on Urbit when that stack is ready enough.
Centralized services like this will always fail eventually. We need better models than our current megacorp/client stack and the incentives that creates for most services.
It's not so much the tech companies and payment processors that are making policy, but a reaction from them to changes in government policy that increases their exposure.
Why can't these websites simply find other banks to do business with?
I mean also overseas, for sure the extra costs (if any) are better than basically killing the golden goose.
The odds of Onlyfans becoming the huge phenomenon that it is were so slim, it seems like a waste of luck to just throw it all away because of banking problems.
Visa and Mastercard allow adult. They just force you to pay the "high-risk" category. Which is much higher fees. OF can't get away with only charging models 20% if credit card processing is taking more than half of that.
I suspect they are currently not classified as adult and the banks are saying, look, you are almost entirely adult so you have to pay us more.
I mean, yeah, that's one of the mechanisms. Charge you close to an order of magnitude more for being "high-risk", while also putting all the actual risk on you as well. Visa/MC are more than compensated for each chargeback with the additional fees the charge the vendor for each chargeback.
Why hasn't someone started a bank and/or payment processor without these puritanical moral qualms about adult content? Seems like the real golden goose, waiting to be had.
Call it "providing financial services to a neglected/stigmatized sector of the entertainment industry and bringing the benefits of official banking and regulations", then. Yes my first comment was probably worded with an inflammatory bent, but this does genuinely seem like an underserved sector.
Akin to the problems legal marijuana grows and dispensaries have with accessing banking services (though in that case due to federal regs), the stances of the entrenched industry leaders seem to bring more negatives than would come from providing the needed services.
I understand, but there's usually a good reason why the underserved sectors are the way they are. For the payments industry I would imagine this market is simply not large enough to allow for economies of scale, so the services can't be priced at a level where it can be sustainable.
It seems like an obvious area for crypto to stake a claim, but that doesn't appear to have happened.
> The company will prohibit users from posting any sexually explicit conduct, starting in October. Creators will still be allowed to post nude photos and videos, provided they’re consistent with OnlyFans’ policy, the company said Thursday.
This paragraph contradicts itself:
- The company will prohibit users from posting any sexually explicit
Versus
- Creators will still be allowed to post nude photos and videos
1,395 comments
[ 3.4 ms ] story [ 446 ms ] thread"The company will prohibit users from posting any sexually explicit conduct, starting in October. Creators will still be allowed to post nude photos and videos, provided they’re consistent with OnlyFans’ policy"
Edit: Apparently the same thing happened to them too. Thank you to the person who linked the other discussion below.
State-backed capitalism has its faults, but they usually try to move billions into a strategically important area that benefits a large enough section of the economy.
Now their in this weird uncanny valley of "adult content" combined with "no adult content". Seems hard to shake that image.
Lol. Watching a musician on OF and your friend looks over your shoulder.
It's going to be similar if people link to OnlyFans instead of Patreon (or Locals).
If someone linked me their OnlyFans, I would assume it’s porn.
How do they seriously expect people to use it when the brand is porn?
Now a lot of painters, musicians, YouTubers etc. have Patreon.
https://youtu.be/ji5qepCx-8s
https://onlyfans.com/reallinustechtips
Ended up being one of the top accounts on the platform for a while.
While we allow nudity and for creators to push the boundaries of art, we also have guidelines against funding pornography on patreon. In our community guidelines: We define pornographic material as real people engaging in sexual acts such as masturbation or sexual intercourse on camera.
Edit: an 18+ interstitial would just be one that asks if the person is 18+
Same as Twitter. It's awash in porn but you wouldn't really know it if you stuck to the default trends and searches.
> Creators will still be allowed to post nude photos and videos, provided they’re consistent with OnlyFans’ policy, the company said Thursday.
So I am guessing the distinction is nudes vs sex acts?
Their credibility is gone.
He puts the sketch in sketchy (porn click farms in the 90's, sued by Amazon and Microsoft working together for spamming emails by the millions in the early 2000's).
Even dead ones get it better. I took one look at it recently and saw lil peep on there. My first thought was wow they're really putting a dead rapper's meat out there like that? But nah, it's like unreleased music videos and shit. Gotta wonder who is milking that.
> That popularity also brought with it additional scrutiny, and OnlyFans is positioning itself more as a forum for musicians, fitness instructors and chefs than sex workers. While many of its most-popular creators post videos of themselves engaging in sexual behavior, several mainstream celebrities like Bella Thorne, Cardi B and Tyga have also set up accounts.
Not sure about the other celebs.
>Not quite accurate. Bella Thorne joined Onlyfans and promised "no clothes naked" content in exchange for her $200 subscription fee. She made millions of dollars but then only sent clothed and obscured pictures to her subscribers. After thousands of people demanded refunds, Onlyfans changed their policies to heavily limit how much subscribers could be charged for content, how much they could pay, and increased the creator payout wait time from one week to three weeks. This heavily damaged the incomes of thousands of people overnight.
A lot of OF creators only do nudes and nothing sexual.
I personally know models making 6 figures and they don't even do nudes on OF.
Want to buy something? Open a Coinbase or Gemini account, hook up ACH or wire transfers, wait a week for the deposit to be made, then send 'dollars' to this really long and complicated looking address. If you send it to the wrong address you are SOL.
Well... I guess ultimately you still need that thing between the credit card and the service eg. stripe... idk if the porn thing is like a blanket protection against CP or something?
To reach the masses you probably have to go with "know your customer" (KYC) requirements that are going to scare lots of people away when they have to upload photos of their passport and stuff like that to a website.
And governments and banks are going to impose the same restrictions somehow.
Unless they use a coin that is private, all transactions are going to be recorded in the blockchain and publicly viewable to everyone. Nobody wants their porn purchases to be public knowledge.
It will probably eventually get there but probably at least 5 years out.
I'm curious about that, I agree that you can trace transactions of a wallet, but can you figure out who a wallet belongs to?
Congress, for one. There's a history of bills that are meant to target trafficking scooping up consensual practices as well (see also the Mann Act, SESTA/FOSTA). I'm not sure how influential the threat of something like this was here, but it can't help:
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/human-trafficking-banking-bil...
"Ah shit, honey. Somebody must have stolen my card."
May people do have one (55%) as it sometimes comes with a payment package, but they are generally frowned upon as tech from the stone age and insecure.
For sex workers, there is ManyVids that will eat their lunch.
Only benefit out of this, maybe nsfw Reddit will be worth a visit again when most of the OF ~~spammers~~sellers have gone.
https://www.engadget.com/2017-10-27-patreon-adult-content-cr...
Much of the pressure came from payment processing partners and banks, much like is described in this article.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/vbqwwj/patreon-suspension-of...
It seems like for any crowdsourced funding platform there is a volume cap for NSFW content imposed by the need of those platforms to seek wider audiences and funding sources.
Reddit seems to have resisted whatever calls it must be getting to eliminate porn. So far at least. It will ban or quarantine some heretical ideas, but porn is still there.
Worth noting this scenario is even less similar than as you wrote it.
Not only can’t you pay content creators on Reddit, but the awards, are you paying Reddit for hosting the creator.
Reddit gets money, creator gets a png. It’s a really bad deal, and I’m not sure what kind of lunatic buys Reddit awards.
Not entirely. They purged all NSFW subreddits from the r/all and r/popular meta subreddits. They also go on a purging binge whenever a remotely taboo subreddit makes the news.
But they also spent years promoting racism, hate, dangerous conspiracy theories, a neo-nazi rally that resulted in murder, etc. It's hard to look at all of that and think it was just "kind of taboo".
Over time, the signal to noise was low. But occasionally there was a good point or funny meme.
I can't say for sure I saw any racism worse than anywhere else. I really don't like when people use whatever this is ((( ))) to talk about Jews, saw that a couple times on t_d, but I've definitely also seen it on /r/politics /r/atheism etc
It was actually for "violence against police". Hillary Clinton's MediaMatters group found a few comments and made an article on it, this was pushed as far as possible, presenting Reddit with enough cause to "quarantine" them.
The specific anti-police messages were about a congressional walkout in Oregon, and threats to use the police to bring them back for a quorum. A rep replied "Send bachelors". This was the cause and theme of the comments MediaMatters focused on. None were made by mods, their own posts, or even upvoted (under 20 or so). Reddit used this to say the mods there were not removing extremist content, eventually forcing the sub allow only mods "approved" by Reddit Inc. They shuttered the sub before allowing this to happen.
The big joke to is that these anti-police messages were before the summer when it was non-stop ACAB, Kill The Police, etc, in practically every other sub-reddit as part of the riots and protests. Standards applied evenly, Reddit would be left with a knitting and a windsurfing section.
Reddit wanted the_donald gone, end of story. MediaMatters helped, and the reason was surface level deep, but they didn't need some iron clad reason. Interestingly, Reddit removed the "violence against police" reasoning, and replaced it with a more generic cause, as the hypocrisy was warming up.
I researched this shortly after it happened.
I never saw that back then, that subs would ban you for that, but recently I posted a negative comment to No New Normal. I was instantly banned from almost every popular reddit sub.
A couple of them sent me a think saying they might unban me if I promised never to post there again. It wasn't a supportive comment, I was mocking one of them. How insane is it that the people that admin and mod Reddit are so fragile that they literally ban anyone who talks to people they don't like?
This can't continue. I suppose I appreciate their acceleration.
For starters, the comments got considerably more explicit than "Send Bachelors". I'm unfamiliar with this specific event, but researching it, I see:
“none of this gets fixed without people picking up rifles” and “[I have] no problems shooting a cop trying to strip rights from Citizens.”
Perhaps these are what you meant by the "theme", but those seem considerably more explicit, especially for a subreddit already linked to an event that resulted in someone being murdered.
>Reddit wanted the_donald gone
Then why didn't they get rid of them until a year later? The event you're referencing seems to be part of the quarantine, not part of the banning. The banning took place after the mods of the subreddit tried to evade the quarantine by moving to another sub and continued to support breaking Reddit rules.
Except that what actually happened was they had moved off Reddit, locked the sub down as an archive, and then finally banned when they refused to accept the Reddit provided mods.
I just checked, and it looks like the website they moved to lasted only months, before the operator shut it down over concerns about racism, concerns from their host, and FBI inquiries. Painting it like it was just media matters picking up on one thing is far from the whole story. The place was septic.
It just seems that Reddit has a policy of cutting subreddits loose once they get mainstream media attention, in order to avoid overly negative press. It happened to T_D, WatchPeopleDie and quite a few other Subreddits; basically all bans came after they went into the spotlight despite existing (in some case, peacefully) for years. To me it seems that Reddit is totally fine with hosting controversial opinions as long as it doesn't generate press.
All of the porn subreddits that still exist banned domains that serve "unverified" content. The amateur porn scene has been leveled, most of which was legitimate content. Also a lot less user submitted content simply because the hassle of verification and also you have to formally identify yourself at one point. Claims of Reddit hosting illegal content is hugely overblown.
This is why many people who post fetish-y art (even stuff like mind-control kink) moved from Patreon to SubscribeStar. Even erotic roleplay site F-List moved to SubscribeStar.
That sounds outrageous. Is there a link to more info about this policy?
https://heavy.com/news/2018/12/patreon-sargon-of-akkad-jorda...
>Because you are raising funds on Patreon, we may be held accountable for what you do with those funds, so we may also look at what you do with your membership off our platform. As a result when we talk about “On Patreon,” it means the creations you are funding on and through Patreon. When reviewing a page, we look at how creations are shared, where the page is linked to and where the traffic comes from. No matter what happens, we always give creators the opportunity to appeal a decision by contacting us and sending any relevant information they believe was not considered. We may not change our minds, but we will always listen.
From: https://www.patreon.com/en-GB/policy/guidelines
This means that you only need to link to your Patreon, not even link from your Patreon for them to find you objectionabe.
About NSFW creators leaving the platform because of tighter content restrictions on fiction:
https://www.dailydot.com/irl/patreon-hypnosis-porn-ban-sexua...
https://thenextweb.com/news/patreon-continues-to-crack-down-...
Further, Patreon has communicated to artists that regardless of the age of a fictional character, certain art elements common to anime/manga style drawing (even of adults - "big head, big eyes, short height") may be considered as marking the artwork as a child - and even adding adult-like proportions such as large breasts may not be sufficient to evade Patreon's ban: https://twitter.com/Waero_Re/status/1238408555507539968
Another artist in the thread noted that Patreon decided their content was "violent" because their drawings featured people not smiling during orgasm.
Wow.
That is not good. Any hypothetical employer could justify any hypothetical abuse using that rationale.
Centralized services like this will always fail eventually. We need better models than our current megacorp/client stack and the incentives that creates for most services.
In this case though it may be a factor of liability changes on high risk content: https://www.wired.com/story/how-a-controversial-new-sex-traf...
It's not so much the tech companies and payment processors that are making policy, but a reaction from them to changes in government policy that increases their exposure.
I mean also overseas, for sure the extra costs (if any) are better than basically killing the golden goose.
The odds of Onlyfans becoming the huge phenomenon that it is were so slim, it seems like a waste of luck to just throw it all away because of banking problems.
Besides PR in the age of revenge porn, what's the technical or legal element which changed compared to 2019?
Can't be social because if anything society is in love with porn.
For some reason payment processors have always viewed themselves as morality police.
I suspect they are currently not classified as adult and the banks are saying, look, you are almost entirely adult so you have to pay us more.
Akin to the problems legal marijuana grows and dispensaries have with accessing banking services (though in that case due to federal regs), the stances of the entrenched industry leaders seem to bring more negatives than would come from providing the needed services.
It seems like an obvious area for crypto to stake a claim, but that doesn't appear to have happened.
This paragraph contradicts itself:
- The company will prohibit users from posting any sexually explicit
Versus
- Creators will still be allowed to post nude photos and videos
What is this article trying to say?
Based on the Indie Hackers interview with two active Only Fans content makers, it also sounds like their app is kinda shitty and slow.
Seems like they're opening the door wide open to a new competitor.
(not a judgment on what they do but the reality of the situation)