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Ask HN: What to do if your FAANG is levelling you according to your nationality?

7 points by baileys-lvl ↗ HN
I applied internally to another team (for a 1-level bump and $20K extra comp) and got the job, but HR shot me down and wanted me to move across at the same level, no changes in comp.

When pressed, the other manager (who talked to my manager, with both being supportive) let leak that HR did not want to raise my level any further due to my location in Europe.

I have been here for four years and got steady raises and level increases throughout (ranked in top 3 performers for a team of 25).

Am overall royally frustrated by this, since it likely means it's implicitly the end of my career track.

I vested yesterday, so am considering leaving for a smaller company and saving myself the aggravation altogether.

What would you do?

(EDIT: I have been intentionally vague in some parts, but I am an EU citizen, currently fully remote, working for a US company on international projects. I also have a rare set of skills that I cannot go into, but which my new team values highly).

25 comments

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jstx1
It's not exactly clear from the way you've written it - are you a citizen of a European country who currently lives and works in the US?
baileys-lvl
No. Just edited to clarify that.
jstx1
You need to clarify it a bit more. You're getting paid in dollars, you aren't in the US and you're using the terms location and nationality interchangeably.

A company taking location into account is very different from treating you differently based on your nationality.

baileys-lvl
I cannot be more specific otherwise my identity would be obvious. The EU is not a unified job market, and the equivalent of those $20K is a massive improvement for me.
[deleted]
(comment deleted)
jstx1
You should have titled the post "I work remotely from Eastern Europe, FAANG are paying me a US salary but they aren't giving me a raise. What should I do?".
cosmodisk
Not just Eastern Europe. The salaries are much lower in the UK, Germany,etc. which means anyone on this side of the pond working for the same company could end in a situation like this.
quantumofalpha
> the equivalent of those $20K is a massive improvement for me

$20k raise is peanuts in US tech. If you're in it to chase the greenback, suck it up, transfer to US on L1 asap, get green card in 2-3y, get $100-200k raise on your first job hop after it.

benjaminjosephw
Are they allowed to do that? It suggests a strong stance that the market rates of engineers is location specific not skill/capability specific. If you're part of a company that is built on a meritocratic culture, you should absolutely challenge this. You might even consider seeking legal advice.

Paying people living in one place more than people living in another place for the same work is a slippery slope that harms the interests of workers when it becomes acceptable practice across the industry. Maybe resisting the absurdity here could be your act of solidarity with those who are in the same position but without the freedom to speak out about it.

bloak
It's perfectly normal for salaries to depend on location, even within one country, and even within quite a small country like the UK. So the problem here is the "level", the seniority/role/title/whatever, not the salary.

In general I do rather have the impression that the best way to have a "career" is to change employer every few years. I'd say, go for it.

jbn
"Paying people living in one place more than people living in another place for the same work" <-- is this not what companies all do, they use COLA adjustment to pay 2 different wages in 2 different places.

Note also that take-home pay might be very different due to employer costs (If you pay some one X, and it costs X+D in one place, in a different country/place, maybe for the same cost, the take home pay might very well be X/2 just because the "D" part inflates due to local regulation...).

Not saying this is a good thing, just pointing out it is already happening (i.e. it's slipped all the way down already!).

znpy
> they use COLA adjustment to pay 2 different wages in 2 different places

Except they then make the same profit in both markets.

Take for example the cloud market: VM pricing is mostly the same in the us or Europe or Asia. Same for non-vm prices.

isbvhodnvemrwvn
Why would that matter, it doesn't give a candidate any leg-up in the negotiations.
cercatrova
So what? Prices for labor are based on supply and demand, not the potential profit of services in each market.
znpy
If you're actually such a strong performance be ready to leave due to this.

Apply to another company, and let your manager and HR know that you are ready to leave if you aren't treated well.

bjourne
Are you a member of a union?
baileys-lvl
No. I am not a US citizen and there is no such notion for EU tech workers.
siva7
There is only one reasonable thing you can do if you're not satisfied how they compensate you and you got good credentials - leave (after you signed a new contract). Everything else turns likely into a headache.
matt_s
Exercise your options, find an employer that values your rare set of skills and leave.

Sounds like you have a good relationship with your manager so they would probably be a good reference. If making FAANG money in EU means you have golden handcuffs (e.g. local market is much lower paid) then you might be searching for a while.

quantumofalpha
Sounds normal. I had experience with Google - they would categorically refuse to uplevel on transfers (except maybe across ladders e.g. PM<->SWE) and reneg on pay (mostly 'cause you have zero leverage in this position). They have paybands per location/level to stick to, most other tech companies too. Exceptions possible but you'd have to make your case reach someone VP level who has the power to override the prevailing policy. Low level managers don't.

> What to do if your FAANG is levelling you according to your nationality?

Your nationality has absolutely nothing to do with it. If you're not happy with your level, earn a promo or leave for some other company willing to uplevel you on hire.

romanhn
Not sure which FAANG this is, but when I was at FB, uplevels on transfers were not a thing, regardless of manager promises. Downlevels were, if you were switching functions.
toast0
This was my understanding at FB as well. Same while at Yahoo.

Transfers were expected to be for same pay etc (caveat any regional adjustment), and maybe something would happen at the next review. Different groups competing for the same external hire weren't supposed to offer different pay either, from what I heard.

relaunched
That's odd. I've only ever been a part of companies where HR made a recommendation, but the decision was on the hiring team's management.

While I do like the recommendation to get an external offer, there might not be time for that. Another option is to refuse the internal offer and stay with your current team. Honestly, hiring is hard. If the manager has to go back to the well and either restart the interview process or hire his not preferred alternative, that might motivate them to knock something loose.

Good luck.

Sevii
As far as I know Amazon doesn't do uplevels on team transfers either. You don't get to skip the promotion process.