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Ask HN: What is your recommended path for getting into freelancing?

15 points by khaled_ismaeel ↗ HN
tldr: what is your best advice for a competitive programmer wanting to start freelancing (possibly taking it as a full time job even)?

I am a computer science student with a long history of programming and mathematics competitions. I believe I am proficient enough for real life projects and I would like to try my luck with freelancing (I also fancy the freelancing lifestyle, being free and all).

A quick search on Google lead me to platforms such as upwork, freelancer, fiverr, and others. They seem to be too full of spam, however (students asking for homework and tests and similar). I had the feeling that toptal could provide a more serious atmosphere, but my application was refused because I had less than two years of experience.

It seems to me that the freelancing platforms are very hard to penetrate for a student with no work experience. What advice can you give for a person in my situation?

Thanks everyone

9 comments

[ 1.8 ms ] story [ 28.4 ms ] thread
mooreds
I wrote a comment up here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29300115

tl;dr: when freelancing, you need to find ways to do 3 things:

   * find the work
   * do the work
   * get paid for the work
Usually the middle one is the easiest/most fun.

Easiest way to find the work is to work with folks you've worked with before, and build a business based on referral.

tkgally
> Easiest way to find the work is to work with folks you've worked with before, and build a business based on referral.

I agree. I worked as a freelance translator for nearly twenty years, from 1986 to 2005, and almost all of my work came from people I knew personally or from people previous clients had referred to me.

Are there are programs at your university that need programming help? Do you know anyone who runs their own company and might need computer assistance? The first jobs you get might not be the most interesting or pay the best, but they will provide the practical experience you will need to get better work later.

Another possibility is to try to find an experienced freelancer who is willing to serve as a mentor. That person might farm out some work to you while also offering advice on getting and keeping clients, deciding how much to charge, dealing with taxes and insurance, etc.

I left freelancing before those online freelancing platforms had much of a presence, but I have since hired freelancers a few times through Fiverr. While I was satisfied with the work they did for me, the price competition among the people who bid for my jobs was absolutely cutthroat, and I felt sorry for anyone trying to break into freelancing through those platforms. Unless you are living in a country with both a very low cost of living and good Internet access, I would avoid trying to find work through those platforms if you can and instead try to build a client base through personal connections.

chrisrickard
If you're proficient in building and delivering projects, that's a great start, but unfortunately (and sometimes surprisingly) not the most important thing. I would say at this point it's sales.

Personally I would build a marketing website showing off your skills, talking about why your the right person for the job, and ideally, some examples of what you have done (these don't need to be live/online, can just be case studies with some description on the problem, your solution, the tech, how it helped the customer etc). A random example I just googled: https://www.fromthemountain.co.za.

But at this stage don't overthink it. Just get something up, something you can link to and point people towards.

Finding projects (sales) will be the hardest thing. Personally I would recommend steering clear of freelancer/upwork/blahblah, as it's all a race to the bottom. Maybe its good to get started, but generally I would first look towards your own circle of contacts.

I started as a freelancer 10 years ago, then levelled that up into a custom software agency, and last year sold to a larger company. I'm (slowly) writing my experiences over at devtoagency.com - whilst they are written more towards a freelancer who wants to start an agency, perhaps some posts would be useful to you, e.g. this one about asking friends and family for referrals https://www.devtoagency.com/referrals-from-friends-and-famil...

Good luck. Going out on my own was the best thing I ever did.

khaled_ismaeel
Very nice blog you got over there. Your post on referrals was particularly interesting. I come from Syria and over there (possibly due to poor internet infrastructure) personal referrals are a must-have for everything. After I traveled to Russia I was kind of overwhelmed by how none-personal everything turned out to be (stores, jobs, etc). I had the feeling that I had to let go of my previous "human interaction above all" paradigm in life, but I see that you definitely didn't and it served you great.
stevenicr
Would love to see folks add things like where to get free/affordable:

contracts billing software legal advice

I know there's been some goodies posting mainly a couple/few years ago - so maybe those are still the way to go, don't know. Thinking about getting back into this again myself.

stevenicr
my expected formatting failed above, should of been more like:

1 contracts.

2. billing software (or/and time tracking?).

3. legal advice cheaper

I did some algolia-foo for about 20 minutes and lots of non-relevant to sort through.. however I found a couple of old posts (2009 and 2013) that have the linked-contracts just 404s now.

even this more recent one that has a good discussion / things to consider with contracts in the thread ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18911317 ) has the domain in the main is blocked by my AV soft.. however the github with it is still surf-able ( https://github.com/jackmorgan/the-plain-contract/ )

Would love new discussions on these things.

I vaguely recall some techcrunch? writeups long ago about some get quick legal advice app / call for like $29 per call or hour or something? Is there anything like this still happening?

guard0g
Get a full time job, make friends and treat everyone with respect, work hard and do a kickass job in something essential for the company (that other companies also need), then quit and offer to consult for them. They’re your first client, which builds credibility (and eliminates suspicion you left on less than optimal circumstances). Write a blog and/or volunteer in the local tech community, and you’ll be surprised how many referrals you can get. Also, other ex-employees of the company can be wonderful referrals. Good luck.
jameshush
I was going to write the same thing. The key is to be a good person and do excellent work consistently.

It sounds simple, but not many people actually do it.

[dead] digital2568
Step 1: Get The Right Equipment. Step 2: Find A Skill In which You Are Interested. Step 3: Polish Up Your Skills. Step 4: Build Your Reputation. Step 5: Create A Portfolio. Step 6: Try Freelancing Part-Time. Step 7: Choose The Best Freelance Marketplace. Step 8: Charge The Right Price.