Sitting itself is not such an issue. The intermediate (hidden) variable is sloth. Take breaks, every hour, and move during those breaks. If you have a tablet or a notebook, use it to read your email/HN standing up. etc.
I love my ergotron work fit which is basically an attachment that clamps on any desk and lets you raise and lower the keyboard, mouse, and screen ($250-400 look at all models and find deals online). I find myself standing for about half the day. I've read that the opposite extreme, standing all day, has its own health concerns.
Saying correlation is not causation without adding anything else amounts to nothing, it's just a phrase.
From HN user apl, because he said it better than I could:
This certainly is a true and tested adage, but I've got a feeling that the correlation-backlash has gone too far in the other direction. Don't just repeat it without getting it. If substantiated through proposal of a suitable mechanism, correlation is solid corroboration of a causality-claim.
More precisely, correlation most definitely never implies absence of causation.
One possibly relevant consideration: people who are elderly and/or infirm often have to sit around a lot more, because they are physically incapable of moving around as much. This may (or may not) account for some of the increased likelihood of death and other negative health effects.
Another possibly relevant consideration: having an active job means moving around and doing something. Switching from sitting at a desk for hours to standing at a desk for hours may prove to be no more beneficial, because the critical component may be the moving around part.
Not trying to be a parade rainer, but I'm always cautious about supposed breakthrough health trends, because there are many complicated interacting factors that make up someone's overall lifestyle and health factors. In the past, isolating a single factor (oat bran!) has rarely proved to be a panacea.
Every data point used in this infographic shows correlation between sitting all day and poor health. I'm tired of seeing this argument repeated without any attempt to analyze the causes - this infographic is just as meaningless as my original pithy remark. It's just a way to take advantage of trends (standing desks) to get web traffic.
Please don't use this quote as a way to shut down discussions. If you're genuinely ignorant about how causality and correlation interact, go learn about it. (Judea Pearl's Causality is pretty good.)
But that is all this infographic consists of--- some correlations presented as if they were causal proof, with no actual analysis of whether that's the case. It has claims like "SITTING MAKES US FAT", with no support besides a correlation (and not even a particularly strong or well-controlled correlation).
"Sitting makes you 40% likelier to die within 15 years than someone who sits less than 3"
Same idea with the quote on heart disease - sure, but what was the base percentage of dying within 15 years that they based the 40% off of? If that's at all high, then I'd be worried.
I'm still all for quick breaks of exercise to refresh the mind, though.
I bought a desk-sized Lack table from Ikea, and took it to Home Depot to saw the legs down, so that it added around 12" to my standard desk. Now I can stand while working. Assuming you have an external monitor / keyboard / mouse, the only thing left is to put your monitor on some books to get it closer to eye level. I find this is ergonomically very comfortable if the desk & monitor are both at optimal heights.
I printed out this infographic and taped it to my office door shortly after switching to a standing desk. Two of my coworkers have subsequently switched as well, and several more are interested.
I didn't want to spend a bunch of money on a standing desk, so I built a platform to sit on top of my current desk from materials from Home Depot. It uses pre-finished shelving and PVC pipe, and doesn't require any tools besides a drill and hack saw. Costs about $45 in materials and an hour or os in labor. Photo: http://cl.ly/1h282P2Q2N2a0i0a3u0K
I built a second version of this with deck railing legs and metal connectors (got access to a miter box so I could use wood instead of PVC). This also costs $45 in materials, about 2 hours in labor, and is much more sturdy. Photo: http://cl.ly/1J263Z3l223o0o1A1X0t
I've been meaning to write up some instructions and a materials list, but haven't had time yet. In the meantime, if anyone wants more info about how to build these, I'd be happy to help -- contact me on twitter or shortmail at @masnick.
I read an article back in the day that stated people who fidget when they sit burn significantly more calories. Forgot where I read it, though. Maybe I'm just making excuses for myself...haha.
Guys, just so you know, this is an infographic created for SEO purposes alone.
Nothing wrong with infographics per se, but take a good look at the site it is hosted on: http://www.medicalbillingandcoding.org See that? Online degree affiliate site of little value to the world.
Please consider where the content is hosted on before blindly upvoting it like they do on reddit. Affiliate marketers routinely game social news sites through this trick. Don't let it happen on Hacker News.
No, because I'm not questioning the value of the content due to the person or site that included it. I'm questioning the motivations behind the submission, and arguing whether we should support or oppose to such efforts in this community.
I don't believe standing still while working is the best alternative. I think it's better to get up and move every half hour, even for just a 30 second break. Drinking lots of water to encourage restroom breaks is a good way to make it a habit. Also, choose exercises daily that have a variety of movements and avoid too much repetition.
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[ 3.3 ms ] story [ 83.0 ms ] threadI'd like to give standing up a try - is there a cheap solution that is beyond "3 boxes on the table"?
Sitting itself is not such an issue. The intermediate (hidden) variable is sloth. Take breaks, every hour, and move during those breaks. If you have a tablet or a notebook, use it to read your email/HN standing up. etc.
All three levels are adjustable.
(even if you are not strong enough to do pullups, you can hang or do "negative" pullups)
From HN user apl, because he said it better than I could:
This certainly is a true and tested adage, but I've got a feeling that the correlation-backlash has gone too far in the other direction. Don't just repeat it without getting it. If substantiated through proposal of a suitable mechanism, correlation is solid corroboration of a causality-claim. More precisely, correlation most definitely never implies absence of causation.
Another possibly relevant consideration: having an active job means moving around and doing something. Switching from sitting at a desk for hours to standing at a desk for hours may prove to be no more beneficial, because the critical component may be the moving around part.
Not trying to be a parade rainer, but I'm always cautious about supposed breakthrough health trends, because there are many complicated interacting factors that make up someone's overall lifestyle and health factors. In the past, isolating a single factor (oat bran!) has rarely proved to be a panacea.
Same idea with the quote on heart disease - sure, but what was the base percentage of dying within 15 years that they based the 40% off of? If that's at all high, then I'd be worried.
I'm still all for quick breaks of exercise to refresh the mind, though.
Total cost: $40.
I didn't want to spend a bunch of money on a standing desk, so I built a platform to sit on top of my current desk from materials from Home Depot. It uses pre-finished shelving and PVC pipe, and doesn't require any tools besides a drill and hack saw. Costs about $45 in materials and an hour or os in labor. Photo: http://cl.ly/1h282P2Q2N2a0i0a3u0K
I built a second version of this with deck railing legs and metal connectors (got access to a miter box so I could use wood instead of PVC). This also costs $45 in materials, about 2 hours in labor, and is much more sturdy. Photo: http://cl.ly/1J263Z3l223o0o1A1X0t
I've been meaning to write up some instructions and a materials list, but haven't had time yet. In the meantime, if anyone wants more info about how to build these, I'd be happy to help -- contact me on twitter or shortmail at @masnick.
Nothing wrong with infographics per se, but take a good look at the site it is hosted on: http://www.medicalbillingandcoding.org See that? Online degree affiliate site of little value to the world.
Please consider where the content is hosted on before blindly upvoting it like they do on reddit. Affiliate marketers routinely game social news sites through this trick. Don't let it happen on Hacker News.
Flagged.