Tell HN: You are not alone this Christmas
Hi, my Christmas is solitary this year, no family or friends. I'm not even having a Christmas dinner. I'm not sad about this, though. It's just the way it is. What I wanted to say is, if you are in the same situation, you are not alone. So have a virtual hug from me.
325 comments
[ 1.8 ms ] story [ 292 ms ] threadhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEaKX9YYHiQ
My family is having a quarantine Christmas. We’ll be done on Monday.
(I'll shamelessly plug these open-source world parties https://opensimworld.com/?sub=events )
Have a virtual hug from me. Love you all
Feeling that I'm not only alone but inadequate to have a life like anybody else.
I'm still alive, so there's that.
Going through tough times sucks, but it's extremely helpful to keep in mind that it will eventually pass.
Stay strong.
In 2022 I'll study to become a programmer.
Focus on algorithms, data structures, and try to learn math (I'm very math illiterate, I don't know anything beyond basic arithmetic).
So at least by this time next year I'll have more knowledge.
But I'm open to any advice.
I went BASIC -> C++ -> Java -> Python (some years ago) while learning programming. Learning memory management fundamentals in an unmanaged language felt enormously helpful in recognizing the bigger picture in later managed languages.
... But! It wasn't required.
Advice: Know what language(s) your target job market (there's a lot of programming) uses, and spend more time / practice on those. Most hiring folks don't know enough to evaluate language knowledge from a theoretically similar perspective.
So I would explore and see how far you can get in math before investing to heavily into a specific language. If you want to learn one that’s useful in many domains and is easy to learn while focusing your studies on math my suggestion is Python.
Now if you're in to mastering complexity, C++ can be a great choice, as there are a ton of complex things to learn, but I would take a look at job postings where you think you might want to end up to see if it is actually required. It is very unsexy to talk about on HN, but for pure employability, Java (and other JVM-based languages) are probably the best in most areas. There are tons of remote jobs, and pretty much in any city, plus you can branch out into other JVM-based languages (e.g. Scala!) once you feel so inclined and still incorporate that at work. C# and F# have a similar "progression" and are now completely open source too!
Good luck, whether or not you end up choosing C++!
I agree with other comments that linear algebra has limited relevance to learning programming. Your experience with Emacs gives you a far bigger leg up than mastering linear algebra would.
Problems you solve with programming may or may not require math: the math requirements come from the specific problems.
Every time I've used heavy math in programming, I've figured out the math for the problem in isolation, then programmed that solution.
Strictly that is incorrect, but I get what you mean and agree with the point you’re communicating. I suspect it’s largely due to the rather dysfunctional way mathematics is taught in America.
Writing C for example requires knowledge of order of operations, inequalities, boolean arithmetic, and something very much like mathematical induction if you want your loops to terminate. Most programmers with the math optional mindset just don’t think of all the math they’re doing as math. For me the realization was empowering since once I realized I really was using a lot of math it inspired me to start filling gaps in my knowledge.
Edit: This looks interesting: https://pimbook.org/
To a first approximation, this is a substantially more limited set of concepts than even low-grade math.
Iterating counters and loops is the most "general" math I've used on most problems, and for...each or equivalent auto-bounding functions over sized collections removes that.
Can you write a 3D engine without math? No. Can you write a DB engine without math? No. Can you write a general web app without math? Probably.
Point being: if your goal is to put food on the table by programming, a 2-year study plan worth of advanced math is better invested learning elsewhere.
Most linear algebra courses and textbooks do. Without a lot of background, you'll run into a hard brick well.
A few good starting points
- Project Algebra's Road Coloring curriculum
- 3B1B (on Youtube) has a series on the geometry of linear algebra. You should have the mechanics of adding/multiplying matrices, but not much more
- Game theory is a nice place to explore early
Linear algebra is a many, many year progression. It's quite deep and interesting. But you don't need to start with singular value decompositions and whatnot. Start with those sorts of things, and then apply it in different domains:
- 3D graphics
- Image processing
- Control theory
- Quantum computing
- Data analysis
... and whatever else suits your interests.
After a decade or so, if rather fascinating deep dives, you'll have a deep understanding not just of linear algebra but of some rather interesting domains.
Just sayin', if someone is truly not a math person, saying "oh yeah, learn math and then learn graphics programming" is probably just going to discourage them.
ML is supposedly all about math. And sure, I could walk you through a backprop pipeline at this point. But it took me years before that was useful knowledge to me. The practical experience of doing it was way more interesting, and it lead to more knowledge than I would've gotten with a traditional path.
I was mostly math illiterate too. Geometry was my strong suit, not manipulating symbols. Still want to learn PDEs someday just for fun, mostly because I have no idea how to model anything as a PDE.
But I would never try to learn PDEs to make money, because it would put me under a lot of pressure, since I wouldn't be doing it just for the knowledge. Just make sure you're having fun as you're questing your way towards programming. It's key.
I already use Emacs for everything since 2003, so...
Believe it or not, you managed to hit on the most lucrative long-term strategy, too. That's exactly the mindset that the best programmers have. If you like it, then a job is pretty much a matter of time.
Best of luck, friend. Take care of yourself, and prioritize yourself. You're worth it.
I'm always curious what non-IT folks that use some rather IT-specific tools do (not that Emacs is just for coding like gcc, but it's pretty rare to see it jump over the wall).
Good on you, man, and honestly, I should be the last to take advice from, but you might benefit from a serious skills check-in to see what your real deck of cards is. Sit down and do it with someone who likes you and wants you to succeed, because it seems like you might not be in a state to evaluate yourself favorably. You might discover that you’re sitting at the top and selling yourself into the bottom. I did this, and it was disastrous for my career. There’s probably an upward step you’re not seeing.
* https://youtu.be/UMXs9i201AQ
You'll definitely be great at software engineering, as the intuition to dive deep into the bowels of these archaic ways of using a computer seems to come naturally! (especially compared to my attorney friends, who basically just use the browser, Outlook, and Word, and probably think a "command line" is some sort of military jargon)
Some people have recommended Kahn Academy. https://www.khanacademy.org/
Don’t be afraid to use a calculator when things get complex. Calculators are not cheating. But try to do as much in your head and on paper as you can. It helps to learn why things work.
You will get frustrated. Be patient and walk away for a bit when you need to. :)
As a kid, I used to complain often and loudly that I would never need any of this stuff. Turns out I was wrong.
You can turn around your life. I did so in my 30s. I am only saying this because there's a high chance you are an old fart since you know and like kraftwerk.
As you have correctly guessed, it's not too late.
I like to remind myself of the encouraging phrase "We overestimate what we can can accomplish in a year, and under estimate what we can accomplish in five". Compounding gains is the game and humans always seem to underestimate their power
In game programming you would need linear algebra, but you can go a long way with just vectors, cross products, and dot products.
I happen to like hearing about your life, so please feel free to DM me any time. https://twitter.com/theshawwn
Happy to just listen. No advice.
I will mention that I suspect many people going through this won't be comfortable with Twitter as the means of communications....
At least according to me you definitely are not inadequate :)
What OP brought up is what I think about the most: that I am too inadequate to just have a normal life. Just going to work is a little painful since I have to (over)hear everyone else talking about their normal lives.
I'm also going through a breakup right now, albeit from a shorter relationship. I was happy to spend Christmas with my sister to have some illusion of a functional family, it was nice. It feels unbearable at times but I try to find solace in the fact the world is so vast and full of opportunity and so much more than what you're (I am) able to see in the current moment. Your plan to study to become a programmer sounds great and you'll be in a much different place in a year than you are now. Hope you can pull through until then.
I also had a dark period some years back. Such things can sure mess with your ego and make you feel like a loser.
On the other hand, when you hit rock bottom, there is not much left to lose. You can start building up your life again the way you want.
Merry Christmas, bro/sis.
Hang in there. I think the past two years have been rough for many, so you aren't alone in the struggles. If you haven't already gotten diet and exercise to a good point then that can also be good for helping both the body and the mind.
Additionally, I'm always up for a chat, if anyone ever needs someone to reach out to.
Programming is a great distractions, as others have pointed out. Make sure you don't use it to completely displace the pain you're feeling. You need to spend some time with it as well, that's how we humans deal with an it. Alternating between moments of distraction and periods of "dealing" is a good middle way, I think.
You're a great human being, never forget that.
You're not alone in that experience. Which isn't information that has helped me at all. Except that I at least believe that others have been here and scrambled blindly and made it somehow too, so why not us?
Walk. Outdoors. In the greenest place you can find.
No, it won’t change anything that you’ve been through, but it really will help you to quiet everything for a small chunk of time to let your mind get a rest from it.
Please don’t ever think you’re inadequate. No-one, not even you, as any idea what might be waiting in your future :-)
Thanks for the help and kind words.
An audio book at that time, however, is a great solution. Audio books, for me, can't occupy my entire mind. I can't sit and listen to an audio book. At the same time, they occupy enough of my mind that I can't do other mentally intense things and pay attention to the book at the same time. I had used them for driving, yard work, and other boring tasks to quiet the noise in my head and the feeling of boredom[0] that the task occupies.
When walking with a good audio book, I can observe the world without the noise of my circumstances and it really is a peaceful exercise.
[0] For me, boredom drives depression.
Although the reality is the mind is anything but idle for those predisposed to depression. The rumination, negative thought patterns and self-critical thoughts are worse than a prison sentence of solitary confinement.
For those who may not understand this, imagine standing over a 5 year old constantly berating them, in a horrifically negative way, for every action they take, good or bad. Now imagine the effects of that over years or decades.
Then my allergies will flair up and I'll have a miserable 1-2 days of recovery and be hating life. No thanks
You’re just as worthy of life on this earth as anything else. Hang in there!
However, there are a few things that helped me get through the dark times, I am writing them below in the hopes that you may find them useful:
1. Exercise, this is absolutely critical. If you have never done it, it's ok, Julian has a great guide to get started: https://www.julian.com/guide/muscle/intro but there are also lots of guides online.
2. Nutrition is another one, stay away from junk food. Your brain will try to find comfort in high calorie / sugary foods, don't let it win. Eat vegetables and proteins instead.
3. Sleep is a tough one, but also important. Do whatever you need to sleep (exercising will help a lot). Your brain will keep you up at night, learn to recognize this pattern and avoid it when you can.
4. Make a plan. Grab a blank sheet of paper and think of one goal you would like to accomplish, then make the task into smaller sub tasks and from there derive a schedule for achieving it. This will help you stay productive and improve your state of mind.
5. Research. This oddly helped me a lot, I started researching psychology, relationships, listened to "dating" advice (I know.. some speakers were good, some were trash but I enjoyed them nonetheless), TED talks, books, etc.
6. Join communities. If you're an introvert like I am, this is difficult at first but you can start slow. I did this slowly, made a few friends online, then worked up the courage to join discord, then started messaging some of my old friends on Facebook, then had some phone calls and eventually met people face to face (whenever COVID restrictions would allow of course)
7. Don't reach out to your ex, when she/he calls you (and they will) don't respond, avoid contact with their families, don't read old messages, delete their picture, etc Trust me, you have been shot with high caliber rounds right now, you need to heal and they will only get in the way of it.
You can do it, too, and the effect on mood is spectacular. In fact the effect on mood comes way before a half-marathon. So don’t get overwhelmed and think you have to do that much.
I'm not a fan of self help books in general but Atomic Habits really changed my mindset for good.
If it's a good idea ... start now!
* One each of push-up, sit-up, burpee, star jump, squat, and run up and down the stairs;
* Every week, increase by 1.
Running groups seem intimidating to everyone - even reasonably fast amateur runners. Once you go however you will find you will meet lots of interesting people all working to stay healthy or challenge their own personal goals. It's absolutely not a competitive environment.
Even still, maybe I’ll give it a try. Thanks for the tip.
I would never get up so early if it weren't for these groups.
Other than these running groups I actually don't have a friend group where I live. It's nice to consistently see a mix of regular and new people and do something healthy (except for your knees perhaps) together.
By the way I really like wearing Hoka One One shoes for their extra cushioning. Definitely helps with pavement.
If you are bored of pavement, at least where I live there are many trail running groups too. I just don't like having to drive far to start running.
Anyway, again: thank you very much. This is very appreciated. Very kind of you.
I have found this book (https://tinyurl.com/4k27x6s9) to be a wonderful resource. I know there are many more to recommend, but I would start with the basics.
*EDIT - spelling.
My point is that what you're going through will pass. It does take work; so keep up doing the things you know must be done to move your life ahead. You have received lots of good advice in this thread; I don't need to say more (except one thing I will add at the end). Do what you need to do, and this period will be over, and life will be good.
My one piece of advice is that I've found meditation is very helpful. It enables me to let go of negative thinking that arises from painful times decades ago, when those thoughts do arise. It's a very important part of my life now.
The vulnerability, honesty, and goodwill in threads like this always warms my heart and bolsters my faith in humanity. I'll offer my own contribution. I wrote a deeply personal book called "Eating Glass" about navigating these seasons when everything seems to fall apart. I mention it from time to time on HN when I think it could be helpful, but today I'll just post the entire book for free: https://s3.us-west-1.amazonaws.com/com.markdjacobsen/Eating+.... My passion is just to help others walking similar journeys. Consider it a resource if it's helpful.
I wish you well on your own journey, and everyone else going through similar experiences.
Why? because even if your decision was mistaken, it was the best decision you could have made at that time.
Another way to look at things is that you've just gained a tremendous amount of agency. You're no longer required to perform these roles. There are surely dreams or opportunities out there which you wanted to pursue but were never able to. Take whatever amount of time you feel is appropriate to grieve, it's very normal to experience distress in the face of radical change. Then pursue them. There won't be many times in your life when you're presented with a clean slate like this.
You're still alive, but you probably don't feel like you're living. Maybe life is becoming a bit like getting from one difficult thing to the next. And those "things" aren't anything that is normally difficult, but feels overwhelming. I've both been there recently and have been there, in the past. It's tough and my heart goes out to you.
Most advice is bad so here comes mine: get from one thing to the next for a little while. Take the time. You need it. And understand one thing: you're not special[0]. Whatever mistakes you're beating yourself up over many, many others have made and experienced the same or worse circumstances. The very vast majority overcome those mistakes, and many do it without medication, doctors or other treatment[1].
And then there's "later" -- whatever that is: During a divorce group meeting a gentleman said something that greatly affected my life: Whether its winning the lottery or becoming a quadriplegic, the happiness of both individuals looks pretty similar a year later. Neither have ever happened to me, but in my own life, that 1-year rule was something that time-and-again proved to be true. And my timeline is typically 3-4 months, not one year. As they say, "this too shall pass".
I've lost a great job in the past. I found a better one. I lost a pretty rough relationship, not by choice, to the point that I'm not interested in doing that again. I hate being alone[2], but I know that the sting will fade and I'll start dating, again. And I know there's someone who will want to share life with me in a way that is more fulfilling than my former relationship was.
Easily the biggest factor, for me, was re-discovering my Christian faith. I realize there aren't a lot of us in this place and I'm not interested in being preachy -- to each his own -- but its really the only thing I can credit with getting me through a really rough tragedy about a decade ago. It wasn't "being surrounded by other caring people at church" which caused me to be less lonely or made my life better because of that. I don't put myself out there very easily. I didn't know anyone at my church and didn't meet anyone until well after those circumstances passed. It was prayers, all of which were answered, several of which were answered in ways that I refer to them as miracles. Yeah, yeah, I can explain them as coincidences, too. They're not but I'm not going to attempt to defend that.
The only other bit of advice I'd offer is stay as far away from alcohol or other mind altering substances as much as you can. One of the ways out is finding a purpose for your life to replace the ones you've lost. This will be impossible if you add another layer of resistance on top of the problems you already have. You lost. You're not a loser. You had a 7-year relationship. You had a job. Those came from something you did and you probably had far more success in those places than you had failure, but you won't be able to see that clearly right now.
I'm praying for you and your circumstances. This time of year really amplifies loneliness. I'm right here with you.
Merry Christmas!
[0] I chose that word intentionally, not insultingly. When I'm depressed it's easy to feel like I'm the only one who's going through what I'm going through and that I'm uniquely cursed. Somehow using the word "special" to describe that situation makes it seem a little less difficult...
So yes, I'll be spending most of my time alone, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Anyway, have a "Merry Christmas", or "Happy Holidays" or "Happy Festivus" or whatever holiday greeting you desire from me. And a virtual hug as well.
I got to get my aluminum pile from the crawl space for next year.
https://youtu.be/1njzgXSzA-A
Looking at this again in context of this thread no it’s commentary becomes clearer.
If anyone is alone and wants to shoot the shit to get through this holiday email me terminal dot recluse at gmail dot com
Merry christmas.
>Scrooge: Oh, Spirit. Must there be a Christmas that brings this awful scene? How can they endure it?
>Bob Crachit: It's all right, children. Life is made up of meetings and partings. That is the way of it. I am sure we shall never forget Tiny Tim or this first parting that there was among us.
I don't know how you can endure it, and I don't know how you can fill that hole. I'm sorry you have to go through this.
I'll be there too :)
Ancient oak trees, with canopies the size of houses, gingerly cartwheeling down the street, until a wind shift sends it rolling through the neighbors(empty) house. Watching their entire lives evaporate into projectiles that peppered everything downwind.
Modern garage door being sucked out, thrown over the house, to impale itself into the house behind it, evaporating it a few seconds later.
Large trucks, turning side-over-side, like logs rolling down a hill.
A cast iron bench being launched like a rocket into a neighbors window, turning the contents of that room, window, frame, and window air conditioner into a debris field; something from with-which punched a hole through a stop sign.
The roof of my house being lifted 6-10 inches directly upward, rotated about 30 degrees, and slammed back down. Like a sonic boom went off 10ft over-head.
Front support column being blown through my living room window, glass embedding itself into the walls opposite.
The physics of your everyday environment radically and violently change, you see things that you can't see anywhere else. I was on a few drugs while everything was going on, and there's so much more, but none of that was what really messed me up.
I don't know if other people have ever seen something that their brain couldn't understand at all. Like all context does not exist, this is entirely new to human experience kinda thing:
My house had a big ditch behind it, then a set of train tracks that were about a foot lower than my land grade, then another big ditch, then a state park. A very large state park that was miles and miles of ancient oaks, swamps, etc.
I walked out behind my house when the storm cleared, and I froze because I couldn't understand what I was seeing: Imagine an eldritch-old forest, you see it everyday, and now where an impenetrable wall of wood was, is now white horizon. It had been flattened, or erased. My eyes were seeing the white horizon while my brain was struggling with my memory and anticipation. It's the most disassociated I've ever felt without advanced chemistry.
I saw almost the exact same thing last week. One of the neighbours lost their roof and when it blew off it looked like levitation for a few minutes. Then it shifted about 100 feet and slammed to the ground.
https://www.britannica.com/story/why-is-christmas-in-decembe...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturnalia
If someone is used to do doing this and is unable to, it's not hard to see why they would feel lonely.
I chose not to visit with friends and family last year due to covid but I didn't feel lonely. I observed some of my usual traditions like preparing some fancier than usual food and drink, zoomed and played games online with friends and family and had a nice and relaxing day.
One could choose another day, it just happens to be this day. :)