Poll: Do you prefer the office or work from home?

312 points by alfiedotwtf ↗ HN
@bckr submitting this as an Ask HN[1], but I think we would all get better insight if this were a poll

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30239283

370 comments

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Been working from home for 12+ years now. I can't imagine going back to an office.

I get more work done at home than I ever did in an office and I have 7 kids and we homeschool.

You have my respect. No way do I think I could manage the time commitment and work needed to effectively homeschool.
My wife deserves nearly all the respect for homeschooling. She does the lion's share. I help with checking the work and mostly science and math.
20 years for me - since late 2001. Loved it in a 450 square foot apartment in a very lively Brooklyn neighborhood; I loved it in my peaceful 2br apt with a view in Seattle; I still love it now with a house and a toddler (still in the city).

I started my career in an office - a very fancy one at that with an incredible view and great coworkers. But office life has never been for me.

> I have 7 kids and we homeschool

Impressive.

10+ yrs wfh, 4 kids homeschool. Ditto, amazing wife.
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Going to an office to write software is absolutely insane. I like going on fridays and leaving early to drink beer with coworkers.
Agree. I go in once a week to pick up a shared lunch for everybody and we hang out and play some board games
Hanging out with coworkers would be my own personal hell, to be frank. And there's nothing wrong with my coworkers, I'd like to emphasize that, but I have friends and family that I'd rather hang out with. Coworkers are just coworkers to me.
I'm confused, what makes it hell if nothing's wrong with them?
Spending time socializing with people that aren't part of my social life by my own (direct) choosing feels like a chore to me, I suppose. A work party, to me, does not resemble actual work in many ways… and yet it does not resemble a party either. I would certainly enjoy to play volleyball on the beach with friends and family but would rather avoid it as a reward or team-building activity.
The absolute absurdity of sitting in an open office, and pretending to program the full 9-5. That's just not how work like this happens. Why do companies pay their developers high salaries, but then tie one hand behind their backs like that.

For me? Never again.

Why are you pretending to program the full 9-5?

I like the office and am currently working in the office but I just... get up and leave whenever I want. Come back whenever I want. No need to pretend to work 9-5.

Here's a story that explains this concept. A programmer goes to his manager, presenting a paper with a lengthy problem for the manager to solve. The manager looks over the paper, thinks for a few minutes, then writes down the answer. The employee then tells the manager "What were you doing for the last 5 minutes? It didn't look like you were working at all". The manager responds saying "I was thinking about the problem before coming up with the solution".

The programmer then informs the manager that this is what it is like to write code all day. But since programming looks like you are just sitting there not doing anything for much of the time, then you have to pretend to be doing something whenever someone walks by so it doesn't look like you are just goofing off (otherwise they feel that they can interrupt you breaking your train of thought). And that makes programming less efficient.

The manager was then enlightened.

every manager worth their salt climbs from being an engineer, so they should already know this
I'm a software manager and this isn't what happens in practice at all. The more comfortable they are, the sloppier and lazy their resulting code as they feel no pressure to take their work seriously. I can, and will, stand behind devs for hours to keep them determined and on-task.
Surely this post is parody, right?
I think maybe this is some kind of local optimum, but a poor one. Like if your devs already don't give two shits about anything, pressure from you watching over them might improve things somewhat.

But like the real fix is a path to a much better optimum, which is giving employees autonomy, trusting them, rewarding them adequately, getting them to actually care, so that they don't need to be watched over as individual code monkeys.

No. I'm the manager, they're the dev. If they want autonomy, become an artist.
Do you want to feel powerful or to have productive devs?
I'm not a psychic, but I sense your software manager career is not going very far.
I seriously hope this is sarcasm. The best devs I know are the ones that goof off the most, because they're the ones that know they're good at what they do. The crappy devs are the ones who sit quietly at their desks all day and pretend to get work done. I think you should seriously reconsider your management style.
This is exactly what I've seen and experienced. The best devs that are goofing off, are the bedrock of a great work environment.
At least in my case, praise has often been given out based on time of work rather than work.

I am a hard worker because I send 2AM emails (which I may have scheduled in advance to give that impression).

Does "praise" mean "cash" or "promotion" (and if so, does "promotion" mean "more cash")? If not, why would you care about praise?
Benefit of the doubt if something takes longer than I estimate or if I decide to casually take an afternoon off to go talk to my aunt.
Is that not table stakes for any software engineering job?
That's pretty cool you work for a company with a culture that makes that possible. You're probably in the minority when it comes to office workers, though.

> Why are you pretending to program the full 9-5?

I'm not, because I now work from home. Where people value my actual work output, and not the hours I'm sitting in a chair, where my manager can see me.

This 100%. People are acting like someone is chaining them to their desk. Seriously, just get up! No one is going to say shit, you have all the power in this current market. I'm a huge fan of 2hr lunches that include a nap in the park. Get my best ideas walking to/from the park.
This can be quite true. I have gone weeks barely checking email and nobody said anything. Nobody even noticed.
My experience is almost exactly contrary.

At home, I get a "guilty" feeling if I don't work 100% effectively for the whole day. At the office, I never felt pressured to "code" the full eight hours, as I could see nobody was doing so (in Slack it seems everyone else is always green/present.)

At the office, I'd fill the day with conversations, lunch and coffee breaks, and other meaningful interactions with other programmers, managers, designers and various other stakeholders.

At home, when I need to take a mental break I just get bored and start procrastinating with the computer. If I go see my family to the other room we talk family business.

I look forward to returning to the office. Immense amounts of information just never get communicated over Slack & Zoom. I feel like working in a dark tunnel for the past 2 years and going.

If I wanted to sharply focus on a specific task for the whole eight hours I could do unlimited remote already pre-Covid. I used this option rarely, as these days could get quite exhausting.

I guess this is a good example of different people's work styles, and why it's probably important to give people the flexibility of choosing. I don't feel that type of pressure when WFH, but do when I'm in an office.

When WFH I'll often just check out for multiple hours in the middle of the day. Go on a walk, take a nap, whatever... Sometimes I'll just do more hours later that night to make up for it, or sometimes I'm just on top of everything anyway, and the break helps keep my mind fresh.

I never felt like I had the ability to do things like that when in the office

Indeed. Unlimited remote option with no pressure to attend the office works the best for everyone. We had this already pre-Covid due to being a distributed team between two cities.
This is true, with exception of Japanese people programming the full 7am - 10pm and pretending not working.
But why go 9-5? Show up at 10. Take a 2hr lunch at noon, and leave at 4. Ride your bike in, chill with people you like, get some work done, don't stress yourself. Ride your bike home and crack a beer. No one is chaining you to a desk, if you're a software engineer the cards are all in your hand in this market.
You describe my ideal hybrid schedule. I don’t miss being in the office Monday through Thursday at all, but I really miss Fridays in the office.

In my experience, remote work typically has no direct productivity downsides, but team cohesion absolutely can take a hit. I find being in the same room with someone doesn’t help us work any better, but having been in the same room with them at some point (ideally not all that long ago) absolutely does, likely even more so having had a beer with them.

> In my experience, remote work typically has no direct productivity downsides, but team cohesion absolutely can take a hit

I'm sure this varies based on the type of work you're doing, but I found the hit to team cohesion led to long term productivity losses. At first we were getting more done than ever. As time went on our raw work output day-to-day did not decrease but a lot of unneeded work that previously would have been headed off at planning and discussion stages would get through.

This was on a team that is specifically doing speculative high risk/reward work so that might be applicable to a lot fewer people than I imagine.

> the hit to team cohesion led to long term productivity losses

It obviously ought to, right, or else why does (should) anyone care about team cohesion in the first place?

Keeping your people happy does not only impact your productivity, but it also impacts motivation (people who love their job are more likely to try and improve beyond their job), the overall churn and, as a second-order effect, even stuff like hiring or wages.

Of course, in the end this all affects the company productivity, but it's really not as straight-forward [0] as the productivity of a single team.

[0] "straight forward" is a bit of an overstatement for measuring team productivity, but that's a different discussion.

> Going to an office to write software is absolutely insane.

Why?

Writing software, especially in a large organization, is often an inherently social job, just like many others. You often need heads down time to actually get into flow and produce code, but that doesn't mean interaction with others isn't a significant part of it as well.

Linux kernel team seems to manage fine. Or maybe they'd all do better if they were in a big open office with Linus Torvalds.
Managing fine is different than it being insane to go into an office. And I don't know on what basis we can conclude that it wouldn't be better if core Linux devs were working together.

I don't know much about the nitty gritty of what kernel deving looks like, but it's possible that the work there looks more like longer stretches of heads down time than average. E.g., I can imagine you could be pretty impactful being heads down for weeks or months at a time micro-optimizing the performance of various components. I think this tends not to be true of most software.

One thing I do know about the social dynamics of Linux development is that Linus can be an asshole and flame at people a lot. You could worry that this would be more intense and thus worse in an office, but IME this kind of stuff tends to get better once people can see each other as actual humans and not just text on a screen.

I think the overwhelming majority of software that's written does not need that much attention.
What do you mean by attention?

I mean that e.g., software in large organizations often needs to fit in with the rest of the software the organization is writing, and that producing code is only part of the work; there's also working with others to find out what the right code to produce is.

Last Friday I went in and got a good education on some of our physical hardware. This knowledge is only held by people that have been with the company since Spring 2020 or work in that department.

I can only imagine the amount of institutional knowledge that is being lost right now. Workers that are low to the ground and sociable who form informal bonds between departments are hurt by being limited to only online interactions, and as a result, the organization suffers too.

For me the sweet spot is working from home with a place away from home I can go when I feel like it. This could be a coworking space or coffee shop but my favorite is the public library near me which is not too trafficked, has excellent Wi-Fi and is a great place for everything but meetings.
I think my views have changed over the course of the pandemic— originally I was thrilled by not having to commute, being comfortable, having an easy way to take a break.

Now in 2022 it sort of feels like living at the office, and the lack of separation between the two can be annoying. The flexibility to pick when I want “intense focus” time at the office has been working really well for me. (Thank goodness my company allowed us to be hybrid.)

Yeah. I'm working from home. I'm loving the convenience and the ability to use, for example, my favorite keyboard. But working in my bedroom and livingroom has kind of ruined those rooms for me. I think I'd enjoy it much more if I had a separate home office room to go to.
If you can get a dedicated home office somehow I’d recommend it.
My job supplied a laptop and I just use another desk for that. So When I'm working its the work desk, when I'm at home its the home desk. Conveniently they're at 90 degrees but share a chair which let's me sometimes be at home when I'm at work. Which is nice.
I actually have a desk in my bedroom which is completely devoted to work. I believe the problem is that it is in my bedroom, but this is how it worked out with two people working in a tiny apartment.
Yes, "it's not working from home, it's living at work" is how I feel and how I have heard it expressed.
WFH is so much better for 2 reasons: can focus, no commute.

Other great reasons: not spreading germs. get chores done during lunch break. see more of kids. look after pets. easy take holidays where you work from another location. own office space. decent coffee machine. not being caged in a city centre during lunchtime. bring in washing if it rains. be near school if there is a problem (like kid is sick). conversation over zoom means both of you get to work at a desk and have good ergonomics while solving an issue.

I'm a social person. I vastly prefer working from home. I've been doing so for the past 8 years. My work days are short. My time with family, hobbies, and friends is long, peaceful, and uninterrupted.

Working in a remote first organization is better. No asses to kiss. Just results. And ample amounts of free time.

Work from home but head into the office once or twice per week. I’m liking the mix of comfort at home without losing connection with colleagues.
We're about to adopt the same hybrid schedule. It's a good compromise from what it was before the pandemic (always in office).
The first rule of change management is to boil the frog slowly.

Unless the hybrid schedule is optional, expect to be back full time in under a year! You'll know you're about to go back when your managers manager has an all hands and mentions something about people being confused or not knowing when their team will be in the office.

They'll manufacture consent by doing a bunch of surveys that they claim people want to go back.

Then 3 months later they'll mandate teams return to work full time (with a flex alternating friday off or something) for 'team cohesion'.

You can actually be a change management consultant. It's big money.

At the start of the pandemic, I knew I would miss working with people in person, but thought I would be totally great with WFH.

Now, I know that I badly need some amount of in-person time with my coworkers on a weekly basis, or I go crazy.

It's a motivational thing for me. I thrive on solving problems for and with other people, and there's an "out of sight, out of mind" effect for me over zoom. It's just harder for me to get my brain going.

I wish I were better at WFH - maybe with the right type of work I would be. I love everything else about it! My home office setup is awesome, I always hated commuting, I love the flexibility of doing chores during the day or getting some work done at 11pm because I don't feel like sleeping.

But man, I miss people.

> It's a motivational thing for me.

I've always loved working from home (and was doing it for almost a year before the pandemic started), I'm quite self-driven, but I do recognize that it can be difficult to get back into the groove once you've been out of it for a while - meeting colleagues in person would help with that aspect.

Ideally, if my colleagues weren't some 3000 km away, I wouldn't mind going to the office once a week or something.

It's hard to find places that have anything in the middle. It's either fully remote, they may or may not even have an office anymore, and they act like you're crazy if you suggest having some sort of standing office space available without special reservations or advance notice. Or on the flip side, they want you in the office 3, 4 days a week, 8-5 or whatever, basically pre-COVID requirements.

I agree I think the best of both worlds would be some sort of schedule, maybe ~1-ish day a week on average. Personally I'd love something like Monday-Tuesday in the office every other week. But everybody is different, which in turn makes it really hard to coordinate and make everyone happy.

> I agree I think the best of both worlds would be some sort of schedule, maybe ~1-ish day a week on average.

Yeah this would be fine/nice as well.

If nothing else there's at least been a strong step towards the potential of WFH with all of this, even though it hasn't lead to ideal outcomes.

Our company is heading exactly in this direction. As we have people who don't want to or are not able to regularly work from home we provide office space. And as we have people who are either too far away from the main project team or want to work from home our leadership (more or less successfully) tries to create a working hybrid model.

But that is not without difficulties.

That's my situation, we have a very globally diverse workforce from the UK, France, North America. I can only see this happening more and more over time now. Companies no longer need to restrict hiring to the small pool who are able to physically travel to a single location everyday.
This kind of makes you a bad coworker. I would be annoyed if someone actually needed to pester me in person regularly to function. I work from home to avoid people like that now. If I was in the office I would not want to talk to anybody unless we had some prearranged meeting on a specific topic.
Not bad, just different. Many humans enjoy socializing with other humans in a workplace setting. It's ok that you don't like it, but that doesn't make this person a bad coworker.
> If I was in the office I would not want to talk to anybody unless we had some prearranged meeting on a specific topic.

This is the sort of honesty I’d love to hear when interviewing candidates.

And if a candidate said that, how would that influence your hiring decision?
Personally - I'd not hire that person. Sounds like they're completely inflexible and unable to adapt to constantly changing environments. Maybe really good for maintenance work or something but if you do startups, work on growing products, do major feature work that has a lot of back and forth, etc. Very likely to not do well at any of the jobs I've had.
Yeah I've never done any kind of software engineering work that wasn't highly collaborative.

    Maybe really good for maintenance work
Even maintenance work is highly collaborative in my experience. Maybe even moreso than developing new features in some ways. As a maintainer you often need to work to understand the intentions of the people who originally wrote the code.
Would probably depend on the role and team culture right?

There are good and bad fits for that attitude

When is not wanting to have conversations with colleagues unless there's a prearranged meeting a good fit?
I guess if everyone else feels the same way? It does sound like kind of an all-or-nothing situation, but for the right person, "coworker who is guaranteed to never ever ever bother you" might be kind of nice?
This is how my workplace operates now. If you have to discuss something you throw it in slack and anything real-time requires a meeting set up at a specific time. It works very well and no one just barges in and interrupts my work whenever they feel like it.
I’ll leave that as an exercise for the reader — a hiring Rorschach if you will.
Maybe it depends on how the team is structured. For the team I belonged to, most of our long-term planning was done informally, we were small enough that we could often spontaneously discuss future goals, present problems, and potential solutions. But with the advent of WFH, those discussions no longer happen, and nobody seems to have time or interest in regularly scheduled meetings.

But I don't know, I only learned recently that my own team members had been working around a broken feature that I maintain for over a year without telling me. I kind of feel like I've been abandoned.

> But I don't know, I only learned recently that my own team members had been working around a broken feature that I maintain for over a year without telling me.

I keep getting this happen. Someone wants an improvement/fix to something and just doesn't communicate that, probably because it has to be very intentional now, whereas it used to be something you'd mention over coffee when you saw the right person.

I'm sorry to hear that. My team is actually excellent about communication for ongoing work, and I still feel the way I do - I'd be waaaay worse off if I felt like people were forgetting about me.

If I could offer some unsolicited advice - tell them that you feel that way! I am quite confident that no one wants you to feel abandoned, and they would be unhappy to know they're making you feel that way. They might not be able to fix the situation all at once, but I hope you're able to get a better situation soon, one way or the other.

WFH has become so monotonous. It drags on far longer than working from the office. I can't focus. It's more exhausting. There's nobody to talk to.

My employers are getting half the efficiency they used to get. Anything I used to find enjoyable about the work is now gone.

I'm probably going to go on a looong sabbatical soon.

I found that for the first few years, but eventually got used to it. 13 years later it doesn't bother me. Having a young family at home with me definitely helps defeat the loneliness though.
I'm in exactly the same boat. Working from home has a lot of advantages (as a longer sleeper, I can get up later, I can eat at home, I don't need to travel, I have a really nice setup etc) but I really miss having a coffee break with coworkers. We regularly do some Zoom coffee meetings or are even having a drink, but it's not a perfect replacement.

On the other hand, the pandemic really took the fun from meeting people all day, so I don't think I'd be happy in an office either, at least under the current circumstances.

What if you WFH and others work from your home too and vice versa?
We actually did this a few times and it was really nice! Current living situations make it a little impractical, but we should try doing it again some time soon, that's a great idea.
It’ll be a big LAN party.
I have felt some of this. I setup zoom meetings occasionally with coworkers that I used to chat in the hallway with. It is a nice way to keep the connections, and despite the purpose of just shooting the breeze, usually some productive discussion comes out of it.
Yeah I've been WFH since 2018, and I'm not a people person, but dang... I miss people.

On the flip side, being able to drop everything and go to the DMV without feeling the social pressure to skip lunch or work late is nice. I feel like I only have a finite number of super productive hours a day, and it's not eight, and they're not always squished together back to back.

    But man, I miss people. 
For me, working from home gives me more time to spend with family and friends, so that's been the tradeoff and it has mostly worked. I also get more exercise/sunlight. Even if it's just a walk with the dogs during lunch, or mowing the lawn.

Although, it's doubly tough when things aren't good at home. Because during those times, the office provided some solace. But overall it's been positive.

Have you gotten at least some kind of positive tradeoff in terms of more friends+family time, exercise, etc?

Yeah, my work-life balance has been great as a result, and I've been able to spend a lot of time with friends and my partner. So that's something I'm actually very grateful for.

But at some point I realized that I really missed work people! I got into software engineering because I love talking about engineering with other really smart engineers. Took me a while to realize that was what was missing.

I've worked at a few companies remotely.

One company was absolutely abysmal. No video chat ever. None. Never saw my coworkers' faces. Who can work like that? Obviously they can, but man that sucked.

Second company was a bit better, but not great. Avoided collaboration and/or video chat pretty strongly but not entirely. Which was weird because when we did do it, everybody was very chatty and they were also good working sessions.

Current company has been great. Strong collaborative culture but they also respect if somebody just needs to focus solo.

I would say that overall this company scratches like, maybe, 80% of my itch as far as being immersed with other engineers (in terms of actual collaborative work, and random tech talk bullshit) is concerned.

I think this is the key aspect. For people with families at home, WFH is a godsend. I have two small children and am an avid runner on my local trails. WFH has meant I can get up around 7am and go running with my dog through the countryside, to then return, have a shower and walk with my young son to his school to drop him off. I can do all that and be showered and ready to start work in my home office by 9am.

Any companies not offering remote now that instead want me to commute to an office and lose all of that personal time, are an immediate rejection.

On the other hand, young professionals who have moved into a city and our just developing their career, they want to be among peers, socializing , learning and building a network.

This was my opinion back in 2020, moved to another house with other neighbors, now it's the other way around.

Now I almost long to get off work and do some choirs outside instead.

I think the biggest issue is that people are lonely due to the pandemic, and are conflating that with working from home. You can have a strong social life and working from home. For others, unfortunately the only socialization they can get is forced interaction with coworkers at the office.
Conflating those concepts may be appropriate here, for many people. I don't think it's only a matter of how strong your social life is outside of work, or a matter of people leaning on forced socialization at work. That's an overly reductive look at it.

I would like to talk about it but I'm kind of sick of seeing the discussion framed in term of people who only socialize at the office.

The fact is, in the office we have many in-person interactions spread throughout the day. Socialization isn't fungible, we can't simply replace interactions in one context with interactions in another context and assume people will be happy with it.

I can see what you're getting at, and I thought it was the issue for me, but I've come to realize that it's not a loneliness/lack of socialization thing. It's just that I really treasure in-person interactions with the people I am working on something with.

I got into software engineering because I like solving problems, but also because I love solving problems with really smart people. Turns out that it feels really good to do that in person!

Coffee breaks, lunch outings, being able to stop by someone's desk and shoot the shit or see what they're working on -- I've realized that these things are not only enjoyable for me, but critical for both the actual quality of my work and my motivation to do it. Not to mention any kind of whiteboarding / collaborative discussion, which I think is pretty obviously nicer in person.

So far, nothing I have tried remotely gives me the same kind of satisfaction that just physically being with my work partners does. I do think there's something very deeply ingrained in me that's responsible for that, and I know it's definitely not something everyone wants or needs.

> being able to stop by someone's desk and shoot the shit or see what they're working on

So long as the other person feels the same way. One of the reasons I enjoy working from home is people can no longer wonder by and shatter my concentration because they're on a break. They can ping me in chat and I'll get to it in my break.

sure, obnoxious coworkers suck, but the 'oh noes, my concentration/flow' argument has been done to death imo.

thanks to hybrid work, ppl can hide at home all they want.

ps: pls also consider parents that get interrupted far more frequently when working from home.

> sure, obnoxious coworkers suck, but the 'oh noes, my concentration/flow' argument has been done to death imo.

But why do such people say such silly things if it's not true?

Do I think it's 100% true?

No, but it feels that way for them.

I f*king hate useless meetings where my time is wasted. I had a coleague express the same thing about a topic.

Business replied "well, we only had 4 meetings and at least 2 were really required so it was not excessive".

So who was right?

Everybody was right, business did not feel it was excessivez the developers felt it was excessive.

WFH works, 2 years of pandemic proved it does. Some people like it and some people don't, it's not about arguments but about preferences.

But it just so happens that one preference is highly correlated with doing useful work, and the other to chatting, butt-in-seat mentality, and having others do your job (asking for "help").
Interesting. I've never ask myself this question, but reading your post I have realized that I really don't like solving problem together in person with whiteboard etc. Realizing that this cannot be considered as a good trait from professional perspective I still cannot resist the bitter feeling of hours wasted that way. My memory definitely deceives me - it couldn't always be that bad, but I can't help the impression is still strong.
> but reading your post I have realized that I really don't like solving problem together in person with whiteboard etc

I used to really hate it, now I just hate it -- like letting someone else sample my food.

I really hated it because of all of the pollitics and egos and because I was really passionate and brought a lot of insight to the table while 90% the time the others just brought their egos to the table.

Now I'm just jaded and I hate it because 90% of the time the solution really doesen't matter and people just waste eachothers times in endless meetings about details that really don't matter.

> like letting someone else sample my food

Just let them do it before you taste it, and then pretend you're royalty and thank them for testing it for poison.

À friend of mine struggles with what sounds similar and I implore you to ask if that is really what is going on? The lightbulb moment for them was realizing they didn't like putting in the effort of asynchronous communication because they struggled with organisation and not having a routine that allowed them to be productive in moving their side forward. It was a lot easier for them in the office because they were able to get away with these habits by just showing up and using the actual time to start.

What worked for them was therapy, creating a morning routine of moving their work forward and demoing their progression with short <2 minute Loom/Slack video clips. They also invested into one of those drawing tablets for $80.

For me, the two aren't conflated, and I still find that I prefer some office time. I have the ability to work from home or work remote, so I often do that. But I live in China, so social life is rather normal these days (modulo the occasional restrictions).

Like another commenter said, I find it easier to care about the concerns of people around me, so if that's a bunch of people at my company then I'll care more about them and what they need. It makes a difference for me if physical presence and work presence are aligned.

Probably for a similar reason, I've found that I can't reach 100% productivity consistently (over weeks) unless I'm in an environment where people around me are working. So that means finding a coworking space wherever I go.

Also, in-person conversation is so much higher bandwidth than anything else. Those couple hundred ms of latency do matter. Being able to party on the same physical whiteboard is really nice.

I've seen this argument several times and while it's probably true for some segment of the population, it's definitely not for everyone (who feels this way).

I have this sentiment, yet I hang out with one or two friends once or twice a week, occasionally some family every couple weeks or so, and constantly on a daily basis get to socialize with the parents of my dog's friends while on walks.

None of that makes up for working alongside people. And I don't just mean work specifically but forming connections with my coworkers. I'm a huge proponent of making real social connections with coworkers so that it's easier to be collaborative with them. There will be times when your work is not siloed and you either need context about something that your coworker has contributed to before but you haven't, vice versa, etc. and it helps if you both have some kind of connection and stake in the work relationship. If there's no stake in it, then other than the bare minimum (such as not wanting someone to totally screw up something owned by the team), nothing will be contributed. It can make gathering context brutal, work more competitive (resource starvation where one coworker can let their coworker have more trouble which results in them getting a better pick of things to work on, etc.).

I think forming connections is very important... but it should be encouraged independently from working at the office or remotely.

I work remotely for a U.S. company with coworkers from Ethiopia and other countries.

Pre-pandemic, they flew me to the U.S. and I met the U.S. and Indian coworkers, and we went to a conference together. It was a HUGE help - but I think it's something that can be done a few times a year or even once a year, doesn't need to be an everyday thing.

If I'm not occasionally in the same room as someone else, I find that in very small ways you lose an abstract, almost ethereal sense of being in connection with another human.
Going to the pub or a cafe with a friend is completely different from the interactions you have in your work. Most (all?) humans need both - we need to work together, and we need to relax together.
Got the following insights from my younger team members, who are single, new to workforce, new to the city (edit - not in 'home' city).

I miss the office for..

- Free and convenient food.

- Social chatter & engagement.

- Making friends with employees who I don't know and connecting with new employees.

- Work life separation (balance).

- Proper workstation, climate controlled environment.

- Sense of belonging - team outing, after hours beers..

- Intra and inter company sports and games.

- Meeting potential dates.

Engagement is a good word for what I'm missing. Talking with work people - even if we're not actually talking about work - makes me feel more engaged with my day-to-day tasks.
I miss people. I don't miss my coworkers. I get plenty of interaction with my coworkers via the web. I miss socializing with normal folks who aren't obsessed with status, salary and career trajectory.
We're still working from home, but I get together with a few people from the office once a week for lunch. I'll admit that we might be lucky in that we all live in the same city so it's easy for us to meet for a weekly lunch.
> Now, I know that I badly need some amount of in-person time with my coworkers on a weekly basis, or I go crazy.

That's the problem with people that doesn't want WFH: they also want their coworkers to work at the office so they don't "go crazy".

Yes, this is indeed the problem. I like the social aspects of work (work discussions, but also small talk) more than the work itself. Some people argue that that should not be their problem, and that as long as they get their work done, it's fine, which is probably true.

What I do know is that I did work from home for four months and I was miserable. Any job where the norm is at least three weeks at the office would be a huge plus for me, and if choosing between jobs that are mostly remote and jobs that are mostly in the office, I would take a paycut for the job that is mostly in the office. I realize it may be the other way around for other people and am really curious what the norm will be in the end.

I love the lockdown, I get to WFH and not have to deal with small talk every day, mandatory company dinners, commuting through rush hour traffic smelling exhaust, getting up early and going home late, staying late because the boss is staying late, slamming coffee in the afternoon to stay awake instead of taking a nap, not getting any sunlight because I'm in the office during all the daylight hours, having to cram my errands into the same time as everyone else when the markets and stores are the busiest, eating whatever food you can get close to the office instead of eating healthy, dressing up for work, having to shop for work clothes, not feeling free to go on a non-work website because someone could see your monitor from over your shoulder, dealing with chatty coworkers who go on and on about nothing, dealing with coworkers who have loud phone conversations, not being able to listen to the music you want, breathing recycled indoor air constantly, not being able to adjust the temperature to what you like, not being able to inject comments into a conversation over someone who is dominating a room, not being able to yawn or close my eyes or pick my nose during a meeting... I should probably stop.
I agree on everything you said and let me add: I get to pick my chair, desk, displays and overall computer peripherals in my home. I control the temperature, freshness of air, lighting, noise level, internet speed. And having your own toilet is cool too.

Personally just being lifted from a 1h + 1h car commute has dramatically increased the quality of my day to day life, so much that friends and relatives noticed an uplift in my mood.

At face value, just commute time savings is HUGE and easily calculable. I also spent a significant amount of time figuring out what to wear, ironing, accounting for weather, packing my bag. It was 40 mins of "commute" but also like 40 mins of "getting ready". I'm saving 1:20 per day now which is almost a whole day per week.
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Yes. Not to mention the hidden time cost of owning a fully functioning car. Light broke, or it won't start? I have to fix it in my own spare time, bring it to the mechanic and so on.
Consider yourself lucky to be working at a company where you would even want to be around the other staff I guess.
This is just my experience, not a right/wrong thing.

I’m the opposite. Part is that I irrationally hate lifestyle change. Part is that I work with so many teams.

I hated switching. I liked my busy workspace and being able to jump in and help people around me, get info, etc. I had the benefit of also having a private office I could retreat to when I needed long focus time.

I also love routine. I like predictability of my schedule.

But so much of the teams I primarily work with had been spread across the country. 3 cities at the time. They missed out on the hallway chatter and always felt behind.

After a couple months, I got into my groove. I was collaborating with the folks outside my city (and building) much better. But I was overwhelmed by notifications, and was working too many hours.

I disabled all chat notifications on my phone. I started enforcing a beginning of the day and my kids pop in to remind me it’s over (I lose track of time when I’m focused).

Those teams are now in 6 cities. I’ve learned to schedule collab time, offer myself up to teach new folks when I have time and jump in on things I don’t know the same way.

I also schedule 1 hour meetings with close coworkers for 10 minutes of decision just so the conversation can wander. We have an open biweekly call to just joke and wander into something brilliant.

Folks got super aggressive with meetings. So I block off focus time on my calendar and reject meetings that should be emails. I reject emails for things that should be public. I ignore “good morning” chat messages from people I don’t know. When I’m focusing, I disable notifications and turn my speakers off.

I’m more productive and collaborative now. I have more control with people not able to just walk up to my desk. I’m not distracted by others’ more appealing problems except when I plan to be. Folks in other cities have equal access as local.

I also switched to waking up early for my quiet time at home, before the kids wake up, and not staying up late. I stopped eating lunch out, but always take an hour away. Sometimes I just eat a snack and take a power nap. I quit drinking soda. I stopped caffeine after noon. COVID got me doing outdoor activities that I love regularly out of necessity.

I’m 60lbs lighter than when COVID hit, and just feel a lot healthier. It wasn’t an arching intentional goal, just a change here and there to feel better.

Also, I’m naturally an introvert. At work people don’t see that because I am jovial, kinda loud, and opinionated. But when I clock out, I’m done. I just want to chill with my family.

I’ve dabbled in hobbies. Outdoors stuff like fishing and hiking. Picked up sewing bags and masks. Small home improvements. Goofing around with guitars and drums. Making my own guitar pedals. I just don’t force myself to finish anything, it’s just entertainment.

We’re starting back “hybrid” soon, with “team days.” For some that’ll mean 2-3 days per week in office.

But my teams aren’t local, so I really only see that happening when we can get folks traveling again for planning events. I’m not going to the office to Zoom, when I can do it at home without shoes. Maybe the occasional whiteboarding session. I haven’t found an adequate digital replacement for that.

I get to see my wife and 2 kids way more during the day, and my extended family lives just down the street. I'm not missing out on socialization. I imagine if I was still single and lived out of state, this might be a problem for me though.

I don't miss the office-loud-laugher, or the drive-by-tell-you-a-dumb-joke guy when "I'm just trying to get my work done please". My manager wisely scheduled a daily team meeting so I get to see my team every day via Teams.

I would strongly prefer WFH or at least a hybrid. But I’m more than happy to work from the office if it’s a competitive advantage in the common era.
For me it's the same. Perhaps a bit of preference to working from the office ( I'm also nearby).

But I've noticed that our jr programmers haven't improved since 2 years ago.

Work from home but within reasonable driving distance (2 hours) for a day or two in person event (usually some portion work oriented but mostly socializing focused) every month or two with folks in similar situations. I like this balance much better than my previous job where I was work from home but never got to meet everyone because it was a large company and we were all over the country. There was still ~weekly mix of getting together with local folks at the regional office but looking back it still seemed more often than I like. That said I like each much better than at the job prior to that where they had an aversion to people not being in their office chairs every day. All 3 jobs were in the same field and closely related outside of seniority.
Working from home means I get to see my wife and children for more hours of the day. It also means that I get to choose when I will allow myself to be interrupted, rather than sitting in an open concept office and being _continually_ interrupted.

I've been working from home for over six years. I never want to return to the office. I will change careers before I return to a software development office.

Same, I do marketing and have been working from home for almost six years. Nothing could make me work in an office again.
Open concept offices are awful. As someone who is more vulnerable to interruptions than most, being able to control my work environment is a godsend.

Everyone is different, but my ideal work environment is library quiet. No music and certainly no overheard conversations or people constantly walking past. I’ve never worked in an office that was willing to provide such an environment, but I have it at home.

Totally agree, used to wear enormous noise cancelling headphones but I would have to pay music to completely block out noise from the office, but then there would be loud music playing in my ears. Real challenge there
Noise cancelling responds to droning, repetitive sounds, while a big chunk of plastic responds to everything. Not to sound like a shill, but there’s an old headphone model (HD-280 pro) I’ve always sworn by, and I was pleased to see that same model was in Google’s “stuff” catalog for any employee to request.

Another colleague reused his earmuffs and earplugs from the gun range, but I think most of those are pretty uncomfortable.

    Another colleague reused his earmuffs and earplugs 
    from the gun range, but I think most of those are 
    pretty uncomfortable. 
You can definitely get ones that are about as comfortable as a pair of comfortable over-ear headphones.

Ideally, everybody struggling to work in an office would wear big, absurd earmuffs.

Maybe if management looked around and saw that 80% of their employees were geared up like they were working on the tarmac of a busy fucking airport just to get some work done, they would rethink the hell of open offices.

Nah. They wouldn't.

> Open concept offices are awful.

The only people I've met who seem to like them are people who do sales for a living or the exact kind of coworkers who I would really not like to be in an open office with.

I have a really nice office in Seattle. Since I am the second most tenured person on the team, I even have a water view and am right next to the snacks. I haven't seen the inside of this office since May 2020, and probably never will again.

All of my colleagues and I have agreed that we don't see the need to go back and our employer is likely going to sell our admin building (we have several other buildings for actual patient services) and distribute some of the money to those of us who worked in that building as a bonus or as an allowance to buy equipment for home.

I've visited the open offices at friends who work for Microsoft and Google and they're just awful hives of noise. I would rather have my own door and own bathroom.

Don't underestimate the utility of being able to just take a goddamn nap when you've had shit sleep the night before rather than powering through the day trying to appear productive when you're a zombie. Most normal people have bad days when they really shouldn't be at work, its so much easier when you just aren't at work and can deal with the problem (take a nap, take a cold shower afterwards, get in a few hours of actual non-zombie productivity and call it a day). Then you're much less stressed the next day. And there's no worry about insomnia-spirals where you get so worried about being tired at work that you can't sleep.
Yeah. God. The ability to take an afternoon nap if you need it... there's no way to even put a monetary value on it.

Can walk, get some exercise/sunshine, nap, even have a quickie with your partner or look at porn, etc. No matter how awesome one's office is, those things are generally not options.

There's also no pointless commute. No wear and tear on the car. No carbon emissions. No wasted time. Also no risk of injury if you get into an accident.

And even if you bike to work that latter point still stands due to the passively homicidal assholes driving cars out there.

Yeah. With our environmental disaster unfolding, it's hard to sit there in a car burning fossil fuels for many hours per week and feel good about it. Even all-electric vehicles have a pretty significant environmental impact; they still have to be manufactured and the electricity still has to be generated elsewhere.
One of the big upsides of contracting is the days when I’ll down tools at 10am and declare that “I am not smart enough today to accept money in exchange for programming computers”.

I get the occasional day off to go do things that don’t require brain. They only pay for bites of the donut with the jam in them.

It’s a net win for everybody.

> rather than sitting in an open concept office and being _continually_ interrupted.

I think of the benefit of the office being the opportunity for continuous partial attention. It affords the ability to be aware of what's going on about you, to learn & see a lot more. But one has to be attentive-ish, have some receptivity, to benefit from this. I feel like I can work without interruption in an office. But it's a risk or a sacrifice to do so: giving up my option of awareness, giving up the chance to share, the chance to learn or teach, the chance to discuss, to focus on my own things.

Rather than argue against open office as a bad construct, my main grievance is that most engagement points are synchronous & exclusive. Those not in the room at the time are not included, in most organization. Most learning, most deciding happens in the moment, in confidence. The open-office works because people are unable to find good forums for important conversations, and so ad-hocracy is an acceptable all-connected fallback.

Remote tends to be way more deliberate. Ad-hoc interaction is replaced by smaller networks of who-wants-to-talk-to-who. Most actions are private & hidden. It's even less communicative.

I'd far prefer an organization that can find more enduring, participatory, accessible ways of communicating. True for organizations which are remote, and those that are in person.

I don’t believe I can write useful software while following someone else’s conversation. Certainly my best work has been after everyone else left and I suddenly realize I’m hungry or thirsty or uncomfortable and haven’t really moved for hours.
> Certainly my best work has been after everyone else left and I suddenly realize I’m hungry or thirsty or uncomfortable and haven’t really moved for hours.

Exactly this.

The "hmm I should get lunch WHAT DO YOU MEAN IT'S THREE O'CLOCK? CRAP" days are the most productive.

I agree for the most part, except that I once had a software job where I had my own office, and it was the best. I could spend half of the day with the door left open, and fix my coworker's problems, and then spend the rest of the day with my door closed doing deep work. It gave me a great sense of what pain points were effecting others, but also allowed me to shut off the distractions when needed.

I absolutely cannot get anything done with open office floor plans. And commuting is life wasted.

Yeah I’ve been working from home for near on 12 years. I’d rather take a drastic pay cut and change careers than ever go back. I fully understand why some people like (or even “need”) it, but I absolutely despise it.

I get way more work done in a lot less time, save time and stress due to the commute, see my family more, and have significantly better mental health due to all those previous points.

I did miss the office a bit earlier in my WFH career when video conferencing wasn’t as common, but these days it’s not an issue at all and you still get face time with your colleagues etc.

> It also means that I get to choose when I will allow myself to be interrupted, rather than sitting in an open concept office and being _continually_ interrupted.

This is extremely situational. When I was in a larger house and had no kids, WFH was an easy way to avoid interruptions.

Moving to a smaller house (more expensive city) and having kids flipped the situation around. Avoiding interruptions at home was extremely difficult because I was always only a door away from someone asking a “quick favor”.

It’s not just me: As a remote manger I can almost always tell when summer break starts for everyone’s area because there’s a stepwise decline in productive when people’s kids aren’t in school.

Likewise, the office environment makes all the difference. I’ve worked in open-office spaces where everybody respected each other and concentration was the default. I’ve also worked in private-office spaces where I could expect knocks on my door every 15 minutes or less because the culture was so bad that interrupting the engineers was the default practice.

Lately, I’ve felt that fully remote has been the worst of all worlds. Once Slack becomes the default I’m pinged from every angle all day long. It’s hard to push back against people who want answers now now now and know they can get your attention by typing the right few characters into Slack. Comes down to culture, but Slack makes it easy for people to quietly interrupt people directly whereas it was much easier to police the interruptions (as a manager) when I could literally see the offenders bothering the engineers.

> Moving to a smaller house (more expensive city) and having kids flipped the situation around.

I lived in an 800 square foot home with one bathroom for five of the last six years, with my wife and two children. My desk was beside the front entryway, with no door.

> Avoiding interruptions at home was extremely difficult because I was always only a door away from someone asking a “quick favor”.

That's a problem of setting boundaries. It never gets easier, but at least the spouse works and the kids go to school and day care.

> I’ve felt that fully remote has been the worst of all worlds. Once Slack becomes the default I’m pinged from every angle all day long. It’s hard to push back against people who want answers now now now and know they can get your attention by typing the right few characters into Slack.

More setting of boundaries. Be firm and say no. Better, don't respond outside of your core hours unless you're explicitly on pager duty.

When I want to focus, I pause slack notifications. Slack provide a way to still send it, but in my workplace people tend to respect that setting unless it is a real emergency.
Yeah, this is the key.

Whenever I hear about somebody's hellish Slack culture at their workplace and they blame Slack I always think, "That sounds like a bad office culture that would be bad even if Slack was removed from the equation."

To some extent that's true. But tools have their own culture as well. I've loved email for 30+ years because the culture is inherently async. I'll reply when I get to it, which might be tomorrow.

Slack builds a culture of hyper-immediate distraction which seems difficult to avoid.

    But tools have their own culture as well.
Yeah, admittedly, this is very true. Any tool encourages some behaviors and discourages others.

    I've loved email for 30+ years
Email feels like a firehose to me. I can't get any value from it these days. 100's of emails per day of notifications and such.

With effort it can be tamed. Filters and so on. But I've never gotten to a great place with it in modern times. With new sources of crap pouring into my inbox every day it is, at best, something that can be tamed but requires constant attention and maintenance.

Of course, this is all subjective and personal. It's working for you! Kudos. =)

> With effort it can be tamed. Filters and so on.

Yes, that is the key.

Beauty of email is that it can be done because it's all open protocols.

I've been dragged into a signal channel and that's one untamable firehose. Sequential stream of messages via proprietary UI so there is nothing I can do to automatically file messaged into various folders. Nothing I can do to auto-process certain messages, nothing I can do to mark some things read and some unread, etc..

Email allows for infinite flexibility in configuring it just how you need to work best.

If you have just one inbox and everything lands there all the time, I can see how that's a firehose that's not going to be pleasant. But with email the tools exist to customize this away.

    Once Slack becomes the default I’m pinged from 
    every angle all day long. 
I recently began work on a team that has a brief "culture FAQ" regarding things like Slack messaging norms and expectations. We have an agreement that @'ing/DM'ing is expected to be asynchronous unless you explicitly let the recipient know otherwise - "hey, the server's down" or "hey, I'm blocked on this" etc.

(above paragraph edited for clarity)

It's been awesome. Very respectful environment. People @ you but you are not expected to stop what you're doing.

By the same token, I can @ others without fear that I'm causing them an undue interuption, because asynchronous messaging is the norm.

Doing this reduces efficiency. You are potentially blocking someone for half of a day when you might just need to send a simple message back.
Ah, thanks for replying. I edited my post for clarity. I assure you we do not sit around, blocked, waiting for replies. =)

The point being, if you need an immediate reply, you're expected to explicitly mention that. Otherwise it's assumed to be async.

It's working well IMO.

Do you look at notifications or how do you manage to separate those two?

Where I work people can call me on slack or otherwise of it is urgent (no one has abused it so far).

If I am in hyperfocus, anything in text is assumed asynchronous and won't get looked at until I resurface.

Our Slack is very similar, but no one's ever laid it out explicitly (at least not to me) - I love that.
Could you share that FAQ here or link to it? I've been recently thinking of writing something like this for my team, so having an existing working template would be of great help.

Thanks!

> We have an agreement that @'ing/DM'ing is expected to be asynchronous unless you explicitly let the recipient know otherwise

How does this work?

Becuase the problem as a recipient is that now I still need to read every.single.message.all.the.time to see what it says, which is ridiculous waste of time and source of continuous interruption.

I much prefer to check email + slack once or twice a day at most, batch process them then. It's the only way to get any work done.

I find this response (which I see a lot) mystifying.

When you have a moment, read the message.

Go back to what you were doing before.

It literally takes seconds to read a message and decide “is everything on fire and I need to respond to this or can it wait until later”.

Mostly, it can wait.

If it can wait, wait. Ignore it. Go back to what you were doing.

Take your time folk, you dont have to respond to every email or every message ten seconds after reading it.

…to be fair, it is a bit rude to leave it for 4 hours before you even look to see what it was.

But hey, as long as you set expectations with your coworkers, that’s fine too.

Slack is only a problem if you can’t control your Pavlovian response to the little red icon.

You’re not a dog; you can choose how you respond to this stuff.

> It literally takes seconds to read a message and decide “is everything on fire and I need to respond to this or can it wait until later”.

I guess your company has a lower message rate than what I've seen. In current company there are 30+ channels and a message arrives on average about every minute.

Each of those "few seconds to read" is a mental interrupt. Happening every minute. This leads to not being able to switch onto concentration mode to do actual work all day long.

The only solution is to switch it off entirely, only check at specific times. But if the company culture is to expect prompt response at all times, that's a conflict.

    I guess your company has a lower message rate 
    than what I've seen. In current company there 
    are 30+ channels and a message arrives on average 
    about every minute.
Hopefully you're not being DM'd or @'d every minute.

Regular vanilla channel messages should never be expected to be synchronous. As you noted, that's completely unworkable.

DM's and mentions should be IMO be "semi-synchronous." Don't expect an immediate reply unless you've explicitly told the recipient that there's a blocker or there's some other time-critical situation.

Admittedly yes, that does require some attention on the recipient's part, because they have to scan the incoming message to see if it's critical. And some discipline on the sender's part. And even a few seconds of interruption can (worst-case) result in 20-30 minutes of lost productivity if one has to dump their entire mental stack.

So, yes it doesn't scale up endlessly. Multiple "semi-synchronous" mentions/DMs per hour would be a real attention drain. Possibly appropriate for managers, but a real deal breaker for individual contributors.

But at that point I would see it as an issue with the role or with the culture itself.

    The only solution is to switch it off entirely, only 
    check at specific times. But if the company culture 
    is to expect prompt response at all times, that's a 
    conflict.
How would you establish a healthy office communication culture? If everybody is always asynchronous, how could anybody be notified of time-critical stuff like blockers etc?
> Regular vanilla channel messages should never be expected to be synchronous. As you noted, that's completely unworkable.

It is unworkable! But becomes the expectation.

> How would you establish a healthy office communication culture?

The same way it has worked well for the ~30 years of my career before slack-obsession. Have something to discuss, put it on the calendar for the relevant people. For smaller things, send email and don't expect an immediate response. If things are truly on fire right now, make a phone call.

Curiously, in decades past we always used IRC which is basically same thing as slack. But IRC never grew this culture of obligated insta-response, it was more for chatter that one could read or ignore depending on how busy. Not sure why. Perhaps because slack is a paid product, it's now part of the business so everyone is expected to take it Very Seriously and be on it all the time.

You're either luckier than me, had the wisdom to choose better workplaces, or both.

    The same way it has worked well for the ~30 years of 
    my career before slack-obsession. Have something to 
    discuss, put it on the calendar for the relevant people.
In my ~20 years in the industry, instead of politely scheduling discussions for the future, people did one or both of the following:

1. Physically walked over to my desk and interrupted me in person

2. Sent me an email, often expecting a near-instant reply, requiring me to choose between "getting work done" and "monitoring my email."

This is why I feel that it's more about company culture than the tools themselves.

To be clear, a couple years back I did work at a company with a horrible Slack culture. I don't mean to defend Slack per se, and I definitely don't think it's the answer, but I don't think it's the problem either. Inconsiderate coworkers gonna be inconsiderate.

    Curiously, in decades past we always used IRC 
    which is basically same thing as slack. But 
    IRC never grew this culture of obligated 
    insta-response, it was more for chatter that 
    one could read or ignore depending on how busy.
Amen. This is why I strongly feel it's a culture issue and not a technology thing.

"Back in the day," generally it was the tech/engineer types using IRC. We all generally understood the concept of focus time and understood that IRC should not be used with the expectation of synchronous responses.

Now, with Slack, we have a lot of corporate/managerial/whatever types using an IRC-like tool, and they often just don't "get it." Much like my elderly father initially struggled to understand that text messaging wasn't something that guaranteed an instant response.

Everything you just says is a great advocacy of a hybrid environment. I’m diametrically opposed to ever working in an office again. I’ve never worked in an office where I felt comfortable. I’m wonderful at focusing from my home office and my productivity nearly doubled. I’m literally never going back. That said, it doesn’t work for you it seems, and that matters too. Hybrid is the answer, as one size does not fit all.
> Moving to a smaller house (more expensive city) and having kids flipped the situation around. Avoiding interruptions at home was extremely difficult because I was always only a door away from someone asking a “quick favor”.

IMO full remote can eliminate the need to live in a small house in an expensive city.

> Working from home means I get to see my wife and children for more hours of the day.

I wouldn't be surprised if there is a strong correlation between the number of people (partner,family,kids) and how much people enjoy working from home.

I live alone in my apartment and going the first year or two of the pandemic seeing people I know once every few weeks drove me mad.

I live alone and I'm still pretty pleased almost two years into not seeing people face-to-face.
I worked professionally in an office from 1998 to 2020 and remote from March 2020 till now. There is absolutely no comparison. Working from home is so much better than working in an office that I will quit any job that wants me to work in an office from here on out. Fortunately my current company (a Fortune 100 company) is saying that at some point everyone will have to come back to the office T-TH, except for IT/programmers/developers.
I’ve been remote at least some of the time for the last 4-5 years and fully remote since the start of the pandemic (which is what I intend to do going forward).

I totally understand why some people would rather be in an office, even those who are “just” writing code. But I’m just not a very social person and I value time with my family over in-person social interactions with my coworkers (despite my current coworkers being very nice and awesome people).

There’s also just zero need for me to be physically colocated given the work that I do, so any benefits are greatly outweighed by the commute and lack of flexibility that comes with a requirement to be in an office everyday.

i'm happy with either during my actual work time, but commuting is a huge negative. wfh all the way.
Did freelance, was at home everyday for many years. I loved it. But since I reported to myself, keeping a good schedule or structure was a challenging task.

Along with that I didn’t have coworkers so things got pretty lonely.

Lacking both structure and socialization allowed me to be completely wiped out emotionally for a long time when I lost an important person in my life.

I got a job, luckily an office job… in the second half of 2019.

Covid hit and I was work from home again. But this time I had structure. I had some socialization with coworkers through messaging and occasional virtual meetings.

This was a really great middle ground. For awhile I suppose. My office is still closed and I would enjoy the option to go in, but only for in-person socialization.

That’s a pretty self-serving reason for an office though. I’ve recently found other means of feeling a sense of community, and I’ve literally have never felt better in my life.

I guess my tl;dr, in-person work had been a long term substitute for community for many people. Remote work is great, but try to maintain structure and become part of a true community.

wfh vastly better although I enjoy going into the office on occasion to catch up with coworkers over lunch or something
I've been working from home for about five years and vastly prefer it. I wouldn't be completely against going to the office one day per week, my previous company did this (my current company doesn't have an office in my country much less nearby). It would take something significant to get me back in an office full time again.
I would like hybrid, but I think it is missing the biggest benefit about WFH, which is that it lets you move away from the office. I would rather my house now be near my office so I could go in a few days a week, but if it were close enough for that I wouldn't have been able to afford it.
Where is the option in the poll: “prefer private office with door”?
Agree, definitely. Even working from home, for temporary separation from distractions this is ideal. Rooms are unreasonably expensive and the toll of not partitioning and ensconcing enough people and things with them is steep.
Work remotely from coworking space at my option; prefer my ability to make my own decisions.
I've done both and I'm indifferent.I recognize this is probably a very pro WFH crowd but there are pros and cons to both of them. I find collaboration is just easier in person and most of the big "aha!" moments I've had came during water cooler talk.I've also had co-workers whose quality of work completely shit the bed when we went WFH and some of them were let go by management because of it. On the other hand, being able to just get up and go to the kitchen whenever I have down time or get some chores done whenever I have a moment is pretty great.