I had concerns about this yesterday, and shared in that thread. Doing things to support Ukraine is vital, but so is doing things to support Russians.
They're the only ones that can stand up to Putin without (we hope) causing WW3.
As I said yesterday, the people he's terminating in Russia are the engaged ones that read western papers and go to western tech conferences. They're currently putting everything on the line to protest.
I get the anger and frustration, but every move is critical now.
This could be understood - a lot of their employees ARE from Ukraine, as far as I remember (so it's rather different from situations companies like Apple/Disney don't want to work in Russia)
This could have grave issues for them IF Ukraine will be fully occupied for a long time but it looks they decided to accept that risk.
I will not trust Namecheap with my domains or hosting again.
Based on direct comments here on HN from their CEO, at any time they might cut off my service without notice for having been born in a country they don't like, or for having an ethnic-sounding name that reminds their support staff of names they don't like.
I am not a war criminal. I do not support human rights abuses. I shouldn't be painted as a war criminal or as a human rights abuser by accident of birth.
I will take my business to companies that don't care where I was born or what my name sounds like.
I don't agree that having to become a freedom-fighter in foreign countries should be a necessary condition for me to continue to be allowed as a customer of a domain name / hosting business.
>The UK will not forget what Putin did in Salisbury.
For anyone unaware, Salisbury was where Russia sent an incompetent military hit squad into Britain with a chemical weapon (a Novichok nerve agent) to kill a Russian dissident. They failed to kill their target, double-agent Sergei Skripal, or his daughter Yulia.
They did however severely poison them, along with a police officer who went to the Skripal's home.
The Russian GRU military officers also failed to securely dispose of all the nerve agent before they fled, resulting in the poisoning of two random British citizens months later, one of whom died.
We did next to nothing about it at the time, we just pissed and moaned and kicked out some Russian spies.
Several years earlier, Russian-backed terrorists used a Russian-supplied missile to blow up a civilian airplane, MH17. They killed everyone on board. We did approximately fuck all about it.
Despite there being 10 British people on the flight (and some Indonesians, a bunch of Aussies, the Malaysian crew, and a big load of Dutch people). 80 kids on that flight.
I think, thanks in no small part due to the corruption in our government and financial sector, we officially forgot quite quickly.
Excellent summary of the Salisbury chemical weapons attack for that is what it was, totally against the treaty on chemical warfare and tantamount to an act of war.
"Several years earlier, Russian-backed terrorists used a Russian-supplied missile to blow up a civilian airplane, MH17."
By all accounts this appears to have been an accident, in the sence that they never meant to shoot a civilian aircraft. These types of mistakes have been made before, with US shooting down a Iranian passenger plane (Iran Air Flight 655), and Iran accidentally shooting down their own (!) airplane.
It appears in each case it was a Ground-to-Air missile and the crewes were panicking thinking they were under attack.
"Then fight for it. Unseat Putin and his gang of scumbags that pilfered billions"
Some people who are Russian citizens, weren't even born in Russia or left as children, precisely because their families were being prosecuted.
I recently saw a picture of 12 Russian opposition leaders, lawyers and journalists from 2000's - the one thing all of them have in common, is that they are dead.
It's clear the current leadership won't leave peacefully, protesting with posters and slogans does nothing. And unlike America, you have no right to bear arms in Russia, so good luck attacking armed men with a kitchen knife.
I don't know what an average man can do against current regime that isn't either suicidal self-sacrafice, or is basically terrorism against the state. Maybe you think that's what required, but unless you have that kind of experience, it's not fair to critize random Joe
If anyone actually considered Russians and Belarusians war criminals and human rights abusers by accident of birth outside melodramatic Internet comments, Namecheap probably wouldn’t be offering them literal free service in the linked Twitter thread.
The context is NameCheap's CEO gave Russians and Belarusians "one week to get off my platform, no refunds" a few days ago. This was of course a very crass and inappropriate emotionally-charged response to Putin's little war, and many customers are interested in finding a more responsible & reliable service provider that won't endanger them so needlessly.
I hope NameCheap grows from this experience. Communication is difficult at all levels, and it's become easier than ever for our emotions to govern how we act as individuals, companies, and governments. Slow down, communicate, and listen.
How about giving people a little slack on being emotionally charged when most of their employees are in a war zone? Guarantee their employees were pressing for this and in the big picture it's not fair but it's nothing compared to what they're going through and makes them feel like their company is on their side
The CEO made their choice and you made yours, but it sounds like you don't have any compassion for the situation they were in or in the choices they made since, to which you are commenting on.
I can imagine if you had employees in Ukraine, people you have a direct connection with, being attacked, dying, having everything taken from them and you are powerless to stop that from happening, you are going to be frantic and emotional and want to do everything in your power to help (or maybe YOU wouldn't, but I don't know you). They decided to do so because they couldn't look their people in the eyes and say we are still taking money from the people doing this to you, please support them so we can continue to make money. It doesn't matter if the people of Russia aren't the enemy, it's who they represent to those you care for, the people you have to look in the eye. As the person running the business they had to make a choice on what was more important to them, their people or their customers in Russia and they made their choice, despite how it could affect their business and the perception of their reliability as a provider.
There have been many comments since then and by the sounds of it, this CEO was at their limit, having been frantic for days, lacking sleep and doing what they could and I cannot fault them for that, only respect it. They aren't acting like a faceless conglomerate who couldn't give a shit who lives or dies, even their own employees, and only seeing the bottom line.
It seemed like many, many comments were made that this was a mistake to turn off access to the Russian people as it's most likely the folks who are anti-regime were the actual customers and that by doing so, they were actually making things worse. This makes a lots of sense and is probably the case, yet I imagine this wasn't necessarily a realization to the CEO during this crises, especially if you aren't from Russia or a similar country. I have to imagine that since the backlash the CEO has had some time to regroup, rest, read the comments and take in all this new information, these new reasons why they were wrong and realize they made an error, despite trying to help. So here we are a day or two later and they've tried to turn around and help the people they wronged with something very potent.
Perhaps you are in Russia and feel wrongly targeted, and I can imagine the entire world is coming down on you and it is also unimaginably awful. It feels like everyone is against this war and angry and no one can target or stop Putin or do anything and those with any power to do anything are trying to do what they can to make it all stop. It is a fear that perhaps Putin knew all along that the world would sanction his own people into chaos and would perhaps drive them to hate everyone else more than him and then he wins. I can't imagine what it's like to have to live there and be anti-regime as it sounds too dangerous to do anything to resist and the world only seems to be punishing those in pain, not the one causing it, yet they have no other recourse or outlet.
Anyway, I would imagine if this hit you hard and you can't see or don't care about the 180 that they made, unfortunately you are probably going to see a lot more of this in the near future and those companies probably won't be as reflective. If you'd rather have a company keep you as a customer at the cost of their employee's lives or sanity, then I guess you have a good measure of what type of company to buy from. CEO's are usually humans (although most don't show it) and humans have the rights to make mistakes and take stands, especially in the time of war. I don't think for a second this CEO is being racist for fun. If you are insulted enough and never want to use them again fine, but at least acknowledge that they tried to learn from and right the mistake or understand where they are coming from.
That was a long, very emotionally charged reply that is not relevant to my situation.
> If you'd rather have a company keep you as a customer at the cost of their employee's lives or sanity
I did not select my birthplace or name. I don't see why their employee's lives or sanity depend on their customers' biographical happenstance.
I am no more culpable for the actions of Russia, Belarus, or Ukraine than any randomly-selected HN member born in any randomly-selected geographic region.
That is the distinction the CEO of Namecheap should have made and failed to make when he decided that a significant subset of his customers are war criminals or enablers of war criminals by virtue of biographical happenstance.
That said, as you pointed out, the CEO made their choice and I've made mine.
I fully support NameCheap and they will continue to have my business. Most of us commenting here are doing so from the comfort of their safe office. Ukrainians are dying, defending themselves from a war which they did not provoke.
I empathize with simple Russian people who are impacted by this but the world needs to send a message to Russia. There will be casualties.
You can move your domains or hosting infrastructure. People cannot be replaced.
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[ 0.62 ms ] story [ 83.8 ms ] threadThey're the only ones that can stand up to Putin without (we hope) causing WW3.
As I said yesterday, the people he's terminating in Russia are the engaged ones that read western papers and go to western tech conferences. They're currently putting everything on the line to protest.
I get the anger and frustration, but every move is critical now.
This could have grave issues for them IF Ukraine will be fully occupied for a long time but it looks they decided to accept that risk.
Based on direct comments here on HN from their CEO, at any time they might cut off my service without notice for having been born in a country they don't like, or for having an ethnic-sounding name that reminds their support staff of names they don't like.
I am not a war criminal. I do not support human rights abuses. I shouldn't be painted as a war criminal or as a human rights abuser by accident of birth.
I will take my business to companies that don't care where I was born or what my name sounds like.
ref: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30504812
For anyone unaware, Salisbury was where Russia sent an incompetent military hit squad into Britain with a chemical weapon (a Novichok nerve agent) to kill a Russian dissident. They failed to kill their target, double-agent Sergei Skripal, or his daughter Yulia.
They did however severely poison them, along with a police officer who went to the Skripal's home.
The Russian GRU military officers also failed to securely dispose of all the nerve agent before they fled, resulting in the poisoning of two random British citizens months later, one of whom died.
We did next to nothing about it at the time, we just pissed and moaned and kicked out some Russian spies.
Several years earlier, Russian-backed terrorists used a Russian-supplied missile to blow up a civilian airplane, MH17. They killed everyone on board. We did approximately fuck all about it.
Despite there being 10 British people on the flight (and some Indonesians, a bunch of Aussies, the Malaysian crew, and a big load of Dutch people). 80 kids on that flight.
I think, thanks in no small part due to the corruption in our government and financial sector, we officially forgot quite quickly.
Edit: A few minor changes to make it less difficult to read. Bonus add - The ridiculous "Salisbury novichok suspects say they were only visiting cathedral" https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/sep/13/russian-tele...
By all accounts this appears to have been an accident, in the sence that they never meant to shoot a civilian aircraft. These types of mistakes have been made before, with US shooting down a Iranian passenger plane (Iran Air Flight 655), and Iran accidentally shooting down their own (!) airplane.
It appears in each case it was a Ground-to-Air missile and the crewes were panicking thinking they were under attack.
But Russia knowingly supplied terrorists with the weapons system.
The terrorists knew they were attacking a plane, they just thought it was a different (and hostile) plane.
And through panicked incompetence those terrorists obliterated a Malaysia Airlines 777 with nearly three hundred people on it.
Then Russia took the weapons system back and lied about it.
Some people who are Russian citizens, weren't even born in Russia or left as children, precisely because their families were being prosecuted.
I recently saw a picture of 12 Russian opposition leaders, lawyers and journalists from 2000's - the one thing all of them have in common, is that they are dead.
It's clear the current leadership won't leave peacefully, protesting with posters and slogans does nothing. And unlike America, you have no right to bear arms in Russia, so good luck attacking armed men with a kitchen knife.
I don't know what an average man can do against current regime that isn't either suicidal self-sacrafice, or is basically terrorism against the state. Maybe you think that's what required, but unless you have that kind of experience, it's not fair to critize random Joe
I hope NameCheap grows from this experience. Communication is difficult at all levels, and it's become easier than ever for our emotions to govern how we act as individuals, companies, and governments. Slow down, communicate, and listen.
I didn't know that. But if that is the case, the company could have offered them money and support to relocate somewhere out of the war zone?
That is rational and humanitarian, and probably would get them better PR among non-ideologues.
They were literally surrounded and being bombed in Kharkiv. Hard to get out in those circumstances. It's an actual war...
I can imagine if you had employees in Ukraine, people you have a direct connection with, being attacked, dying, having everything taken from them and you are powerless to stop that from happening, you are going to be frantic and emotional and want to do everything in your power to help (or maybe YOU wouldn't, but I don't know you). They decided to do so because they couldn't look their people in the eyes and say we are still taking money from the people doing this to you, please support them so we can continue to make money. It doesn't matter if the people of Russia aren't the enemy, it's who they represent to those you care for, the people you have to look in the eye. As the person running the business they had to make a choice on what was more important to them, their people or their customers in Russia and they made their choice, despite how it could affect their business and the perception of their reliability as a provider.
There have been many comments since then and by the sounds of it, this CEO was at their limit, having been frantic for days, lacking sleep and doing what they could and I cannot fault them for that, only respect it. They aren't acting like a faceless conglomerate who couldn't give a shit who lives or dies, even their own employees, and only seeing the bottom line.
It seemed like many, many comments were made that this was a mistake to turn off access to the Russian people as it's most likely the folks who are anti-regime were the actual customers and that by doing so, they were actually making things worse. This makes a lots of sense and is probably the case, yet I imagine this wasn't necessarily a realization to the CEO during this crises, especially if you aren't from Russia or a similar country. I have to imagine that since the backlash the CEO has had some time to regroup, rest, read the comments and take in all this new information, these new reasons why they were wrong and realize they made an error, despite trying to help. So here we are a day or two later and they've tried to turn around and help the people they wronged with something very potent.
Perhaps you are in Russia and feel wrongly targeted, and I can imagine the entire world is coming down on you and it is also unimaginably awful. It feels like everyone is against this war and angry and no one can target or stop Putin or do anything and those with any power to do anything are trying to do what they can to make it all stop. It is a fear that perhaps Putin knew all along that the world would sanction his own people into chaos and would perhaps drive them to hate everyone else more than him and then he wins. I can't imagine what it's like to have to live there and be anti-regime as it sounds too dangerous to do anything to resist and the world only seems to be punishing those in pain, not the one causing it, yet they have no other recourse or outlet.
Anyway, I would imagine if this hit you hard and you can't see or don't care about the 180 that they made, unfortunately you are probably going to see a lot more of this in the near future and those companies probably won't be as reflective. If you'd rather have a company keep you as a customer at the cost of their employee's lives or sanity, then I guess you have a good measure of what type of company to buy from. CEO's are usually humans (although most don't show it) and humans have the rights to make mistakes and take stands, especially in the time of war. I don't think for a second this CEO is being racist for fun. If you are insulted enough and never want to use them again fine, but at least acknowledge that they tried to learn from and right the mistake or understand where they are coming from.
> If you'd rather have a company keep you as a customer at the cost of their employee's lives or sanity
I did not select my birthplace or name. I don't see why their employee's lives or sanity depend on their customers' biographical happenstance.
I am no more culpable for the actions of Russia, Belarus, or Ukraine than any randomly-selected HN member born in any randomly-selected geographic region.
That is the distinction the CEO of Namecheap should have made and failed to make when he decided that a significant subset of his customers are war criminals or enablers of war criminals by virtue of biographical happenstance.
That said, as you pointed out, the CEO made their choice and I've made mine.
I empathize with simple Russian people who are impacted by this but the world needs to send a message to Russia. There will be casualties.
You can move your domains or hosting infrastructure. People cannot be replaced.
Not looking forward to the day, I get various internet services cut off for all the war crimes America commits.