Ask HN: What is this mental technique called?

36 points by jstx1 ↗ HN
I read about this in a kind of new-agey self-help book more than 10 years ago and I don't remember the author or the book title. I'm looking for the source. It's something like this:

1. Something happens to you - interaction with a person, some mundane or significant event, whatever it is.

2. You have your "first response" to it - that's the first thought that comes to you after the event, maybe it's your first reaction when you read a comment online, or when a colleague does something you don't like etc.

3. You discard your first response and think "if that's not my response, then what is". A second possible response comes up in your head. You get rid of that one too.

4. Repeat steps 2 and 3 for a while - possible ways to respond occur to you and you discard them.

The general idea was that the later responses are more mature, more compassionate, more useful etc. and you're systematically working your way to them.

Any idea where this is from?

24 comments

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Hypnotist David Snyder says it is (one level) the other way around.

The first answer you get from the unconscious and it is right.

After that you start making up lies to be socially acceptable.

From the way the question was asked, I don't think it's limited to just questions though. You might be asked for something. In that case, your instinctive answer might not be the one you end up being happiest with.
It is all just another presentation of the mind :)
No. Social acceptability aside, I know my instinctive response is often clearly, demonstrably wrong, to the point of clashing with simple facts. It's worth noticing your first reaction, but maybe so you can figure out where your subconscious is getting such nonsense.
They touch on this idea in ventriloquism. The idea is that your brain normally stops you from saying the first thing you think of, because you're afraid. But when you have the puppet, the puppet can say anything because it's not you. It lets you get that first thought out that normally would have stayed hidden.
Well it's slightly related, but there is 'broken telephone' which is a game where the initial message becomes very mangled the more people that repeat the message to each other. Lookup 'chinese whispers' too.

Maybe this is like a reverse broken telephone where the end message becomes better than the initial input?

You can certainly improve a story by telling it over and over again.

I homeschooled my son in math: somehow he was totally impervious to algebra but turned out to have more aptitude for (at least some kinds of) mental arithmetic than me so I had to learn to get better at it to pick up the pace.

From doing that I learned a bag of tricks for computing square roots (and some other math tricks) that I have well practiced for certain cases (particularly if I pick the number) For instance there are two easy ways to calculate the square root of 50, either based on 50 = 2 * 5^2 or 50 = 7^2 + 1. I can make up easy cases like that and solve them and people will complain about how unfair it is.

There's a book by Resmaa Menakem that includes something like this. He wrote My Grandmother's Hands & Rock the Boat. Acronym SNAPS: stop; notice; accept; process (?); shake-it-off (and keep going).

Blindboy on his podcast talks about this as well. His mental-health specific episodes are particularly valuable, covering Transactional Analysis, Cognitive Behavior Therapy, and ways to outgrow anxiety, among other topics.

A counselor advised something like the steps you wrote when I struggling with processing work emails: break the task into smaller and smaller steps until you can do one step, then check in with what the body is feeling and opt to either continue or stop and take a long, slow breath (ideally 5-6 seconds in and 5-6 seconds out, per Breath by James Nestor) or several or whatever helps, then keep going.

I think this was mentioned in the book thinking fast and thinking slow by daniel k
I'm not sure if it links directly to dialectical behavior therapy, but it sounds an awful lot like a combination of an emotional regulation technique with an interpersonal effectiveness technique, plus a side of mindfulness.
This is simple mindfulness. Being self-aware of your own internal processes is the first step along a very long path of self-realization.
Seems like you absorbed wisdom through various resources? E.g. Books to share? Would love to compare notes.
Hi Abner. Big fan of the handmade network and conferences!

And likewise. Would love to hear your thoughts. Below is a summary of my point of view, and it is not novel, but the continuation of a few decades long process. If you find it valuable and wish to continue the conversation I'm reachable directly at jesse DOT r DOT meyer AT me DOT com. And this invitation extends to others -- just include the title of this HN post. I've discussed my experiences with mindfulness / meditation and its effect on my life in a previous comment here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24186942 . That may be a good place to begin to get a sense of whether my more philosophical take below will resonate.

'The map is not the territory.'

Wisdom begins with a perception of the world, which includes a perception of our-self. But immediately we seem to run into an issue. The world as represented to us by our brains is subject to, well, features of subjectivity. By thoughts and conventions of thinking and feeling which are not our own, but a heritage of society reaming with subtle assumptions, and by the general pressures and rewards of life, which are so normal to us that we are only dimly conscious of. My hope here is to uproot and expose light on some of our ways of thinking and feeling about ourselves and our relation to the world. The way I go about this is by removing as many conceptual layers as I can, while retaining the ability to articulate ideas. After all, discussion is difficult without categories or ideas. Maybe this is analogous to the software engineering practice of removing layers of abstraction in order to see what exact transform is necessary for the computation. Once the desired computation is understood, only then can we reason about improvements. That is to say, before we can be wise, a clear perception of the world is required. But people have different conceptions of what clear means.

Our culture has taken a restricted view of knowledge. We feel that we can only know something if it can be represented or conceptualized in a symbolic form and manipulated according to an abstract system of rules. This can lead to the false impression that books, words, and ideas are in some sense a final destination but I maintain they are points of departure. Anyone who has taken a few minutes to self-observe (mindfulness meditation) will quickly come to realize without any outside interference that there are other forms of knowledge, which are immediate and non-linguistic, non-symbolic, and vitally, non-categorical in of itself.

I labor on this point because so much of our lives as thinking people is spent thinking -- manipulating symbols in our minds. In seeking wisdom, then, we would feel natural and quite at home at searching for the wisest set of symbols and rules governing them, and how they reform our thinking. A worthwhile activity surely. But the world itself is not composed of thoughts, or symbols. Rather, the mind is, and so it composes the world in thoughts. And I think a good place to establish some baseline is somehow coming to see that. A strict exercise in 'building first principles from first principles'. This is essentially what the notion of 'the void' or 'emptiness' means from Indian / far eastern philosophies. It's not the emptiness of atheism. It's just that the world as it is, is 'thoughtless', or 'mindless', a 'void'. And as it is is an unspeakable beauty of great transformative power.

Non-sarcastically, the best resource is your own life. Every moment is an new opportunity to deepen our sensitivities. And the basic technique could not be any simpler. Breathe, watch, and listen, and feel. The thinking will come all on its own. But return to your breath, your eyes and ears and body.

Thanks for the kind comments (and the very useful response!)

Life got a bit busy but I plan to reply back in detail soon -- I'll probably just do it at your e-mail :)

It also relates to stoicism, more specifically the practice of becoming aware of your irrational reactions and impressions.
I'd call it "the best way to improve your Hearthstone ranking".
Self-control and emotional maturity. I have to use it to keep from falling for other fantastical labels given to it in order to sell classes and books.
Sounds like Stoicism. Read the "Enchiridion" http://classics.mit.edu/Epictetus/epicench.html

A lot of ancient knowledge got recorded in the past, but they used papyrus or stone tablets. They didn't quite manage to get it published electronically. So every few years we modern people wonder if Google or Hacker News can tell us how to be happy and sane.

Yep, sounds like basic mindfulness. In meditation 101, you sit calmly and observe your thoughts, as if an unbiased bystander. You might imagine putting post-it notes on your thoughts. 'Thinking of eating', 'Worried about work' - then, later, you might dive into questions about the labels themselves: Are they biased, are they how I truly feel? why do i feel that way? am I reacting from emotion? what do my thoughts and their labels say about me and my mental state? etc. . .ideally, this process brings mental clarity.
I did this for a while, but then I started watching he who is doing the watching of himself. That guy is seriously a trickster. Fortunately the next guy up has been able to sort things out pretty well. Although, there have been a few times…
I think you are referring to Eckhart Tolle's mindfulness. I have one of his quotes that I have clipped into my notes as:

“What a liberation to realize that the “voice in my head” is not who I am. Who am I then? The one who sees that.” -Eckhart Tolle

HTH.