Tell HN: AT&T disabled phone numbers and accounts of users using the old phones
AT&T disabled users phone numbers and account for using SIM in the phones not on the whitelist.
https://www.att.com/idpassets/images/support/pdf/Devices-Working-on-ATT-Network.pdf
https://forums.att.com/conversations/wireless-account/my-att-prepaid-account-disconnected-today-but-i-just-added-money-this-sunday/6271d8e6ee9f260c2628029a
98 comments
[ 4.3 ms ] story [ 171 ms ] threadThis is a kin to raising arms over the EOL support of Windows Vista.
When I talked to the AT&T folks in store, they indicated that it was happening even on 4G capable devices that weren't bought from AT&T and therefore were unlisted in the system.
It's simply being used as a driver for new phone purchases.
https://community.verizon.com/t5/Verizon-Wireless-Services/W...
https://www.reddit.com/r/verizon/comments/4oaw2x/i_hotlined_...
I wonder how long I have on T-Mobile, I keep getting texts like "T-Mobile: Action needed. VoLTE settings may be affecting service quality for phones on your account.". On this particular account there is a single Nord N200 5G bought from T-Mobile, and as far as I can tell VoLTE works fine on it.
except they sent free phones to people who had 3g phones. They weren't super-new, but they were newer than the phones they were replacing.
I am on an MVNO, so I ultimately decided to migrate back to Verizon. The only reason that I was on AT&T at all was a larger diversity of supported devices. VoLTE has really put an end to that for me, as I'm on LineageOS.
This is extremely device dependent. Out of officially supported LineageOS models, the general rule of thumb has been VoLTE that works in stock firmware on Motorola or Oneplus will also work in LOS. Samsung won't as they have a proprietary implementation.
AT&T goes a step further than just blocking devices that don't register on IMS and also runs IMEI whitelists so almost all imported phones will not work on their network.
I still have a few active SIM cards supporting GSM-only operation if I feel like using an old phone from 2005. (I have a sony ericsson w810i that Google's WAP site still works on, the oldest phone I tried within past year was a t68i but data wouldn't work, just calls/sms)
It's very useful in countries like Turkey which don't allow foreign phones. So you need to copy the IMEI of a local unless you want to buy a new phone.
Any devices this is going to work on will be old and will not support VoLTE. Modern smartphone SoC's (all the Qualcomm ones at least, which make up majority of US android devices) have the modem IMEI stored in memory that can't be modified, any guides on these devices are just about spoofing IMEI reported to android system, not to the network.
Which part of what I wrote isn't true? I'm talking about device IMEI spoofing, not AT&T's whitelist.
I have been using a f(x)tec pro1 for years on 4G+VoLTE on their network, and got the same text message saying they would terminate my account if I did not get a different phone. I decided to lay low and moved my sim into a supported phone with the intention of letting the dust settle white I prepare to port my number to t-mobile (they have by far the worse service in my area, but seem to be the only US provider allowing the pro1 to be activated).
I still have an inkling of hope that I will be able to move my sim back to the pro1 after whoever is responsible for the 3G shutdown gets their bonus and they stop going after unsupported devices aggressively.
They also retain metadata on users for seven years, longer than any other carrier.
I really should have left long before I did.
https://www.nbcnews.com/technolog/how-long-do-wireless-carri...
ATT is the worst company, even worse than comcast. Doing something to just be hostile to their customer base is in their DNA, they are used to their monopoly status from the say of Bell Telephone, that company will never change and will never be customer friendly
Was in the same boat over a year ago when AT&T started SMS spamming about 3G sundown plans on one of my prepaid phones (Blackberry Key2) flagged as "incompatible"; to be sure, the older KEYone and Priv models are apparently whitelisted because AT&T had sold and directly supported those models at some time in the past.
Got so annoyed by the recurring, persistent warnings and no reasonable explanation why this 4G VoLTE phone would be sucking hind tit on their network in the near future that I ported the number to T-Mobile on a random Sunday afternoon (reduced monthly bill too) and never looked back.
If the UX leading up to disconnect was anything like mine, I'm honestly not sure why this event is catching so many AT&T customers off guard.
All supporting my growing conviction that phone co's are constitutionally incapable of delivering good internet connectivity and should be forced out of that game as soon as, and by any means possible.
you're missing the point
at&t is shutting down 3g towers because pretty soon they won't be legal anymore
no cell company can service you whether they want to or not. that spectrum is being turned over to 5g devices mid next year.
https://www.wired.com/story/3g-service-sunset-what-it-means/
ATT is just about one of worst telco company around. It doesn't surprise me they are doing stuff like this for bonus or whatever reasons. They have in the past selectively blocked email, calls before (for their customers without notices) and now phones. If you can do NOT use ATT as a telco provider.
Forum users reported that customer service can whitelist an IMEI. They did not for me. So I switched to the T-Mobile network. From my international SIM now I get a message from their roaming partner AT&T saying that voice calls will not work.
T-Mobile is sunsetting 3G as well in July 2022, they sent me a text saying that they "think" that my phone is compatible. The decision of AT&T to not support my phone is not technical.
[+] It has 2 SIM card slots, something that seems to be impossible to get in the US. I think only one of the 2 slots fully supports LTE.
The 6T and 8T has 2 SIM slots in their retail unlocked versions. T-Mobile 6T and 8T versions can be flashed to this config (but you will need to buy a new sim tray to hold both cards).
It's also pretty common now to see phones that have esim and a single sim slot in the US.
Both of the slots support LTE; OnePlus has made some frustrating power saving decisions though, which force the secondary (non-active) SIM to 3G when it's not in use.
This can be disabled (at least on my 7 Pro running Android 10) via logkit following these steps[0]. Once disabled, the phone will fully support VoLTE on both SIMs.
[0] https://forums.oneplus.com/threads/dual-4g-networks-setting....
This is correct. The whitelist that they're using specifically is here[0].
Some phone representatives will claim to people that they need a "5G Phone" - this is misleading, either on purpose (because the rep wants to increase their sales figures), or accidentally (because the rep isn't well trained on how to handle this situation).
AT&T will provide alternative phones for free, but they usually aren't great. Last I heard it was an iPhone SE (2020) for existing iPhone users and a low-to-mid range Android phone for existing Android users.
[0] https://www.att.com/idpassets/images/support/pdf/Devices-Wor...
> What type of device are you using? Customers using 3G and non-VoLTE devices are subject to immediate disconnect as we sunset the 3G network
This sounds like the competitor to the records for lunacy in history: one owned device¹ will not support their service - and they will cease the contract?! [Edit: they have closed the accounts...]
[Edit: sorry, but I believe I must reformulate the above before skimmers drill in their mind a wrong piece of information I slipped in out of confusion. Please see the further exchanges below with corrections and clarifications.]
(¹And how are they entitled to know what it is - it is not a trivial right to peek.)
But the core issue remains: they have disabled the SIMs, they have reappropriated the numbers of paying customers.
From one of their employees: «While at the store they can reactivate your account with your old number if it is still available»
When one buys petrol, how can it the seller's business which engines will see it.
In the basicmost terms: if the connection technologies of some devices stop being supported by the infrastructure, what is expected is that the subscriber will deal with it in their own terms - not that the contract is ceased!
What the fuck? Here in Germany, customers have the freedom of porting their number over to a new provider 30 days after contract cancellation [1], precisely to prevent such scenarios.
[1] https://dejure.org/gesetze/TKG/59.html
Unfortunately, the rep insisted that all telcos would follow suit, and there would be no phones used without 5G compatibility soon.
The higher your resolution is the more you can be sold for.
Conveniently, they get to charge manufacturers for this certification process; and if consumers don't have a compatible phone, they get to advertise new expensive ones which come with installment plans.
Overall, it's a win-win for AT&T, and a loss for customers.
[0] https://www.theverge.com/2018/6/28/17515464/att-911-emergenc...
With low level of obstruction, the distance range of 5G is half a kilometer. The distance range of 4G is ~30km. 5G covers roughly one fiftieth of the distance of 4G.
If they phased out 4G, people still owning a mobile telephony device would stop receiving service when out of urban areas?
If its rolled out on 26ghz its bad in range. Sub 6 GHZ 5G rollout is as good or better than 4G on the same frequencies.
My carrier have rolled out 5G on 700 MHZ and I am seeing better coverage than their 4G network.
Range will be the same, but coverage can technically be a bit lower. This is because the modulation used for 5G uplink (phone to cell site) - OFDMA - is more complex than the modulation used for LTE uplink (SC-FDMA).
This is the same reason you might’ve been in a very rural area and seen 2G. It doesn’t necessarily mean there’s a 2G-only cell tower nearby; just that the 2G signals are more resilient to interference and signal loss.
The downside to that resilience is, of course, much lower complexity, and thus it can carry less binary data.
Um, no. I regularly connect to a N41 sector broadcasting over 12km away and pull 300-400mbit off it. That's midband 5G, which most consider medium distance.
AT&T is running 3G on 850mhz which they can put a 5G N5 carrier on. This can do that kind of range with obstructions, but is less spectrum so will congest easier like T-Mobile's 600mhz N71 carrier.
EDIT: WCDMA (3G) was always the weakest for coverage. Geographic cell sizes actually shrink as more users connect https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_breathing_(telephony)
This has caused many people to get notified of incompatible devices that they thought would work. The devices do continue to work, for now, but as 3G is shut down in a staggered fashion, they’ll seem like they work until the owner tries to make a phone call or realizes they haven’t received a call in a while.
This has approximately zero chance of being true. For instance, all iPhones before iPhone 12 lacked 5G. There's no way AT&T or any major carrier will get away with nuking support for iPhone 11, XS, X, 9, or 8. Probably not even iPhone 7, which still supports the latest version of iOS.
So that works. Verizon's PR had to do damage control on that. That got around. That's how you get them.
Next time record the convo. Record all your convos. They love to tell you black is white over the phone, but then in court, turns out now I am not a lawyer or nothing, but I'm pretty sure they tell them black is black and white is white. American courts work pretty well, especially when it's that clear cut, as far as I see it.
There should be a call app, of course the same people you're talking about are against this it's the telecoms and the smartphone people in bed together (like AT&T and Apple with the original iPhone, openly, and this 5G business) but anyway, the following could still be done. It starts recording the minute "this call might be recorded" sounds. A tiny ML model trained just for that, not connected to the internet, that switches on record when it hears that.
How are you supposed to record calls on iPhones?
Disabling phones because they're not "approved" is stupid but hey, US telco and stupidity are synonyms
«... Please make sure you will have a 4G and VoLTE telephone available for the end of the works, set for this date»
Looks pretty linear... It should be "base behaviour", what one should normally be entitled to expect.
Of course, we are sorry and concerned about this whole situation.
Edit: the original post disappeared: it mentioned that this user had service cancelled and telephone number reappropriated over an LG V30 - a 2017 device - because it was "not accepted in their system". It "joins the club" of many hit by the whitelist.
You may be disadvantaged but that number can be transferred to a new phone.
Or, possibly, your existing phone at a new carrier.
https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/porting-keeping-your-ph...
File a complaint with your state AG's consumer protection office.
Most have a specific form (usually online) for telecoms issues.
AT&T is a incredibly consumer-hostile company that does not play by the rules, can and will hold your phone numbers hostage, and as shown here will arbitrarily disable devices when it is convenient for them.
My Galaxy Note 8 supports VoLTE, but AT&T won't provision it and I don't really know why. My guess was that it would take extra work and they doesn't feel like doing it.
The spectrum is needed for 5G.
From the FCC:
https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/plan-ahead-phase-out-3g...
So how many years should a company continue to support old technologies?
3G was first released in 2002 (20 years ago) [0]
4G was 2010 (12 years ago), which was the successor to 3G (though I realized "4G" is a debated term) [1]
To put this into perceptive, Samsung/Google don't even support their cellphones older than about 2 years old.
Now I'm not suggesting a shorter support cycle, but 20 years seems more than fair.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3G
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4G
I can also buy a brand "new" telegraph today from Amazon for $10. Should carriers still support something that was created 100 years ago?
Very few people are advocating that they keep 3G around using 5x5MHz of spectrum for little gain; people are just advocating that they not limit consumers from using the supported device of their choice regardless of whether it's on the list.
[0] https://www.att.com/idpassets/images/support/pdf/Devices-Wor...
No one is saying ATT should continue operating their 3G network. On what grounds are they terminating subscriptions?
Also, there's more than just Apple/Samsung/Google. Operators are shutting off 3G, but keeping 2G alive for a while longer for crap that's abundant, and doesn't need anything more anyway.