Ask HN: I did not get pay rise – as only person in team. Should I quit?

31 points by hansor ↗ HN
Hi.

I'm sole developer working in some niche industry in team with 9 engineers.

Today our CEO announced that 80% of people in our company (thousands) received pay rise(due the inflation etc.).

It is first time in 4 years that I did not get any pay rise.

Just month ago I asked(via email) for feedback from my boss and he praised my skills, ambitions and working speed.

Reason that I did not get pay rise might be that I'm not afraid to criticize some stupid ideas, and I'm very offensive when it comes to handling projects (I lead, and I work hard). So I often have some silly(very short lived) conflicts with some of the engineers.

I love my job and industry, but I often have problem with my team (non programmers) and I lack "emotional" support form my boss(no "thank you" for working in weekends for example).

My boss refuses to talk with me about it.

Should I just quit?

86 comments

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Sounds a bit shit.

If you can find a better work environment then quit. I wouldn't work weekends without some form of recognition, which is sounds like you are not getting.

I mean, why would you give 80% of a company a raise and not this guy? Sounds like maybe he isn't someone they want to keep around long term?
Indeed, it sounds like they want him to leave and if he isn't getting on with the other engineers it might be for the best for everyone.
I think it’s not a good time to quit, unless you have enough savings. Ask for a raise
Having gone through a few major recessions in my life and survived (and not) layoffs, I find that the idea that "it's not a good time to quit" is a myth, and potentially a dangerous one. That is assuming "quit" implies having another job lined up (even in the best of times I'm not a big fan of just quitting with nothing lined up)

First off, if you want to change jobs, doing so when people are still hiring is a good idea. It's much easier to change jobs now that it will be in 3 months when other companies start doing layoffs. This stage in the down turn is right before the music stops in a game of musical chairs.

Additionally, at this stage in the down turn, it's impossible to know what's next and how bad it will be and who will be impacted the most. I've known far more people laid off while working at "safe" companies than those knowingly taking risks at smaller companies. Sure some companies will layoff new hires first, but others will layoff older, less productive division, other will look for highest paid employees etc. Nowhere is really safe and only hindsight will tell you what was and wasn't a good move. Best time to join Amazon would have been right after the dotcom burst.

Most important, in the last few down turns I've been through, agility and adaptability where the keys to survival. The "play it safe at a big co/job you know" path, somewhat ironically, only works really well is times of stability. This is a time to keep your eyes open, start thinking about a wide range of next future moves. It's better to jump without hesitation (and be ready to jump again) than look for stable ground.

That said it's more important than ever to do you due diligence on a future employer. Now is not a great time to join a startup run by "kids" (this is not a comment on age, but on maturity) that don't know what they're doing and make rash decisions and are delusional about the future of their product. I was take a hard pass on any crypto companies right now, and on companies that won't talk much about their financials.

> no "thank you" for working in weekends for example

At least, stop working in weekends. (Unless you can somewhat compensate the hours reducing the time during the other days of the week.)

Wait to quit. Wait for do your daily jobs unless the boss explain its choice.
your boss refuses to give you feedback on why you didn't get a pay raise?

email their manager and ask them why you didn't get a pay raise because your manager isn't answering questions.

Also, important: did you clearly indicate you wanted/expected one beforehand?

If their company went through a regular pay assessment cycle, and they did not get an inflation adjustment, then they received a pay cut - especially if all other employees received an inflation bump.

Many companies break down a cost of living adjustment separate from a performance increase, and it sounds like at the very least the op should be asking about a missing cost of living adjust.

>Also, important: did you clearly indicate you wanted/expected one beforehand?

yup

Yes, this is a skip-level discussion. Don't threaten to leave, or anyhting. Just patiently ask why you're not getting feedback (written or verbal) on why you didn't get a raise. Make it clear you're interested in learning precisely what you need to do to qualify for one.

If at that point they dont' give you actionable feedback, get a competitive job offer and share it with the head of HR at your company along wiht a short note saying that you can't afford to keep working there.

Don't quit until you have another job offer in hand. But you should start getting job interviews.
If you admit to being offensive and often having conflicts, it sounds like you already have an idea of why you did not get a raise. I'd tell your boss that refusal to talk about makes you feel like you are not wanted there, so if they do want you on the team, that discussion needs to happen.

And if it doesn't, then yes - it sounds like there are some problems in both directions, so maybe it is time to find something else.

> I'd tell your boss that refusal to talk about makes you feel like you are not wanted there...

IMO, he's probably not wanted there given what he's said about himself and that the boss won't talk about it. The whole situation sounds to me like they don't want to fire him but are hoping he'll leave.

> The whole situation sounds to me like they don't want to fire him but are hoping he'll leave

Depending on where the company is located, I would say this could be likely. In certain places, an intentional termination of any sort, can result in legally mandated exit payout packages.

Don't quit right away, but start interviewing and get an offer. You'll be in a better position to negotiate. And you can still quit then.
You should never quit until you have another offer in hand.

> Reason that I did not get pay rise might be that I'm not afraid to criticize some stupid ideas, and I'm very offensive when it comes to handling projects (I lead, and I work hard). So I often have some silly(very short lived) conflicts with some of the engineers.

I'm all about pushing back on "stupid ideas" but you might want to think about coming up with a less abrasive way to do it. That won't win you any friends and could hinder your ability to get other jobs in the future "He was a hard worker but no one wanted to work with him". You can skate by for a while acting this way but it will come back to bite you. Working on your soft skills can be invaluable and let you go much further than you otherwise might.

But all that said, I'd look for a new job unless you want to try asking for a raise. Even if you get the raise, if it feels like pulling teeth, then start looking. Also don't work outside 9-5 hours unless you are compensated, companies will take advantage of that and not care if you burn out.

> You should never quit until you have another offer in hand.

Assuming you don't want some time out in between jobs of course.

Eh... Most companies are flexible on start dates. If you want to take some time off, just put that start date a month or two past your end date.
You can still quit and delay your start date. You can also request to go on unpaid time off. You don't need to disclose that your time off will be spent on interview prep :).
I would personally try to get the new job to delay my start date if the alternative was to hunt for a new job while having none.
Of course! I just meant don't quit out of spite ever. It's always better to keep plodding along at your current job (income, health insurance, etc) until you find an alternative.

Whatever spike of adrenaline/endorphins you get in that moment will not be worth it in the long run.

Another way to put it is “revenge is a dish best served cold”.
Thats been seriously untrue for myself. I found myself in a job that was a complete joke while also pounding me with off the wall expectations changing at every turn. How could you possibly plod through an environment like that while maintaining the energy to take on the second job of finding a job. I wouldn't say I quit out of spite, I quit out of severe disillusionment, so perhaps your advice is not qualified to apply in that case. But the general advice to quit a job when you have an offer in hand may be good for most but bad for some in particular circumstances. I would say don't dig yourself deeper into whatever hole you may find yourself, if that means you gotta stick out a job because you have no other runway well then do that. But taking time off from working for the economy doesn't mean its a net loss for yourself in the long run, it can free up resources to pursue more lucrative options, especially true when the knowledge worker is unyoked from all the cognitive demands of their day job.

Everyone, please fully qualify your advice.

> I just meant don't quit out of spite ever.

I don't think your situation is "spite", if you are stuck in a toxic environment that is doing more damage to you than the good (pay/insurance) then by all means quit. It's the "I'll show them!", "They can't handle this without me", twist of the knife that some people build up in their heads that I'm arguing against. In your case I'm guessing you didn't quit the same day you thought about quitting? It took a few days/weeks? I'm just trying to advise against acting hastily or in anger. Think it through and make sure you know the consequences before you do something that "feels good"/righteous.

Nicely articulated, I had quite the same experience as well.

People under-estimate the energy and effort to find a good second job and so actually best to take the time to get it right instead of jumping from one bad job to another just because of being afraid to quit while there is no job offer yet.

Also, logically thinking, every new graduate who is fresh out of school is just equipped with skills but is able to find a job so it should be even easier for someone who has already even further developed their skills to be able to find a second job even if they've already resigned from their previous job.

It seems like some people just think that they need some leverage of having an existing job in order to find a second job but in reality that doesn't make sense since skills are what is more important.

All bets are off if you have even minimal "fuck you" money, of course.

Most people don't, though. They can't go long without a job, and having a gap on their résumé is scary (for good reason—if you need a job, anything that might make getting the next one a little harder isn't good).

> having a gap on their résumé is scary

I always hear this, but nobody has ever questioned me when I said I took a few months just because I could and wanted some time off.

As a candidate just another question to worry about, even if it doesn't actually come up, and at best the result of it coming up is neutral, not positive for you. The more you need the job, the more stressful that sort of thing is.
+1. There is a Venn diagram of your best interests and the company's best interests. These circles often overlap, but personally, I would prioritize my own career development over my own (potentially wrong) opinions about what projects I should work on.
Take a month of vacation then see how they feel afterwards. Either way you're looking for an exit strategy.
Job hop every year :)
Do not quit, but do start interviewing. Once you get a better offer in hand, present it to your boss. If they refuse to match (or outbid) for you, then take the competing offer.
I'm not sure if I agree with this approach. I would say ask for a raise without showing you have an offer from another company. If they don't then leave. I feel like it is awkward to show them that you have offer and then stay. But It could be just me.
Personally, I don't care if they feel awkward, nor do I care to be perceived as loyal in matters of business. The awkward exchange wouldn't need to happen if they ensured that they're employees felt taken care of. You shouldn't feel accountable for that.
True, you have a point. Personally, if I wasn't fairly compensated I would just leave. I can understand that there could be situations that changing jobs might not be straight forward.
Uh, no. Just take it and quit.
No pay rise is pretty common in most companies in most years. You should think about what you really want. Do you want higher comp? Or do you want to work less? or a change to a different role? Promotion? Time off? Dont ask us what is best for you.
I want my pay to keep up with inflation - I understand that with 20 years of experience I'm at the top of where and engineer can get, but if my raises don't match inflation I'm getting a pay cut. If you really mean to give me a pay cut, then be honest about it.
Higher comp. always.
How often did the others get a raise in the last for years?
Vast majority of them once per year.
Don't work weekends, it isn't buying you anything.

No rush, look for a better job. If you find one you would be happier with, just take it if you also get a raise.

Maybe you need to learn to work as a team.

Hard work alone won't make you grow your career, you need to be tactful and you need to be a team player. Calling an idea stupid is childish and unprofessional.

If your boss announced that almost everyone else but you got a raise, he probably wants you to quit, just not enough to straight up fire you.

Either find somewhere else or consider this a wake up call to change.

> and I'm very offensive when it comes to handling projects

Offensive as in aggressive? or offensive as in rude? the latter will only hinder you. You can have a no-nonsense attitude without being annoying.

> no "thank you" for working in weekends for example

stop working weekends if you aren't getting paid for it

Proactive, rude, driven, suffer-no-fools, fast, unsustainable, etc. There's a lot that "offensive" could mean. I must admit, I'd look askance at anyone I work with describing their approach as "offensive".
offensive as in aggressive/agile/slick/no-nonsense/not lazy
Do you have "fuck you" money?

If the answer is yes then I would still wait until September or so if I were you - summer is slow season in recruitment and the job offers are usually uninspiring.

(comment deleted)
Yes. But first:

Secure a new job. And while you do that, work on your soft skills. You admit to being "offensive" and yet you want "emotional" support.

> My boss refuses to talk with me about it.

Get a strong documentation trail going, send an email indicating you need to speak with them about x, you're free anytime they are, send calendar invites etc.

Once you have their explicit refusal or implicit from negligence -- go to skip level (boss of your boss) and be prepared to need to move in the org as retaliation is too likely to risk.

> My boss refuses to talk with me about it.

Well, that's a red flag if I ever saw one. It sounds like you already have some areas you know you should be working on, and that's good. But if your boss refuses to talk to you about your career / pay then something is going on. Or maybe you just have a bad boss. Either way, I'd be looking for that reason alone.

>My boss refuses to talk with me about it.

Leave. Find another job, and then quit.

I personally would take a step back and get rid of any assumption about why I did not get a raise. You have jumped to the conclusion that you did not get a raise because of some personal defects. It could just as well be that 80% of the company was profoundly undercompensated whereas you are already compensated in line with market rates.

I think it's reasonable to expect your manager to provide more details. I would give my manager a heads up that if they do not explain I am going to escalate. In my escalation I would stick to the facts. "The CEO said 80% of the company got raises. I did not get a raise. I have asked my manager for an explanation. My manager refused to explain."

P.S. you should totally work on those personal defects that you've identified in yourself. It sounds like you may also have some responsibility in creating a toxic work environment.

> It could just as well be that 80% of the company was profoundly undercompensated whereas you are already compensated in line with market rates.

As a manager, I cannot emphasize this enough. It happens all the time.

It's very unlikely that a developer hired 4+ years ago is compensated in line with market rates. The market has gone bananas in that time and it would be very rare for a company proactively give raises big enough to match.
It's not unlikely at all. I've seen it many times.
Many people have won the lottery. That doesn't make it likely.