HN Explorer

Ask YC: I just got laid off, and I have some startup dreams.

32 points by rtf ↗ HN
Some background: I graduated college a little over a year ago with an Economics BA. I have the start of a career in game development; I did level design and scripting on a work-for-hire console license, which went six months from contract to ship. (Not a sane schedule.) There was stress, long hours, a month of working weekends, but I'm fine now; and the game shipped.

Since then the company hasn't gotten new gigs to support its staffing, so they had to let me go. Both the founders said they'd have me back in a heartbeat; I can probably find a job in gaming again with some time. I'm also working on some open source game tech ( http://gamesc.sourceforge.net/ ) - If I had to point to one technical skill I'm best at, coding is probably it.

However, starting a startup intrigues me more than game projects, and this seems like the time to consider it seriously...but although I'm in the Bay Area, I don't have connections in the startup world, and I really want to tap into that experience. Also, being deeply into games, I'd like to stick to that topic for business ideas. I don't know if I could buy into any old web app. Working on any old game is better, but only a little bit. I'm really keen on finding something innovative to do in the sector(business-wise) and a team to do it with; something that's really disruptive. I think it's possible. But I don't think I can do it alone.

I guess my question would be: What would be the right steps to take, to meet the kinds of people I want to meet that would work together on this kind of startup? Staying in the industry might be the way to meet the people I need. But I'm not convinced it's the best, or the only option.

29 comments

[ 4.8 ms ] story [ 82.0 ms ] thread
nuggien
I'd get another day job while I come up with an idea for a startup. Good ideas don't come by that easily.
trevelyan
Why is this modded down? I agree.
davidw
Mixing the job suggestion (which is probably good) with the idea suggestion (something people are biased against: execution vs ideas). alaskamiller's comment below/above is more practical in terms of the job.
jacobscott
I think I agree. If you decide not to get a real job while searching for startup footing, make sure that you're learning enough to balance the opportunity cost of salary, on the job learning, and startup stuff on the side.

What you don't want to do is end up like Seth Rogen in Knocked Up -- unless your goal is to be a stoned slacker. Note that Katherine Heigl is unlikely to sleep with you in real life.

immad
This post is a good start. Contact me, we might be able to work together. Or I will give you tips anyway.

My email is i.akhund (at) gmail (dot) com

iamelgringo
I just got home from the Hackers and Founders Meetup 20 minutes ago. And, I started the group because I wanted the exact same thing: To hang out and talk with people who are serious about founding startups.

We get together in the Bay Area every two weeks to hang out, have a tasty beverage and talk about startups, the web, stuff we read on Hacker News, etc...

We've had between 20-30 attendee's the past few meetups, and people really seem to enjoy it.

Our next get-together is going to be a little different. The founders of Heysan and Snipd have agreed to give a presentation. So, there will be a 1-1/2 hour presentation and we'll be adjourning to the hotel bar after that for socializing.

Anyway, the address for the meetup is http://www.hackersandfounders.com

If you're interested, stop by or drop me a line. I'll buy you a drink.

jacobscott
Does anyone have a good writeup somewhere of all such (public) groups? I trust HN pointers/analysis over just searching meetup. I'm relatively new to the valley, it would be nice to figure out what part of the technology social network I fit best with.
iamelgringo
A lot of it depends on what you're interested in. There are Meetup groups for most technologies out there: Rails, MySQL, LAMP. And, then there are Web 2.0 groups, "New Tech" meetups, general entrepreneur groups and business groups. Each one tends to have a focus and a slant. Some are sponsored, some aren't.

The Hackers and Founders group I host tends have about 1/3 to 1/2 of members read Hacker News on a regular basis. I'm also running it to simply build community. I'm not getting any financial return on the deal. I'm really just doing it to get to know other Hackers and Founders.

There are also non-Meetup.com groups like super happy dev house: http://superhappydevhouse.org/ and various and sundry Tech Crunch get-togethers, Digg parties, etc...

My advice would be to try a couple out. Worst case scenario, you're out a couple hours of your time.

rtf
When I got my game gig it was through demonstrating work at a Meetup group(San Francisco Game Developers), so I know this is a good place to start. I'm planning to show for as many of these events as I can.
hbien
Hey rtf, I'm in the Bay Area too. There are _tons_ of meet ups, hackfests, and user group meetings you can go to.

SupperHappyDevHouse is coming up this Saturday (Oct 3rd) and the Hackers & Founders meetup is Oct 16th.

Usually the goal of these meetings isn't to find another founder though, it's just to have fun by hanging out and sharing interesting ideas w/ like minded people.

I think it might be a good place to start though.

shawndrost
Start going to the local hacking/entrepreneurship/etc meetups, there're probably 4-6 per week in your area. meetup.org
danielh
I second that. Meetups are the best way to get in touch with like-minded and interesting people.
wastedbrains
I agree, I believe the new tech meetup in SF is the largest in the country.

Also find a language or group specific to gaming. SF Ruby meetup is huge.

bootload
"... the game shipped ..."

Bummer. This highlights a problem making games. Revenue is project based and a bit like farming a crop. Miss the schedule, a hardware release, market and you don't get paid as much.

"... What would be the right steps to take, to meet the kinds of people I want to meet that would work together on this kind of startup? ... I'm in the Bay Area ..."

A job for "Gabriel Weinberg's" AskYC Archive ~ http://www.gabrielweinberg.com/startupswiki/Ask_YC_Archive look under Founders

spoiledtechie
Thank you for this Link!!!!

It is a huge amount of information that I really need. Thank you.

(coming from a guy who also wants to start up a business)

Thank you.

bootload
"... Thank you for this Link!!!! ... It is a huge amount of information that I really need. ..."

Save the thanks for Gabriel for the "Best-Of" links and the Askyc team for comments search & where I go to find things. They are really adding a great deal of value.

alaskamiller
Do you have money saved up? If so budget that to work on your ideas and network for 3 to 5 months. If not, get another job.

Networking in the valley is not that hard. You can establish a pretty decent network within just a few weeks. My email is alaska.miller@gmail.com, I'm in Cupertino, let's get in touch.

guit
Go work for a start up. It's the best place to meet and learn from talented developers, founders, VCs, well-connected board members, etc. Build and keep those relationships.

Brainstorm ideas and then sleep on them.

Hack on the weekends.

And then when you're ready, make your move.

wastedbrains
I think this is good advice if I would have known more about the startup world I would have worked at a startup out of college instead of big business.

If you are not opposed to moving there is a great opportunity to work with some cool startups in Boulder, CO

http://boulder.me/

Shameless plug, I am in Boulder. My startup is a bit to small to be a part of Boulder.Me, but I know a bunch of the teams involved and it is really cool.

Jaykyburz
pffft.. screw startups, go work with the best people in the business on one of the best projects out there, Bioshock 2. 2K Marin are looking for level designers.

http://www.2kmarin.com/

tell em Jay from 2K Aus sent ya.

jyu
Given your current position, this is really sound advice. The team behind Bioshock was innovative, relatively small, and they made an incredible impact on the gaming world.

As many before me have said, it's better to start a start up when the opportunity and market timing are right, not when your timing is right. In the mean time, working with a bunch of performers with a proven track record isn't a bad alternative.

vaksel
Well you can try doing one of those mobwars type games. Some of them are profitable, just come up with a good idea, and make some good images(most of them have crappy looking images).
maxklein
If you like games, then do games, don't do web apps. Web apps are good for stuff that needs the web, but for stuff for whom the web is just a nice thing, but not neccessary, web apps are often not the best solution. It's easier to sell desktop software than web software.

And another important thing: Don't start a business from a position where you have little money. It will make you cut corners for the sake of making money, and you will not like your product as much as if you had time to really craft it out. So I advice you to find a job which is stable and does not take too much time, then develop your game on the side.

Game programming takes looooong, and nobody will finance you while you try to make a game. Get a job, do it on the side. It's the adult thing to do. Anyone who tells you to quit everything you have and play the lottery with your life savings probably has something to gain by you doing this.

AlexTheFounder
rtf, while you call your startup ideas "startup dreams", don't go for it. Go for it only when you start calling it "passion" and know where to start
tstegart
You might want to try your hand at iPhone games. There's currently a lot of room in the industry for new players. It has low barriers to entry, yet people are seeing a huge return on investments, and you can get projects out the door in a smaller time frame than most games take to develop and market. To me, it seems like the perfect space for a new business with little capital and lots of skill. I'd even say its perfectly suited to you. You can learn a new language and practically make yourself golden when it comes to being employed if your venture doesn't work out, because there's huge demand for iPhone programmers.
rtf
Thanks for your comments, everyone. I'll start following up on specific comments shortly, but some general thoughts:

My reasons for wanting to go for a new business have to do with the calcified nature of the development process; now that I've "seen the elephant" in this side of the business it's all much less interesting, and it won't get better just by changing my employer. It won't get better by going indie, even. I want to go beyond shipping products and find the next level - the franchise, the organization, whatever term might apply.

So in that sense I'm not worried about the product idea, just the process - the potential of changing and improving it. That's where I think the startup world has something to offer.