I think the wide range is appropriate given that the thread is trying to extrapolate an entire company's culture from a single word in a job posting title. It's up for interpretation, but I think the message the company is trying to get across is that their culture is not like that portrayed in the recent LinkedIn employee TikTok videos.
I"m mad at myself for seeing the CEO of one of my former employers pushing the book Grit constantly, seeing the above behavior and not putting two and two together for months...
That's perfectly reasonable, many companies are not in a position where they can afford (or are able) to grow someone up.
I see way more juniors hired than companies can afford, and then people wonder why nothing gets done with "so many developers".
Each junior absorb capacity from more senior employees.
It's purely a business choice whether you hire someone to grow up or not.
I have experience with jobs that were the opposite of these (except for long hours) and definitely required grit. Which is still to say: not pleasant, but rewarding. It might be reasonable for some jobs to filter out people looking for “pleasant”, without it being a toxic work environment.
“Filthy mouth” is something a stuck up cunt would say. Cultures are different. Unless it turns into verbal abuse, get over it.
There is a huge variety of cultures that speak English and only a subset can’t handle hearing certain words. Having a problem with people swearing is effectively classism in the US.
I think in most cases it's just "talent" throwing a buzzword out there and is pointless to read into. On the other hand I agree it has the connotation that most people have brought up. If somehow the culture is really "gritty" it sounds like an excuse to coerce people into working without support and convincing them it's a good thing
Do people still say those terms? I feel like they were cool (well, at least not utter cringe) for like 6 months 10+ years ago and ever since has been a signal of cluelessness. “Grit” at least implies self-awareness / honesty so long as it’s not paired with other indicators that it’s coming from the “hustle culture” idiom
I'm cringing at this jobs website in my country that lists 47 "ninja" jobs including "Mortgage Broker Ninja" and "Customer service Ninja" among others...
I assume they want to hire someone who resembles the official mascot of the Philadelphia hockey team. Important skills include threatening physical violence over social media.
I'm less cynical than others here. They probably just wanted a job ad title that a) sticks out b) gets your attention by making you reflect on your own personality and c) entice you to click through to the ad and see what kind of jobs "gritty people" applying for.
As I write this comment almost everyone else in the thread is interpreting it to mean some variation of an abusive workplace environment. The guy you responded to is being more charitable and less cynical than that.
I think it's actually more cynical than the other comments, because in the case of abusive workplace environments, asking for "gritty" employees is a fairly honest thing to do, and gives a decent indication of what the company is like. Whereas the commenter here was suggesting that the term "gritty" is a nothing more than a meaningless attention getter, and thus totally insincere.
This is like emails from Nigerian princes with deliberate grammatical errors. It weeds out candidates who would turn them down after an interview, leaving only those candidates desperate or gullible enough to take the position.
I'm never going to work for a company that encourages "hustle". Uber's "always be hustlin'" was so astonishing I couldn't believe it was real when I first heard it.
To me this directly implies they want to move fast and ignore ethics and morality in order to do so. Like, that's pretty much one of the accepted definitions of that word?
Do you really think the majority of Uber engineers have forsaken all morality? A more plausible explanation is that bad patterns can emerge from systems where most of the players are still behaving [locally] ethically.
Grit can be defined as "Perseverance of Effort and Consistency of Interest" [0] so when I see an ad looking for "gritty people" I assume they're trying to find folks who tend to keep working on a problem consistently and won't want to move on until the work is completed.
Kind of a boring response, but I think you're reading too much into this. It's just a word.
Funny to see it rubbed so many people the wrong way. It actually stood out in a positive way to me, I read it as “we want people who bring projects to the finish line, including if they are challenging”. The reason I would see it as a positive is that I would expect the existing culture to reflect that, and it’s a quality I value in colleagues. As a shared culture it also seems like a good trait for a growing company.
It seemed a net positive to me too. Presumably, you would join a fast growing company for a challenge and not just to coast or “quiet quit“. You would want colleagues who feel the same esp. if chunk of your compensation is locked up in equity.
>> “we want people who bring projects to the finish line, including if they are challenging”
I think that statement would attract better candidates than wanting gritty people. One reason for that is that very capable people need less grit to succeed than others that are less capable.
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[ 0.23 ms ] story [ 278 ms ] threadSOURCE: my current company likes me and the other 2 gritty software engineers.
Worst case: they want to hire people that will work endless hours to meet arbitrary deadlines
https://nypost.com/2022/08/23/linkedin-employee-reignites-wo...
I see way more juniors hired than companies can afford, and then people wonder why nothing gets done with "so many developers". Each junior absorb capacity from more senior employees.
It's purely a business choice whether you hire someone to grow up or not.
https://www.amazon.com/Grit-Passion-Perseverance-Angela-Duck...
There is a huge variety of cultures that speak English and only a subset can’t handle hearing certain words. Having a problem with people swearing is effectively classism in the US.
I'm cringing at this jobs website in my country that lists 47 "ninja" jobs including "Mortgage Broker Ninja" and "Customer service Ninja" among others...
https://www.seek.com.au/ninja-jobs
https://twitter.com/lennyaduncan/status/1328769408773148672
Regardless, I feel like that's a little too optimistic.
Makes me think of a snyder movie. Would you want to live in a snyder movie?
To me this directly implies they want to move fast and ignore ethics and morality in order to do so. Like, that's pretty much one of the accepted definitions of that word?
Cynical view: they're cheap and want you to do the job of 2 or more people.
Kind of a boring response, but I think you're reading too much into this. It's just a word.
[0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4981570/
I think that statement would attract better candidates than wanting gritty people. One reason for that is that very capable people need less grit to succeed than others that are less capable.
Which makes it content-free, because that's what every company is looking for anyway.