Ask HN: How do you overcome feeling completely lost in life?

You can get a pet to start, a fish-tank is super-low maintenance and quite nice and distracting when you need it to be.

Make a routine where you get out of the house and go buy a newspaper. Then read it on a bench somewhere.

Start with these two.

I'm pretty much in the same boat, so I don't have any good advice, but you have my sympathy. The only thing that's kept me going for the past year is setting a "final project" to complete before I die. This "big goal" feels a little less pointless than the "small goals", even though I know it's not.

I used to feel intensely lonely until my 30s. I made significant efforts to get out there and socialize. Something changed and I'm now considered a very extroverted person by others. A few things clicked inside me. Some books you may want to consider:

1) Dale Carnegie's how to win friends and influence people book.

2) The Game by Neil Strauss(friend gave me a copy .. this is about pick up artists, something I never did but it was influential in some way)

3) Surely you're joking Mr. Feynmann

All these books have something about being social. I make it a bit to get to know strangers (on planes, uber rides, whatever). I almost think of it as a missed opportunity if I don't have an engaging conversation with people. Many are strangers and I'll never see them again, so if I say something stupid, whatever. I guess that is the idea I got from The Game.

I still suck in group settings socially. I feel incredibly awkward. But 1-1, I am actually impressed with my transformation. I was super introverted until exactly 30. I guess one other thing that changed is if someone invites me to something social, I always came along, and I kept a smile on my face. This was exceptionally easy to do in NYC (getting invites to hang out with people I mean).

I also have to say, friend, you must love and respect yourself, first and foremost. I felt some pain in your words. Look .. we all have done stupid things we may cringe on in reflection. My addiction is tech and online shopping. I try to do my vices in moderation. Don't judge yourself too harshly. We're all imperfect humans. Good luck to you.

> In my early twenties, I would self-medicate with various addictions

Which ones? Some drugs are more social than others. On the other hand, your problems sound pretty deep-seated and you probably won't relax enough to bridge that gap with recreational use. You'd probably be better with a therapeutic approach.

> Setting personal goals is even more hopeless when at the core, I just feel empty. Every time I try to set even small goals for myself (starting personal projects, hobbies, etc.)

I don't think 'deciding' to have a hobby ever works that well. It is perfectly normal to get interested in something, try it out, and then lose interest after the initial thrill has worn off. But drive comes from being obsessed by something even if you're useless at it. Avoid comparing yourself to others, which is a huge problem in this age of social media. Your solitary tendencies are an asset here in that you can take time to get really into something that fascinates you. It's fine to find this late or be lost along the way.

> [...] gravity pulls me back into the void. Any sort of direction or intention feels like trying to build a house of cards on a non-existent foundation.

It sounds very much like you're judging your efforts on the foreseeable outcome, and lacking depth/experience that outcome doesn't seem that great. Don't worry about it. It's perfectly OK to just please yourself, and even if all you ever work on are simple things, those might be the useful examples someone else desperately needs. Don't worry about the outcome, do it because you like it. Being goal-oriented is not the only way to go and tbh I think it's massively overrated.

Some of that is cultural. One approach you should consider is trying out a different culture for a while to see if you like it. Moving to a different country for a while is the closest thing there is to a life reset button. You have to deal with people because you don't know your way around, to the point of perhaps needing language classes. And you have to work differently at it because you'll need to meet people across linguistic and cultural gap, so you'll get a lot of practice telling your backstory and answering the kind of predictable questions about it (from superficial to serious and thought provoking). It's totally OK to be kind of awkward in this situation. In general it's fine to be awkward as long as you're nice. You'll also be able to practice listening and asking other people about their lives, and making it easier for other awkward people to communicate with you.

Having a solid economic situation gives you a huge head start. Figure out the logistics, pack a bag, and head off somewhere - don't overthink it, just follow your whims. If your first whim isn't that rewarding, try somewhere else. Just go be a part-time tourist for a while and immerse yourself in some different environments until you stumble on something you really like.

It's a little hard to provide good advice when you say that the deep sense of emptiness has always been with you, and that you have no idea what you want to change.

I'm sure you've spent a lot of time thinking about how you feel, so I find it interesting that you're unable to identify what potentially could fix the sense of emptiness. Have there been any times in your life when you felt significantly less empty or even somewhat closer to a sense of meaning?

I agree with a couple of the other posters that what society expects people to want can feel very sick and pointless, and that people in such a society often internalize unhealthy assumptions over time (selfishness, isolation, etc).

Maybe spending time in a foreign country with a healthier culture would be good, or trying to carefully reconsider some of the most fundamental axioms / perspectives that you might have unconsciously internalized. Maybe it's worth dropping some of those axioms or adopting new ones? If you feel like you've hit a bottom, then testing out new perspectives just for fun might be worthwhile (or at least harmless, since the only place to go is up).

This is one of those few posts that i feel like I’ve posted myself while sleepwalking:)

I feel your pain, bro. At least to the degree possible via writing.

I’ve been there and partially still am.

I haven’t got my sh* together. And haven’t even figured out for sure what i wanna do with my life. Or better say - what else/next I am going to do with it.

And you know what, a substantial (if not most) part of the so called successful people you see on the internet - neither.

I promised myself not to pretend anymore that I have. Not to lie to myself and others when possible.

The good thing is that you have something inside you that craves for a change. It cannot take it no more.

I would focus on this something first.

> no idea what I even want to change

Here you go! There’s a force inside you that wants to change your state of being.

And this has giant meaning for you. Otherwise you wouldn’t bother posting here, right?

So why don’t you start respecting and nourishing this part of you first?

You have nothing to loose, as your other parts didn’t have any luck finding any meaning anyway, did they?

This is what helped me to climb out of the deep black hole i once spiraled down into.

Not to the happy life, but at least to the level when I was motivated enough not to miss an amazing wife god sent my way and start a family.

This has not solved the “void” issue for me. No happy end here, sorry.

But this and having a baby pushed me out of my comfort zone in a good, even though very mentally and physically challenging, way.

Next big step up from the void for me was working with psychotherapist. Although I’ve spent quite an effort finding the “right one”.

This hasn’t made me happy either, sorry :)

But it helped me to start learning to listen to my deep inner voice. The same one that originally screamed for help to get him out of the emotional, social and mental void I’ve put him into.

It helped me to start really caring about me, instead of boosting my ego or supporting my public mask.

It helped me to start recovering that intimate connection with myself most people suggesting to solve such issues by healthy diet or Stoicism teaching take for granted.

I keep learning. And my wifi signal from this inner self is still weak, connection keeps interrupting :)

But at least I am at the point where those surface level meditation/hobby/gym/books/sleeping advice start making some sense to me. And start having some positive effect.

I agree with virtueman's comment here that there is something messed up with environment (using that term quite liberally here) where you have material luxury but can't quite share it with anybody. However in every problem lies an opportunity. And allow me to share it as how I -an outsider- sees it.

When you say `software developer quickly approaching 30 with no direction in life, no hobbies, no friends, no family, and no idea what I even want to change.`

I see the following facts: a person who can earn a reasonable amount of money to live well and who does not have pressing personal obligations to others at this point in their lives. This allows this person to do things that a lot of people can't do and as such he/she should try somethings that are well suited for said person as described by the facts.

Some actionable ideas: 1. Volunteer - ideally through physical labour. 2. Leave the country you are in work in a different place/culture. 3. Leave the country you are in and travel while keeping your job (this requires you have a remote job) 4. Explore new hobbies. People typically make friends around shared interests. 4.1 - eg: photography but of type that requires doing something new like, sports photography - forces you to go out to events and capture action; astrophotography - forces you to go out explore the night skies and be a part of that group; macro photography - forces you to see things that most people miss, Microscopic photography - get a microscope, stick a camera on it and stick a small piece of whatever you are having for lunch or dinner under it; bird photography - forces you to chase birds and the next thing you know you will meet interesting members from the Audubon society. 4.2 Arts: drawing, painting, sketching.. take some classes - ideally in person- see if anything sticks. 4.3 Creating something with your hands: wood working, ceramics etc 5. Last but not least - start listening to your inner voice. Most people feel lost (including myself when I was - more before than now) when for one reason or another have stopped listening what they wanted. I think this typically happens during childhood/yound adulthood and progresses over time to a point where what you want is completely overshadowed by your conceptions of what the society/environment/culture thinks of what somebody your age/type should want. This is usually years in the making and take some time to undo but with perseverance can be undone. Start small with little things like lunch - what do you want for lunch and not what you should be having for lunch. ask yourself such questions at various time during the day everyday to see if there is an incongruence between what you are doing in that moment / timeframe and what you want to do ideally (even if its impractical). this is how you listen yourself and over time learn to listen to you 'voice'

Good luck and the best is most definitely yet to come for you!

It's 6 AM. My wife's away for work, I didn't digest a pizza, I have dishes to do before the plumber comes at 8, a gift package to collect at some UPS point at 7, some residual burnout due to too many things to do in the last week, month, year, years, and a Monster energy drink yesterday which has completely blown up my metabolism. I'm on Discord looking for humans, you know, a little irrational, non-conformant human beings. That spark of chaos that brings curiosity back in and depression out. I've been struggling all life with minor depression, I'm 38. A developer who hasn't done any career. I remember times being younger nerding at night learning Linux with no regrets , or when I was playing in a videogames' music band. It's not what I do, it's the degree of freedom that I felt in doing it. Now I could play bass again but it would not be the same. But I'll tell you, keep on searching and fighting. Life is a journey, you'll never know where you'll end up. Things come unexpected

Read Ecclesiastes - he feels your pain.

Focus on getting out the house first. Experience the world. Try meditation. Exercise - not for muscle or aesthetics, but because of the endorphins that will make you feel better.

Don't set goals. The only goal should be to undertake these actions regularly. Life might still feel intellectually empty while doing these things, and that's okay. The point here is to start with your body as it'll feed your mind and you might start to feel a bit better.

My advice is this:

Become a different person.

Take your life and incinerate it. Not literally of course.

I mean completely change what and who you are.

You’re an accomplished software engineer at 30? Great. You’re done doing that.

Go buy a $15k trailer, get a truck, and hit the road. Stop looking at screens, only read books. Stop working a job behind a desk, find something else, or if you can afford it don’t work at all.

I suggest reading CrimeThInc: Days of War, Nights of Love. https://crimethinc.com/books/days-of-war-nights-of-love

Pick up a guitar, learn to farm, meet some nomads. Do it all in another country. Break the law. Do whatever you feel like. Don’t hurt people, obviously, but you’re probably a sane enough person to not want to anyway. Learn a new language. Stop speaking your old one. I mean, really, and truly, break out of the matrix. Go to the edges of your universe, like the “Thirteenth Floor”. Get fit, dissolve your old identity. Become awesome at yoga, or weightlifting, or Jiu Jitsu.

You really can choose to become unstuck. Fly to Europe, buy a bike and a tent, and just go, man. Figure it out later. What’s there to be afraid of, really?

Jim Carrey said:

“People talk about depression all the time. The difference between depression and sadness is sadness is just from happenstance — whatever happened or didn’t happen for you, or grief, or whatever it is. Depression is your body saying f*ck you, I don’t want to be this character anymore, I don’t want to hold up this avatar that you’ve created in the world. It’s too much for me.

You should think of the word ‘depressed’ as ‘deep rest.’ Your body needs to be depressed. It needs deep rest from the character that you’ve been trying to play.”

This is clearly linked to one of the four existential givens "meaning and meaninglessness.

Carl Jung said, man needs to find meaning to continue his journey around the world, therefore, without this meaning, he is lost in no man’s land and wandering the labyrinth of existence.

I too felt this great cloud hanging over me in my early 30's, I am now nearly 70.

I left school with no formal qualifications, worked in the building trade and constantly asked myself "Is this all there is". For me, I found that while I was stuck in this place of no return, the boredom, the depression and an overwhelming sense of just giving up on life I found my way. It is in this place that you need to trust your organic self to find your way.

I came to realise that everything I had previously done in my life has been programming by society, family and a raft of other institutions. Ultimately none of this I actaully chose to be my life.

So I changed my life to do things that I wanted. I gorged on books and went back to college and university, qualified as a psychotherapists and spent the next 30 years loving life.

Taking responsibility, another existentialist requirement. Namely taking responsibility for your current life situation. As Sartre said, "The individual still retains the agency over their own existence and they are still free to make the choice"

At 30 years old your brain has only been fully developed for about 5 years, Now is the time to reconstruct the life you choose.

books: all Carl Jung, Victor Frankl, Irvin Yalom or any existential philosophers

Are you really lost if you can point out you're lost?

Read some Ecclesiastes or "Man's Search for Meaning" by Viktor Frankl. Or maybe "Narrative of the Life of Frederick Douglass" for some perspective.

At certain times in life the watering hole dries up, when external and/or internal motives have been squeezed to their last drop it sometimes feels like a desert. Those moments present the opportunity to head down a path to become more authentically loving (Christ-like). Following that lighthouse is always the right direction, no matter how lost you may feel.

Volunteer. Go help other people. Something with commitment, not just casual. See how other people are trying to survive. Perhaps you’ll start appreciating how fortunate you are in the process. Take responsibility upon yourself. Stick through it.

Join the military. Join the police. Set a goal to pass and get accepted.

Start doing a sport. Track your progress vigorously. Commit to doing it for at least a year. Rain or sunshine, snow or mud.

This is Oogway in you is getting disappointed with Shifu.

> There is an old Eastern fable about a traveler who is taken unawares on the steppes by a ferocious wild animal. In order to escape the beast the traveler hides in an empty well, but at the bottom of the well he sees a dragon with its jaws open, ready to devour him. The poor fellow does not dare to climb out because he is afraid of being eaten by the rapacious beast, neither does he dare drop to the bottom of the well for fear of being eaten by the dragon. So he seizes hold of a branch of a bush that is growing in the crevices of the well and clings on to it. His arms grow weak and he knows that he will soon have to resign himself to the death that awaits him on either side. Yet he still clings on, and while he is holding on to the branch he looks around and sees that two mice, one black and one white, are steadily working their way round the bush he is hanging from, gnawing away at it. Sooner or later they will eat through it and the branch will snap, and he will fall into the jaws of the dragon. The traveler sees this and knows that he will inevitably perish. But while he is still hanging there he sees some drops of honey on the leaves of the bush, stretches out his tongue and licks them. In the same way I am clinging to the tree of life, knowing full well that the dragon of death inevitably awaits me, ready to tear me to pieces, and I cannot understand how I have fallen into this torment. And I try licking the honey that once consoled me, but it no longer gives me pleasure. The white mouse and the black mouse – day and night – are gnawing at the branch from which I am hanging. I can see the dragon clearly and the honey no longer tastes sweet. I can see only one thing; the inescapable dragon and the mice, and I cannot tear my eyes away from them. And this is no fable but the truth, the truth that is irrefutable and intelligible to everyone.

> The delusion of the joys of life that had formerly stifled my fear of the dragon no longer deceived me. No matter how many times I am told: you cannot understand the meaning of life, do not thinking about it but live, I cannot do so because I have already done it for too long. Now I cannot help seeing day and night chasing me and leading me to my death. This is all I can see because it is the only truth. All the rest is a lie.

> Those two drops of honey, which more than all else had diverted my eyes from the cruel truth, my love for my family and for my writing, which I called art – I no longer found sweet.

—Leo Tolstoy, A Confession

Change your location and observe yourself. If you feel better, that's the right direction.

I'll e-mail you with more ideas.

I've been in what I think is a similar place before. Every now and then, I still find myself right there on the edge. In those moments, for me, it's not that I want to exist, or not exist, it's just ...grey. And, an average grey at that - let's call it #CCC. Nothing drives me or energizes me. I just ... am. The advice you mention -- finding friends, connecting with the world around you, finding purpose, finding passion, finding things that satisfy the brain -- was always useless advice to me. It's honestly good advice if a person is in a position to receive it and when they try it, it actually works and moves the needle. It just didn't work for me because it was the wrong timing. I needed to solve my first problems first.

I had to figure out my brain chemistry and what my brain needed. Once everything was mostly fine-tuned through some meds and therapy, I was able to better figure out what I needed.

I found the advice that was previously useless to me made a difference. It's not like code though where you knock something out and after twenty hours of hard work you feel like you achieved something grand and you're proud of your work. No, this is a much slower pace and it requires persistence. Small attempts day by day leads to things looking entirely different after a year.

I needed to work on my physical health and exercise more. I needed healthier habits and boundaries with work. That put my brain chemistry in an even better position.

I needed a connection to people. I too am not the best at maintaining relationships. My brain has issues with object permanence. If it is not in front of me, even people, I just don't think about them. I set up a notebook as a personal CRM and I try to check in with a group of friends and a very close friend as often as I can. Be sure to make a close friend or two. Someone you can share who you really are with. Talk about the things that are not going well in your life. Our culture doesn't promote people being vulnerable with one another but it makes a huge difference if you can find a friend you feel comfortable getting close to. It was challenging for me in my mid to late thirties to try and connect with people again. People are married, have kids, and have moved on and I simply did not stay in touch. Here I was suddenly 'showing back up' as if I hadn't flaked on them for the last 15 years. It has made a difference to have friends. At the end of the day, we're a social species, even the most introverted of us. It may not feel natural or it may not even feel like it's improving your situation but keep grinding it out to create some close friends. I'm a software developer too. I find I like the ritual of being tenacious and pushing through to solve interesting problems. It's a dopamine hit for me to have an interesting problem and solve it. I then love factoring the solution until it is the best abstraction I can come up with. But, my brain has an issue with classifying "interesting" correctly so I have to hack my motivation on mundane work frequently. If an issue isn't interesting, my brain loses motivation. If it is something that really interests my brain, I'm fully on board until I understand the inner workings. I find I have to hack my motivations with relationships, too. I started to treat it as a social experiment and something I needed to figure out.

You might try to find some gregarious folks who do things outside of your comfort zone. Find people with passions that are different than yours but not in a mediocre way where you will be bored and not interested when they talk. You write code and debug it and build up a mental model of how it works. You're going to want to find people with similarly challenging work and passions. It could be anything, maybe they like riding horses, magnet fishing, riding ATVs, camping, shooting, goofing around on a podcast, rock climbing, ballroom dancing, sewing, or painting. Maybe they're just funny and make ...

Check out “childhood emotional neglect” and “complex posttraumatic stress disorder (CPTSD)”. There are lots of books, websites, and forums about this.

Your chronic feeling of emptiness and lack of joy indicate that you have turned off your emotions, maybe in early childhood, maybe to block out a traumatic experience or because your family ignored you and so emotions felt useless.

Look for a therapist who specializes in these issues. You will probably need to try out multiple therapists before you find one for you.

Sounds like you have a lot going for you. It is really common with these issues to have low self-esteem, to feel lots of shame, to feel hopelessly broken, etc, but other people probably do not see you like that.

> But no matter which end I try to start from, I can't seem to escape the sheer meaninglessness of it all.

First of all, you are right. There isn't an once of "meaning" to anything. So don't feel "flawed" for seeing the naked truth as it is, while surrounded by a bunch of us delusionals thinking there is some sort of "meaning" to our lives. The meaning is what we put in ourselves. It's a product of our minds. Sso there is nothing to escape from.

Now, what next then?

Writting this whole post shows effort and concern. You seem concerned about your situation. This is good, this is a driving force. Use it. You are an organism, a system, that for some reason function out of the "norm". Study this system scientifically and figure out why that it. Not necesserily for the purpose of getting better. But for the shake of knowledge, for the shake of understanding yourself and putting your mind at ease.

> Making friends/maintaining close relationships doesn't come naturally to me, and the more effort I put into it, the more detached and dishonest I feel.

No reason to feel dishonest. Be straight upfront, state your selfish reasons for interacting with others and i bet you will find people who will love to hang out with you and help you, because you know why? They also need what you need, they just don't see it as clearly as you do. You know you need to interact with them to get better, they just do it instictively without knowing. As before, you've just seen the naked truth, unlike the rest.