> (US) Law enforcement (agencies) already buys up data from brokers. The Department of Homeland Security...purchased cell phone location data on millions of Americans... The Federal Bureau of Investigation has also been purchasing cell phone location data... These practices circumvent democratic accountability: Agencies buy the information without warrants, and in doing so may bypass prohibitions on companies handing data directly to law enforcement.
I don’t see this as contradictory. It’s the same reasons it’s a bad idea to talk to cops: it can’t help you, it can hurt you, you might say something false, they might mishear you
“Can’t help you” doesn't match all people’s experience
I think we’re underestimating how many quick misunderstandings actually are cleared up, and how not every interaction with a cop is about an investigation. Yes, even for marginalized groups of people
No one is talking about asking a police officer about their day. Nor are they talking about reporting a crime.
However, police are trained to lie and manipulate. I am not a minority and even a small interaction has been tenuous. I reported a minor crime to a police officer who promptly detained me while they figured out I wasnt a part of it. I've been detained for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, etc.
The point of it is that if a cop is talking to YOU it's simple fact that YOU are a potential suspect. No one is saying you can't exchange pleasantries. But cops don't ask you questions, show up to your house, pull you aside, etc to ask how the weather is. They are investigating you and they are trained to make it look and feel like a normal conversation. It's safer, but more extreme, to assume that every single interaction with a police officer is dangerous. You might be wrong 9/10 times, but the 1/10 times you're right you may have given your lawyer enough to get you out of an otherwise "slam dunk" case.
Every lawyer in the country says in any other circumstance you shut your mouth until a lawyer is available. You can't talk your way out of going to jail but you can talk your way into it. And remember, in the court of law the cop is always assumed to be innocent.
its also too reductionist, "can't help" is too reductionist. knowing when to shut up is important, but talking to police unnaturally like a robot at all times isn't the most helpful at all times either.
Disclaimer: brother in law a police officer now retired, and they fight a constant battle against such a dynamic range of attitudes and aggression that it’s a miracle they don’t all quit en masse.
Police are not malevolent actors except in rare exceptions (despite the news wanting to push a more dramatic narrative for eyeballs).
While racist assholes are in the exceptions category, incompetence is more common for that category.
And the far larger category is people out to do good while in sometimes great danger.
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[ 5.7 ms ] story [ 30.7 ms ] thread> (US) Law enforcement (agencies) already buys up data from brokers. The Department of Homeland Security...purchased cell phone location data on millions of Americans... The Federal Bureau of Investigation has also been purchasing cell phone location data... These practices circumvent democratic accountability: Agencies buy the information without warrants, and in doing so may bypass prohibitions on companies handing data directly to law enforcement.
> Plus, the data may not even be accurate.
I think we’re underestimating how many quick misunderstandings actually are cleared up, and how not every interaction with a cop is about an investigation. Yes, even for marginalized groups of people
However, police are trained to lie and manipulate. I am not a minority and even a small interaction has been tenuous. I reported a minor crime to a police officer who promptly detained me while they figured out I wasnt a part of it. I've been detained for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, etc.
The point of it is that if a cop is talking to YOU it's simple fact that YOU are a potential suspect. No one is saying you can't exchange pleasantries. But cops don't ask you questions, show up to your house, pull you aside, etc to ask how the weather is. They are investigating you and they are trained to make it look and feel like a normal conversation. It's safer, but more extreme, to assume that every single interaction with a police officer is dangerous. You might be wrong 9/10 times, but the 1/10 times you're right you may have given your lawyer enough to get you out of an otherwise "slam dunk" case.
Every lawyer in the country says in any other circumstance you shut your mouth until a lawyer is available. You can't talk your way out of going to jail but you can talk your way into it. And remember, in the court of law the cop is always assumed to be innocent.
its also too reductionist, "can't help" is too reductionist. knowing when to shut up is important, but talking to police unnaturally like a robot at all times isn't the most helpful at all times either.
Disclaimer: brother in law a police officer now retired, and they fight a constant battle against such a dynamic range of attitudes and aggression that it’s a miracle they don’t all quit en masse.
Police are not malevolent actors except in rare exceptions (despite the news wanting to push a more dramatic narrative for eyeballs).
While racist assholes are in the exceptions category, incompetence is more common for that category.
And the far larger category is people out to do good while in sometimes great danger.
The fact that they are allowed to continue to violate our constitutional rights through loopholes like this is the bigger problem.