Reid Wiseman (47): A US Navy pilot who served for a time as the head
of Nasa's astronaut office. He's flown one previous space mission, to
the International Space station in 2015.
Victor Glover (46): A US Navy test pilot. He joined Nasa in 2013 and
made his first spaceflight in 2020. He was the first African American
to stay on the space station for an extended period of six months.
Christina Koch (44): An electrical engineer. She holds the record for
longest continuous time in space by a woman, of 328 days. With Nasa
astronaut Jessica Meir she participated in the first all-female
spacewalk in October 2019.
Jeremy Hanson (47): Before joining the Canadian Space Agency, he was a
fighter pilot with the Royal Canadian Air Force. He has yet to fly in
space.
By inventing ssh, software engineers have shot themselves in the foot. Wont be seeing them on such missions anytime soon.
But what happens if there is a bug, the network connection to earth has died and the zoom calls have gone offline. Will we need a software engineer on board then?
Nasa found out about the "turn it off and on" trick to fix bugs and decided not to send a dedicated software engineer :)
On a serious note, some of the best programmers I know had education and experience in non-cs disciplines and moved to programming. If a software/network engineer is truly needed onboard, I'm assuming NASA would have selected/trained people with the required skillset even if it is not their primary domain of expertise.
"In selecting a woman and a person of colour, Nasa is keeping its promise to bring greater diversity to its exploration efforts. All the previous crewed missions to the Moon were made by white men."
Please, please tell me that's not in the NASA press release. I mean, I get that's important for journos, but the hell?! Independent of your opinion on forced diversity, how demeaning is it for those undeniably brillant and capable people that manage to be an accomplished astronaut? Your employer insinuating it's not your skill and intellect, but your melatonin and gonads that gets you to space.
Edit:
I don't question they are some of the most capable and focused individuals on earth, and they have absolutely earned their place. Also, I think it's absolutely great that NASA acknowledges that the "all-white-boys-club" is something that belongs in the past. The thing that annoys me is the way it's presented. Why can't they just truthfully say: "These are the best of the best humanity has to offer!"? The "but they even are black and female!" in the text implicates that's one of the reasons they were chosen as well. And that's unbelievably demeaning to these two, at least I would think so in their position. (And probably not care the slightest, because "I'm going to space, so whatever!")
> Your employer insinuating it's not your skill and intellect, but your melatonin and gonads that gets you to space.
Why would you assume it's not both?
When the apollo program was all-white no one was going around saying "I bet those guys aren't any good and just got the job because they lack melanin" — yet other races were excluded from the astronaut program all the same.
I do not believe parent assumes that, but rather states they hope it's not the latter on its own (or at least not a major driver in the decision process).
I don't even care if it's the latter, because everyone in the astronaut program is someone who has earned that place on the mission.
It's the way the press pushes that to the front that I find demeaning to those two exceptional individuals.
It's the same as all my non-white and/or female colleagues are considerably more often asked to visit career fairs and outreach programs at schools and universities. All of them know it's neither their people skills nor their undeniable ability that puts them front and center, and they hate it.
Why is it demeaning? It's the truth. The pilot is black and one of the mission specialists is a woman, within the context of an institution that hasn't historically had a lot of those on historic missions. That it's notable enough for media to state it doesn't say anything about the individuals.
let’s not forget the first native american, twins, man, dog, satellite… when it’s such a limited cohort we look for firsts, strive for them at times… we all gain from learning from a diverse variety of viewpoints… this is kinda why we’re putting people into space to begin with! I’m sure we’ll celebrate the first child in space, the first blind person in space, the first furry! we should be seeking these out and calling them out, we want more people interested in space exploration
> Why can't they just truthfully say: "These are the best of the best humanity has to offer!"?
That is almost exactly what they said!
> Among the crew are the first woman, first person of color, and first Canadian on a lunar mission, and all four astronauts will represent the best of humanity as they explore for the benefit of all,
and
> They represent exactly what an astronaut corps should be: a mix of highly capable and accomplished individuals with the skills and determination to take on any trial as a team.
I imagine there are at least a few dozen equally qualified folks around there, and they still have to pick only four. Then of course they'll use also other criteria, less important for the job itself (as everybody already fulfills those).
Ok, so token black dude heads the mission and stands above all of the Caucasians in the photo op, and announced by the Administrator for NASA Bill Nelson, who is a politician/lawyer that somehow got a free ride to space and now controls via presidential appointment... all of NASA. With zero rocketry experience.
Translation: only black people that tower over their Caucasian NASA counterparts, and presidentially-appointed lawyers from Yale, get to go to space.
Why are they looking in different directions? This is obviously Midjourney.
Nonetheless, I'm so proud and happy I get to show my daughter this image, even if it won't include a moon landing. (She recently asked if a woman had ever landed on the moon.)
> In selecting a woman and a person of colour, Nasa is keeping its promise to bring greater diversity to its exploration efforts.
I wish people would stop promising diversity and just select people. Looking at their background, everyone selected is super qualified and seems like a great match. The diversity promise does nothing except make people doubt their credentials.
You see it also with the Vice President. Kamala Harris is talented in her own right, but Biden’s promise before he selected her made it seem like she was not. He should have just selected her without making the promise.
> Only assholes think like that. Only assholes doubt credentials because we are now trying to explicitly defy our biases.
And/or people capable of unpopular rational thinking and noticing patterns. You can't aim to select people for characteristics other than pure merit and at the same time claim merit is the deciding factor in selection - well, short of amazing coincidence.
- We promise to select someone biologically related to Congress
- We have selected Mark who is a nephew of a prominent senator and really the only one available in the pool that meets the above qualifications
- But Mark is just as qualified if not more so than anyone else. He was selected on merit just like everyone else!
You seriously believe this shit? You expect other people to?
> That it's only a coincidence that every single astronaut during the Apollo missions was a white man. That they were all definitely above every possible non-white non-man.
Are you seriously implying that the past Moon missions were not selecting organically for the most qualified they thought they thought they had, but rather as some sort of identity politics conspiracy against non-whites and women? Serious projection. Evil white males do not control space and access to it. Anyone qualified that thinks they can pull off a lunar mission is free to try.
No one is saying "pure merit" got these people on the mission. But they are all qualified. They can all get the job done. They do have the credentials. Beyond that, they have other qualities that tipped the scale in their favor to be selected.
"Pure meritocracy" is a myth.
And it's funny you're trying to say the Artemis 2 crew was not selected due to "pure merit", but then want to suggest that all of the Apollo missions were.
I'm not implying the Apollo missions were not selecting based on whatever weird conspiracy narrative you've concocted. I'm saying that racism and sexism in the 60s and 70s was more the norm than the exception. And that's why your qualifier of "most qualified they thought they had" is doing a lot of heavy lifting. They didn't think much of women or minorities. Their biases favored white men. Not to mention all the biases all the way down. White men would have had an easier time to get access to the education and training to be able to be considered to be an astronaut.
So before you accuse others of projection, make sure you aren't the one in the booth.
So you’re an asshole if you think critically and notice obvious patterns? At Stanford in the mid-90s it was quite apparent to anyone with a head not buried in the sand, that certain groups of minorities performed at drastically lower levels than their peers. Any rational observer who was aware that the school preferred to admit applicants with brown skin, and then detected the obvious pattern of low performance in those groups, was not necessarily an asshole for noticing that. Christ, this observation was not even lost on those members of that group in fact.
What's also impressive is that the youngest of these people is 44.
The oldest will be 49 when they take off in November of 2024.
It's a testament to the amount of experience and training required for these missions. The Apollo astronauts were mostly around 40. With Ken Mattingly being the youngest person to land on the moon at a spritely 36.
33 comments
[ 3.7 ms ] story [ 88.1 ms ] threadI'll believe it when I see it.
But what happens if there is a bug, the network connection to earth has died and the zoom calls have gone offline. Will we need a software engineer on board then?
Can Gen-X dreams actually come true?
On a serious note, some of the best programmers I know had education and experience in non-cs disciplines and moved to programming. If a software/network engineer is truly needed onboard, I'm assuming NASA would have selected/trained people with the required skillset even if it is not their primary domain of expertise.
Please, please tell me that's not in the NASA press release. I mean, I get that's important for journos, but the hell?! Independent of your opinion on forced diversity, how demeaning is it for those undeniably brillant and capable people that manage to be an accomplished astronaut? Your employer insinuating it's not your skill and intellect, but your melatonin and gonads that gets you to space.
Edit: I don't question they are some of the most capable and focused individuals on earth, and they have absolutely earned their place. Also, I think it's absolutely great that NASA acknowledges that the "all-white-boys-club" is something that belongs in the past. The thing that annoys me is the way it's presented. Why can't they just truthfully say: "These are the best of the best humanity has to offer!"? The "but they even are black and female!" in the text implicates that's one of the reasons they were chosen as well. And that's unbelievably demeaning to these two, at least I would think so in their position. (And probably not care the slightest, because "I'm going to space, so whatever!")
Why would you assume it's not both?
When the apollo program was all-white no one was going around saying "I bet those guys aren't any good and just got the job because they lack melanin" — yet other races were excluded from the astronaut program all the same.
I do not believe parent assumes that, but rather states they hope it's not the latter on its own (or at least not a major driver in the decision process).
It's the same as all my non-white and/or female colleagues are considerably more often asked to visit career fairs and outreach programs at schools and universities. All of them know it's neither their people skills nor their undeniable ability that puts them front and center, and they hate it.
It is not. https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-names-astronauts-to-...
> Why can't they just truthfully say: "These are the best of the best humanity has to offer!"?
That is almost exactly what they said!
> Among the crew are the first woman, first person of color, and first Canadian on a lunar mission, and all four astronauts will represent the best of humanity as they explore for the benefit of all,
and
> They represent exactly what an astronaut corps should be: a mix of highly capable and accomplished individuals with the skills and determination to take on any trial as a team.
Translation: only black people that tower over their Caucasian NASA counterparts, and presidentially-appointed lawyers from Yale, get to go to space.
This post was not generated by ChatGPT-4.
Nonetheless, I'm so proud and happy I get to show my daughter this image, even if it won't include a moon landing. (She recently asked if a woman had ever landed on the moon.)
I wish people would stop promising diversity and just select people. Looking at their background, everyone selected is super qualified and seems like a great match. The diversity promise does nothing except make people doubt their credentials.
You see it also with the Vice President. Kamala Harris is talented in her own right, but Biden’s promise before he selected her made it seem like she was not. He should have just selected her without making the promise.
And/or people capable of unpopular rational thinking and noticing patterns. You can't aim to select people for characteristics other than pure merit and at the same time claim merit is the deciding factor in selection - well, short of amazing coincidence.
- We promise to select someone biologically related to Congress
- We have selected Mark who is a nephew of a prominent senator and really the only one available in the pool that meets the above qualifications
- But Mark is just as qualified if not more so than anyone else. He was selected on merit just like everyone else!
You seriously believe this shit? You expect other people to?
> That it's only a coincidence that every single astronaut during the Apollo missions was a white man. That they were all definitely above every possible non-white non-man.
Are you seriously implying that the past Moon missions were not selecting organically for the most qualified they thought they thought they had, but rather as some sort of identity politics conspiracy against non-whites and women? Serious projection. Evil white males do not control space and access to it. Anyone qualified that thinks they can pull off a lunar mission is free to try.
No one is saying "pure merit" got these people on the mission. But they are all qualified. They can all get the job done. They do have the credentials. Beyond that, they have other qualities that tipped the scale in their favor to be selected.
"Pure meritocracy" is a myth.
And it's funny you're trying to say the Artemis 2 crew was not selected due to "pure merit", but then want to suggest that all of the Apollo missions were.
I'm not implying the Apollo missions were not selecting based on whatever weird conspiracy narrative you've concocted. I'm saying that racism and sexism in the 60s and 70s was more the norm than the exception. And that's why your qualifier of "most qualified they thought they had" is doing a lot of heavy lifting. They didn't think much of women or minorities. Their biases favored white men. Not to mention all the biases all the way down. White men would have had an easier time to get access to the education and training to be able to be considered to be an astronaut.
So before you accuse others of projection, make sure you aren't the one in the booth.
Observing reality is never wrong.
The oldest will be 49 when they take off in November of 2024.
It's a testament to the amount of experience and training required for these missions. The Apollo astronauts were mostly around 40. With Ken Mattingly being the youngest person to land on the moon at a spritely 36.