"Given the harmful effects of light pollution, a pair of astronomers has coined a new term to help focus efforts to combat it. Their term, as reported in a brief paper in the preprint database arXiv and a letter to the journal Science, is 'noctalgia'"
This is what you came up with after four days? That isn't even a response to what I asked and it's pretty far removed from light pollution being a real problem.
Sensory pollution is just as bad as physical pollution, probably even worse. You can get people behind picking up litter and not burning tires.
But it's impossible to make them understand how miserable it is being exposed to a constant drone of noise or the light that comes in through your blackout curtains at night.
Usually you're told to get over it. Would you tell someone to get over coughing fits from someone blowing black smoke from their chimney?
To be clear, even though this article is about visibility for astronomers, you are saying that light coming through your 'black out curtains' is the same as black smoke from burning tires coming into your house?
I can't decide if you understand the impact of light pollution and don't believe it matters, or if you don't know the impact of light pollution and so don't understand why it matters.
If you understand the problem and don't believe it matters then I have nothing else to add. I respect your choice of belief.
Otherwise: light pollution disrupts wildlife, impacts human health, wastes money and energy, contributes to climate change, and blocks our view of the universe - this last one being something humanity has enjoyed for thousands of years.
It's possible these are not topics that concern you - that is entirely your option - but it does concern other humans who quite enjoy the night sky and would love to pass it onto the next generations better than it is now.
Second, both of these sites just make claims and use stock images but have no evidence at all. Some of them are just ridiculous extremist opinions like
"It destroys a precious heritage of natural beauty that for millennia has inspired us and expanded our understanding."
Cities have lights on at night. If that really bothers someone they can move outside a city or a small town. This is not going to change.
These sites are one step removed from flat earther claims. "It destroys the natural darkness that is essential to human health and well being." Good thing I have walls and curtains and can close my eyes.
I do think it is kind of crazy when I am out late in the city and still see lots of lights on in office towers everywhere. I refuse to believe that many of them are actually occupied at that time and it seems like a waste of electricity and also damaging to the ability to see stars.
The advent of LED lights being so cheap to keep on I imagine some places just decide to leave them in all night. As for the astronomers my view is they miss the convenience of having a telescope close to their homes and universities whereas the best terrestrial telescopes have been on desert mountains.
These days they can probably log into those remotely.
Personally I think seeing dark skies is important for regular folks too. I was fortunate to grow up in a place where you could easily see the Milky Way at night.
It's truly awe inspiring to lay down at night looking at the stars, and really makes your problems seem insignificant in the grand scale of the universe.
Oh I don't just mean for astronomers, I definitely feel like all those lit up towers must be contributing for less visible night sky stars for the rest of us
> Along with our propensity for polluting air and water and the massive amounts of carbon we're dumping into the atmosphere to trigger climate change, we have created another kind of pollution: light pollution.
Ahh yes, light pollution, killing millions annually like air pollution and choking seas and rivers like water pollution. Threatening the existence of nations and making swathes of the world unlivable, like climate change.
Come on, light “pollution” is not remotely equivalent to the others.
"Come on, light “pollution” is not remotely equivalent to the others."
Submitter here. Doesn't make it less relevant. Greenhouse gasses, 'forever' chemicals, other types of chemical/nuclear pollution, raw sewage released into rivers or oceans, microplastics, noise pollution, light pollution, strip mining, slash 'n burn practices, overfishing, etc etc, they all degrade the natural environment one way or another.
What's left is the result of all those effects combined. So even if one type of pollution doesn't seem that bad, it adds to the death-by-1001-papercuts we're dishing out (with "papercuts" being an understatement).
Another casualty of car dependent urban sprawl. It used to be you could travel 10-20 miles and be at a dark site. But now it's all single family homes as far as the eye can see. 100 foot wide roads connect them to big box stores with endless street and parking lot lights that turn the night sky into and orange/white haze.
I feel pretty lucky to be living in Colorado with ample dark sky areas in a short driving distance. Even living in a small city in the Denver metro area - the night sky is significantly clearer with more stars than I used to see as a kid growing up in the “rural” Midwest. Although I’m sure folks who lived in the front range 50 years ago have Noctalgia for even darker skies.
Whenever friends come visit (especially those who are more city-folk and less outdoorsy) I make sure to take a short drive into the mountains so that they can see the milkyway with the naked eye. Never fails to blow their minds. Still blows mine after all these years.
During an overnight power outage several years ago in Provo Utah, I was able to read a book near a window solely via light pollution from Orem Utah reflecting off of snow and low lying clouds. I wrote at the time that we might be able to solve the light pollution problem by showing that increased light pollution corresponds with lowered church attendance due to a decreased sense of wonder. Perhaps we can convince religious fanatics to rally against light pollution with the same sort of fervor that they use against abortion now.
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[ 3.1 ms ] story [ 307 ms ] threadhttps://arxiv.org/abs/2308.14685
But it's impossible to make them understand how miserable it is being exposed to a constant drone of noise or the light that comes in through your blackout curtains at night.
Usually you're told to get over it. Would you tell someone to get over coughing fits from someone blowing black smoke from their chimney?
If you understand the problem and don't believe it matters then I have nothing else to add. I respect your choice of belief.
Otherwise: light pollution disrupts wildlife, impacts human health, wastes money and energy, contributes to climate change, and blocks our view of the universe - this last one being something humanity has enjoyed for thousands of years.
It's possible these are not topics that concern you - that is entirely your option - but it does concern other humans who quite enjoy the night sky and would love to pass it onto the next generations better than it is now.
If you'd like to know more, here's some good resources: https://www.darksky.org/ https://www.darkskiesmatter.org.uk/
If English is not your preferred language, there may be similar or better content in your preferred language available through $SEARCH_ENGINE.
Second, both of these sites just make claims and use stock images but have no evidence at all. Some of them are just ridiculous extremist opinions like
"It destroys a precious heritage of natural beauty that for millennia has inspired us and expanded our understanding."
Cities have lights on at night. If that really bothers someone they can move outside a city or a small town. This is not going to change.
These sites are one step removed from flat earther claims. "It destroys the natural darkness that is essential to human health and well being." Good thing I have walls and curtains and can close my eyes.
These days they can probably log into those remotely.
It's truly awe inspiring to lay down at night looking at the stars, and really makes your problems seem insignificant in the grand scale of the universe.
Ahh yes, light pollution, killing millions annually like air pollution and choking seas and rivers like water pollution. Threatening the existence of nations and making swathes of the world unlivable, like climate change.
Come on, light “pollution” is not remotely equivalent to the others.
Submitter here. Doesn't make it less relevant. Greenhouse gasses, 'forever' chemicals, other types of chemical/nuclear pollution, raw sewage released into rivers or oceans, microplastics, noise pollution, light pollution, strip mining, slash 'n burn practices, overfishing, etc etc, they all degrade the natural environment one way or another.
What's left is the result of all those effects combined. So even if one type of pollution doesn't seem that bad, it adds to the death-by-1001-papercuts we're dishing out (with "papercuts" being an understatement).
Whenever friends come visit (especially those who are more city-folk and less outdoorsy) I make sure to take a short drive into the mountains so that they can see the milkyway with the naked eye. Never fails to blow their minds. Still blows mine after all these years.