>(3) Results: Compared with a placebo, spermidine supplementation significantly increased spermine levels in the plasma, but it did not affect spermidine or putrescine levels. No effect on salivary polyamine concentrations was observed.
Which might be fine if the metabolite is actually the responsible molecule.
Given the concentration, you'd have to drink half a litre of human seminal plasma to match one 15mg supplement pill.
I have no idea what the concentration of seminal plasma is in semen, but even if the latter was pure plasma that's still 135 sessions to equal one pill.
The 15mg/d they used in that study is just the standard dietary intake (top end, europeans). Looked a number of other studies that also used just regular intake levels as "supplementation". Weird how they all stay small when the no observable adverse effects level is much higher.
Even if it did, you'll get at least as much from eating about 60g of wheat germ as an unprotected sex worker would get if they had new clients every 3.5 minutes for 8 hours.
The study talks about how, "declining egg quality in older mice can be reversed with a dietary supplement". Sooo... unless you have a very specific genetic condition you are not going to be able to self dose and replicate the study.
The molecule is Spermidine. If you are interested in at-home trial to increase intake of spermidine, you can buy some wheat germ and either toast it and let it soak in water overnight.
Its also good for autophagy and there has been no known side effects. Its just a plant product anyway!
IMHO, Sinclair is making a mistake by taking spermidine directly since it will probably deplete riboflavin (B2) because the excess spermidine will be metabolized my Spermine oxidase which uses B2 as a cofactor
IMO, a better way is to trigger your own body to make spermidine by getting enough Arginine and taking Manganese, B6, and keeping your methylation cycle flowing.
The pathway is as follows:
Arginine -> (Arginase, uses manganese as a cofactor) -> Ornithine -> (Ornithine decarboxylase, uses B6 as a cofactor) -> putrescine -> (Spermidine synthase which needs SAMe and Pyruvate) -> Spermidine
In my opinion, yes. But I still feel the better route to increasing spermidine is finding out if you are deficiency in arginine, manganese, B6 or one of the several cofactors for the methylation cycle.
Though, will having more Arginine, Manganese and B6 automatically trigger your own body to make spermidine? Isn't there maybe a limit when the body stops producing spermidine?
1. Spermidine found to increase lifespan and fertility in mice.
2. Spermidine levels not found to increase in blood or certain tissues when fed to mice.
3. Therefore, 1 is wrong.
Finding 2 in no way disproves 1. Facts which could be consistent with both 1 and 2 being true:
- spermidine metabolites are responsible for benefits
- while spermidine levels are maintained, excess spermidine is used beneficially
- experimenters in 2 simply haven't looked in the right tissues
And so on. TFA says there were observed phenotypic improvements (follicular health, oocyte number and quality), which categorically trump 2's failure to observe increase in spermidine levels. And none of this says anything directly about spermidine's effects in humans
I’ve watched a lot of Stanfield’s videos. Over time I came to realize that his whole image is built on being “the critic” and tempering optimism around these treatments. Except for his own personal research, which he’d like you to help fund :)
At the end of the day, “the critic” is a valuable job. Someone has to do it. Not sure it is really helping progress the industry though. I think it would be better for him to leave this to the lawyers tho.
It mentions egg quality. If that impacts development of the fetus as well, it could mean those who wait to have a single child at an older age are less likely to see negative health impacts due to mother's age.
It's only problematic for old people, governments and investors. In fact, let's cut governments and investors form the list, as they are already included in the first category.
This is not entirely true. Some brain cells and the cells in your eye lens will be there your entire life and could even potentially live longer if they were not limited by the rest of the body. Cancer is definitely a lot more than just immortal cells.
Usually mouse studies get a flood of comments about how they're mouse studies. I think it's interesting that there isn't really a flood this time when it's about aging/longevity, as a lot of people here seem to be immortalists. Hope and faith take you places, I guess.
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[ 0.21 ms ] story [ 127 ms ] threadArticle: https://www.nature.com/articles/s43587-023-00498-8
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spermidine
A little on the nose.
Which might be fine if the metabolite is actually the responsible molecule.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytic_acid?wprov=sfla1
[edit] remove doubled word
I have no idea what the concentration of seminal plasma is in semen, but even if the latter was pure plasma that's still 135 sessions to equal one pill.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spermidine#Sources
[1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10143675/
Its also good for autophagy and there has been no known side effects. Its just a plant product anyway!
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29315079/
So is heroin/opium...
> Getting the dose right is important, as the study also showed that excessive amounts of spermidine led to poorer quality oocytes in mice.
[1]: https://www.lifespanpodcast.com/nmn-nr-resveratrol-metformin...
[2]: https://fastlifehacks.com/david-sinclair-supplements/
https://www.uniprot.org/uniprotkb/Q9NWM0/entry
IMO, a better way is to trigger your own body to make spermidine by getting enough Arginine and taking Manganese, B6, and keeping your methylation cycle flowing.
The pathway is as follows:
Arginine -> (Arginase, uses manganese as a cofactor) -> Ornithine -> (Ornithine decarboxylase, uses B6 as a cofactor) -> putrescine -> (Spermidine synthase which needs SAMe and Pyruvate) -> Spermidine
https://www.mdpi.com/metabolites/metabolites-12-00344/articl...
Roy: A Life Well Lived is a Virtual Reality Life Simulator
In the game, scientists are working to extend life. This translates to hacking the videogame's code.
Success. The player of the game is locked in permanent catatonic fugue. Stays in game forever. Immortality achieved.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVvqGAjg_J8
1. Spermidine found to increase lifespan and fertility in mice.
2. Spermidine levels not found to increase in blood or certain tissues when fed to mice.
3. Therefore, 1 is wrong.
Finding 2 in no way disproves 1. Facts which could be consistent with both 1 and 2 being true:
- spermidine metabolites are responsible for benefits
- while spermidine levels are maintained, excess spermidine is used beneficially
- experimenters in 2 simply haven't looked in the right tissues
And so on. TFA says there were observed phenotypic improvements (follicular health, oocyte number and quality), which categorically trump 2's failure to observe increase in spermidine levels. And none of this says anything directly about spermidine's effects in humans
At the end of the day, “the critic” is a valuable job. Someone has to do it. Not sure it is really helping progress the industry though. I think it would be better for him to leave this to the lawyers tho.
This is another indicator that that is not quite the right way to think about cancer.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37839458