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Is a Poe.com subscription better than ChatGPT Plus?

27 points by instagraham ↗ HN
For about $7 more than ChatGPT-Plus, Poe gives you GPT-4 plus other models like Claude-2-100k and StableDiffusionXL image creators plus the ability to make and monetise your own bots.

Seems a bit redundant to subscribe to ChatGPT-Plus for GPT-4 and extensions (which are poorly maintained, hard to use, and often broken) when Poe offers more.

44 comments

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gumballindie
Both procedural text and image generators are filled with inaccuracies. Not surprising given the nature of this type of technology. But poe does seem to be more user friendly, and it’s not as controversial as openai.
pgryko
I'm guessing that Poe.com uses the GPT4 api - I struggled to get similar quality answers from GPT4 api vs their web interface. A google wasn't very helpful, suggesting using a temperature of 0.7 and a custom prompt.

Mostly I wanted to use GPT4 api via the terminal on chunks of text, but was not able to get the same quality as the UI.

I'm open to suggestions

dr_dshiv
Seriously, using gpt4 through API is not as good as chatGPT—anyone know why? I’ve wondered this for years. (Ok months)
nemosaltat
Same. I wrote an implementation around GPT-4 & sqlite to store and analyze my queries and was hoping to use that exclusively. I still find myself using ~~GPT-4~~ chapGPT, huge shoutout to autodev.py for making that experience worlds better. edit: clarity
maxbaines
Very likely your initial system prompt, versus chatGPT. Also ChatGPT is more than just an client for the GPT4 API.
maxbaines
That said I see better results mostly via the API and a good prompt.
YetAnotherNick
There is definitely something different. e.g. If I ask to output JSON, ChatGPT sometimes starts with something like "Sure here is the JSON output", while API never does that.
hn_user2
Interesting, I have switched over to using chatblade CLI client and had not noticed a degradation in results.

Guess I better start trying some queries in both for a bit to compare quality.

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PostOnce
poe.com tells me absolutely nothing, it's an email field and a "go" button preceded by the phrase "fast, helpful AI chat". That's the entire website.
instagraham
This page makes the value-offer clearer: https://poe.com/explore?category=Official

It is basically an aggregator of AI models and tool, baked into one platform, with user-generated chatbots to play with.

To be fair, it was explained to me on some Tweet which is how I originally found it.

justaj
That link redirects me to https://poe.com/login again.

And I have still no idea if it offers a free trial, how long that trial lasts and what payment methods it accepts.

capybara_2020
Poe is owned by Quora, make of that what you will.

It is easier to get the images you want with ChatGPT and Dalle. Plus ChatGPT comes with the analytics tool.

Personal opinion but SDXL is not the greatest right out of the box as a text to image gen when compared to Midjourney or Dalle3. StableDiffusion shines when used with other tools like controlnet or image to image.

So it all depends on your use case.

larodi
I support your call about SDXL. Been using DALL:E 2/3 and Midjourney since v3 for production of actual design collages for actual events, which get actually printed. SDXL is nowhere near this all, unless you need a simple image of female-looking manga character with a dreamy eyes.

I suspect the perceived superior quality of said providers is potentially due to their experience in wiring multi-model (multi-modal) systems and having more than one agent work on the image.

rg111
I think Claude 2 is much better than GPT-4 based on chats.
instagraham
Yeah I've been using it regularly. Poe has Claude too, btw. I like the idea of user-generated chatbots though, which Poe seems to be unique in offering.
liviux
You can even try nat.dev
pogue
Looks interesting, but again - no description. Can you tell us more about it and cost etc?
cyberpunk
I used poe initially, as I was on the wait list for gpt-4 (or plus or whatever it was called) and the UI was utter garbage, couldn’t copy paste code, only had an iOS app.

Then went for a real OpenAI subscription and finally now use it via my kagi ultimate subscription..

Personal preference ofc, but having used all three: OpenAI’s ui is the best, kagi is the better value, and I would avoid poe…

ashirviskas
I currently have OpenAI subscription and I am really interested in moving to Kagi, but it is hard to find information on their ultimate plan. What AI features does it offer?
cyberpunk
You can choose between gpt-3.5, gpt-4, claude-1, claude-2, and google 'bison' (I didn't try that one though).

Mysteriously, it seems like the chat box on openai.com gave me slightly better answers than via their api; and sometimes Kagi.com renders a bit poorly while streaming responses, but meh. I can throw a random istio error into it or whatever and it gets me 75% of the way to a solution, so it works well enough. YMMV

ashirviskas
Thanks! Can you do image generation, or upload your own images for it to use?
gtsteve
I hadn't heard of this website. Is there a page that describes what it does? When I navigate to poe.com, it just wants me to enter my email address and make an account, and I'd like to learn about what it can do first.
curiousgal
I guess that confirms that it was made by Quora.
0xEF
This annoys me, as well, when web services do this, but I did sign up out of curiosity back when I was looking for some easy-access AI to play with and learn. In my relatively uninformed opinion, Poe offers just that.

I wasn't so much interested in image generation, but looking for a sort of AI assistant that I could use as a rubber duck, helping me reframe problems and (hopefully) try different solutions. Yes, it's basically learned from Quora, but like any other Q&A site, you will always have a mix of actual good info and overly-opinionated hogwash (SE, anyone?). And, like any Q&A site, it's up to the reader to separate the wheat from the chaff, so an AI chatbot is no different.

What I liked about Poe is the Android app. Its convenient, smooth, and seems to be a little more versatile than other chatbot apps. It's easy to pop it open and prompt for a code snippet, or some random bit of EE knowledge while I'm at work instead of digging through the fluff pile of modern Google ad-driven results.

In short, what it does is act as a simple chatbot assistant, and should not be taken exceedingly seriously. Also, I never paid a dime for it get good use out of it, so it's wort trying, if anything.

0xEF
In my morning haze, I forgot to mention that pretty much exclusively use the General Assistant bot on Poe's platform. I might muck around with other bots out of boredom, but I find the Assistant to be fine for my minimal needs. That said, it is important to understand how you plan to use a bot and your expectations of the results before selecting one. None of them are magic bullets, yet.
pogue
So, the site is trained on Quora alone or it's the same library as OpenAI with added training from Quora? (The answers on Quora are terrible, IMHO, so if it's exclusively trained on that - omg no thanks!)

Also - rubber duck?

0xEF
So far as I can tell, Quora is a bit cagey about how these bots were trained, assuming due to third party involvement, so I am not finding any concrete info. That said, I'm also not using it for research-dependant questions or in situations where incorrect info results in catastrophy. I work with and test electromechanical industrial devices, and I find myself using Poe Assistant mostly for quick reference of expected component values or filling it gaps of little programs I make to automate simple tasks for myself. I have not run into any issues where the information Poe Assistant provided was decidedly false, but there have been times where I double-checked slightly more crucial info. Again, choice of chatbot seems to be a balancing act of convenience and user intentions or need, so mileage may vary.

As for rubber ducking, it's the concept of talking to an inanimate object (like a rubber duck) to help with problem solving. It's something I find very helpful and have been doing since I was a kid, but it was coined in the book The Pragmatic Programmer, which is a good read if you're so inclined.

0xEF
After my other reply to you, it occured to me to simply ask Poe Assistant to see if I got a different answer. Here is the response to the question "what data was used to train you?"

I have been trained on a diverse range of data from the internet. This includes books, articles, websites, and other text sources, to develop a broad understanding of human language. However, the specific datasets and details of the training process used to train me have not been disclosed publicly by OpenAI, the organization behind Assistant. I should note that while I strive to provide accurate and up-to-date information, I may not always have the most current data on certain topics since my training only goes up until September 2021, and I don't have access to real-time information.

instagraham
It's sort of an aggregator of different AI models. A customisable chatbot where you can choose between GPT-4, PaLM, LLama, Claude, etc. With user-created bots available through a search and explore page - sort of like an Instagram for bots and AI (which is how it was described in a tweet or something that led me to it).

Agreed their website could explain itself better but I think the actual offering is pretty substantial.

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maxbaines
Im building baarilliant.ai (you can signup for, early preview) works with OpenAi, Anthropic and Llama, Mistral and StableDiffusion via fireworks, you can also edit, save in app and as .md, share and experiment with Prompts and Functions. ShowHN coming soon.
gardenhedge
Is this an ad?

Either way, I am not paying more than the $20 chatgpt charges for any AI

muzani
If you're using ChatGPT Plus only for GPT-4, you can get it cheaper via the API. I use it quite a bit - doing PRs, writing code, stories, hackathons, asking step by step instructions on how to do things. It cost me $3 last month.

You can use the OpenAI playground, build your own chat interface, ask GPT to build it for you, but I just use Chatblade: https://github.com/npiv/chatblade

Anticlockwise
Isn't this only true if OpenAI decides to let you into the gpt4 API? Is there a trick for getting them to turn it on? I haven't heard back from them for access yet.
iex_xei
It should open after you pay your first invoice > $1
rmason
I loaded Poe on my phone before heading to Europe this summer. I found it extremely useful finding popular restaurants with the locals that weren't in the guidebooks. If you were looking for niche locations like antique car museums or anything amateur radio related it was hit or miss.
727564797069706
Poe is a platform that lets people ask questions, get instant answers, and have back-and-forth conversations with a wide variety of AI-powered bots. It is available on iOS, Android, MacOS and web.

The AI on Poe is powered by models from several sources, trained by different companies. Those different models are optimized for different tasks, represent different points of view, or have access to different knowledge. Some models are fine-tuned versions of models created by others.

Poe currently supports ChatGPT and GPT-4 from OpenAI, Claude Instant and Claude 2 from Anthropic, StableDiffusionXL from Stable Diffusion XL, PaLM from Google, Llama 2 from Meta, and many other bots created by the community.

Source: https://poe.com/about

Scottn1
Kagi Ultimate is $25/mo and has access to GPT-4, Claude 2 and Google Chat Bison.