Ask HN: Is it worth switching to a Mac?

When I went to college a few year ago I got my first Mac -- a Powerbook G4. I had only owned PCs before then but used Macs in the computer labs at school. I loved the Powerbook and didn't look back.

Of course, at work I have to use a PC so I can't speak too much to web development on the Mac. In general, though, I have to deal with a lot less of "trying to get things to work" on OS X and a lot more "working with things".

I am a long time mac user, not a new switcher, but I am a web developer on a mac. If you are going to heavily rely on VMware to run all of you windows apps you might want to grab a pro or the top of the line macbook, the bare minimum is to juice up the RAM. I have an older white macbook and I love VMWare, but just for running on operating system at once, I usually have a ubuntu server going and when I try using a winxp system it does get a little sluggish on the computer.

In terms of mac version of the software they are equally good, MS Office for mac is usually pretty responsive and doesn't crash. In my experience massive excel files sometime bomb out excel, I'd say the PC version was a little more stable. People have also said the newer version of Adobe CS seem to run better on PC then mac. I have not really had a problem, though. I never heard of mac version of UltraEdit, SQLYog, WinSCP, Camtasia Studio, Although for Camtasia there are some decent mac screencast recorders, but not to my knowledge ones as feature rich as camtasia.

I know a few people who have asked for my advice for buying a computer and being a good apple fanboy, i've recommended macs, once they got the hang of it and the little differences they've really liked it.

I know for me having access to the unix underpinning/programs is a great thing that has help me as well as being able to install pure linux programs, pending dependencies and all that. I've gone the VMWare route for running my windows things and not using boot camp. If I wanted to use the windows side of things for longer periods of time I would use that setup.

All that said, with more market share that macs are gaining it's great using one because most of the system is well thought out and can be pretty powerful when you need it to be. I can develop sites on my system like I am developing on the linux box I am going to deploy to, test sites with in safari, firefox, ie6, ie7 and have a generally secure computer that I can kill any process or program that is freezing up on me.

Just my thoughts

For me, I made the switch because I think Macs are cheaper after about one year of use. If my time equals money, and I value my time at $50/hr (which, yes, is a bit arbitrary), and I assume that I will spend less time configuring, defragging, cleaning, or anti-virusing my Mac than my PC, then it gets to be a real simple equation.

I took a look and just sort of estimated how much maintenance time I put into my PC over the course of a year. I estimated it to be at about 2 hrs per month (which I think was, actually, not enough to keep it secure), or $1200, so the total cost to me, of ownership is whatever the price is of a PC plus $1200.

I find that that maintenance time on my mac is significantly less right now than it was or ever has been on my PC.

So in the end, my answer is: yes-- get a Mac. At the end of the day, they're cheaper.

Will you be doing ANY mac work?

If you're just going to be running everything in Windows anyways, you can get more machine for your dollar by buying another Dell or a Thinkpad.

I use Mac, Linux & Windows at home; most of the development I do is Windows based though, so I use a Vista / Ubuntu dual boot laptop (Thinkpad T61P. I LOVE it.) for when I need to go on-site.

OSX + VirtualBox + XP is a far better Unix/Windows hybrid than XP + Cygwin.

As a developer I like running software that is similar to my production environment. OS X is close enough to Linux that most applications work the same. This makes me more productive and makes development easier.

When I switched it was frustrating. It took me 2 weeks before I felt comfortable navigating the OS.

After that 2 weeks things began to feel comfortable. I feel much more productive on my Mac now than I ever did on a Windows box.

I went from Windows at home, Linux for work to using my Macbook both at home and the office. (At the office, it's hooked up to an external keyboard, mouse and monitor.)

Most of my work involves programming, but I ssh into another machine and do everything from the command line. My workflow has changed very little - it's just prettier and behaves much better. I think of OSX as being the prettiest Unix has ever been; it is everything I wanted Linux to be.

I'm not sure how this maps to you. Eclipse supposedly works on Mac, http://developer.apple.com/tools/eclipse.html, but you might want to look at Xcode.

I think I am actually a little less productive on a Mac than I was on Linux. However, if you are developing web applications that will be hosted on a *nix server, OS X is much better than Windows.

I do a fair bit of coding on Mac, Windows and Linux (usually ubuntu) If you switch, be prepared that it will take you a bit of an adjustment, as many of the basic actions that you do without even thinking about it will change.

However, I think over time you'll find that it is not a change you'll regret. I find that in general, you'll get things done faster, and learn new things quicker. It's definitely the platform that I have tended to gravitate to for most of my work.

Plus, the new macbooks are solid.

I switched from Windows to a macbook pro about 9 months ago and have mostly been happy. I'm irritated by the behavior of cut and paste regarding subfolders and files, and the different hotkeys slow me down. On the plus side, Terminal and shell scripting make the dos prompt look like a cheap toy. The hardware itself is beautifully done. There are far fewer instances where OS X annoys me, and I've yet to have a virus or spyware issue on OS X, and I haven't had to pay the antivirus "tax" of speed and money.

Overall, I prefer it to Windows, but I'm still thinking of switching to Ubuntu.

Yes it's worth it to switch. Took me about a month to get completely comfortable, but a lot of it is trial and error. It's like learning to drive on the opposite side of the road.

The keyboard commands aren't hard to master but by default, a lot of the keyboard options are turned off in OS X. System Settings > (Full Keyboard Access) [x] All controls

I can't live without Quicksilver, but the learning curve for it is pretty steep (more advanced commands).

http://osx.iusethis.com/ <- Good site to browse to discover OS X apps.

Hey if you have specific questions, email me and I'll be happy to answer them. I've helped a lot of people switch. Lots of times, you just need some tips to feel comfortable.

Except some stuff like proper java 1.6 I am very happy with my Mac. Switching from windows to mac is a good choice. If you would have been a Linux user, I'd say maybe stick with it :)

Eclipse works like a charm on OS X.

Instead of VmWare you might consider http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallels,_Inc. ... or well, actually you don't need any virtualization at all for what you are using?

If you want to go native, this list of Mac counterparts might help you:

  Eclipse - There is a Mac version.
  UltraEdit - Coda or Textmate.
  SQLYog - Sequel Pro.
  WinSCP - Cyberduck, YummyFTP. Tons of clients. Check out ExpanDrive for some real fun. 
  TortoiseSVN - Syncro SVN.
  Adobe CS3 - There is a Mac version.
  Camtasia Studio - Screenflow. 
  MS Office - There is a Mac version.
  WAMP - There is a similar MAMP. Then again, you are running on a platform 
         that has all those goodies pre-installed and ready-to-go!

Anyone have some additional suggestions?

PS: Virtualization has a cost associated with it. I only fire mine up for testing. Make sure you max out the RAM you get on the machine.

I recently made the switch and my #1 objection to doing it: the keyboard shortcuts. I've actually mastered most of the shortcuts in about 1-2 days.

The main reason I made the switch is because I am going to do iPhone app development and that's pretty difficult on a PC.

So far it's been pleasant. I am pretty impressed by OSX, definitely some advantages over XP and this is pretty much understood and repeated, but Apple goes out of their way to make everything work nicely. My freakin' keyboard lights up when the room gets dark. That's pretty cool.

I recently switched from linux to mac, and I would not pay the apple tax again. I force myself to use the fisher price os they call osx, to justify the apple tax i payed for the hardware. But being a windows to mac user may be a better transition. For those that say use Vmware.. why not just buy the cheaper hardware and run windows. The hardware is all commodity, and you are not getting any benefits from the hardware, compared to x86 vs ppc days. Mainly is a software point of view. From what I've found in ubuntu repository any software I ever wanted or needed I could find for free. To make osx usable for me, I've had to pay for quite a bit of software. I find it much less productive.. my best example is .. on standard keyboard layout .. press ctrl + c , and notice how your hand is shaped. Its already in an extended position for the next key. Now on mac to copy its command key (apple or win key) + c ... you hand is curled into like a ball.. and no matter how long you use it, its still awkward, and not as natural when typing. For me I wanted the *nix environment + the stability, and osx does deliver, but the price is your computing freedom.

When it comes to programming, I found Xcode to be a much nicer IDE over Visual Studio. On the downside, I can't find many games for the Mac at my local stores (*I don't want a dual boot or VM).

no, you are just trading an "uncool" closed platform that bends you over for an apparently "cool" one. their hardware is unimpressive commodity stuff, and i don't even think osx is interesting. if you can't figure out ubuntu, maybe developing software isn't for you. the day is coming when people will reject steve jobs psyco-level control freak pointless upgrade cycle and macs will be uncool again...just get out ahead of the trend now and look that much hipper later.

I recently (<1 month) switched to Mac from Debian. As others have suggested, the initial comfort period might be lil difficult to cope with, but it wont feel like a curve. Things are pretty the same (Eclipse, dir structure, shell etc.), but I havent regretted the "change" yet.. plus the community is good, with nice treatment for apps as in Ubuntu..

How about the linux to mac switch? Has anyone tried that before?

I switched from Linux to OS X several years ago. I tend to live on the command line so my experience is a bit different.

First, I installed Fink which brings dselect and friends to MacOS X. Fink let me install all the packages from Linux that I use. For giggles, I installed the Apple X server and ran KDE from Fink. It worked but felt sluggish. I also realized this was very pointless and stopped doing it after 5 minutes. Running X apps with the Apple Window Manager in rootless mode feels fast.

I have Virtual PC on my G4 Powerbook. It isn't fast but lets me test stuff in Windows when I have to. I used to work off a Macbook Pro in an old job and found VMWare Fusion and Parallels were fantastic when I needed to do work in another OS.

Overall I like it because its a UNIX I don't have to spend time administering.

I notice your usage patterns/programs are different than mine. Hopefully the perspective helps at least. Good luck!

Here's Paul Graham on the switch to Mac:

http://www.paulgraham.com/mac.html

actually if you are not doing any iphone development (or mac development) i dont see the point. i am on a dell inspiron (bought early last year) and is very solid. running fedora 9, only log in to XP if i have to (around once a month).. cost of hardware is lower (id say atleast 10%-20%) and you have a lot more freedom with what you can do without running into the JobsWall! plus for webapps i can get it to mimic the production environment almost as is.

Yes it is not as "cool" as a mac, but hey if I wanted my machine to look hot Id have gone into fashion design.

Think about the software too. I see you use Adobe CS3 and MS Office, so you'll have to buy new licenses of each of these, unless you're running them in a VM.

I looked at moving to a Mac just like you are and after looking at the hardware and software costs, I could by myself a separate linux server as well as a new PC for about the same price as a Mac. You're also limiting yourself in the hardware you can buy by using a mac, no more upgrading the video card if you feel like it, or getting a $40 digital TV receiver, no more plugging in a RAID array on the weekend, the number of third party accessories is smaller and there a lot more expensive. Also the amount of free utilities for the Mac is a lot less (I use a bunch of little free PC utilities, that have seeped in over time, and would take a lot of time to replace). I have 2 monitors at the moment and thinking of getting a third - can the Mac support a third? not sure. There's a lot you take for granted in the PC world that you give up if you move to the Mac world. The Mac hardware is a closed proprietry system and all the negatives that come with that are there, but I do agree it's nice and shiny and I just want to touch them :-).

So I'm buying a little Mac laptop to play with (officially for the kids) and keeping my development on PC's. If you want to dip your toes (to see what all the hoo ha is about) the Mac mini could be an option too. hth.

Having all the power of unix and a nice interface is great. Its slightly harder to sell if you are not a command line addict but if you are developer though you should be one.

My experience has been pretty positive. I can focus on coding and not have to spend all my time holding my OS's hand or hunting for settings buried in some maze of dialogs or some undocumented config file.

I was in your position recently and decided to switch. 3 months later and I'm back with Windows - it is simply more efficient for me. I'm really big on productivity, so I really tried to customize every tool I've listed below. To give some background, the main programs I use are:

1. (http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2004/04/09/launchers.h... "Launchers - SlickRun vs QuickSilver + Butler/Launchbar")

a) Ported all current bangs from SlickRun to QuickSilver.

b) Tried Butler, Launchbar to quickly launch artists, songs. Ended up sticking with Launchbar.

* SlickRun is marginally faster, minimalistic. Support different use cases.

* Felt frustrated in QuickSilver's scripting language trying to do simple stuff like "Open new Window (not tab), ssh to this hostname."

* Tie as I'm prejudiced.

2. Terminals - PuTTy + cygwin vs Visor + Terminal, iTerm, x11... + Gnu-darwin, fink

* I heavily abuse remote (Ubuntu) session screens to do all my work. (I'm usually a Rails dev using VIM.)

* Needed 256 colors, package manager, bright (as opposed to bold) colors. Prefer no tabs.

* I have no idea why the native Terminal program doesn't support 256 colors. Entirely silly.

* Package management is a pain. Ended up doing all my work on my remote Linux box.

* I really prefer PuTTy. Every single terminal program I used on OSX either didn't fit in visually or were missing some feature that was provided in PuTTy.

* Spent way too much time frustrated while trying out everything. At then end, still frustrated.

* I understand this might just be due to my prejudices, so tie.

3. Virtual desktops - VirtuaWin vs Spaces, Witch

* Spaces has huge numbers of problems. Especially when combined with CMD-TAB. Spent way too much time frustrated. Gonna give this one to Windows.

4. Browsers - Firefox vs Firefox.

* Lack of right click drag mouse gestures. Large drop in productivity I never managed to replace. Windows wins.

5. Music - Winamp vs iTunes.

* I really learned to hate iTunes. A lot. Ended up bugging out on my giant music library and crashing a ton for no reason. ... Spent even more time debugging/Googling. Frustrating.

* Tie, lots of people like iTunes. I prefer my Winamp + Python script to update m3us.

Every other program had a relatively easy replacement. Here are my other gripes:

6. Hardware - Right click.

* 'nuff said. Everyone trying to justify this design decision is probably a fanboy.

7. Keyboard shortcuts.

* Three months later, I'm completely used to the keyboard shortcuts and hate them passionately. Does anyone honestly like the Apple bindings better?

* They lie! Changing bindings for applications like Firefox in the "control panel" does not work at all. Another frustrated day.

Conclusion:

* If you spent a lot of time becoming proficient on your platform of choice, you probably can only lose on OS X.

* It is incredibly frustrating trying to make "minor" tweaks. They turn into massive battles that remind me of my days trying to tweak my Linux desktop box.

* If you aren't an efficiency freak like me, you might gain by switching.