Hey, just published my after action report on publishing my first Node.js module written in ClojureScript. I was trying to fill some gaps in the existing documentation and pool together the research I did for the project. Hopefully some people here will find it useful. I would appreciate any feedback pro or con. Thanks!
I have to ask: why? It's server-side, so why not just write Clojure and take advantage of the JVM performance, scalability and everything Clojure gives you that just isn't available in ClojureScript?
Real Clojure. You have access to more of the language, better tools, more libraries, better performance. Anytime you target JS it's like running with lead weights around your ankles.
I think the argument for Node.js was that it is typically difficult to write asynchronous code, and they made some effort to make that better, and the one language across front end and back.
With Clojure you can write asynchronous code just as easily with much better performance. I can also share code bases across my backend (cascalog, storm), mid-stack (noir), and front-end ClojureScript.
The arguments against Clojure is that some people have difficulty learning it and functional programming in general.
This is totally awesome, thank you for writing this Matt.
That said, my argument against Clojure is the sheer weight Java interop demands (I always found myself dealing with far more Java than I would have liked). And with Clojurescript, the tooling feels incredibly raw to me. Getting started sucked up most of a weekend, and even then it was considerably less pleasant than parenscript.
That said, clojurescript really just felt very young to me, and could become something amazing with time and momentum. Perhaps you could write a short article about your setup (backend-mid-frontend), and some tips for people testing the waters? Would be highly appreciated!
The high level is Rails on the very front for legacy reasons, and it's easier to find libraries that do, authentication, authorization, billing etc... that speaks to solr or a restful service running on noir hosted by tomcat, cassandra is the main DB. All backend tasks are performed by Hadoop or storm, and those jobs are all written in Clojure.
To be honest I feel that the Java interop isn't that bad. It's easier than doing interop from ruby/python down to C or C++. It provides access to lots of high quality libraries and you get the JVM. I think it's more than worth the price.
Although I know many functional programming languages, Clojure is the first that I've stuck with long term, and I think the strength of the ecosystem has a lot to do with it. Languages like Erlang, Haskel, and lisp are really interesting, but the breadth and depth of the libraries isn't comprable. Being a small company we need to be careful how we allocate resources. We contribute back where we can, for instance we contribute to clj-hector and cassandra.cascading but we're only a two man dev shop.
Another reason might be the smaller setup/footprint. Setup and deployment of the JVM and all related systems is more complex than a Node.js based system
10 comments
[ 0.29 ms ] story [ 44.7 ms ] threadI think the argument for Node.js was that it is typically difficult to write asynchronous code, and they made some effort to make that better, and the one language across front end and back.
With Clojure you can write asynchronous code just as easily with much better performance. I can also share code bases across my backend (cascalog, storm), mid-stack (noir), and front-end ClojureScript.
The arguments against Clojure is that some people have difficulty learning it and functional programming in general.
That said, my argument against Clojure is the sheer weight Java interop demands (I always found myself dealing with far more Java than I would have liked). And with Clojurescript, the tooling feels incredibly raw to me. Getting started sucked up most of a weekend, and even then it was considerably less pleasant than parenscript.
That said, clojurescript really just felt very young to me, and could become something amazing with time and momentum. Perhaps you could write a short article about your setup (backend-mid-frontend), and some tips for people testing the waters? Would be highly appreciated!
The high level is Rails on the very front for legacy reasons, and it's easier to find libraries that do, authentication, authorization, billing etc... that speaks to solr or a restful service running on noir hosted by tomcat, cassandra is the main DB. All backend tasks are performed by Hadoop or storm, and those jobs are all written in Clojure.
To be honest I feel that the Java interop isn't that bad. It's easier than doing interop from ruby/python down to C or C++. It provides access to lots of high quality libraries and you get the JVM. I think it's more than worth the price.
Although I know many functional programming languages, Clojure is the first that I've stuck with long term, and I think the strength of the ecosystem has a lot to do with it. Languages like Erlang, Haskel, and lisp are really interesting, but the breadth and depth of the libraries isn't comprable. Being a small company we need to be careful how we allocate resources. We contribute back where we can, for instance we contribute to clj-hector and cassandra.cascading but we're only a two man dev shop.