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My iOS app has reached 1 million downloads.

26 points by ronyeh ↗ HN
Hi all,

Tiny Piano, my free piano app for iOS, reached 1 million downloads this weekend.

http://itunes.apple.com/app/id477014214

I built it on my own, using the Sparrow framework. I'm happy to answer any questions you all have (e.g., regarding indie iOS development).

Thanks!

Ron

p.s. of course, I'm now getting the "You're submitting too fast. Please slow down. Thanks." error. I'm definitely reading your questions, but I won't be able to answer them until the error goes away. Sorry!

43 comments

[ 3.1 ms ] story [ 87.3 ms ] thread
raikia
You should make an Android version. Then I'd use it.
ronyeh
Thanks for your feedback! I'd love to make one (eventually) since I have a Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1. But right now, I don't have the cycles.

I'm looking into getmoai.com to do cross-platform development.

raikia
Yeah, I totally understand. The app looks good and high-quality, but I don't have an iOS device to try it on....sorry.
mrschwabe
Congrats, nice work dude. Did you try other frameworks; why did you end up choosing Sparrow vs other routes?
ronyeh
Tiny Piano was actually my 5th app that I published on the App Store. It turns out that I needed to ship four duds before I happened on a successful app. I also built a few game prototypes that never made it to market.

I first tried cocos2d, probably the most popular 2d game framework for iOS. I built two prototypes with it... but struggled to get either app to a state where I was happy with shipping.

Then, I happened across Sparrow. I realized its architecture was very similar to ActionScript 3. In my previous life, I had built a lot of stuff in Flash. So, I was able to build apps much faster once I found Sparrow.

Recently, I've been keeping my eye on MOAI, which allows you to publish games to both Android and iOS. I might built future games with MOAI.

zura
Have you considered HaXe? (Also similar to ActionScript 3)
ronyeh
I ran across HaXe while I was in grad school, and tried it out back then in 2006. I haven't tried HaXe recently.

I just did searches for 2d game toolkits... and I happened to find Sparrow. It was completely open source, and a very clean/simple toolkit, so I liked it immediately.

I'm still looking for a simple/clean/open source JavaScript game toolkit that allows me to deploy to Android + iOS. That would be my dream come true, I think.

japhyr
Would a JavaScript toolkit run games in the browser, or as a native app?
ronyeh
I would love if the JS toolkit ran games as a native app.

This is the closest one I have found: http://impactjs.com/

I hope that future smart phone OS developers allow us indie devs to use JS to make native games. I personally don't truly care if the API is or isn't compatible with HTML5/canvas. As long as it is in JS, I'll be happy. :-)

I actually have gotten used to Objective C, so I don't mind using it. But I feel like there are a lot of JS developers out there who would like to build mobile games. Why make them learn something new?

jamessun
Can you be more specific about your struggles w/Cocos2d? Were you simply more comfortable w/the similar concepts and naming schemes for Sparrow and AS3? Thanks!
ronyeh
In short, I was simply more comfortable with Sparrow.

I think it was a combination of a bunch of factors. I was learning iOS development at the same time as I was learning cocos2d, all while brainstorming and hacking on my first ever mobile app. Thus, every time I couldn't remember / figure out how to do touch handling, or place a sprite at the correct location, etc... I blamed it on cocos2d. :-D Of course, cocos2d is a fine toolkit. Just see how many games people have developed with it!

Before doing iOS development, I had spent my 2.5 previous years doing AS3/JS development. Before that, I spent ~6 yrs doing Java development. Sparrow happened to match my mental model of how graphics, event handlers / touch handling, and animation worked.

So if you have a similar background to me, then do give Sparrow a try!

jamessun
Appreciate the candid feedback. Good luck in your future iOS endeavors!
seclorum
I'm a MOAI developer, and I can tell you: USE IT! Its freakin' awesome. ;)
ronyeh
Do you have a game in the store that I can look at? As far as I can tell, most of the games in the store are from larger teams... and that worries me.

I want a toolkit that is super easy for one person to work with. I even considered going to Corona at some point, but I am a fan of open source SDKs, so MOAI caught my eye.

I might also take a look at Starling (http://gamua.com/starling/) from the same developer as Sparrow. It allows you to write in AS3 and publish to Android and iOS and Web/Flash.

seclorum
Believe it or not, I've been using MOAI to do non-game apps - i.e. utility apps. I've done one game with it - a Lottery ball physics game - and it was very, very fun. I don't think you should shy away from MOAI because of the perception that it takes a team to make the game - well, as long as you can find some way to get content made - i.e. graphics, bitmaps, etc.
ronyeh
Would you mind sharing a link to some of your moai utility apps? I'm always interested to see what others have done. :-D My sparrow/cocos2d apps (duds included) are here: http://itunes.apple.com/artist/id431782728
xackpot
Congratulations ronyeh. That's wonderful. Can you please share with us how you have marketed your app? I have an app of my own (Finderous) and I am trying to figure out ways to market it.
ronyeh
Thanks!

I feel I got pretty lucky with marketing. My best guess is that word-of-mouth has played a big part in the app's growth. People love to show off, and it turns out that Tiny Piano is a fun way to show off something cool to friends.

But specifically, I have two Facebook pages where people can like my app/company and get updates: https://www.facebook.com/squarepoet https://www.facebook.com/tinypiano

If someone likes my app, it'll show up in their profile. So there's a chance that their friend will also find my app.

I also include an "Email a Friend" button in the app. People use that button to share the app with friends.

As an engineer... I don't enjoy marketing. But I know it's super important, and I'll spend much more time on it going forward.

xackpot
Thanks, I believe integrating social components in one's app has become critical to app's marketing. I have put facebook and twitter sharing in my app and I will put email a friend option as well.
ronyeh
I'd love to have this discussion move toward the topics of indie development and marketing. As a solo developer, I find it difficult to do good marketing.

I might try doing some giveaways (contests) on my FB page. I find that giveaways on sites like engadget tend to generate a lot of traffic.

zura
Did you make the artwork yourself?
ronyeh
Yes. I spent a lot of time in Photoshop and Illustrator. I first learned Illustrator in 2005 for making illustrations for technical papers. It takes a looong time for me to make good art, and I wish I had the $ to hire a graphics designer.

I've practiced enough that I can make "above average programmer art"... but one day I want to hire a real artist to give my apps that necessary shine that Apple requires to promote your app as an "App of the Week."

AnandKumar
Congrats Ronyeh. Well made, just now downloaded and played a Zeppelin song on it. How long did it take you to reach the figure of 1 million?
ronyeh
I released it on Feb 26, 2012, but the download numbers were very low for about 2 months. Then, I released version 1.1 at the end of April. Sales picked up, and have stayed pretty high since then. So, the bulk of the 1M downloads have come in the last two months.

If you sign up for a free AppAnnie.com account, you can take a look at the rankings history in the various countries.

The app did really well in China/Taiwan/Hong Kong, because I added the Chinese word for "piano" as a keyword. App Store SEO really helps!

luxpir
Thanks for that last piece of information - I'm looking for concrete examples of where translation boosted sales and this fits the bill quite well. Have you localized for any other markets?
ronyeh
I have not localized the app itself. I feel like that is a lot of work for one person to maintain.

However, I have localized the App Store title, description, and keywords to as many markets as possible. I use Google Translate and my best judgement. Mostly, I just translate the word "piano" into different languages, to improve search. See my German page: http://itunes.apple.com/de/app/tiny-piano/id477014214

This has had a positive impact on sales in Germany, Japan, and Korea.

revorad
Congrats! That's really amazing and inspiring. Just tried your app - it's fantastic. No wonder so many people downloaded it.

I noticed you also have in-app purchases. Do you make much money off those?

ronyeh
One data point: yesterday, num_in_app_purchases / num_new_downloads was 0.0158, so about 1.6%. Though this is an imperfect stat, since there's probably a delay before you get bored with the free songs and decide to buy the IAP.

I do make enough revenue now that I could "build mobile apps" for the rest of my life. Of course, this trend has only been true for about one month. So there are no guarantees... I guess I just need to continue to work hard and crank out new fun apps. :-)

J3L2404
Conspicuously similar number to average CTR. Is there some correlation? Congrats on your success.
ronyeh
It's definitely in the same ballpark as average click through rate for my ads.

Maybe that's the magic number for free apps? For every 1000 people who try your free app... about 10 to 30 of them will convert to a "paid" user either by buying your IAP or clicking on your ads.

On great days I have seen up to 3% CTR... but usually it's lower than that.

upinsmoke
What's the ratio between 1 Song Pack and All Song Packs? Thanks
ronyeh
Yesterday, 67% of IAP was for All Song Packs. 33% of IAP was for individual song packs.

Again, an imperfect stat, since 33% of my active users are still on an older version which does not include the option to buy All Song Packs.

My goal is to make it super compelling to buy the $3 All Song Packs. Maybe one day, I'll have 10 song packs, and still keep the All Song Packs at $3.

Since I am not a big company, I don't need to charge my users up the wazoo. I mean, some games have "virtual coin packs" that you can buy for $99.99!!! I feel that is unethical, since you are basically cheating the end user. Some little kids will buy the $100 coin pack, and their parents will yell at them. From a user's point of view, every time I see that, I think WTF....

As an indie developer... I don't need to make enough revenue to sustain a 30 person company and please my investors. Let's say (eventually) I sell 500,000 "All Song Packs" at $3. That comes out to about 500000 x 3 x 0.7 = approx. $1 million, after Apple's commission. After I pay my taxes, I'll be able to buy a modest house in the Bay Area. So my goals are definitely not beyond reach. And that realization is what allows me to wake up every morning and fire up Xcode. :-)

dawson
Hey Ron, congratulations on your great success! I am probably being stupid here, so please forgive me, but on your website http://www.tinypiano.com/videos/ it states "Check out these fun videos of our iPhone guitar app." but then shows videos of your Tiny Piano app? :)
ronyeh
Hey, thanks for the bug report (now fixed)! ;-)

This is simply because before Tiny Piano was Tiny Piano, it was actually an app called Gravity Guitar: http://itunes.apple.com/app/id431782725

Gravity Guitar is one of my aforementioned duds. Despite its good reviews, since it is a paid app, and since I didn't spend nearly enough effort marketing it, it never got that many downloads.

At some point late last year, I got frustrated and decided to make a new app. I ripped out Gravity Guitar's guts, replaced the art and music, and shipped a new (free) app called Tiny Piano.

Turns out, free >>> $0.99.

taphangum
Hey Ron, Congrats!

I have a site in this niche that offers encouraging tips to ios developers and entrepreneurs.

Would you be up for doing an interview? It'll be all text based.

Email me here: tapha[AT]taphamedia.com and we can get it going if you would like to do it!

ronyeh
I'm not currently doing interviews, but feel free to ask me questions here. I guess maybe this thread will evolve into a reddit-style "ask me anything." :-)
zura
May I ask you - do you make enough with this piano app to leave the day job and fully concentrate on indie development?
ronyeh
Yes, in fact this is now my day job. :-)

My income has only been stable for about a month though, but if I can keep it up, it'll pay me a decent software eng. salary.

It's much safer if I have multiple apps pulling in revenue. That means the revenue graph will smooth out a bit (i.e., if Tiny Piano does poorly one week, another app can cover). Right now, income fluctuates wildly based on downloads and usage.

zura
Great, I wish you all the best and thank you very much for answering the questions!
yonix
Hey Ron!

Congrats on reaching 1 million.

Could you tell me how you managed to get approval for including songs from artists like Justin Bieber and LMFAO in the app?

ronyeh
Well, first off, I do not include any samples from their MP3s, nor do I include reproductions of their copyrighted sheet music.

Second, I am careful to link out to the artist's content on iTunes and YouTube. So hopefully the music industry understands that I am driving users to their songs. If a user wants to listen to Justin Bieber's Baby, they won't be able to do so within my app. They'll need to go download it from iTunes, or be the 756 millionth viewer on YouTube.

But honestly, I'm not trying to infringe on anyone's content. I just want to make a fun app to drive up interest for various artists and songs (not that Bieber needs my help). But if they contact me and want a particular song removed, I will be happy to do so.