Job market for a 30+ person learning to code?

if you have skills and work hard - you should be in a really great spot to find a cool job, start or join a cool startup.

If you are okay with an entry level role and wage for the first 1-2 years then you are on the right track. In fact that is one of the best ways to learn best practices is working alongside experienced developers. You'd be getting paid to learn! You're in the market with the highest demand for workers right now so fret not, keep on learning and you'll be fine.

In my experience if a candidate is willing to accept the pay level of a younger colleague (just because they have similar number of years of experience) then employers don't care much. However, if it's a strategic job opening to be filled by someone expected to build a full career, it'll be harder to sell yourself knowing that your first 15 years are already gone.

You will need to create your own opportunities. Simply taking courses in coding is not going to cut it. Take what you learned so far and apply it to something concrete. Studying Android? Build an app and put it in the market place. Blog about it. Get people to use it. You will soon discover larges gaps in your knowledge. Study those concepts on your own. You can't wait for a course to teach you.

You are in a difficult spot. It is not so much that younger developers are better, but developers that start young shows that they have passion, and are not simply chasing a paycheck. You need to prove that you are not only a competent developer but also that you are passionate about the field. Start reading ... A LOT.

I don't think you could ever be too old to work as a programmer.

When people say they would rather hire junior programmers it is because of their drive to learn new stuff and their use of the most modern techniques, not their age.

Java is a great basis to work off, and I bet you'll get a fine job with it, but also consider learning a more dynamic language like Python, perhaps learn it at codecadamy.

I don't personally have any experience with being 37 and looking for a job, but I don't see a reason why someone should turn a fine developer down because of his age.

Also, 37 is not very old at all..

This is an interesting question and one I've thought about a lot too. I'm 37 and an experienced developer/entrepreneur. I've been self-employed for 12+ years but if I ever had to "get a real job", it's something to think about.

First off, remember that it's not legal for a US employer to ask your age. They can only ask if you're over 18. Of course, if you want to be sly about it, you'll need to craft your resume carefully (putting the year you graduated from high-school or college can tip off). Also, your looks may or may not belie your age (I have no gray hair and can look late-20s if I shave my beard).

Also, I think the biggest (perceived) issues are that either (a) employers don't want to hire older developers because their experience demands higher pay or (b) they want younger developers who can work insane hours. I must say, I don't know if these are generally true (they aren't when I hire people).

But for you, (a) shouldn't be an issue. You're a new developer so you probably are fine with a entry-level salary.

I got a decent programming job only at 28. Though I coded a few programs since I was 17, only at 26 I was assumed at a "developer" position, as PHP junior dev. Then learned Python and used it wherever possible, and at 28 got full-time Python developer job, now I'm 30 and work as Python Team Leader.

Several years ago things like lambda functions, scope and closures were weird and hard to comprehend for me. It took time, but after all you can become fluent.

As I see now, it doesn't take as much brilliant mind as it takes just "flight log hours" to handle complex problems. A guy who won a national programming olympiad (Russia) told me he won by "outsitting" the others, ie. he took more time to prepare and knew more cases. Although it was a disappointment for him (that problems became all the same and boring), it's a nice surprise for us: we (not-CS-graduates) can eventually cover the "flight hours" gap.

if you freelance and do remote work no one need know how old you are. the surest way to get started freelancing is to build something of your own and just start showing it off. If it's good people will ask you to build things for them. So as you learn you should be hacking together something tangible and useful. When you're done you'll have become competent and you'll have a portfolio project to show.

My take is that your age should not the biggest thing you should be worried about. If all you have are coding classes on your belt, and no actual projects in the wild (stuff you did outside of class, apps you built that are on the market, open source contributions) then that should be something you should aim to rectify.

It's not about age, it's about skill. It can be hard to find honestly skilled programmers, even with how many coders are out there. Know your tools (the whole ecosystem, including version control, testing, profiling, etc). Know your languages. Know how to estimate your work (which only really comes with experience, but you don't need to wait for a job to build that experience). Know how to communicate what you are doing and how you're doing it and how to convey that what is being asked cannot be done in the time allowed (by suggesting alternatives rather than flat-out 'can't be done').

Most coding jobs, especially for junior devs, are going to want code-samples - that's where you have a chance to shine. Contribute to an open-source project or create something you can share (even if it's a 'how to get started with X' kind of project, it lets you demonstrate your coding/documentation approach).

If you can demonstrate you are productive and adequately grounded in general computer science, you should not have trouble getting contract assignments in a hot area like Android programming. You can use the contract assignments to build your resume. Or, if you have the means to write some apps for Android app stores that look good and get good reviews, you may be able to skip that step.

Oh please don't refer to 37-39 as old! I'm not quite there myself, but I I'm not far. :) it is never too late to kick ass if you want to kick ass. Best of luck! Like others have said, go create your own opportunities.

If you get good, your skills will speak for themselves. And besides, discrimination based on age is illegal in many countries.

Something to consider: a lot of the reason people discriminate against older programmers is because it's a signaling quality for other, harder-to-measure qualities that are really important for programmers. When someone sees a 37-year-old mediocre programmer who's been programming since he was 22 and spent 10 years at his last company, they think "Why haven't you advanced? Why are you still doing the same stuff you were doing 10 years ago? Are you lazy? Not passionate? Don't have the mental capacity or will to learn new things? Have you gained no new skills in the last 10 years?"

This logic doesn't apply to someone just starting out at age 37. Here there's a really easy explanation for why you're mediocre: you just started out. And I find myself viewing someone who, say, just got out of the military at 35 and is now trying to get a job as a programmer at 37 very differently than someone who has been writing CRUD-screen apps for 15 years.

I wonder if the reason why programming tends to be more ageist than many other professions is because learning new things is really a core part of the profession. An accountant can take their core skills and jump into any job, because the rules are basically the same everywhere. A Ruby-on-Rails dev can take their skills, but they will have to learn a good deal about the existing codebase to be productive regardless of whether it's using the same framework. So someone who shows they haven't learned anything new in 10 years is toxic in the software industry.

tl;dr - Ship something, THEN look for a job.

In the real world, your age is a handicap, no matter what people say. Look for differentiators. A great one is the ability to point to something reasonably complicated that you built from scratch and shipped. Very few programmers can do that, and the ones that can are a class above in the eyes of many employers.

One thing you have going for you is actual life experience that a fresh college grad can't possibly have. I'd try to figure out a way to emphasize that in the interview process. Certainly it's a better strategy than trying to hide your age.

I earnestly recommend going WAY, WAY past whatever you're learning in class, and becoming a subject matter expert in whatever you like working on most. If it's Java, read the entire JVM spec, for instance. Many employers will test primarily for raw problem-solving ability and general CS knowledge in interviews, but I find that intimate, detailed knowledge of one or two areas can also be a powerful differentiator.

Of course, make sure you can actually code. The only way to do that is to code a lot. Remember it's possible to know a lot, and even be able to explain a lot of technological concepts, and still not be able to code worth a damn. Don't be that guy. If you ship something substantial, you're going to have no choice but to do a good deal of coding, and enough server admin / networking / etc work to get an idea of how everything fits together, and a taste of the sorts of compromises one makes in actually getting something out the door.

I suffer from a different, though similar, disadvantage in the interview process: being black (and dressing, acting, talking like it unabashedly). I've learned to live with reduced initial expectations over the course of my educational and professional career (not interested in a debate on this; I have dozens of unambiguous life experiences to confirm). The upside is that people are primed to be surprised by what you can do. Try to view that as an advantage.

Build something small that you like and are proud of. Whenever we look to hire developers (especially Android devs) - those with a few apps in the store immediately get a pass on the first round of interviews and make it to the next level.

Honestly, building something tangible skips through a lot of the other pieces.

1. Learn to code (You're doing that now) 2. Write down ideas (10 a day) about businesses you can start with software (thank you James Altucher for that tip) 3. Once you have a solid idea (dont do your first one) start writing an MVP. Not sure what an MVP is? Listen to the Lean Startup book on Audible (or buy the real book if you like to read) 4. Build a MVP product and ship it. Get a couple customers. 5. Work hard. 6. Eventually get paid and not work for anyone, other than you and your customers.

You're 37 now, you definitely dont want to be in a cube farm with a bunch of other resentful folks who write code for a fortune 500 company. I'm sure you have some domain knowledge around something else. Perhaps you were a flooring installer prior to code. Maybe you were a plumber, who knows. Take that skill and think about what software could have helped you during those times. Look for competitors, evaluate the market and then once you find that idea in that proper niche market. Go for it.

Another book to listen to: Start Small, Stay Small

Good luck!

well, if you would put a contact information in your https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=rburgosnavas HN profile (in the about field) i would contact you for a freelance project (if you do freelance).

i recommend to stop seeing age as an obstacle, see it as an asset - what did you work before? see your new programing experience in context of your previous work experience.

note: i'm 35, i love starting over

Consider getting a low-level job in a shop which is doing Java/Android work (presuming this is your interest). You might at first do 2nd-level customer support, testing, or other non-programming things. However, especially if you position yourself to employers as someone taking on such a role so you can learn on-the-job, you'll be able to finagle your way into more challenging work. Maybe there's some manual testing which can be automated. Now, you've shown you can write code. Before long, you'll find yourself in a development role, and you'll have been paid while learning. By letting potential employers know of your intentions, you can induce selection bias in your favor -- the employers who want testers who will shut-up and do as told will throw your resume away, but those who want motivated people who can take on greater responsibilities will love your goals.

First of all my advice is go for it. Don't let pre-conceptions about age hold you back. In my last job the older engineers were far more talented and productive than the younger fresh-out-of-college or college drop-outs.

Another thought: younger engineers are sometimes preferred simply because they're teeming with naive energy. When I think of hiring someone who I know will spend majority of their time grinding down a mountain of technical debt who do I look for? A naive 20-something college drop-out who will work themselves to the bone for 80k, beer and foosball? Or a 40 year old pro who's been through a successful acquisition, has enough money to not have to work and will figure out in about 2 days how lame the founders are for letting the technical debt grow into such a monstrosity?

Presumably, you have been doing something with your life these last 39 years. I would venture to say your best bet is to take the experience you have in what ever field you were previously in, combine it with your new found programming knowledge and build something.

If you discover you love programming, then you're all set - all will follow from there.

If you don't, then you may be wasting your time.

If you're not sure, keep going until you are.

build something you can show off, then apply for jobs.

a lot of employers are going to also ask: what do you do to keep up with the changes in technology?

also, learn SQL. it's easy, and necessary. pick a database, install it, become somewhat familiar with it.

As someone with experience hiring developers, my concerns about "older developers" were two-fold.

First, the cultural fit. If the company is all mid 20-somethings, would you fit in with the team. ?

Secondly, are you really set in your wise regarding your code and almost as important, what SDLC you're comfortable with (because we aren't using waterfall here!)

So I wouldn't ever not hire someone just for being old, but those are two concerns that I'd have with any candidate and they're a little more of an issue with older developers.

That said, regardless of your age, what is going to get your a job is networking. Start getting involved in the community now. Take on freelancing projects. Attend meetups. Get to know people.

There's an intern on my team that is going back to school for a second degree in CS. He's 32 and will likely have a full time offer locked up by the end of the summer.

Most of my team is in their 40s and I don't think they would have any trouble hiring an older person as long as they had talent. Honestly, you might be a better hire because you're less likely to leave the company in a couple years than a 21 year old that's still trying to figure out what to do with their life.

I became a startup founder when I lost a position at a startup because they hired a younger (cheaper) person. I have 20 years of experience with several patents, etc. Literally we were expanding the team, I interviewed the person, he got the new position, then I was let go. Totally age discrimination, but I couldn't prove it, of course.

Even 20 years ago, Microsoft, et. al. focused on hiring kids right out of college... they're young, easy to mold, cheap, etc.

I won't say the job market is closed to you, but I think that the best power you always have comes form making something yourself. IF you have trouble getting a job in this field, building your own startup -- and I mean, a real business that sells someting to people, SaaS, or whatever business model works for you- something like patio11 -- would be making your own job.

These days we don't need the capital concentration that companies represent, you no longer need to do time as an employee. You can make your own job.