Ask HN: How do I give back to people helped me when I was young and had nothing?
Throughout my career, I've received incredible kindness and inspiration from experienced people - professors, and strangers who invested time in me when I feel like I had little to offer in return. While I always express gratitude and try to pay it forward, I often feel there's still an imbalance. I feel like I owe something more direct to the specific people who shaped my life.
How do you meaningfully give back to people who helped you early on (when you literally have nothing...haha)? What forms of gratitude have you found most meaningful?
Appreciate any comments.
215 comments
[ 121 ms ] story [ 5216 ms ] threadThe folks I've done this for were pleasantly surprised, both by the note and the contents of it. They'd forgotten how they helped me, which makes sense, because it was a big deal for me but not for them.
A physical note, reminding them of the help they gave you, is a great way to say thanks.
Also, paying it forward is the best way to give back and can create long lasting positive ripples.
Think about what someone did for you in the past (an intro, a kind word, a helpful convo an investment, whatever it was) and try to do it for someone in your life today.
It felt like rays of sunshine that came at a time were I particularly needed some, it made my week and then some.
Everything from professors, musical artists, authors, and professionals.
I never expect to get anything back but it's surprising how often I do.
My thoughts are that, if I did/wrote something that improved someone's life, even a one-word "thanks" would feel really good.
Pay it forward
If some of these mentors are retired, I'm sure they would love to hear from a former protege/student/mentee. Watching my dad after his retirement, he always enjoys these interactions with his former colleagues -- talk about their profession or department. Made his day/week in most cases. Retirement can be professionally lonely sometimes.
Dollars meant nothing to him, but control — and meant nothing to this Groom.
>If some of these mentors are retired
Retired people typically rock, so-long as they didn't spend their entire careers being bullies. For several years I lived in a retirement community (as "the help") and the endless dinners/conversations rarely "got old." I mostly enjoyed working with/for elderly retirees, except that most seem to have almost no concept of how much dollars have deflated since their pre-70s/80s/90s gold-backed hayday.
>[things you could do]
Help raise "the next generation" by living well and mentoring your own deserving minds — perhaps have an informal lunch with both your advisor and advisee?
You could throw money at it or try to make big gestures but to the people that helped you just knowing how much it meant to you is the best reward.
That being said, even a handwritten note or phone call to say "I just wanted to say that at X time in my life, you did Y and it was amazing at the time and helped me get to where I am now" goes a LONG way.
(and some of it is, I confess, main character energy)
The first time I went to Defcon, I felt lonely and lost -- it was the first year they had those cool electronic badges, and at the time they were only given out as entrance tokens for an exclusive party that was the talk of the con.
I didn't really "know" anyone there -- like a lot of young hackers, I was part of one of those vBulletin board hacker crews that have been lost to time and I'd exhausted the meager savings I had built up that summer on my plane ticket and hotel room at the Riviera.
A lot of people who had expense accounts were going out to nice places for dinner -- the guy with per diem would get drinks, the guy who had to itemize, and me, the guy trying to get a group together to visit that cool looking dive bar next to Bally's kept getting laughed at and called a newbie...
Then none other than Dan Kaminsky[1] strolls up, tells me he knows who I am (!) and heard I'd been asking about the ninja party, tells me he can't get me in but he knows a room party. Shows me a room next to the pool with a keg in the bathtub, I threw them a five and we sat around talking until late in the night. They had some good tips on cheap places to eat, how to get free drinks at the penny slots, that sort of thing.
And then, every year since that I visited, I did what he did... wander the convention looking for the budget travel crew, the folks who don't do it for a salary and whom this is their reality, and I'd take them on a quest for two dollar hot dogs, show them the little store next to the dive bar where they could stock up on beer and liquor and ice and then disappear into the night like some kind of helpful spirit of the hacker night.
Anyways... long, profuse thank yous are not needed. What you should do is make sure you keep the gates open that were not gatekept for you. Be the person who connects others, in ways that you can't always list on your CV.
[1] Rest in power
This is awesome. One interaction like this can change the entire vibe of a group's weekend. Good on you.
Piling-on your story: I'd love to know who the guy was I hung out with at Defcon 3. My friends' flights were earlier than mine and I ended up alone in Las Vegas, newly-turned 18 y/o and w/ very little travel experience outside of Ohio.
I ended up hanging out talking with a Unix hacker in his mid-late 20s who struck up a conversation w/ me on the con floor. We hung out the rest of Sunday until my flight left. It made what otherwise would have been a lonely and stressful day a lot of fun.
He gave me an email address to hit him up after the con. It turned out to be fake. I've never been able to find any references to his "name", the domain name on the email, etc. I don't know if he gave me the fake address because of the stigma of a "hacker con"(being worried about real identities, etc). I hope it wasn't because he just didn't want to hear from me again (albeit I do recognize I was pretty insufferable at that age).
If you remember hanging out w/ a long-haired kid on the last Saturday of Defcon 3 I'd love to touch base. (My God... that will be 30 years ago in a couple months.)
The only payback would be in passing it on. The act is an attempt to build a culture of openness and collaboration. It is only partially about helping the person that needs it and more about creating a gift to future us.
Carried on the tradition, and credited the "man", and potentially spawned others to do the same. I think that would be have been biggest thank you Dan Kaminsky could have received.
Just weeks before he passed, we were trading long Twitter DMs late into the evening—deep, technical conversations spanning topics that were hard to get good information on elsewhere.
After his passing, as I began sharing these stories, I found that so many others had experienced the exact same generosity from him. He had a remarkable way of making people feel seen and supported.
Treating people shitty has no reward, takes zero effort and minimal intelligence.
It's not like they go "ah yes, just what I deserve!"
If anything, it puts them in a confusing or uncomfortable position.
I get it now. But if you have people to thank, call them and make it short and sweet. But don't do the big gesture.
His response to your thanking him was perfect.
Thanks for sharing, and for your example.
It really all comes down to example.
Monkey see, monkey do.
I never met Dan K., but, from everything I've heard, he was real mensch.
Is this what getting old feels like? Seemed it never happened now it is a regular occurrence. Just as life is getting really good, my friends have started dying off.
The big lesson is recognizing how far a little help goes.
Often it's not much for the person who gave you help, but the result cascades. Nobody is completely self made. We do a lot of work to push ourselves forward but it still relies on other people.
So as you grow, take a chance on others. Don't just look at who they are but who they want to become. The world is full of gates that are extremely difficult to pass through but trivial to hold open for others. It can be making introductions, passing along a resume, or just taking the time to say hi and be friendly.
Recognize that the world is noisy and that these little things help us navigate. We solve big problems by breaking them down into many little problems, so it should be easy to understand how solving little problems makes progress towards solving big ones. Even if you don't know what that big problem is. Just try to make the world a better place. Recognize your struggles and when you can, help others to not face the same issues. You can't solve everything and you won't be perfect, but as you've recognized, a little can go a long way. So do that.
People aren't born wizards. We all start as noobs. Don't forget the journey
I believe you.
By the time I was cool enough to have my pick of parties, I ended up having a massive panic attack during the crowd crush at the bar at some Rapid7 event and ending up pissing off the person who got me the ticket by leaving after 30 minutes to go buy a Manhattan at some side bar in the casino rather than wait in line 45 minutes for a beer, then spend another 45 minutes trying to wiggle away, only to start wiggling back.
I know I will never have that kind of impact on someone but I hope I have / can continue to pay rabbi back by practicing that level of kindness and consideration to others.
Looks like it became a "symposium" in 2008[1] if we're discussing the same thing.
The one PETS I went to, Dan wasn't at, but Caspar Bowden joined me in my quest to try to eat lunch before 9pm in a certain EU country and reassured me that my concerns about mass surveillance were rooted in facts and logic in rather disturbing detail.
My impression of academia was that there's two very different sets of people, one I came to term the "hostel people", the other the "hotel people": Hostel people would talk to whoever seemed interesting, hotel people want to know: Who are you, who's your adviser, where did you do your bachelors, where did you do your master's, what did your parents do, did you go to a fancy prep school, did you grow up in a large city or "flyover country", and so on and so forth.
Anyways, in comedy we often talk about "punching up" -- when it comes to building community I feel it's best to do the opposite and "shore up the base" -- focus on building up the next generation.
https://petsymposium.org/2007/
https://petsymposium.org/2008/
I would add something to that advice. I would tell you to go back to the people that helped you, and thank them. Tell them what they did, and why it helped you.
That may prove both cathartic and/or encouraging to those who helped you, and spur them on to continue helping others.
I say this because I was a foster child. I aged out of the system. In general, the experience was terrible, but there were a couple families who made a significant impact in my life by things they said and taught.
10 years later, when some of that began to take root in my life, and have a real impact, I went back and thanked them. It was a VERY good thing.
I would say when you have the opportunity, you should do the same.
He told me that when I was successful, to do the same.
- speak to them frequently and deliberately remind them of how immense their help has been to me. i try to share important updates with them as well.
- gifts
- paying it forward. easiest, kind of natural responsibility though (even if no one helped you). hence least emphasized as a way to show gratitude.
I always go through every cold contact email or message from any university student who messages me out of the blue, simply because a McKinsey Senior Managing Partner took the same chance for me. He even recommended me to the McKinsey recruiting, even though I was ridiculously off-cycle, even though my profile was kinda shit lol, just after one meeting. But because of him, I got my first exposure to whiteshoe recruiting (eventually joined a place where McK people dream of going to). So now I give back the opportunity to anyone who asks me politely for a meeting or for advice.