Please, James, don't sue me. It's just my opinion as a fellow Design Engineer... and in my defence, I probably wouldn't have written this if your company didn't constantly proclaim how amazing all your products are. And besides, these days, I can't exactly opt-out of a Dyson-altered existence, given that you're systematically making public washrooms everywhere louder, wetter, more expensive and more confusing. I don't really like your products, James, I don't like what they stand for and I don't like you either, for that matter. Anyway, here's (just some of) the reasons why. But please, James, don't sue me.
It didn't include the terrible battery pack design of the vacuum cleaners either. They could have added a few resistors (already supported by the battery management chip they're using), but instead they didn't so the battery packs just fail. https://old.reddit.com/r/18650masterrace/comments/tifbgr/dys... and the eevblog original linked there.
Dyson is like the IKEA for household appliances. They are pretty and fancy and somewhat featureful but they never seem to hold up to the truly high end stuff like Sebos/Miele. Those brands will cost you an arm and a leg but they will do exactly what it says on the tin, and nothing more. No gimmicks, just suction.
It was announced a month ago and seems to handle the design criticism in this blog entry. If it works as well as demonstrated will put it in a new class of vac.
>Dyson hand dryers are very fast, but as a result, they fling water everywhere
Isn't that the whole point of them? Instead of imparting enough heat energy to evaporate all of the water on your hands, they just push it off which is much faster and more energy efficient. How would they work better than regular dryers without doing that?
I used to work for Dyson and I think this is quite off in many ways.
* The industrial design of Dyson products is generally great. I don't think they poke you or anything like that. They even have nice affordances like all the things you can use being red. Contrast that with my terrible Shark where everything is black. Took me a good few seconds to find the bin release button. It also has an atrocious UX - a slow on/off button instead of a trigger, and an amazingly useless "smart power" feature that just varies the power almost completely randomly as you vacuum.
When I worked there all the vacuum guys were worried about Shark because their pickup is apparently better. They needn't have worried because their UX is so abysmal. Although I guess in fairness Which doesn't know UX exists.
* Some of the criticisms of the tech are valid, e.g. the hand dryers spraying water everywhere (they easily erode painted walls and now they generally install them only on tiles). But those are just flaws of the tech, they don't negate the fact that the hand dryers are much better than the standard cheap ones. He quotes the claimed hand drying time for a cheapo dryer as being close to an air blade but anyone that has ever used one knows how much of a lie that is. The washing machines did damage clothes but apparently the main reason they stopped making them was a manufacturing issue with the drum.
* I don't think anyone really believes that James Dyson is personally inventing all Dyson products now. That doesn't mean he has no influence. When I worked there (about 10 years ago tbf) he still had huge influence over the designs, especially the ones he cared about.
The one thing that is true is that Dyson won't make anything that isn't patentable because James Dyson dislikes his products being cloned so much. So even though though could make really good versions of normal products, they don't.
Also they are way too expensive. Though in fairness my shitty Shark was expensive too.
hey, author here, thought I'd reply to you. Cheers for reading and thanks for the feedback.
I wanted to explore how the focus on tech-centrism impacts the product design and styling. I do think Dyson makes compromises on cost and ergonomics to uphold their brand values. Does that mean the products are bad? No - but I think they could be better. Do I think a lot of other products on the market are far, FAR worse? yes. But Dyson asks us to hold them to much higher standards (and pay a lot more). So I think serious design criticism is warranted.
Dryer time - there is a huge spectrum here. There are many dryers which cost a fraction of an airblade and dry with similar speed. My real point is that dry speed is a key factor but not the only factor, and that I believe other manufacturers have set their design decision-making with a different set of priorities.
You make a good point about colour-coded interaction points - and the consistent application of those colours across the vacuum product range is good as well. I intend to update the article with some feedback and I'll be sure to mention that for balance.
Regarding James Dyson and the invention culture: I worked with senior ex-dyson designers some 6 years ago so have some 2nd hand awareness over the IPR culture and JD's oversight of design reviews. I agree that I don't think the public literally think that it's JD himself inventing things (though, he is certainly more involved in design than a typical CEO). Yet the objective of the Dyson branding is surely to ensure that the name James Dyson is firmly in the public consciousness as an inventor extraordinaire. I think that is a conscious choice by Dyson and that it has a sizeable influence on societal perceptions of the design profession.
I dunno about this; that greenlight vacuum they brought to market a few years back is dope af. My first little orb Dyson is still kicking almost 15 years after I bought it.
I think their brand isn't just about tech itself, but the utility exploring novel tech can drive.
Dyson has not made himself very popular in the UK by advocating loudly for Brexit, then moving the HQ to Singapore, then firing almost his entire UK R&D department. Someone I know was fired by email while on holiday. Bastard.
I have a V12 and had V6 cordless before and I am quite impressed by these including the Pencil one. It made vacuuming at our home quite simple even for kids. Where do you see they are lacking?
Okay maybe I am an outlier, but when I vacuum my place (1400 sqft), it takes about 1hr. I fill half of the container with dust. I am kinda thorough, maybe borderline OCD :)
And so I need a vacuum that is not going to lose power, so I am happy to stay corded, with full sucking power all the way.
I can see the Pencil useful for a quick limited vacuuming.
All I see with Dyson is shitloads of overpriced plastic. I refuse to use any of the various expensive always-break plastic Dysons and prefer my heavy fifty-year-old Kirby Omega. Actual metal. You can still get almost all parts for it, they'll rebuild it, and it is incomparable at sucking up and mulching spilled hay and wabbit poop. I could probably vacuum my driveway with it. $35 used on eBay years ago.
I've always wondered why central vacuum systems never took off. We recently moved into a house that was built in that sweet spot in the late 80s / early 90s when central vac was getting pretty popular, and we love it. Quiet, light (you're not hauling around a motor) and with lots of wall inlets, you can vacuum the whole house with a pretty short hose. In my view, this was peak vacuum design, and they perplexingly seemed to go out of style and are not built into newer homes.
The investment is quite big, I don't know about maintenance but I would expect these air ducts need to be cleaned regularly. Then you need to switch the hose many times to clean the whole house, right? I'm using dyson v12 slim battery vacuum and I'm quite happy. Battery lasts for almost 50 minutes, it's easy to empty, quite lightweight and the green light illuminating the floor is so useful. I don't see why I would ever consider the central one.
You could say the same about Apple or any company over 20 years old which has had time to go through a few department leads and culture shifts.
I’ve had the Dyson DC02 (1995) - great machine, rubbish plastic in the handle which always cracked after 5 or more years. The filters were also a terrible, throwaway design.
Then bought the DC25 (2008). The DC02 still worked, but this was a dramatic upgrade, solid, strong, easy to clean the brush bar (a long haired dog and 2x daughters made this a god send feature) and easy to wash filters.
Then bought the DC16 - their first cordless. Appalling suction and batteries which died after 1-2 years of use.
Next decided to try a different brand and bought a Miele CX1 (2019) - their first bag less cleaner. Highly rated, very expensive. It had the worst brush head I’ve ever seen, required fiddly disassembly to empty the weird little dust compartment within the canister and had a very odd dust filter which was a pain to clean. Terrible vacuum and lousy design compared to our previous Dyson.
Now we have the V15 - phenomenal cordless vacuum. Can’t praise it enough. It’s just a vacuum mind but it’s very good.
As an aside we’ve also bought the Dyson fans for work. The circular one worked well the HP02 heater purifier which cost a fortune has a high pitched whine which is so irritating that everyone turns it off and this is despite Dyson reluctantly taking it back and ‘fixing’ it - whereupon a year later it’s back to whining.
Dyson himself seems a hypocrite and a little questionable - between Brexit and then incorporating in Singapore and also buying swathes of British farmland I’m not exactly enamored. Also backing out of the Dyson car seemed a low ambition move to me given he has total ownership of the company and is one of the few people in the world who can make that kind of impact.
But the article itself just seems a nothing burger.
But as an owner of the Dyson WashG1 mop, It is quite magnificently the greatest cleaning equipment I enjoy using often. It guides well, vacuums well, mops amazing and overall a marvel in design and function. It's a must for those with pets and little ones tracking everything everywhere. There is literally only two design complaints I have, the pull out tray to clean should have a cocking slide trigger to release all the residue and junction joint frame from the dual canisters is a little to cheap plastic for me, it's only a matter of time before the latches break.
If Dyson is picking shiny tech-centric design to the detriment of practicality, then why are their vacuums still the clear top choice in the cordless stick vac category? I'm trying to purchase a new cordless stick vac for a family member, and all the review sites put the Dysons at the top.
26 comments
[ 2.9 ms ] story [ 46.7 ms ] threadIt was announced a month ago and seems to handle the design criticism in this blog entry. If it works as well as demonstrated will put it in a new class of vac.
Isn't that the whole point of them? Instead of imparting enough heat energy to evaporate all of the water on your hands, they just push it off which is much faster and more energy efficient. How would they work better than regular dryers without doing that?
* The industrial design of Dyson products is generally great. I don't think they poke you or anything like that. They even have nice affordances like all the things you can use being red. Contrast that with my terrible Shark where everything is black. Took me a good few seconds to find the bin release button. It also has an atrocious UX - a slow on/off button instead of a trigger, and an amazingly useless "smart power" feature that just varies the power almost completely randomly as you vacuum.
When I worked there all the vacuum guys were worried about Shark because their pickup is apparently better. They needn't have worried because their UX is so abysmal. Although I guess in fairness Which doesn't know UX exists.
* Some of the criticisms of the tech are valid, e.g. the hand dryers spraying water everywhere (they easily erode painted walls and now they generally install them only on tiles). But those are just flaws of the tech, they don't negate the fact that the hand dryers are much better than the standard cheap ones. He quotes the claimed hand drying time for a cheapo dryer as being close to an air blade but anyone that has ever used one knows how much of a lie that is. The washing machines did damage clothes but apparently the main reason they stopped making them was a manufacturing issue with the drum.
* I don't think anyone really believes that James Dyson is personally inventing all Dyson products now. That doesn't mean he has no influence. When I worked there (about 10 years ago tbf) he still had huge influence over the designs, especially the ones he cared about.
The one thing that is true is that Dyson won't make anything that isn't patentable because James Dyson dislikes his products being cloned so much. So even though though could make really good versions of normal products, they don't.
Also they are way too expensive. Though in fairness my shitty Shark was expensive too.
Don't buy a Shark.
I wanted to explore how the focus on tech-centrism impacts the product design and styling. I do think Dyson makes compromises on cost and ergonomics to uphold their brand values. Does that mean the products are bad? No - but I think they could be better. Do I think a lot of other products on the market are far, FAR worse? yes. But Dyson asks us to hold them to much higher standards (and pay a lot more). So I think serious design criticism is warranted.
Dryer time - there is a huge spectrum here. There are many dryers which cost a fraction of an airblade and dry with similar speed. My real point is that dry speed is a key factor but not the only factor, and that I believe other manufacturers have set their design decision-making with a different set of priorities.
You make a good point about colour-coded interaction points - and the consistent application of those colours across the vacuum product range is good as well. I intend to update the article with some feedback and I'll be sure to mention that for balance.
Regarding James Dyson and the invention culture: I worked with senior ex-dyson designers some 6 years ago so have some 2nd hand awareness over the IPR culture and JD's oversight of design reviews. I agree that I don't think the public literally think that it's JD himself inventing things (though, he is certainly more involved in design than a typical CEO). Yet the objective of the Dyson branding is surely to ensure that the name James Dyson is firmly in the public consciousness as an inventor extraordinaire. I think that is a conscious choice by Dyson and that it has a sizeable influence on societal perceptions of the design profession.
Cheers!
Everything will be worker and independently owned (bootstrapped and no VCs), no patents (we don't care about clones)
Just make great product that is open has free software.
If there would be significant interest Dyson could have a direct competitor just like many other open source companies like System72 and Red Hat
Still some of the criticism holds, such as the terrible wall charger.
I think their brand isn't just about tech itself, but the utility exploring novel tech can drive.
The humdinger should be a more modern replacement, but it sucks. No trigger, no fun.
Dyson's brand is to be technologically forward. It is supposed to look like the future, which is why the angular mix of colors works for the brand.
Bosch, I have no idea what their brand aesthetic is, or what they are trying to say.
This doesn't mean that the Dyson is better than Bosch, or any other competitors, just that brand does come into the equation as well.
Yes, it is heavy, and corded, but it is a beast, and still amazed at how much dust it gets every week.
I have to admit that I am not impressed at all by the latest Dyson cordless versions, including the new Dyson PencilVac (https://www.dyson.com/discover/innovation/new-machines/penci...).
And so I need a vacuum that is not going to lose power, so I am happy to stay corded, with full sucking power all the way.
I can see the Pencil useful for a quick limited vacuuming.
It has a headlight.
I’ve had the Dyson DC02 (1995) - great machine, rubbish plastic in the handle which always cracked after 5 or more years. The filters were also a terrible, throwaway design.
Then bought the DC25 (2008). The DC02 still worked, but this was a dramatic upgrade, solid, strong, easy to clean the brush bar (a long haired dog and 2x daughters made this a god send feature) and easy to wash filters.
Then bought the DC16 - their first cordless. Appalling suction and batteries which died after 1-2 years of use.
Next decided to try a different brand and bought a Miele CX1 (2019) - their first bag less cleaner. Highly rated, very expensive. It had the worst brush head I’ve ever seen, required fiddly disassembly to empty the weird little dust compartment within the canister and had a very odd dust filter which was a pain to clean. Terrible vacuum and lousy design compared to our previous Dyson.
Now we have the V15 - phenomenal cordless vacuum. Can’t praise it enough. It’s just a vacuum mind but it’s very good.
As an aside we’ve also bought the Dyson fans for work. The circular one worked well the HP02 heater purifier which cost a fortune has a high pitched whine which is so irritating that everyone turns it off and this is despite Dyson reluctantly taking it back and ‘fixing’ it - whereupon a year later it’s back to whining.
Dyson himself seems a hypocrite and a little questionable - between Brexit and then incorporating in Singapore and also buying swathes of British farmland I’m not exactly enamored. Also backing out of the Dyson car seemed a low ambition move to me given he has total ownership of the company and is one of the few people in the world who can make that kind of impact.
But the article itself just seems a nothing burger.