Is it actually killing the SSD (SSD can no longer be used) or just corrupting the data on the SSD? It's hard to make out from all the comments and news articles.
I've seen lots of SSDs die suddenly (no longer visible on the bus), so I would assume that is what is happening based on the words people are using. I've yet to see an SSD fail to read only mode like they're supposed to... and there's rarely any warning, just working or dead (although I did have a couple that went from working to terribly slow while doing a large reallocation, and we replaced those rather than find out what would happen over a longer term)
That said, people use words with a different meaning all the time, and data corruption could fit as a failure.
I wonder what the commercial effect is of such a thing on MS. Because assuming that the SSDs are unrecoverable it might lead to sales of new machines or new Windows licenses. There is a fair chance that bugs like these end up making good money, the numbers are large enough that even a small fraction of the users being affected can translate into a serious windfall.
But what's actually happening? There seems to be a lack of technical information.
And why does the SSD allow this to happen? A SSD has its own onboard computer, it's not just allowing the OS to do whatever it wants. Obviously the OS can write way too much and reach the endurance limit but that should have been figured out almost instantly, with OS write stats and SMART stats.
> And why does the SSD allow this to happen? A SSD has its own onboard computer, it's not just allowing the OS to do whatever it wants.
If the device is DRAM-less, much of its central information (large parts of the FTL, in particular) resides in the host's RAM, where the OS could presumably touch it. If that area of RAM is _somehow_ being overwritten or out-of-sync or otherwise unreliable, you can get pretty bad corruption.
"I installed a Windows update and my SSD died afterwards" doesn't seem like news, given that almost all Windows users periodically install Windows updates and SSDs sometimes fail.
Nah, I used various Linux distros for years and the update problems happen there all the time, I think even more TBH, and require substantial technical expertise to fix them.
IMO, the only good way is "if it works, don't fix it", which means, no updates. People are seriously overhyping updates.
I stopped updating all the stuff - OSes, smart locks, android apps, TVs, BP monitors - I honestly had multiple update problems on ALL mentioned devices, multiple times. I only update the thing when I have an actual problem and there is changelog stating that the bug is fixed, or when I want a new feature. You can handle security in other ways in almost all the cases.
I think this IT update burden has gotten out of hand - I don't recall any other domain is like that - my car, my house, my bicycle, my glasses DO NOT UPDATE and its glorious - apart from physical damage, they work the same as yesterday.
That's why I don't install updates, unless and until they've been proven not to break things. I miss the old days when software was expected to work out of the box and updates, on the rare occasions when they appeared, were actually useful.
I hope you are speaking with tongue in cheek. Security is the main reason to keep current with updates. They address various “CVE” reports and go beyond to patch things not reported by CVEs.
Install "Windows 10 IoT Enterprise 2021 LTSC" if you don't mind buying grey market keys. Less crapware, more mature and less enshittified than 11, and security fixes until 2032.
I don't want to endorse Windows at all (use Linux if you can!). But maybe you need it to occasionally test something or whatever.
Even though I professionally work with Linux I still don't trust it enough for gaming. I know that Steam does great things with Proton, my issue is that I'm not the type of gamer who constantly plays the same game - Play a game for how long the story or my interests lasts, then switch to the next game.
And after a whole day of debugging and hair pulling at work I just don't feel like then also debugging why a game is not running like it should.
But I heard I should give it a try again, last time I gave it a shot was 2-3 years ago. Big plus would be that I'd be completely free of Windows...
You don't have to buy grey market keys, use the public ones installed through mass gravel. Open source, hosted on Microsoft's own GitHub - it's practically an endorsement!
Please don't buy "grey market" MS keys (i.e. super cheap keys or keys for products not sold to end users, like LTSC).
Either buy keys from legitimate vendors or use alternative activation methods (emulated KMS, etc.). I believe a lot of these grey market keys come either from MSDN subscriptions or leaked MAK keys, in either case, you aren't really paying for the product, you're just funneling money to sketchy people.
Weirdly enough I had one of those 10 IoT Enterprise 2021 LTSC systems kill a SSD in the past month, bad blocks. Intel 520 180GB. Probably coincidence but I figured I'd mention since this was also a system with a large OST file in use.
The biggest problem with this is near zero communications from Microsoft. But what do I expect these days? Shovel AI in everything at any cost.
I’ve had repeatable data loss recently from windows 11 under a specific condition copying directories in explorer. The case works on windows 10 LTSC fine. I have absolutely no idea where to even raise this as an issue now. I’m not sure I even give a fuck.
Not related, but this reminds me of a recent issue with the Samsung 990 Pro SSD that required a firmware update for fix, and some drives had to be returned. I speculate it was exacerbated by increased usage.
Tomorrow, somebody will still explain to you like you're a child that Linux has hardware incompatibilities (on the computer they bought last week the day it came out), and is just not ready for prime time.
They want to stick with Windows because it's safe and just works.
I have a strong suspicion this was some kind of stock / market attack. Phison dropped 14% (and their main competitor Silicon Motion increased 7% incidentally), while every single "news / slop" points to a single original source, some random Japanese person called "necoru_cat" that posted a supposed list of affected models (full of spelling mistakes).
I'm actually very surprised a single person managed to pull off a scam of this magnitude and am very worried about what effect fabricated news (now helped by AI) will have in the future.
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[ 3.0 ms ] story [ 62.5 ms ] threadThat said, people use words with a different meaning all the time, and data corruption could fit as a failure.
And why does the SSD allow this to happen? A SSD has its own onboard computer, it's not just allowing the OS to do whatever it wants. Obviously the OS can write way too much and reach the endurance limit but that should have been figured out almost instantly, with OS write stats and SMART stats.
If the device is DRAM-less, much of its central information (large parts of the FTL, in particular) resides in the host's RAM, where the OS could presumably touch it. If that area of RAM is _somehow_ being overwritten or out-of-sync or otherwise unreliable, you can get pretty bad corruption.
https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/answers/questions/5536733/...
Publications need clicks, videos need watches, people need upvotes
[1] https://wccftech.com/phison-dismisses-reports-of-windows-11-...
IMO, the only good way is "if it works, don't fix it", which means, no updates. People are seriously overhyping updates.
I stopped updating all the stuff - OSes, smart locks, android apps, TVs, BP monitors - I honestly had multiple update problems on ALL mentioned devices, multiple times. I only update the thing when I have an actual problem and there is changelog stating that the bug is fixed, or when I want a new feature. You can handle security in other ways in almost all the cases.
I think this IT update burden has gotten out of hand - I don't recall any other domain is like that - my car, my house, my bicycle, my glasses DO NOT UPDATE and its glorious - apart from physical damage, they work the same as yesterday.
* https://youtube.com/watch?v=mlY2QjP_-9s (JayzTwoCents)
* https://youtube.com/watch?v=sU_WepeHUd8 (ThioJoe)
* https://youtube.com/watch?v=7xS-CE-hy6Q (Dave's Attic)
* https://youtube.com/watch?v=zoHGSz-f6os (Pureinfotech)
Can you point to some "security" updates ? /s
I don't want to endorse Windows at all (use Linux if you can!). But maybe you need it to occasionally test something or whatever.
And after a whole day of debugging and hair pulling at work I just don't feel like then also debugging why a game is not running like it should.
But I heard I should give it a try again, last time I gave it a shot was 2-3 years ago. Big plus would be that I'd be completely free of Windows...
> https://github.com/massgravel/Microsoft-Activation-Scripts
Please don't buy "grey market" MS keys (i.e. super cheap keys or keys for products not sold to end users, like LTSC).
Either buy keys from legitimate vendors or use alternative activation methods (emulated KMS, etc.). I believe a lot of these grey market keys come either from MSDN subscriptions or leaked MAK keys, in either case, you aren't really paying for the product, you're just funneling money to sketchy people.
[1] https://www.neowin.net/news/report-microsofts-latest-windows...
I’ve had repeatable data loss recently from windows 11 under a specific condition copying directories in explorer. The case works on windows 10 LTSC fine. I have absolutely no idea where to even raise this as an issue now. I’m not sure I even give a fuck.
I had a BSOD last week, 0x0000012b (FAULTY_HARDWARE_CORRUPTED_PAGE), which I've never had, and was hoping it isn't related to this update.
https://serverfault.com/questions/1172216/issue-with-samsung...
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/samsung-990-pro-health-dro...
They want to stick with Windows because it's safe and just works.
I'm actually very surprised a single person managed to pull off a scam of this magnitude and am very worried about what effect fabricated news (now helped by AI) will have in the future.
https://youtu.be/TbFIUu_7LIc?si=o1p2FrDYFeLEtIoF
Youtube got bit by this randomly, just working, not looking for this issue.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Softmodem
And how does such a thing reserve host RAM?