Will this protection extend to automobile companies ? Mobile Apps ? Mobile OSs ? I have lost track of the number of leakage points for location data into the tarball of databrokers.
The courts have decided that Verizon selling location data without consent is illegal but I'd be willing to bet that the courts haven't decided that it should be unprofitable.
I'd be surprised if Verizon and the other companies haven't made more than enough money by breaking the law back in 2018 to rake in a nice profit even after the fines they're trying to weasel out of paying now.
I have no doubt that they're still selling our data one way or another anyway. We know for a fact that they've never stopped selling data to to law enforcement, they just require a rubber stamped court order/subpoena to do it.
what are the ways you can poison or fake your location data, like if Verizon in response to this decides to offer a cheaper plan for sharing your location data?
Verizon disputed this not because the fine was in ANY way impactful, but because they wanted to push to see if they could legally do it without any repercussions. In their last quarter alone they made over 9k million USD, if I'm reading it right [0].
> Verizon chose to pay fine, giving up right to jury trial
40Million fine is a cost of doing business, but my question is if people's data was sold without consent, why is a class action not taken against them? Where is the right of the injured party here ?
Verizon is a telco, a regulated industry. They are protected by a tariff, you cannot sue them. So there cannot be a class action lawsuit against a company that can’t be sued.
Definitely not until after the current fashion of fascism is over.
The only way to be able to get something like that passed will be if we can repudiate the money-first, Christofascist, rule-by-fear ideologies and positions that currently hold sway over one of our two viable political parties.
Funny that you say that, I just discovered this phone service called Cape - https://www.cape.co/
It was co-founded by John Doyle who led Palantir’s national security business before starting this company. I think this comment best describes why Cape was started in the first place:
"Cape is not disclosing valuation, but it’s notable that the funding is coming at a time when startups building military, defense, and security services are getting increased focus and priority at a time when geopolitics are shifting.
While many of those shifts are playing out at a much higher level involving wars, espionage against officers and officials, and major contacts between outsized industrial entities, Cape’s products and its growth are one of the rare examples of how some of that evolution is playing out at a consumer level"
you have to constantly advertise your location to get cell service (by design, didn't have to be so)
stores scan your phone radio and also aggregate this data to map your store visit.
this was all done with credit cards in the 50s and then outlawed, hence: reward programs.
so, can't wait for Verizon to offer a cell coverage reward program that is nothing but a waiver to your data, just like reward programs from credit cards of yore.
This may be the wrong time to ask this, but does anyone know where I can buy some location data? I don't want to ask for consent because I want the data (and the analysis) to be as general as possible.
That being said, I have a significant amount of flexibility. The data can be completely anonymized by stripping out the names, addresses etc. The location can be blurred by some radius that's roughly the size of the local census blocks groups. In other words, the location should be random enough to mix together 500-3000 people. The time can also be blurred by a radius of about a week or so. Options like differential privacy are encouraged.
The goal is not to track individuals, just get a rough measure of where they spend their time.
First, does anyone think this is a bad or dangerous set of data?
Second, if not, can anyone point me to some data brokers?
Too bad the US spent so much time prosecuting Google, which never sells personal tracking information, instead of Verizon Which sells everyone's data and is also a ISP monopoly in many places.
31 comments
[ 3.2 ms ] story [ 57.5 ms ] thread[denied because…] > Verizon had, and chose to forgo, the opportunity for a jury trial in federal court.
Now apply it to Flock.
https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.ca2.3fa...
If it's greater than the fine, and they suffer no other consequences (e.g. nobody goes to jail) then the fine is just cost-of-business.
The fine must be greater than what they made, AND some executives or management needs to be held responsible - at least fired.
Otherwise it will just keep happening.
I'd be surprised if Verizon and the other companies haven't made more than enough money by breaking the law back in 2018 to rake in a nice profit even after the fines they're trying to weasel out of paying now.
I have no doubt that they're still selling our data one way or another anyway. We know for a fact that they've never stopped selling data to to law enforcement, they just require a rubber stamped court order/subpoena to do it.
> Verizon chose to pay fine, giving up right to jury trial
40Million fine is a cost of doing business, but my question is if people's data was sold without consent, why is a class action not taken against them? Where is the right of the injured party here ?
[0 ]https://www.verizon.com/about/investors/quarterly-reports/2q...
How much did they make selling or otherwise monetizing location data?
The only way to be able to get something like that passed will be if we can repudiate the money-first, Christofascist, rule-by-fear ideologies and positions that currently hold sway over one of our two viable political parties.
It was co-founded by John Doyle who led Palantir’s national security business before starting this company. I think this comment best describes why Cape was started in the first place:
"Cape is not disclosing valuation, but it’s notable that the funding is coming at a time when startups building military, defense, and security services are getting increased focus and priority at a time when geopolitics are shifting.
While many of those shifts are playing out at a much higher level involving wars, espionage against officers and officials, and major contacts between outsized industrial entities, Cape’s products and its growth are one of the rare examples of how some of that evolution is playing out at a consumer level"
source - https://techcrunch.com/2025/03/19/cape-opens-99-month-beta-o...
Ultimately, I still want to read up on them before considering making the switch.
stores scan your phone radio and also aggregate this data to map your store visit.
this was all done with credit cards in the 50s and then outlawed, hence: reward programs.
so, can't wait for Verizon to offer a cell coverage reward program that is nothing but a waiver to your data, just like reward programs from credit cards of yore.
That being said, I have a significant amount of flexibility. The data can be completely anonymized by stripping out the names, addresses etc. The location can be blurred by some radius that's roughly the size of the local census blocks groups. In other words, the location should be random enough to mix together 500-3000 people. The time can also be blurred by a radius of about a week or so. Options like differential privacy are encouraged.
The goal is not to track individuals, just get a rough measure of where they spend their time.
First, does anyone think this is a bad or dangerous set of data?
Second, if not, can anyone point me to some data brokers?
https://ia801804.us.archive.org/26/items/gov.uscourts.cadc.4...