I've been doing basically this for many years now.
Each password file is AES-encrypted with my master password.
I copy the whole vault around between machines with rsync.
When I run 'password bank' a shell script searches ~/private/Passwords for files that contain ‘bank’ and offers a menu, then gpg-decrypts the file I selected.
I also use this for scans of my passport, recording my bank account numbers, and anything else I want to keep around.
I thought I was the only one, and now I've found out there are thousands of us!
I used pass for many years and loved it. I sync'd my password store between 3+ devices including my Android phone using a git remote. I don't recall the exact reason - maybe the pass android client I had used for years went away? I decided to find the next best option and settled on keepassxc and KeePassDX. The backing store is a binary blob but it does surprisingly well via syncthing: autoupdate works and in the event of a conflict the db merge feature hasn't yet failed me.
Granted on the desktop I find using a (qt especially) GUI more invasive than a terminal but at least on the Android side the app is quite good.
This is interesting for CLI lovers, but I feel KeepassXC on desktop + KeepassDX on Android (with the password DB stored on my own machine and accessed remotely via Wireguard) is a better solution for normies.
I would love to use KeepassXC but it doesn't make it easy to share credentials with the wife. I _could_ use a dedicated vault, but we'll then need to cut-paste things for sharing existing credentials.
So, for now, I've settled on Vaultwarden and it has been surprisingly stable so far.
This is fun if you never leave yourself, but be wary with whom you share it. As a company password manager, there is no way to know who's accessed which secret across their lifetime at the firm so you get to change all the passwords constantly. (Or none, if you can't be bothered.) (Don't ask.)
Or if someone newly needs access, there's no standard way of re-encrypting the files you're guessing they need. You need to hack something together yourself
It uses git, but the commit messages are autogenerated and useless. It might as well have used Dropbox for all the use you get out of it when wanting to find the version before someone corrupted data with their somehow-broken gopass client
There is no way to ever erase anything you've accidentally pushed, short of rewriting the git history and breaking it for everyone (or for personal use: other client devices)
It looks nice and simple, and I like that I can interface with it with manual tools (e.g. write my own commit messages to have some idea of wtf is going on, e.g. when mass-reencrypting to not have 300 commits), but the simplicity is also the pitfall. Feels a bit similar to using hash(site_name+main_password) as a per-site password: beautiful in simplicity but various practical issues
Does anyone have good experiences with a password manager for a corporate environment? Ideally not having yet-another service to maintain, but also not have a server compromise equal business compromise (so end-to-end encryption between the users; verifying fingerprints or some such). From what I found so far, Bitwarden seems to meet that bill but I don't know if there are also others
I like pass and use it a lot, especially as it provides a good and safe backup for the case my vaultwarden instance goes up in smokes.
There is also a drop-in replacement with has some extra features and a bit better UX in some parts, personally I only really use it for the better support for handling multiple GPG keys, as I got some physical backup keys and it can be also nice teams for a shared vault.
Pass is still amazing after all these years. Shameless self plug: I wrote a gnome search provider for it so you can lookup passwords from the overview. Supports OTP as well. https://github.com/Fingel/ripasso-gnome-search-provider
Pass is great, but GPG keys are complicated and add a lot of extra overhead if you don't have one already. Frankly I cannot recommend anyone use GPG today for any purpose. I wrote a much simpler CLI password manager instead that meets explicit security models.
> Notably, pass fails both of these requirements, ... , and the files themselves do not use authenticated encryption.
With pass you can turn authentication on by setting an option to sign the files by default. That comes at the cost of requiring an extra entry of the passphrase so most do not turn this on. Few people are concerned with the idea that an attacker might modify their passwords so they don't work. There is no real benefit to an attacker. They could just delete the files.
Even if signatures are not turned on the regular PGP integrity protection would still be in effect so in the unlikely event that an attacker changed the file an error would be generated and presumably passed on to the user.
I have heavily used Pass over the years. Here are some of its pros (an update to my comment several years ago):
* Your secret key can be stored in Yubikey, handled by a dedicated OpenPGP agent. This allows deriving a strong key from a weak one. Your password is basically a short PIN with max 3 tries. Every password retrieval can require a physical touch. This is convenient and secure!
Pass makes sense if you use it with a hardware key, with touch enabled. With this setup, it’s hard to beat its security.
* It uses public key cryptography, and comes with its advantages. You don’t need your master password to add/encrypt passwords. You only need that for decryption. Less exposure of master key, and more convenience.
For that reason, it’s well suited to share passwords with other people or devices. You can encrypt to multiple public keys. This adds multi user and device support.
You can easily add a backup offline public key (which you may print) if you lose your Yubikey.
* You can decrypt a single password without decrypting and exposing other passwords. The passwords are isolated, if you use Yubikey.
* Searching passwords is quick and transparent. You easily see what is in your store.
* You can use it programmatically, eg, your backup script can grab a password from the store.
* It’s a short bash script that you can verify, and delegates encryption to a dedicated well-audited cryptographic tool.
* PGP is a standard, and GPG and git are widely available. There is no database to break or migrate. You can read your passwords anywhere and in the future.
* The script is written by the creator of the acclaimed Wireguard!
There are also cons.
* Some people don’t like that it leaks metadata (filenames, and password tree), though there are versions of pass that fix it.
* Lately gpg is causing some troubles with Debian Trixie. GPG agent frequently locks the Yubikey and requires restarting pcscd (probably due to conflicts with pcscd).
There is a similar tool Passage using Age, maybe that solves it.
* There are mobile apps, but they are not as frequently updated as something like Bitwarden apps (which has client for every OS, and frequently fixes bugs and adds functionality).
* I haven’t used and not sure how good browser support is.
Here is a post on a similar password management with GPG replaced with Age
About mobile app, I never used pass until today, but it seems great, and so far I only tested it by installing it on my phone in Termux. Can't think of a reason for me to use a special app when running it in Termux works so well. Was happily surprised that even pass show -g worked out of the box, copying output to Android clipboard.
That is also nice since I have ssh already set up so syncing to my computer from the phone will be easy.
Browser password managers with passkeys are more convenient for me, but a pass vault can still be useful for recovery codes and API keys.
I used pass for a while but couldn’t see what threat model it actually solves:
If you let GPG agent cache your key, any script (e.g. an npm post-install) can just run `pass ls` or `pass my/secrets` and dump all your credentials. At that point it’s basically just full-disk encryption with extra steps—might as well keep everything in ~/passwords.txt.
If you don’t cache the key, you’re forced to type your long GPG password every single time you need a secret.
I tried a YubiKey for on-demand unlocking, but the integration is clunky and plugging it in constantly is a pain if you need passwords multiple times per hour.
I just leave my yubi plugged in. It requires a physical touch anyway (at least you can configure it for that which I have). And my place is physically secure.
The good thing also is that unlike with fido2 you only have to enter the pin once for OpenPGP. Then it stays unlocked while it's plugged in. But still needs the physical touch for every password. Perfect and convenient for me.
It also works great on mobile with openkeychain and password store. Both are not really maintained now but I don't really care because the encryption is in hardware anyway (yubikey over nfc)
There's a ton of positivity here, but on the balance there are some significant issues with pass that I think bear mention:
- The fact that it's essentially unstructured data makes it hard to work with generically. If you have a username + password and need to use those in a script, you'll need to implement your own parser in your shell language in every script you need it in.
- `pass generate` to generate new passwords, maybe thanks to the above, replaces everything in the pass value by default. So if you had e.g. a password + secret question answers, if you use `generate` to get a new password it'll wipe out your secret question answers.
- It's very difficult to review history. I stopped using it a while ago, but since everything's encrypted `git diff` won't give you anything useful and IIRC the command line tools were very hard to use for reviewing/restoring passwords when you mess up updates, etc.
- The name makes it nearly impossible to search for
I've been working on something similar... although with slightly larger scope (intended to be used within containers/sandboxes) https://github.com/andrewbaxter/passworth
- Important processes are undocumented. E.g. sharing the pass repository with another computer is not obvious: you need to copy more than the `.password-store/` directory...
- Hard to install if not packaged. I tried to install `pass` on a headless NAS, but it required gpg, which looked hard to cross-compile to aarch64.
- `pass` is a light interface over `gpg`. So it has all the problems of GPG – I've had a few annoyances with `gpg-agent`. Many organizations are trying to ditch GnuPG and switch to simpler and better cryptography tools, like age. https://github.com/FiloSottile/age
- Android with `pass` was a bad experience. The official package was unmaintained. The fork was not packaged in F-Droid. The UI was cumbersome.
I still use pass, for lack of an obviously better universal solution. There's FiloSottile/passage for minimal change, just replacing gpg with age, but no Android. A better alternative would be gopass, which is portable across all unixes, is compatible with `pass` and has an age plugin. But still no Android packaging. https://www.gopass.pw
For me the unstructured data is a big bonus. And it's not really unstructured. You can put Username: xxx and browser plugins like browserpass will pick that up.
Best practice question for syncing pass across devices:
Since exporting and re-importing the private key to a phone seems risky, is the recommended approach to generate a separate GPG key pair on the mobile device and re-encrypt secrets to it?
Pass might work if you really like terminals and only use computers with a Unix-like OS. But if you use a phone, or Windows, pass is just too clunky to use.
How would you build a dead man’s switch for pass?
I’d like my family to be able to access my store if I disappear, but not before. The obvious problem: to re-encrypt for their keys I’d need my private GPG key running somewhere, which defeats the point. Has anyone solved this cleanly without leaving a hot key around?
45 comments
[ 7.9 ms ] story [ 69.8 ms ] threadEach password file is AES-encrypted with my master password.
I copy the whole vault around between machines with rsync.
When I run 'password bank' a shell script searches ~/private/Passwords for files that contain ‘bank’ and offers a menu, then gpg-decrypts the file I selected.
I also use this for scans of my passport, recording my bank account numbers, and anything else I want to keep around.
I thought I was the only one, and now I've found out there are thousands of us!
Granted on the desktop I find using a (qt especially) GUI more invasive than a terminal but at least on the Android side the app is quite good.
Depending on which genre, managing key-rings has element of physical security to encrypt signatures in terminal and bash shell.
For full disk encryption, genfstab and /boot/grub/grub.cfg should contain sigs for partitions.
So, for now, I've settled on Vaultwarden and it has been surprisingly stable so far.
Or if someone newly needs access, there's no standard way of re-encrypting the files you're guessing they need. You need to hack something together yourself
It uses git, but the commit messages are autogenerated and useless. It might as well have used Dropbox for all the use you get out of it when wanting to find the version before someone corrupted data with their somehow-broken gopass client
There is no way to ever erase anything you've accidentally pushed, short of rewriting the git history and breaking it for everyone (or for personal use: other client devices)
It looks nice and simple, and I like that I can interface with it with manual tools (e.g. write my own commit messages to have some idea of wtf is going on, e.g. when mass-reencrypting to not have 300 commits), but the simplicity is also the pitfall. Feels a bit similar to using hash(site_name+main_password) as a per-site password: beautiful in simplicity but various practical issues
Does anyone have good experiences with a password manager for a corporate environment? Ideally not having yet-another service to maintain, but also not have a server compromise equal business compromise (so end-to-end encryption between the users; verifying fingerprints or some such). From what I found so far, Bitwarden seems to meet that bill but I don't know if there are also others
There is also a drop-in replacement with has some extra features and a bit better UX in some parts, personally I only really use it for the better support for handling multiple GPG keys, as I got some physical backup keys and it can be also nice teams for a shared vault.
https://www.gopass.pw/
https://github.com/gopasspw/gopass
https://github.com/tadfisher/pass-otp
The pass android app is really nice too
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=dev.msfjarvis....
It also works in termux
https://codeberg.org/jwgarber/napa/src/branch/main/database....
> Notably, pass fails both of these requirements, ... , and the files themselves do not use authenticated encryption.
With pass you can turn authentication on by setting an option to sign the files by default. That comes at the cost of requiring an extra entry of the passphrase so most do not turn this on. Few people are concerned with the idea that an attacker might modify their passwords so they don't work. There is no real benefit to an attacker. They could just delete the files.
Even if signatures are not turned on the regular PGP integrity protection would still be in effect so in the unlikely event that an attacker changed the file an error would be generated and presumably passed on to the user.
* Your secret key can be stored in Yubikey, handled by a dedicated OpenPGP agent. This allows deriving a strong key from a weak one. Your password is basically a short PIN with max 3 tries. Every password retrieval can require a physical touch. This is convenient and secure!
Pass makes sense if you use it with a hardware key, with touch enabled. With this setup, it’s hard to beat its security.
* It uses public key cryptography, and comes with its advantages. You don’t need your master password to add/encrypt passwords. You only need that for decryption. Less exposure of master key, and more convenience.
For that reason, it’s well suited to share passwords with other people or devices. You can encrypt to multiple public keys. This adds multi user and device support.
You can easily add a backup offline public key (which you may print) if you lose your Yubikey.
* You can decrypt a single password without decrypting and exposing other passwords. The passwords are isolated, if you use Yubikey.
* Searching passwords is quick and transparent. You easily see what is in your store.
* You can use it programmatically, eg, your backup script can grab a password from the store.
* It’s a short bash script that you can verify, and delegates encryption to a dedicated well-audited cryptographic tool.
* PGP is a standard, and GPG and git are widely available. There is no database to break or migrate. You can read your passwords anywhere and in the future.
* The script is written by the creator of the acclaimed Wireguard!
There are also cons.
* Some people don’t like that it leaks metadata (filenames, and password tree), though there are versions of pass that fix it.
* Lately gpg is causing some troubles with Debian Trixie. GPG agent frequently locks the Yubikey and requires restarting pcscd (probably due to conflicts with pcscd). There is a similar tool Passage using Age, maybe that solves it.
* There are mobile apps, but they are not as frequently updated as something like Bitwarden apps (which has client for every OS, and frequently fixes bugs and adds functionality).
* I haven’t used and not sure how good browser support is.
Here is a post on a similar password management with GPG replaced with Age
https://words.filippo.io/passage/
That is also nice since I have ssh already set up so syncing to my computer from the phone will be easy.
I used pass for a while but couldn’t see what threat model it actually solves:
If you let GPG agent cache your key, any script (e.g. an npm post-install) can just run `pass ls` or `pass my/secrets` and dump all your credentials. At that point it’s basically just full-disk encryption with extra steps—might as well keep everything in ~/passwords.txt.
If you don’t cache the key, you’re forced to type your long GPG password every single time you need a secret.
I tried a YubiKey for on-demand unlocking, but the integration is clunky and plugging it in constantly is a pain if you need passwords multiple times per hour.
I eventually switched to Bitwarden.
The good thing also is that unlike with fido2 you only have to enter the pin once for OpenPGP. Then it stays unlocked while it's plugged in. But still needs the physical touch for every password. Perfect and convenient for me.
It also works great on mobile with openkeychain and password store. Both are not really maintained now but I don't really care because the encryption is in hardware anyway (yubikey over nfc)
- The fact that it's essentially unstructured data makes it hard to work with generically. If you have a username + password and need to use those in a script, you'll need to implement your own parser in your shell language in every script you need it in.
- `pass generate` to generate new passwords, maybe thanks to the above, replaces everything in the pass value by default. So if you had e.g. a password + secret question answers, if you use `generate` to get a new password it'll wipe out your secret question answers.
- It's very difficult to review history. I stopped using it a while ago, but since everything's encrypted `git diff` won't give you anything useful and IIRC the command line tools were very hard to use for reviewing/restoring passwords when you mess up updates, etc.
- The name makes it nearly impossible to search for
I've been working on something similar... although with slightly larger scope (intended to be used within containers/sandboxes) https://github.com/andrewbaxter/passworth
- Important processes are undocumented. E.g. sharing the pass repository with another computer is not obvious: you need to copy more than the `.password-store/` directory...
- Hard to install if not packaged. I tried to install `pass` on a headless NAS, but it required gpg, which looked hard to cross-compile to aarch64.
- `pass` is a light interface over `gpg`. So it has all the problems of GPG – I've had a few annoyances with `gpg-agent`. Many organizations are trying to ditch GnuPG and switch to simpler and better cryptography tools, like age. https://github.com/FiloSottile/age
- Android with `pass` was a bad experience. The official package was unmaintained. The fork was not packaged in F-Droid. The UI was cumbersome.
I still use pass, for lack of an obviously better universal solution. There's FiloSottile/passage for minimal change, just replacing gpg with age, but no Android. A better alternative would be gopass, which is portable across all unixes, is compatible with `pass` and has an age plugin. But still no Android packaging. https://www.gopass.pw
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward_Cunningham#%22Cunningham'...
Related: https://github.com/gopasspw/gopass
I haven't used pass in a long time, but I used gopass for a while in a small team and it was pretty great.
Using the openkeychain app and password store.
I have multiple yubikeys as target for each password of course.