I wonder if they're confusing the cause and effect.
Do people who live above 8k feet not die of heart disease or do people with heart disease find it too difficult to live above 8k feet so only people without heart disease live above 8k feet?
I live at 7200 feet and I know several people who have moved to lower altitudes because it's "too hard to breath" here.
> The best defense is to start at 5,000 feet and stay there for 3 days, drinking water like crazy and resting. Then, come up to the higher elevation and give yourself a day or two to adjust. That usually works.
This is crazy to me as I usually only get 1 acclimation night in before going up. I’m curious how people can find their limits / needs?
As a child I lived for two years at ~11k ft (La Paz, Bolivia). I can vouch for the impact of both Acute Mountain Sickness and the sun at that elevation.
"Living at high altitude reduces risk of dying from heart disease", but you're litereally locked in your house because the sun takes every chance to fry you. I'm okay with not reducing my risk of dying from heart disease.
I lived at 10,600 feet for 6.5 weeks last summer, coming from essentially sea level.
I felt like I was adjusted 90% adjusted about 2 weeks in, like I could walk at a normal speed. My Garmin watch agreed with this adaption. However, trying to mountain bike with the locals was hilarious... even at week 6 I barely started to be able to keep up on climbs. I rode my mountain bike nearly every day, or at minimum took a several mile hike
Near the end I had a bender with some coworkers. I started developing a persistent "altitude" cough after that that never really went away until I got back down to sea level. The cough disappeared in 36 hours. And wow, did I feel like superman when I got back racing my peers.
Did you catch the important point in my story though? I live an active life style at sea level, but man, people living in small towns in the mountains _love_ the outdoors. We were active every day of the week: riding, hiking, climbing, etc. I could definitely see how altitude helps with cardiovascular health, but it's already been proven that leading an active lifestyle is one of the most amazing things you can do for your health and happiness.
> people living in small towns in the mountains _love_ the outdoors
You have to. There's no activities besides outdoor activity and drinking and almost every other aspect of living in the mountains is more difficult (versus a normal, big city in a more hospitable terrain and climate).
When I lived in the mountains everyone was either there for the activities, or was a drug addicted hospitality worker there because they couldn't find jobs in cities.
> And wow, did I feel like superman when I got back racing my peers.
Huh, interesting. A friend of mine moved from sea level to ~6000 ft a few years ago. She said it took her a bit of time to get used to running at the new altitude, but eventually felt as comfortable with it as she had down here at sea level. I asked her if running feels easier to her at sea level now, when she comes down the mountain to visit, and she said it doesn't; it's basically the same as it used to be when she lived here.
Maybe the extra 4600ft you went up to made a difference in that, and of course everyone is different, but that's still interesting to me.
> it's already been proven that leading an active lifestyle is one of the most amazing things you can do for your health and happiness.
For your health sure. But for happiness, only if you actually like sporty activities. I don't, and it feels like a chore. Having to do chores all the time makes me unhappy. I've always hated anything to do with sports.
In think some people get an endorfin hit from it but for me that doesn't do much either. I just feel empty and exhausted after it.
I had that exact feeling when I visited denver, many years ago when I was doing triathlons. I woke up the next morning, went to the gym to do a 1 hour bike threshold session, and started panting for breath within the first 10 minutes of warmup. I was like, what-the-heck?
When I did a 2 week road trip from Chengdu to lijiang a couple of decades ago, we spent the first two days of the trip just acclimating on the Tibetan plateau at 3000 meters or at the town near siguniang. Then we hit places like daocheng (3500 meters), we drive through passes at 5000 meters, Litang town at 4000 meters (about the height of mt rainier). The biggest problem I had was the lack of vegetables that high, my teeth really got tired of eating judt meat and potatoes. The places were all populated though with Tibetans, they just lived up there as if it was the most normal thing in the world (heck, litang had 60k people living at 4k meters, that seemed crazy to me).
I am originally from the Himalayas (Garhwal specifically), although not quite as high as in the article, my village is at 5000 ft and damn did I have a shock when I took my desi friends up there (desi means people from the Indo-Gangetic plains, I unfortunately had to come to New Delhi for college and you can imagine the contrast!). While in Delhi, I am one of the more unathletic nerds, but as soon as we were in the mountains, these guys were no match for me! Roads are still very few and far in between in my region so you have to walk a lot, and these guys were getting tired on paths even small children and 80 year olds have no problem completing!
Ask a Himachali person how far something is and it's always "just around the next hill." Another couple of hours of walking and you"ll still get the same answer.
I visited the region around Dharamshala last year which is the same altitude (1500m) and was somewhat surprised I did not notice any effects of the altitude. My whole life (nearly 40) I've been living at sea level, except for trips.
I've lived mostly outside cities though so no major pollution. I'd imagine for Delhi folks the pollution must have a big effect on their lungs - but you'd think it would translate to working well for high altitude.
I grew up in Memphis TN but lived in Boulder CO for a few years. I worked at a hospital in both cities; my job was checking people into the ER.
In Memphis, I’d probably see 7-10 heart related issues a day, with about 2-3 of them being actual heart attacks. Every single day.
By contrast, in Boulder I saw maybe 1-2 heart attacks a year.
It was absolutely astounding. Now, there could be some confounding variables like income/education/exercise/diet. But like another poster said, high altitude places seem to bring out more activity in us.
I lived in Breckenridge (9,600ft) for a few winters post college.
Before college, when I had last been to CO, I didn't get any altitude sickness. Post college, I discovered (by blacking out on the slopes at Vail) that I now got bad altitude sickness. It now takes me almost 2 weeks to aclimate, but once I do, boy, is it amazing.
The most fun time was when I flew home to the East Coast after being there 4 months. I felt like absolute Superman. So much energy, barely needed any sleep! I only wish those effects lasted more than 5 days...
I grew up in the mountains at about 8500 ft, but was often spending my freetime at higher elevations surrounding the village. There are lots of little things about living at high altitude people don't think about, such as cooking times and quirks, sealed containers exploding when going up, etc. My favorite has to be just how superhuman (when I was in my prime) going down to low elevation made me feel.
The biggest issue people don't talk about? Remote high alt places often become unlivable for people when they get elderly due to altitude interference in certain medical conditions, and the general distance away from hospitals.
I miss the mountains so much all the time, and hope to retire back up there.
I spent time in Lhasa, it sits at 12k. It was like another world. High altitude isn't forgiving either. My (62) father was with me and didn't make it home.
My in-laws have a timeshare at 8300 feet. The first couple of days we have to take it easy and drink a ton of water, but then we kinda get used to it. And definitely feel superhuman when we return to sea level!
The hardest part is getting used to cooking at the elevation.
8,000 ft (2,400 meters) isn't particularly high. Millions of people live at that altitude. It's extremely common for people to go on a skiing vacation at that altitude or above, up to maybe 4,000 meters, and not need to take any particular precautions.
As to comments here about days resting while progressing to higher altitudes, such as in the Himalayas. A day or two will mostly result in adjustments in the water balance of your blood. It takes about 10 days to two weeks for your bone marrow to start producing additional red blood cells to compensate for the lower level of oxygen in the air.
High level altitude sickness is more complex and relates to multiple factors, including fluid balance, the health of one's vasculature and lungs, etc.
It is certainly the case that populations that have lived at high altitudes in the Himalayas or Andes for thousands of years have evolved adaptations that make such living easier.
Worked for four months as a mountain bike guide on the death road in La Paz.
3600 meters to 4800 getting to the start of the road to about 1000 meters each day, and back. I believe I made many blood cells and nearly died 3 times
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[ 3.8 ms ] story [ 79.0 ms ] threadDo people who live above 8k feet not die of heart disease or do people with heart disease find it too difficult to live above 8k feet so only people without heart disease live above 8k feet?
I live at 7200 feet and I know several people who have moved to lower altitudes because it's "too hard to breath" here.
This is crazy to me as I usually only get 1 acclimation night in before going up. I’m curious how people can find their limits / needs?
I felt like I was adjusted 90% adjusted about 2 weeks in, like I could walk at a normal speed. My Garmin watch agreed with this adaption. However, trying to mountain bike with the locals was hilarious... even at week 6 I barely started to be able to keep up on climbs. I rode my mountain bike nearly every day, or at minimum took a several mile hike
Near the end I had a bender with some coworkers. I started developing a persistent "altitude" cough after that that never really went away until I got back down to sea level. The cough disappeared in 36 hours. And wow, did I feel like superman when I got back racing my peers.
Did you catch the important point in my story though? I live an active life style at sea level, but man, people living in small towns in the mountains _love_ the outdoors. We were active every day of the week: riding, hiking, climbing, etc. I could definitely see how altitude helps with cardiovascular health, but it's already been proven that leading an active lifestyle is one of the most amazing things you can do for your health and happiness.
You have to. There's no activities besides outdoor activity and drinking and almost every other aspect of living in the mountains is more difficult (versus a normal, big city in a more hospitable terrain and climate).
When I lived in the mountains everyone was either there for the activities, or was a drug addicted hospitality worker there because they couldn't find jobs in cities.
Huh, interesting. A friend of mine moved from sea level to ~6000 ft a few years ago. She said it took her a bit of time to get used to running at the new altitude, but eventually felt as comfortable with it as she had down here at sea level. I asked her if running feels easier to her at sea level now, when she comes down the mountain to visit, and she said it doesn't; it's basically the same as it used to be when she lived here.
Maybe the extra 4600ft you went up to made a difference in that, and of course everyone is different, but that's still interesting to me.
For your health sure. But for happiness, only if you actually like sporty activities. I don't, and it feels like a chore. Having to do chores all the time makes me unhappy. I've always hated anything to do with sports.
In think some people get an endorfin hit from it but for me that doesn't do much either. I just feel empty and exhausted after it.
Then I remember Denver was the mile-high city.
I've lived mostly outside cities though so no major pollution. I'd imagine for Delhi folks the pollution must have a big effect on their lungs - but you'd think it would translate to working well for high altitude.
[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elevation_(film)
In Memphis, I’d probably see 7-10 heart related issues a day, with about 2-3 of them being actual heart attacks. Every single day.
By contrast, in Boulder I saw maybe 1-2 heart attacks a year.
It was absolutely astounding. Now, there could be some confounding variables like income/education/exercise/diet. But like another poster said, high altitude places seem to bring out more activity in us.
Before college, when I had last been to CO, I didn't get any altitude sickness. Post college, I discovered (by blacking out on the slopes at Vail) that I now got bad altitude sickness. It now takes me almost 2 weeks to aclimate, but once I do, boy, is it amazing.
The most fun time was when I flew home to the East Coast after being there 4 months. I felt like absolute Superman. So much energy, barely needed any sleep! I only wish those effects lasted more than 5 days...
Theoretically solar cells designed for more more UV intensity could produce quite a lot more electricity.
I imagine solar panels for space craft are designed with this in mind.
Of course the economics of this, that there’s only a few places where this is useful wouldn’t justify it all.
The biggest issue people don't talk about? Remote high alt places often become unlivable for people when they get elderly due to altitude interference in certain medical conditions, and the general distance away from hospitals.
I miss the mountains so much all the time, and hope to retire back up there.
The hardest part is getting used to cooking at the elevation.
As to comments here about days resting while progressing to higher altitudes, such as in the Himalayas. A day or two will mostly result in adjustments in the water balance of your blood. It takes about 10 days to two weeks for your bone marrow to start producing additional red blood cells to compensate for the lower level of oxygen in the air.
High level altitude sickness is more complex and relates to multiple factors, including fluid balance, the health of one's vasculature and lungs, etc.
It is certainly the case that populations that have lived at high altitudes in the Himalayas or Andes for thousands of years have evolved adaptations that make such living easier.