It isn't "so deadly", it's just unhealthy, and it's made worse by culture and business encouraging excessive consumption and serving sizes.
Ultraprocessed foods aren't great, but it's yet another manufactured crisis to serve as a distraction from the Epstein files scandal and coverup, like the attack Iran will be next Thursday. What a horrible time.
My main problem is defining "ultra-processed," such that I could take action on this in my life.
> From this perspective, homemade jam on pain de Gonesse would be fine; Smucker’s on Wonder Bread would not, even if it contained less sugar and fat. “The thesis is that we’ve been focussing too strongly on the individual nutritional components of food,” Hall told me. “We’re starting to learn that processing really matters.”
So the pain de Gonesse goes through lots of processing to get it's unique attributes, but is not "ultra processed" yet Wonder bread is. Or is it the Smucker's jam that makes it ultraprocessed? Is home made jam ultra-processed?
Or this distinction:
> “Preparing a day’s worth of ultra-processed meals might take an hour,” he said. “Unprocessed meals could take three or four times as long.” He brought his knife down forcefully, cleaving a carrot in two, and continued: “If I’m swamped, I’d rather make the ultra-processed menu. But if I had to pick one to eat for the rest of my life? Unprocessed, no question.”
As somebody who cooks a good chunk of my family's meals, cleaving a carrot in two and taking the example earlier of making a meal of vegetables and grilled chicken is not that time consuming compared to, what exactly? What takes 3-4 hours to prepare here?
Vagueness in articles like these reinforce the idea that there's no definiton of "ultra-processed" that a regular person can use, and that it's just based on vibes and vague feelings of "quality" that are at best defined by traditions rather than by choices that are made. Even the start of the article, that the immigrant noticed that American meals had far larger portions, more salt, and more sweetness than French food, does not comport to the definitons used here.
Maybe the definition is: the food can go bad in a short amount of time, except for staples like rice or flour. Would that work? I don't know. Can I simply switch to dry kidney beans rather than the canned kidney beans, because the canned kidney beans are "ultra-processed"?
I've read sooooo much about ultra-processed food but still don't know how to use it in daily life.
May I suggest starch also plays a role? Removing starch removes the craving, much like sugar (as in pure sugar). Eating an apple doesn't trigger cravings, eating pasta or pizza does.
I am sure it's personal,but the difference is enormous.
So the chefs are preparing food that has the same macros as ultraprocessed meals (I assume like tv dinners or something?) Why do they keep referring to the freshly-prepared food as "ultraprocessed"?
“Is this processed or unprocessed?” I asked.
Kozlosky smiled. “Ultra-processed,” she said. “Lots of participants can’t tell the difference.”
If the term has any meaning, you could tell very easily. Go look at a freshly fried tortilla chip, and compare it to a tostito. You know which one is which instinctively.
I thought I understood the study but now I'm not sure. I thought the idea was to take the exact same thing you'd get in a tv dinner and make it fresh, so no freeze drying, no preservatives, etc. Then if that food on its own causes the same pattern of health issues, we know it's simply a diet problem. It sounds like they replicated that effect. So they got evidence that ultraprocessing doesn't actually matter all that much?
Too many people jump on the health trend bandwagon to get attention, and all the slight misunderstandings add up to a confusing mess of information.
It’s not that difficult: the closer the item is to its natural state, the more healthy it is.
Almost all foods need some processing to be made edible (peeling, cooking, etc), but beyond that their health vs processing ratio declines.
For example: Rice needs to be cut, threshed, and cleaned. Then you have something that’s baseline edible (brown rice). But then people remove the bran layer to make white rice, which removes health. Then they pre-cook it to make “quick cook” rice, which removes more health. Or they grind it up to make rice flour, which removes more health. Or they ferment it to make saki, which removes more health.
At what point does it become ultra processed? It doesn’t really matter. The focus should be on staying as close to the initial edible state as possible.
Anecdotal but the three times I’ve been in the states recently I come away feeling like trash. When I’m there I crave salads and green food pretty fast.
It feels like, as a tourist, unless you’re making food yourself from scratch the ingredients used in most food are not good for you.
I don’t feel that way holidaying in other countries..
Is cottage cheese ultraprocessed?
I eat a lot of real food: my main meal is usually lettuce, tomatoes, cucumber, but then I add cottage cheese a tofu that's 100% protein and some egg whites.
For dinner I will usually swap out egg whites and tofu for something else, depending on my macros (salmon, rice, occasional red meat).
For snacks I eat apple with variations of butters (pure): pistachio, almonds, peanut, cashew, hazelnut.
Sometimes I eat frozen blueberries with cottage cheese and a vegan protein poweder.
The main thing is I eat basically a whole lettuce heart every meal,along with 2 tomatoes.
Fills me up.
All of this lands me on very low calories (1200), so I have been losing weight fast without starving. Arguably,my hunger has gone down substantially.
Boredom is what usually killed me, but turns out rotating between the various butters allow for enough variation
15 comments
[ 5.0 ms ] story [ 49.0 ms ] threadUltraprocessed foods aren't great, but it's yet another manufactured crisis to serve as a distraction from the Epstein files scandal and coverup, like the attack Iran will be next Thursday. What a horrible time.
> From this perspective, homemade jam on pain de Gonesse would be fine; Smucker’s on Wonder Bread would not, even if it contained less sugar and fat. “The thesis is that we’ve been focussing too strongly on the individual nutritional components of food,” Hall told me. “We’re starting to learn that processing really matters.”
So the pain de Gonesse goes through lots of processing to get it's unique attributes, but is not "ultra processed" yet Wonder bread is. Or is it the Smucker's jam that makes it ultraprocessed? Is home made jam ultra-processed?
Or this distinction:
> “Preparing a day’s worth of ultra-processed meals might take an hour,” he said. “Unprocessed meals could take three or four times as long.” He brought his knife down forcefully, cleaving a carrot in two, and continued: “If I’m swamped, I’d rather make the ultra-processed menu. But if I had to pick one to eat for the rest of my life? Unprocessed, no question.”
As somebody who cooks a good chunk of my family's meals, cleaving a carrot in two and taking the example earlier of making a meal of vegetables and grilled chicken is not that time consuming compared to, what exactly? What takes 3-4 hours to prepare here?
Vagueness in articles like these reinforce the idea that there's no definiton of "ultra-processed" that a regular person can use, and that it's just based on vibes and vague feelings of "quality" that are at best defined by traditions rather than by choices that are made. Even the start of the article, that the immigrant noticed that American meals had far larger portions, more salt, and more sweetness than French food, does not comport to the definitons used here.
Maybe the definition is: the food can go bad in a short amount of time, except for staples like rice or flour. Would that work? I don't know. Can I simply switch to dry kidney beans rather than the canned kidney beans, because the canned kidney beans are "ultra-processed"?
I've read sooooo much about ultra-processed food but still don't know how to use it in daily life.
Cut sugar soda, cut beer, skip 1 meal a day.
Now.
I am sure it's personal,but the difference is enormous.
I thought I understood the study but now I'm not sure. I thought the idea was to take the exact same thing you'd get in a tv dinner and make it fresh, so no freeze drying, no preservatives, etc. Then if that food on its own causes the same pattern of health issues, we know it's simply a diet problem. It sounds like they replicated that effect. So they got evidence that ultraprocessing doesn't actually matter all that much?
It’s not that difficult: the closer the item is to its natural state, the more healthy it is.
Almost all foods need some processing to be made edible (peeling, cooking, etc), but beyond that their health vs processing ratio declines.
For example: Rice needs to be cut, threshed, and cleaned. Then you have something that’s baseline edible (brown rice). But then people remove the bran layer to make white rice, which removes health. Then they pre-cook it to make “quick cook” rice, which removes more health. Or they grind it up to make rice flour, which removes more health. Or they ferment it to make saki, which removes more health.
At what point does it become ultra processed? It doesn’t really matter. The focus should be on staying as close to the initial edible state as possible.
https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/the-extraordinar...
some previous discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42623315
It feels like, as a tourist, unless you’re making food yourself from scratch the ingredients used in most food are not good for you.
I don’t feel that way holidaying in other countries..
For snacks I eat apple with variations of butters (pure): pistachio, almonds, peanut, cashew, hazelnut.
Sometimes I eat frozen blueberries with cottage cheese and a vegan protein poweder.
The main thing is I eat basically a whole lettuce heart every meal,along with 2 tomatoes.
Fills me up.
All of this lands me on very low calories (1200), so I have been losing weight fast without starving. Arguably,my hunger has gone down substantially.
Boredom is what usually killed me, but turns out rotating between the various butters allow for enough variation