Ask HN: Founders of estonian e-businesses – is it worth it?

168 points by udl ↗ HN
Hey there,

I'm currently considering opening an Estonian e-business for a small SaaS project. As somebody from Germany, establishing a company is a bit tedious and bureaucratic. Now I've come across the Estonian e-residency program and the option to run a business there. I don't care so much about the tax implications, but more about the bureaucracy aspect. It all sounds quite good. But marketing is marketing and real life often is something else. So, long story short: I would be happy if somebody could share their real-life experiences. Was it/is it worth it? Are there any pitfalls?

Thanks!

64 comments

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Not answering your question directly but accounting and taxes are a thing everywhere. EU rules make accounting for companies quite complicated.

Focus on your business, open the smallest and simplest entity you can to validate your product before spending time and money optimizing or scaling things. That being said, I’m familiar with GmbHs in Germany and I would advise against going this route unless funding is available. Try a sole proprietorship instead if possible.

Thank you! Yes, that's why I'm looking for a simpler and less bureaucratic alternative. I'm totally fine with general accounting and taxes. But I would be happy if there was an alternative somewhere where you don't have to go to a notary for every little change and don't necessarily need a tax advisor because you have to talk to five different tax offices. Germany really makes it more complicated than it needs to be.

edit: just stumbled upon this really good blog post about the topic, in case anyone is interested: https://eidel.io/posts/estonias-e-residency-is-awesome-and-s...

Haha, thanks for linking to my website! Happy to answer any questions.

Skimmed this thread and I'm quite surprised how few people are aware of the permanent establishment problem.

Quick primer on the permanent establishment problem: You would technically have to pay taxes for your company in the place you're living (not Estonia). For example, if you're living in Germany, your Estonian OÜ would technically have to file for German taxes, too, because it's being run from Germany and it now has a permanent establishment in Germany.

So, roughly speaking, the Estonian OÜ is only useful if:

- You are in a country which doesn't have a permanent establishment problem and maybe even offers tax benefits for foreign companies (e.g. the non-dom rules of Malta, Cyprus, etc.)

- You are in a country which doesn't have a permanent establishment problem because they don't crack down on foreign company ownership (e.g. most developing countries)

In all other countries, the Estonian OÜ is likely going to cause you many tax headaches in the long run. In practice, this means:

a) Your local tax authorities don't notice or don't understand, and you're still fine, even though you'd need to file for taxes;

b) Your local tax authorities crack down on you and you need to go looking for a very expensive international tax advisor versed in Estonian and your local tax law.

Thanks for chiming in and also many many thanks for the great blog post :) Yes, I came to the same conclusion. It's a nice construct, but not for EU residents like me. So I guess I'll go for a german UG/GmbH or cancel the whole project at all.
"accounting and taxes are a thing everywhere. EU rules make accounting for companies quite complicated" >> this is the most wrong thing ever. You cannot compare the one click accounting in estonia with german kafkaesk absurdity designed to grind you down. How things are implemented are drastically different in countries even if both in the EU.
I professionally have been helping folks set up and maintain e-Residence and businesses, and all said here in the comments so far tracks: Estonia is absolutely unsurpassed qua administrative ease (this giving you a clear and lasting business advantage), the tax advantages are real, and the jurisdiction only gets better.-

Banking and being scrupulous on your personal taxes at your place of personal residence are issues, but nothing insurmountable, far from it.-

I've considered it as a Spanish resident, but don't you have to live six months there to be considered a fiscal resident? Are people regularly operating them from outside Estonia?
The "e" in eResidency does a lot of work. The scheme will not give you any residency rights or obligations in the physical sense. Just forming and running a company in the EU, including tax and banking systems that are aware of your non-resident status and making running a company easier.

As others have said, it mostly makes sense for people outside of the EU. If you have personal residency in Spain then it is questionable whether the easier paperwork in Estonia will offset the need to do some paperwork in Spain as well.

Hopefully the program continues its success and becomes basis for 25th EU regime
curious how much of the appeal is still there vs a few years ago feels like a lot of these “global founder” setups sound great in theory but get messy in practice
What about EU Inc? Is there any timeline?
Vague. Early 2027 perhaps with a lot of luck, for a regime that will at best solve a very limited subset of issues.

I'm not holding my breath.

For some perspective, look at how something with a much smaller scope is being "revolutionised". I'm speaking of intra-EU dividend taxation, as regulated in EU directive 2025/50 ("FASTER"). A slightly less complicated dividend double taxation regime between EU member states. Applies to dividends on shares in public companies only. If the shares in question have not been traded within 5 days from the ex-dividend date. If the gross dividend is below 100k€. If the member state is not very small. From 2030. Using EU standardised forms. In some cases, resulting in direct reduction of the double taxation at source. In other cases, refund of excess double dividend tax within 60 days.

The clean solution would be to tax dividends in the tax residency member state of the receiving individual only. That would require a rather large leap of trust from very financialised EU member states like .ie, .lu or .nl. Perhaps possible with a long transition period and compensations. Only there's also bad faith state actors like .hu randomly torpedoing EU legislation to extract concessions. This discourages other member states from even trying to implement the clean solution.

I've had companies in a few different jurisdictions, including a Delaware C Corp[1] and currently an OÜ through Estonia's e-residency program.

Yes, it is fantastic and delivers on all of the promises. The only potential headache is that you must collect your e-residency card from an embassy which, depending on your location, might require travel to a nearby country.

I used Xolo but there are lots of agents in the directory. I like and recommend Xolo. No idea what the supposed issue with banking is, all of the agents have banking relationships and you can also use Revolut and Wise. My bank account was opened same day as the company.

Your details are published on the public register. The moment your registration is published you'll get lots of emails offering services, like banking (some people pretend to be Revolut but are actually just sending you affiliate links). Don't publish an email address you care about.

[1] The problem with forming a U.S. company is that all of the formation agents are layers on top of a convoluted nightmare. The formation agent can do their best to abstract away the complexity but the moment you have to peak behind the curtain you'll find yourself face to face with something very scary. The Estonian e-residency program is integrated all the way through.

The U.S. is not a great place for offshore business registration mostly because the reporting requirements around taxation for foreign-owned businesses are so severe. It's just a lot of useless paperwork.
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Oh there will be a lot of issues in the future because Germany says thst your company is in Germany because you work from there. So you have to do taxes in Estonia and in Germany. And prepare for a lot of tax issues if you dont have a good tax advisor.
> As somebody from Germany, establishing a company is a bit tedious and bureaucratic.

I'm fairly sure the German tax authority will claim that you have a local German branch office since you live and work there.

That might be OK tax wise?

But I'd recommend starting with the tax situation in Germany.

Having limited liability through some kind of corporation can be nice.

But on the other hand, it becomes harder in Germany to pay out a varying salary as profits fluctuates throughout the year since the German tax authorities will see that as an illegal dividend payment from your company.

From this perspective it can be easier to set up some kind of sole proprietorship. Easier accounting etc and can pay out profits easier. But you get the personal liability.

This is not hard advice, just some things to point out that it gets complicated fast. So I'd recommend spending a few hundred euros on getting advice from a tax professional to begin with.

> Having limited liability through some kind of corporation can be nice.

I think this is the main point and benefit of the whole thing. It can be difficult and/or expensive to set up a limited liabilty company in many countries; as an e-Stonian, it's apparently cheap and simple.

Any possible tax benefits are just a bonus.

My 2 cents

In 2023 tried to register a business in Estonia.

I had to first get the e-residency.

This worked, (took 6 weeks I believe), but then I had to travel to another country (which had an Estonian embassy) to collect it.

Then I would have had to travel to Estonia itself to register the actual business and bank account (something like that -- it was a while ago).

(There are "done for you" business services, but from what I recall they were quite expensive, and I think would have still required the travel.)

It was theoretically doable, but due to life circumstances I wasn't able to travel at the time, so it didn't work out.

Meanwhile a few days ago, finally worked up the courage, and registered a business in the UK via a formation agent.

It took 25 minutes and $150. (Business was registered within 2 business days.) From the comfort of sitting on mine own ass, on the other side of the sea. So... yeah xD I like this way a bit better so far.

I've been running a saas like this for the past couple of years.

I'm using Xolo which do the accounting and local representative. 99% of my bureaucracy is uploading pdf invoices to the Xolo system. Once a year I have to spend like one hour on the anual report. That's pretty much it.

Every 5 years you have to renew your digital id. It costs a little money and if you are in the EU there will be a pickup location not far away (I had to travel internationally).

I also have to deal with my personal taxes but that's another matter.

Do you live in EU? Do you pay yourself a salary from your Estonian company, and is that your main source of income?
No, I live in Mexico. I do pay myself a salary and some months that is my main source of income.
Can also confirm it is great. The community is also quite nice and helpful. Also worth noting, because that comes up all the time, is that Estonia has a digital data embassy in Luxemburg, so if god forbid, russia would take increase its aggression, there is a copy of everything that would keep running your business. The main issue germans have is you cannot really get rid of german accounting as long as generating the business value there while living there. Once getting used to how smooth things can be, I could not bear having to deal with the german bureaucracy in any other area of life.
Here's a newer post from a German who previously was a fan of the Estonian e-business, saying things changed for the worse in 2025:

https://denationalize.me/emigrate/goodbye-estonia-how-a-popu...

This seems to only raise issues about taxes but none about the bureaucracy side?
That just seems like an ad for their LLC incorporating service.

Ok, road tabbaco alcool taxes have risen in Estonia in 2025. But wtf does that matter for an e-resident?! Or that there are going to be harder ways to "secretly distribute profits". But that's just tax avoidance and they are leading with these ideas on their blog?

2% tax on profits to support the military, and 2% extra on VAT is what changed in 2025 and important for e-Residents.

Here's what I've seen. First you’ll need a service provider (you can’t really avoid it) we tried grouhub,Manuel the guy was very kind. 500€ for the incorporation and he referred us to get the bank account . On the other hand, don’t incorporate too early. If you’re still validating, you’re just paying overhead for nothing(180€/month). On initial capital: you can set it at €10k as it helps if you plan to structure/share ownership more seriously later, but plenty of people start smaller and adjust when needed.
It is mentioned a bit in other comments: be aware that in the country where you live, the tax authorities can argue that your 100% owned company in country X is managed by you. This means it is taxable in your country. It is then up to you to counter their point of view…
What are you comparing it to in Germany? Have you tried services like https://www.firma.de that don't make it much more complicated than the Estonian option these days. I have not tried it myself, but I have friends who had good experiences with it.
You said you are from Germany but not where you are now. If you are still in Germany, forget it. Just because you incorporate outside of Germany does not exempt your from any taxes (and its beauraucracies) in Germany. That is, even with an estonian corporation, you will owe german corporate taxes (plural - one goes to the state one to the county - a.k.a. Körperschaftsteuer and Gewerbesteuer). That implies you will have to do the same tax paperwork as with a german GmbH and file them official with the tax authorities (Steuererklärungen, Umsatzsteuerjahresabschluss) and the Bundesanzeiger (Jahresabschlussbilanz). Nothing gets easier with that setup.
You're not wrong, but you're missing the best part. Estonian company does not pay taxes (*). As long as the money stays within the company he's golden. The company can pay for his car, his apartment/office, etc.

It is only when he decides to withdraw the money the problem occurs.

What you're saying applies to most EU countries. Here where I live you have to reside for majority of the year in given residency to pay taxes over there.

Here's the tricky part.

Estonia is part of Schengen Area. Which means you can travel there and back without passport. There's no paper trail of your arrangements. You can easily create a reality in which you reside there for majority of time.

But again, that's not the selling part of Estonian LTD. Which is - it's extremely easygoing and as long as money stays in the company you're not paying taxes.

Exactly. I'm German and simulated the constellation some year's ago. Verdict was, if you are inside the EU it won't pay out. The Estonian model is for people trying to participate in the EU market from outside.
It is about where the actual "effective management" is considered to be located: If you live in Germany permanently, the tax office can decided to tax you as if you were a Germany company - and yes, most of the times they do it.

If you travel regularly and have an office in Estonia and you make the effective management decisions there, you are obliged to Estonian tax system only.

This should be higher up. Xolo deliberately hides this under small-print with vague statement about this issue.

If you manage your company in, let's say, Germany, it is de-facto German company in the eyes of German tax authorities. When German tax authorities will find this out they will make you open UG/GmbH and pay back the corpo-tax, plus possibly a fine.

Now you will be stuck with 2 companies - Estonian and German, which is way bigger hassle. Not to mention Estonian company becomes useless/liability.

I also want to mention that practically every country has offshore-company laws like this, even places like Thailand and other SEA countries. It's not only EU.

I still live in (and don't plan to change it) in Germany. So I guess the whole thing doesn't really work for me. The goal of the whole operation would have been to make bureaucracy easier, but that doesn't seem to work. So ... it's a no do, unfortunately.
Idk where you are coming from but I am Greek and compared to Greece there is ZERO bureaucracy. You send your documents pretty much whenever you like, you don't get fined for stupid things and you just need to prepare the financial report once per year. We are talking about a very clear and flat system. 20% tax on dividend and for good tax payers it can go as low as 14% as far as I remember. The only "bureaucracy" things is that you have to travel all the way to your country's Estonian embassy to get your e-residency card. Last but not least, don't count on Estonian banks. They don't like e-residents and even if they like them today, don't trust them. reply
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Why aren’t European people starting businesses in the US as pass through entities?

It doesn’t make sense to me why Europeans don’t use registered agents or foreign corporation state registrations to do business as US entities in order to get up and running quickly.

Europeans complain about the difficulty starting a business can just start a business as a US entity, you’re just using the US system as the financial layer.

At the point where you’re making enough money for edge cases or moving to a more favorable jurisdiction then you can afford to because you’re in business now