I suspect the author will be unhappy to hear that the key message I took away from his nice little story (with David Foster Wallace quotes, no less) - was that he was identifying himself as the jerk who loudly whacks away at his keyboard, annoying the crap out of people around him. When I'm near those people in a public space, I always wonder if they are having some kind of mental-breakdown, or whether they are passive-aggressively trying to get people to move away from them. Or perhaps some combination of both.
Ironic, in that what he was trying to communicate was some concepts regarding recognizing the moral reality of those around him, when, in fact, he was one of those clueless types who likely hadn't considered the possibility that his whacking-away at his keyboard was really annoying others.
As to why the "riff-raff" tend to be a little more considerate on public transport - One reason is usually because you don't want to piss somebody off and get a punch to the head. They tend to play things a little more roughly on Oakland public transport than they do on Amtrak.
It would be even more ironic if he was working on this article.
On a positive note, it does a good job of showing how our perception of quiet can be different. I love going out into the nearby woods where you can't hear noise from the cars and trucks that make up so much of our town's noise. It's amazing how a plane going overhead seems so loud after being in the quiet for a few hours.
It's also pretty amazing how your ears adapt and if you choose to spend the night in the forest, you hear every small animal that scurries about.
> When I'm near those people in a public space, I always wonder if they are having some kind of mental-breakdown, or whether they are passive-aggressively trying to get people to move away from them.
Whenever I come across someone typing loudly in public, I am reminded of this scene from Up in the Air:
> Ironic, in that what he was trying to communicate was some concepts regarding recognizing the moral reality of those around him, when, in fact, he was one of those clueless types who likely hadn't considered the possibility that his whacking-away at his keyboard was really annoying others.
No, I suspect that he likely doesn't realize that he is "that guy." I'm almost certain that he believes he is one of the elite, civilized folks who recognizes the "moral reality" of those around him, and that this is just an exceptional situation, which is not a typical example of his behavior.
In reality, he's probably a jerk that ignores others.
If you read his comics [1], you'll see that he's quite self-aware of his own failings and realizes that he is often a jerk himself (sometimes unknowingly). I also got the sense from just this article that he was quite aware of the fact that he was being the asshole.
No, he explicitly describes the situation as finding himself on the "wrong" side of one of these conflicts. He understands that he was the bad guy that time.
I suspect some people can't type quietly because they don't know how. (The secret is to relax the fingers and hands by paying attention to the sensations coming from the fingertips.)
I totally support the quiet coaches. However, they do come loaded with the risk of confrontation between the quiet and the noisy, which is far more disturbing than mere hubbub.
Idea for any startup founders out there: Have quiet breakout rooms where one can't talk in anything but a whisper. Hell, make it so that one can't even use a Das Keyboard in there. I would be curious to run an A/B test on productivity (say number of features produced). :-)
Let me try to answer the question seriously: I have worked in coffee shops with ambient noise which I have been able to tune out. I believe that the experiment is subtly different that what I had proposed because it is looking at a different dimension of noise. The problem with noise at work is that it gets harder to tune it out especially when some of that noise might be relevant. This means that you get more distracted than when listening to some person with a nasally voice is asking for non fat soy latte. Well, that is my hypothesis anyway. :-)
> I can filter out 10% of the noise at home, because if my wife is talking or our cats are meowing, it's almost certainly directed at me.
IMO the only advantage of working from home is that you can control all those free variables that make you distracted: E.g. Get a quiet study where you tell your wife, cat(s) etc that you cannot/will not be distracted during work hours. Doing that at work can be tried but depending on the work place, may not be kosher.
I personally prefer working in the library. I have been most productive doing that back in school and sorely miss it.
Sad but true that there are workplaces (quite popular open-floorplan "collaborative" sardine-packing spaces) where concentrating on your work is unkosher.
> E.g. Get a quiet study where you tell your wife, cat(s) etc that you cannot/will not be distracted during work hours.
Well, sojacques already addressed the cat point, so they only thing I have to add is that I live in Manhattan, in a very spacious place by our standards, but one that doesn't really come with a study - not unless I wanted to tear down everything in the closet, toss my wife's things into a box, and have a space the size of a desk to work in :P
The funny thing is that two months ago when I was taking a train in France with some friends, instead of having a quiet car, they had a noisy car. And it was really quiet in there, by our American standards. There were quite a few elderly couples in the car, it seemed. We were talking and laughing and were probably the loudest on the car. At the end, the person I was traveling with who knew French remarked that the family next to us was talking about how loud and annoying we were. No one told us to be quiet, of course, since this was the loud car.
I guess I'm one of the people who ruin it for everyone else. I'm ADD as all get out when it comes to something I'm not really into, but when I'm lasered in on something interesting, it would pretty much take a fire drill to break me out of that. I even prefer a background din in that situation over dead silence—so I've never been bothered by, or spoken out against, any of the trends away from silence. I love open-plan workspaces since I can have an ear open for anything particularly important or interesting (especially if it's relevant to what I'm working on).
I assure you that it's really just not that simple.
I am adversely effected by all manor of sensory offence — including motion in my peripheral, heat, smells, unpredictable vibration.
The real problem is that it's a downward spiral: if something is bothering me and I become agitated, I am far more likely to become aware of other things which conspire to keep me from being productive. Ultimately, I fall into a state of manic anxiety and get really down on myself for feeling so ineffective.
I really wish I could just put in earplugs. They irritate my ears.
For around $50 you can have an audiologist make earplugs that are molded specifically to your ear. These are much more comfortable and give better attenuation than standard earplugs.
I probably should've mentioned that it's not all sunshine and rainbows for me: the biggest tradeoff was that it took getting on Adderall for me to stop failing the more mundane courses in college (the ability to totally zone in on interesting stuff was always there, though), and since not every task can be an interesting one, I still have to take it to be consistently productive. And the side effects are not pleasant.
I too would love for a few breakthroughs to make it possible to do one-time correctional procedures for stuff like this.
I sympathize with whoever criticized the guy for loud typing. Seriously, it's distracting/disruptive. I learnt to type on (manual) typewriter too but laptops and keys don't need to be stabbed with the force of a thousand suns to register the press.
It can be just as loud as people talking and (IMHO) can be harder to tune out. After all, we're used to hearing people talk all the time.
Oh and while I'm in the mood for ranting, people who eat with their mouths open--particularly when it's something crunchy--or who slurp in any way are going to be first up against the wall when the revolution comes.
I don't catch long distance trains in the US at all. I sometimes take the subway but more often than not you're just standing for 10-15 minutes. In Germany, I don't recall having a lot of problems with noise (although, on one train back from Oberhausen, the smoke was so thick you couldn't see one window from the other in a very Cheech and Chong moment). England varied but was generally fine.
What I'm not looking forward to is when cellphones become usable on planes because you know someone is going to sit there and talk loudly for the entire flight.
One tip though: my Bose noise cancelling headphones are worth their weight in gold.
As a loud typer myself, please let them know. I'm usually wearing my headphones and have no idea how loud my keyboard sounds are - and if I'm in a bad mood, it tends to get louder, without me being consciously aware of it. I wouldn't be offended if someone pointed out how much noise I'm generating, and I doubt they would be, either.
This would work especially well if your boss is willing to spring for quiet keyboards for them, and if they're willing to use 'em.
Yeah, back in high school people would constantly point out that I type too loudly. I think the Apple keyboards have helped a bit, still a bit noisy but not annoyingly like I probably would be on other keyboards.
As a loud typer, I appreciate the reminder that my typing can be annoying to people. I don't know what it is exactly, but I can't seem to get quiet. I've never even used a typewriter! I think it's because I don't type with the traditional method since I self-learned before I could be taught... My method uses fewer fingers which may force them to move faster and thus hit harder, on average.
I'm sorry, from those of us who type loud, to all of you.
I'm with you. But my Bose headphones cancel best the kind of sound that is easily ignored. Typing and talking go right through and even become more prominent against the quieter background. I found that full isolation can only be achieved by playing some music, which is better but still not ideal.
Anyone starting a Kickstart project for a better system can have my money.
I have been using Chill[1] periodically in lieu of music for a few months. It has the typical generators (airplane, beach, city, etc) but also blue, brown, pink, violet, and white noise tracks. I like brown noise; it has the low-frequency rumble of an airplane but the higher frequencies also block out ambient noise. Great for working in an office.
Looking at some of the reviews, it sounds like this hardware has its limitations, namely that it does a poor job of blocking out sounds in the frequency of human voices, which is the main thing that jhandl seems to be looking for.
I use a pair of these ear muffs almost daily; they pretty much block out all sound well for me. Here are a few reviews for the product that address your concern:
"I use them while doing research in a library. It's unbroken silence despite screaming kids and adults talking into their cellphones. People no longer understand proper behavior in a library, but I don't care. I can't hear them. It's wonderful." http://www.amazon.com/review/RQBNEZ9CX3O19/
I've found that more expensive in-ear headphones are significantly better at shutting out all external noise. But be prepared to spend some time playing with different pairs, plugs, and wear-styles (e.g. headphones dangling vs. wrapped over-ear) until you find one that you can handle for hours at a time.
The pair I have are effective enough at cutting out most noise that they're basically earplugs even with no music on and I can wear them for entire trans-atlantic/pacific flights.
In-ear plugs don't work for me, I can't even stand the soft squishy ones for 30 seconds. Given that I also can't sleep while sitting and I can't afford (and my company won't pay) business seats, I have to resort to pills. So the solution for me is Bose + pills.
Thanks, I might try them as they are not in-ear (which is what I can't stand). Chemical help for sleeping while sitting is still needed though, not that I mind.
My approach for international flights is a pair of circum-aural[1] noise cancelling headphones, with disposable foam earplugs inside them, and the music playing just loud enough to distract me from anything that gets past both the earplugs and the noise cancellation.
Where I am (Australia) OH&S regulations say workplace noise louder than 85dB averaged over 8hrs requires the employer to provide hearing protection[2]. The cabin of a 747 in flight is often louder than that, and for me it's usually a 13 or 14hr flight, so not using some form of hearing protection is almost certainly doing damage. But the best reason to wear protection is that I get off at the end of a 12+hr flight much more relaxed than when I don't have earplugs.
[1] big "DJ style" headphones with the cushions that surround/seal around the entire ear.
[2] I've heard, but never seen any actual evidence, that airlines operating in Australia have negotiated exemptions from the standard OH&S rules which would require cabin staff to fly wearing hearing protection.
Try listening to some binaural nature recordings instead of music. It's much less distracting. I find that they function as well as white noise, except that I don't get tired of listening to them for long periods of time.
http://soundtracker.comhttp://www.naturespace.com
Totally agree about the slurping...but it should be noted that this is also a cultural phenomenon. In some cultures, it's a sign of appreciation for the food. Not slurping means you don't like your food and it's disrespectful.
That said, holy hell I can't stand the sound. Nothing will make me flee a place faster than listening to someone slurp their food as they shovel it into their gaping maw.
Of course, anything will go when you're a foreigner (the so-called "gaijin smash"). But I can definitely see them taking offense when a fellow Japanese person makes this mistake.
I experienced quite a culture shock when returning to the US after living in Tokyo for a year. I was at some noodle place with a friend and ate the noodles in the way I considered normal. Eventually he told me he was going to leave because I was eating so rudely.
"Welcome back to the land of the Puritans," I thought to myself.
I find it seriously annoying, but I realize that others don't.
The problem is that if you don't like it, you really don't like it. Meanwhile, if you don't mind it, people who do seem like jerks.
Imagine something more universally recognized as rude. E.g. Eating with someone who keeps making really smelly farts or picking his nose all the time. The disgust is visceral, and hard to rationalize away.
> The problem is that if you don't like it, you really don't like it. Meanwhile, if you don't mind it, people who do seem like jerks.
It's more like how you say it. "Hey Buddy, if you don't stop slurping, I am going to chew and then open my mouth wide to show you my handiwork." is very different from "I am leaving. You are so rude."
> The disgust is visceral, and hard to rationalize away.
The keyword is "friend" - someone who you can talk to; asking him not to do that as it is making you uncomfortable should be pretty easy.
"...but it should be noted that this is also a cultural phenomenon."
After spending some time in Taiwan, I found myself slurping tea and hot pot by default. I came to realize slurping has it's advantages – in particular, you don't burn your lips and tongue on hot liquids.
Although I've re-Westernized when it comes to not slurping food, I do still slurp tea. Apparently, I'm not alone in thinking it's the best way to drink it. From the LA Times:
To taste tea, you must slurp it loudly, because tea needs oxygen to release its flavor. "Can we make some noise?" Spillane urged those who were drinking too politely. "You need to spray your entire mouth and draw air in with the tea to get a proper taste."
Slurping also makes it possible to drink very hot liquid without burning the mouth, and tea is at its best when hot. As it cools, it loses flavor.
> After spending some time in Taiwan, I found myself slurping tea and hot pot by default. I came to realize slurping has it's advantages – in particular, you don't burn your lips and tongue on hot liquids.
Slurping sounds generally annoy me, but I'll admit I slurp that first sip of coffee because I'm never quite sure exactly how hot it will be.
I think it's the repetition more than the actual slurp that bothers me, though. Any repetitive sound can send me into a rage after about a minute.
At my internship last summer, several devs were partial to those super-clacky keyboards one can buy. I can't stand working without (or even with) headphones in places like cafes when loud conversations are going on around me, but I found the keyboard sounds very easy to tune out.
I might be a little biased considering I own one, but many people find the click clack sound produced by a keyboard with Cherry MX Blue switches to be quite relaxing.
I've never been, but have read that Germany has very strict laws governing when and where noise can be made. In fact, only 2 years ago there was an amendment to the law giving children in Berlin the right to make noise, but only during specified hours: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8520941.stm
Depends on your keyboard and force. For example, a MacBook is generally quieter than other laptops but then again once those keys get old they can get quite loose and clackety. What I can say for sure is that those train cars can be pretty damn quiet. I know the quiet car I ride in is possibly quieter than my own car. And when it's silent the ambient noise tends to sound even more faint until someone on the inside starts making some really annoying sounds. I'd also say its sometimes not so much about the volume itself but rather the type of sound. Someone talking on a cellphone is less annoying than a phome ringing which is less annoying than that damn texting keyboard "click" sound which is equally annoying as typing too hard.
Yes! This and the comment below points out the space bar is also a very loud key we can single out on all keyboards. I set my trackpad to use tap to click because I prefer it and it avoids that sound but I do occasionally click by pressing it. Now you've got me thinking how disturbing I might be with my occasional clicking on my MacBook Air on the quiet car.
I've not ridden Amtrak, just Caltrain, but as regards UK trains the answer is that background noise doesn't matter.
People generally talk loud enough to happily hear each other over any background noise. They tend not to notice, either.
As such, when businesspeople consider the quiet car somewhere for meetings because everywhere else has noise, everyone in the car hears exactly what they are discussing.
I'm on the bus at the moment on the way to work, I use a Lenovo Thinkpad Edge in my personal time, it's a decent machine and was within my budget at the time I bought it, but I agree, the keyboard can be extremely loud in quiet areas, but that's one of the reasons I like it.
My iMac at work has a nearly silent keyboard and it drives me up the walls, being so used to developing in my spare time on a loud machine.
In my search for quiet, I often carry a decibel meter around. Amtrak cars, even the quiet cars, have a constant 90 decibel background noise when in motion (measured with a C weighting). It seems like a lot of the train noise is in the low frequencies and the A weighting OSHA uses is the only thing keeping Amtrak out of violation.
Yeah, part of my point was that American train systems are old and awful and noisy. I had the pleasure of riding a smaller Deutsche Bahn commuter train once and the ambient noise had to be in the 50-60 dB range, if not lower.
Never had a problem here in Germany either. Smoking is luckily not allowed anymore, as well.
There is a quiet car, too, but it is hardly necessary. Talking on the cell phone loudly is frowned upon everwhere, even in the underground train -- at least I haven't seen too many people doing it. Just don't take the same trains the drunken soccer fans take (if you're not in the mood).
This is must be a somewhat American problem. I once was at a Cheescake factory there, where it was so loud we could hardly talk with each other. We hypothesized that they do this for a higher turnover.
The people in the Amtrak trains, subways or buses did not bother me -- it was more the screeching noises those old relics made. I would be extremely annoyed by music in a library though.
>We hypothesized that they do this for a higher turnover.
I can (anecdotally) confirm that many places do this. One place where my friend worked adjusted the background music volume based on the wait time, and I know of several restaurants by me where the waitresses will say that the music goes up as the place gets busy to persuade people to leave after eating.
"This is must be a somewhat American problem. I once was at a Cheescake factory there, where it was so loud we could hardly talk with each other. We hypothesized that they do this for a higher turnover."
I've heard that the loudness in restaurants isn't meant to increase turnover - it's actually used to attract people to the restaurant. The average restaurant-goer in NYC seems to have an aversion to places that are quiet enough to carry on a normal conversation. They apparently find the noisy environment to be stimulating and exciting. There are even special sound systems designed for restaurants that amplify certain components of the ambient noise if the natural acoustics of the room aren't noisy enough.
I'm bad with restaurants in Manhattan, but Anella and Bozu are two favorites in Brooklyn.
I agree there are many loud restaurants in Manhattan, but that is mostly a factor of the bar and/or a large space (e.g., Buddakan). Look for places not trying to attract attention (a full curtain on the window, rather than trying to advertise their popularity / bar scene).
My main point was probably that Manhattan != NYC. :)
I can confirm that. Using cell phones in public transportation was forbidden for a few years but is allowed now. People are usually pretty quiet in German trains. Many trains also have special areas for families with kids that are more noisy.
I've lived in both Germany and Australia, and my experience is the exact opposite -- at least in suburban trains, I don't think I ever used a long distance train in Australia. And those are okay in Germany. But suburban trains? The two couldn't be more different! Where I was (small town in Germany close to France and Melbourne, Victoria) there was screaming (!), loud music from cell phones and general obnoxious and ruthless behavior all the time in the local suburban trains in Germany, while it was heavenly quiet and relaxed and enjoyable in Melbourne.
>I sympathize with whoever criticized the guy for loud typing.
I actually don't mind typing: to me, it sounds like ideas. It's also regular enough to become part of the background, whereas something like music isn't, because it's too variable.
>my Bose noise cancelling headphones are worth their weight in gold.
I'm going to be that obnoxious guy: Amazon lists Bose QC 15s (the model I have) as 7.4 ounces. The spot-price for gold right now is about $1,700 per ounce. Are they really worth $12,580?
I hate to be the other obnoxious guy that responds to the self proclaimed obnoxious guy, but I see the quite a bit lately, even paraded in XKCD. Is there a significant group of people that absolutely abhors all rhetorical figures of speech? Or is it only specific ones, such as metaphors and hyperbole, with simile being mostly OK? Just curious.
> Is there a significant group of people that absolutely abhors all rhetorical figures of speech? Or is it only specific ones, such as metaphors and hyperbole, with simile being mostly OK? Just curious.
In medical circles it would be called "learning disability".
On a more serious note though, mocking people who use a lot of metaphors is a good way to try to make yourself look intellectually superior. I see it a lot these days and I find it very passive aggressive. Back in school people making those kinds of comments would be called smartasses and have their asses kicked for using that kind of language.
The deeper I get into writing, and what it means to write well, the harder it is. Reading Martin Amis's The War Against Cliche was a particularly pernicious moment for me. So was Lakoff and Johnson's Metaphors We Live By.
I think the question is this: does a rhetorical figure of speech help the reader or writer see the things being compared or figurized in a new way? If the answer is no, then perhaps we should look at those rhetorical things as literal, in order to remind ourselves of the power of rhetoric.
I favor metaphors and hyperbole like politicians favor hand-shaking and baby-kissing. But it to be done well.
It's funny how things like this can sit totally dormant in your mind for years and years, and at the first mention everything floods back. And just for a silly ST:TNG reference.
Orwell, "Politics and the English Language", 1946:
"By using stale metaphors, similes, and idioms, you save much mental effort, at the cost of leaving your meaning vague, not only for your reader but for yourself. This is the significance of mixed metaphors. The sole aim of a metaphor is to call up a visual image. When these images clash -- as in The Fascist octopus has sung its swan song, the jackboot is thrown into the melting pot -- it can be taken as certain that the writer is not seeing a mental image of the objects he is naming; in other words he is not really thinking. "
"Never use a metaphor, simile, or other figure of speech which you are used to seeing in print."
I lost a pair of these and I just replaced them. So I've bought two pairs in two years. To me the noise canceling is worth it. I also have an aviation headset from them that's lasted me a very long time so I like the quality. I don't consider them the best, I just really like them. The best would probably be a set from Sennheiser or Denon. I'm not an audiophile, I'm more of a silencephile.
Loud typing is a symptom of the lack of private working space in the office. That means the company is too cheap to set up offices or good insulating cubicles for the developers.
Things aren't always like what they seem. Here's my perspective.
I use a ThinkPad that has a noisy keyboard. When I type on a Macbook Pro, my typing is silent. The noise in my case is because of keyboard design, not because of my typing force, I prefer the audible feedback. If I'm in a shared space where all I can hear is my typing, I try not to type.
I have slight breathing problems due to a small nasal passage. When I eat, I sometimes have to breathe through my mouth. I try not to, because eating with your mouth open is considered rude.
> In Germany, I don't recall having a lot of problems with noise
Here in France all train cars are "quiet cars" and most people respect that.
Sometimes you come across somebody who insists on talking on their cellphone while seated (you're supposed to make your calls on the "platform" which is the space between cars), but it's rare and usually doesn't last.
>Here in France all train cars are "quiet cars" and most people respect that.
I wish it were true... I took the train last week and was in the same wagon as 4 "rednecks" who ate their lunch while drinking wine, chewing loudly and laughing. The whole wagon could hear what they were talking about. The SNCF employees didn't even care...
I am a regular train user and it is unfortunately pretty frequent occurrence.
The animation is present on mobile devices as well, though perhaps not on their mobile-formatted site. Do they even serve that site to WebKit browsers anymore? If so, they shouldn't.
I concur. It's both beautiful and understated—I appreciate the visual acuity, but I am more impressed with the fact that NYT, of all, is finally growing past the era of crying "we're interactive!!!" out loud and starting to make good, subtle and tasteful use of unique properties of the Web. This is elegant.
This was incredibly evident during the election. They're really leading the pack in terms of using newer technologies as more than a tool to draw attention to their articles, but to actually add depth to them.
Its very nice, but I think the rapid motion is a little much for reading- they could do the same thing with a slower frame rate and more blurred outside, it might be more comfortable
I used to love the quiet car. I appreciated the serenity and the opportunity to listen to just the noise of the train. But the hostile shushing (2-3 times near me per trip, usually) started to bother me more than the transgressions. I began to worry constantly, checking and re-checking to make sure I had my phone on silent mode. Now I sit one car back and relax. The quiet car is good for people who can deal with it, and that's fine with me.
I think this being loud is particularly ingrained on the US culture. I have to say, tourists from the US are notably loud on Argentina. We have a large amount of tourists on Buenos Aires, but it's always the US accent you can hear all the way across a crowded train wagon or room. I can't imagine why that is.
I had some houseguests visiting from The Netherlands last night. I have never encountered louder talkers, even when we visited a nearby historic church and there was a rehearsal going on. I got a kick out of it, because I'm a notorious loud talker and my friends always give me a hard time about it.
Given our evolutionary history as a tribal species, perhaps the human brain and auditory system is predisposed for survival purposes to make it seem as though unfamiliar dialects/voices/sounds are louder than they actually are.
Without taking an objective measure of the decibels involved you might just be giving in to a stereotype?
It is possible that it's some sort of auditory bias, but there's people from all over the world here (big tourist city and all), and it's almost always people form the US that I notice are loud. Even with the British, I can't normally hear them without being quite close, so it's not the language. Of course, I can't tell how many quiet Americans I've walked by without noticing because they are quiet.
That's interesting, I've had the opposite experience, so I'm guessing it's a perception issue. I'm from Buenos Aires and currently live in New York, both loud cities. I find Argentine tourists around here are especially loud. Maybe I'm tuned to pick up my own accent, or maybe tourists are louder than locals? (the excitement of the new?) Or maybe, as you point out, we just don't notice the quiet ones and assume they are locals...
You probably never have encountered Italians :)
When you hear loud voices in the bus here in Poland then you may be sure that they belong to them. English speaking (British and American accents) are second.
I suspect that the US, including the upper class that can still afford jet air travel, contains more cultural diversity than most other countries, and what you're noticing is the outliers on the right side of the noisiness distribution.
Me, I find Buenos Aires to be particularly loud, but it's only occasionally people (usually groups of cacerolaceros, other piqueteros, or football fans); mostly it's the huge superchargers on the buses, the garbage trucks, the pneumatic actuators on the buses without silencers installed, the motorcycles without mufflers installed, the cumbia villera from the cellphones, and so on. In fact, the only louder city I've ever traveled to was Lima.
The problem with the quiet car is that offenders usually do not realize they are in it. Unless you travel on Amtrak frequently (I don't do it often but certainly more than the average person) you may not even realize a quiet car even exists. It isn't common to have a quiet section on an airplane or any other form of public transportation so I can see why people would not expect this.
Ignorance is no excuse for being loud repeatedly after this is pointed out but I almost always travel in the quiet car and have found that conductors only infrequently make announcements explaining that the car has special rules-perhaps 25% of the trips I've taken.
I cannot blame someone for missing the sign that says, "Quiet Car" but I can place some responsibility on Amtrak for not making the quiet car and the rules that go along with it more obvious.
Not every Amtrak line even has a quiet car - long-distance lines don't have them, and even some regional lines don't have them (such as the Pacific Surfliner).
I usually go Boston to CT or NY where there is always a quiet car but my point about it not being made obvious enough to those that aren't aware of its existence seems like a fairly simple fix.
There will always be the people that do not feel the rules apply to them but most of the loud people I encounter in the quiet car did not realize where they were.
And some lines only have them at certain hours. For instance, Capitol Corridor (Sacramento <-> Bay Area) only has them for the super-early-morning and late night trains.
Did anyone else notice the hidden text "#@$%&!" at the end of the last paragraph? Does this have some kind of meaning or purpose, I can't figure out why it would be there...
<p itemprop="articleBody">
We’re a tribe, we quiet ones, we readers and thinkers and letter writers, we daydreamers and gazers out of windows. We are a civil people, courteous to excess, who disdain displays of anger as childish and embarrassing. But the Quiet Car is our territory, the last reservation to which we’ve been driven. And we can be pushed too far. Our message to the barbarians who would barge in on our haven with their chatter and blatting gadgets like so many bulldozers is: <span style="color:#fff;"><em>#@$%&!</em></span> </p>
Yea I was about to post about that too. I'm guessing it represents the quiet ones' gut response (a barbaric one) that is being masked with the politeness of the silence sign.
I read this article in the printed newspaper at a coffee shop today.
The "message" at the end of the article was a graphic of a finger over a pair of lips. Presumably from the description in the article it is Amtrak's "Quiet Car" logo.
No idea how or why it ended up the way it did online.
Sometimes, the urbanites on HN will pile on suburbia, wondering how anybody can live there. This is one of the reasons I often feel the same way, only in reverse. As I sit here, I can not hear any sounds not originating in my house. While I certainly visit the places with Musak, loud bars, et al, I don't live there. It isn't as grating when there is surcease.
I'm not saying that Here It Is, The Reason Suburban Living Is Better Than Anything Anywhere. I'm just saying, if you're one of those people who just can't imagine what anyone would find appealing about the lifestyle, but were also nodding your head in agreement with this piece... now you can.
My experience with suburbia was that there was always yard equipment going, plus dogs and teenagers. These loud, punctuated sounds always bothered me much more than the regular, low din of a city. Moreover, most of the noise in cities in from automobiles, which are mainly a problem inflicted upon us by suburban development.
... and there are neighborhoods in the centers of cities, typically residential with little car traffic, that are very quiet.
Tokyo has a lot of these. It doesn't have a single "downtown", but rather a large number of busy centers, usually around railroad stations, and in many parts of central Tokyo, the "infill" between these is residential single-family housing or small apartment buildings. In many of those areas, streets are very narrow and windy, there's very little automobile traffic (people walk or bicycle), and it's often very quiet, to the point where one can sometimes hear people talking inside houses while walking down the street...
The biggest problem with Tokyo is a lack of laws against public disturbance in terms of noise people are allowed to produce.
All is fine and dandy until one of those stupid delivery trucks shows up near my building at 6am blaring "Hidari e magarimasu, gochuui kudasai. Hidari e magarimasu, gochuui kudasai. Hidari e magarimasu, gochuui kudasai". For people unfamiliar with Japan, various trucks here are not only equipped with visual (light based) turn signals, but audio based ones as well. This means that whenever they are taking a turn, they are blaring from their speakers "Turning left, please be careful. Turning left, please be careful" ad nauseam.
Seriously, is that really necessary? Not to mention trucks with loudspeakers playing loud music promoting new bands and what not. I find Tokyo to be anything but a quiet city.
To make things worse, sound proofing is so terrible in Japanese houses and buildings (construction standards are really poor here compared to the ones we have in the west), that despite living on the 6th floor I can often make out contents of the conversations of loud drunk groups returning from izakayas at 1am.
But most of suburbia isn't quiet. Especially the suburbia that is Silicon Valley. You have go full-on rural before you're somewhat guaranteed to not be disturbed by man-made noises.
I live in the suburbs and have had the exact same experience on the quiet car as the author. The suburbs aren't quiet either. They suffer the same problems the author points out throughout the piece. This isn't unique to the city at all. I think it's something that anyone can get behind (unless you're one of those annoying people on the quiet car in which case you might not get it).
It really depends where you are. I live in Montreal, in one of the most active neighborhoods, full of shops, pedestrians and nightlife.
But it's all concentrated on east-west streets (in my area). I live less than a block up from the main artery, and it's completely silent here. Ground floor apartment, window onto the street.
I'm in suburbia now, and the noise is nearly constant, year-round. I grew up on a farm, have lived in the hearts of major cities, the middle of an isolated mesa -- basically covered the spectrum of sound environments.
Nowhere has the noise gotten to me like in suburbia. Two words: leaf blowers.
The other day I was awakened by the... most... annoying... sound... in the universe: a leaf blower outside my window.
Worse! They blew everything directly into the bicycle parking row! Years' worth of dirt on my bike in one minute. Debris and filth in all the works. Earthworms. Had to completely detail the whole bike.
Meanwhile, leaves are some of the best compost available. Why do we blow them noisomely to rot on the "unused" areas of the pavement (i.e., bike parking, bike lanes)?
I live in an old inner-ring streetcar suburb (sans streetcar, sadly) that's walking distance (about 2 km) from the downtown core. It's not as bad as some of the newer subdivisions I've been to, but it certainly experiences a share of leaf blowers, gas lawn mowers, gas snow blowers, SUVs and pickup trucks roaring down the street (they're much louder than compact cars), and the distant rumble of traffic on a nearby arterial. We had a backyard dinner party this past summer that was interrupted for an hour by a freaking wood chipper in a yard behind us.
I grew on on the country side. On an island. In the middle of the Baltic sea. In the winter, it would get so dark that I couldn't see my hand before my eyes, and couldn't hear a single sound. Actually this had some strange effects on me, being sort of a sleep walker and all. I would often wake up in the middle of the night being confused, not knowing where I was. I had to feel my bed, find the floor, the walls, the furniture, until I finally come to my senses and realize where I was. Kind of like sensory deprivation. It never happens nowadays, when I live in a city, because it never gets completely dark. Not really on topic, but thought it might be interesting, maybe others have had the same experience. I think growing up this way made me more sensitive to sounds in general, a ticking clock can keep me awake for hours...
I grew up in similar conditions, and only now that you've mentioned it, I made a connection of awaking to not knowing where you are and confused to such sensory deprivation. I don't recall that happening ever in urban areas. Quite contrary, I'm now extremely light sleeper, and wake to full awareness almost instantly. Interesting.
Just as a curiosity, did the confused episodes last long? I'm sort of a light sleeper but I also have sleep walking/talking tendencies. When I wake up in a sensory-deprivated state, it can take what seems like 5-10 minutes before I'm back to normal. It's like waking up from that dream, but having nothing contradicting the dream you just had, so my mind sort of continues the dream line of reasoning until my logical abilities catch up. Very strange feeling.
Respecting shared public space is becoming as quaintly archaic as tipping your hat to a lady, now that the concept of public space is as nearly extinct as hats, and ladies.
I am nearly driven to madness by the torrent of noise in public environments. I don't expect places full of people to be quiet, per se, but I do not understand why every such space needs to have eight screens and speakers every ten feet pumping some kind of inane music.
I spend a lot of time in airports, and I'm always amazed at how hard it is to find any space that is not subjected to either Fox/CNN or whatever insipid music they've decided would be "good for this space." I'm always grateful to find one of those ridiculous chapels that tries not to offend anyone of any religion while still being "spiritual." Because -- praise God! -- at least it's quiet.
Honestly, I just want to read and think. I respect those who would rather talk, or sing, or whatever; I can move away from that if it's bothering me. But how do you move away from environments that are deliberately designed to make sure you are never without noise?
You should never move to Brazil, lol. It's the capital of public noise and, more so, the public kind that invades the private space. Everyone accepts it and takes part in it, meaning those who want quiet are virtually nil.
Silicone keyboard skins cut down on typing noise. It's a little weird at first, but I've found them to be helpful at keeping debris out as well as being the guy typing in a meeting without people looking at me. I always bring earbuds with me wherever I go as to not be distracted by other people.
Unless I missed it, the author fails to mention the other front line in this battle: the airplane. Sure, the roar of the engines can be deafening, but the cellphone ban more than offsets that. I've found that more than anything else flying reminds me of just how productive you can be when free of distractions. Heck, the nature of productivity itself changes: instead of measuring it by how many emails you've answered, it's measured by how much progress you've made in thinking about problems or expanding your knowledge. Part of me is disappointed with the prevalence of wifi on flights now -- it was inevitable, but being put in a situation where I had no other choice but to read a book I've been meaning to read or to simply just sit and think for a few hours provided a really important ballast in maintaining sanity.
Other times you've got shrieking babies, large groups of school children on a field trip, people having inane conversations (loudly, to be heard over the background noise)... basically all the noise you could potentially find in a train car and more. Then there's the security announcements, unavoidable ads for products and the in-flight TV service... plenty of potential for distraction.
On a long flight, especially in the morning, it can be quite nice. But you also may be stuck next to the loudest baby you've ever heard, so loud that you cannot reasonably concentrate, for hours at a stretch.
Oh, the quiet car. I ride the quiet car every weekday to and from work into and out of Chicago (except ours is Metra, not Amtrak). His description of it is completely accurate. The people on the quiet car tend to be thinkers, readers, writers, and I dare say just a bit more intelligent than the average rider.
I've had the same experience before. For some reason people think the signs and the announcements don't apply to them and it just boggles my mind how much self awareness they lack! There's been a guy I've seen on the quiet car twice last week who for some reason had his iPhone at full volume and texted for the entire hour I was on the train. The problem wasn't the texting but that the iPhones clickers clackety keyboard sounds were on. Is that really necessary? And on the quiet car no less? A woman did the same thing a few weeks back. Of course no one said a word but we were all very annoyed. And then you get the oblivious guy who doesn't read signs or listen to the 3 announcements who talks on his cell the whole ride. And don't get me started on the teenagers who seem to be visiting the city for the first time and for some reason need to scream at each other despite being centimeters from each others face in a car full of completely silent people. The signs are obvious. The announcement are loud, clear, and numerous. So what the fuck, man?!
That's life now. It seems we have a whole generation of people who are just completely lacking self-awareness and have a serious problem with entitlement. But it's not young people this is specific to. I'm only 26 and I'm good on the quiet car (though I have had my moments I'll admit). There are people of all ages,miracles, and genders who behave this way and though I think humans are like this by nature anyway I also think the Internet and cell phones have made it worse. It seems like a learned behavior.
I just blamed Internet and cell phones for a portion of the world's ills. I'm going to go think about how old that makes me sound now...
"I'm good on the quiet car (though I have had my moments I'll admit). There are people of all ages,miracles, and genders who behave this way..."
You probably don't encounter the same people all the time. There's enough people out in the world such that each one can "have their moments" when they're around you, and nowhere else, and you wouldn't know the difference.
I do sympathize with you though. I've got a sound sensitivity problem, and lots of noises bug me way way way out of the ordinary compared to most peoples' tolerance. I know this isn't specifically related to quiet cars on trains, but noises in general still bug me (even my own oftentimes). I'm sometimes shocked how I can be on an airplane, with gigantic engines blowing away at tremendous force just 20 feet from me, yet a person a row ahead of me chewing gum or chowing down on pretzels penetrates in to my brain.
I hear what you're saying and you've got a point. Makes sense. But for the record, most of the people on that car I actually do see 3 to 5 times per week. So far it's been very rare for the regulars to have annoying moments. I've been keeping track for six months now.
Do you get much flak from others for your sensitivity to noise?
Some noises bother me a lot. Anything that's repetitive will annoy me to the point that I basically cannot function and get extremely angry, and it only takes a minute or two to get to that level. Sometimes sounds (and not necessarily loud ones) are physically uncomfortable.
I have similar issues with some textures (in food, clothing, etc.) and am very sensitive to smells (the cause nausea and headaches).
All my life I have been told I need to "get over" this, which I have certainly tried to do, but there seems to be only so much I can do about it. People who don't experience this level of sensitivity just think I'm being difficult and that I do this by choice. Frustrating.
as a kid I did - it was worst with family - caused a lot of bad feelings. as an adult, i can basically just walk away or leave the room, or try to compensate by controlling the conversation or doing something else to distract myself for a few moments.
I think the term is hyperacusis, but that now seems to general. I'd found a more specific term for this condition I think I have, but haven't been able to find any doctors or therapists willing to deal with it.
in my case I'm not sure I get physical discomfort - it's more mental, or at least, that's how I register it.
It's good to hear I'm not the only one out there with this condition in its more severe forms. (Not that I ever considered myself original in this regard.)
It's so difficult to communicate to others the level of my sensitivity to repeated noises (esp. oral/eating) - and the level of my sensitivity seems so flat out absurd, unjustifiable and irrational - that I've basically suppressed and internalized it as far as humanly possible and have come to consider it a best-to-be-kept secret, dogged malady.
There are very few things I wouldn't give to see myself freed of the condition. It turns what would normally be sitting down and eating dinner with my lovely significant other into a quotidian session of repressed frustration and anger at having to listen to her (oh, the humanity) chew food and handle utensils.
This diversity of opinion about what is and is not hard to tune out is fascinating.
Also 26 here. One of the great shortcomings of youth is not being able to understand that other people can be fundamentally different. Not better, not worse. Just different. This is something I'm only truly beginning to appreciate lately.
I had never realized until this thread that people could find typing annoying. Well, theoretically I mean I understood you could think "Oh that's annoying" and get on with life. But not the overwhelming, consuming pathos here.
Maybe the problem is less a lack of self-awareness and a serious problem with entitlement. Maybe the problem is this:
Their awareness of self leads them to different conclusions about what is and is not annoying. They don't see themselves as doing anything more entitled than breathing, because other people's typing bothers them about as much as your breathing.
While we're on this subject, a related rant/question:
Why are so many people so totally oblivious to so many announcements, signs, and otherwise?
You've all seen it: Boarding a plane, for example. "Ladies, and Gentlemen, we're boarding rows 1 - 5 now. Thanks." And as sure as Spring, there will _always_ be someone from row 324 who gets in line. The staff are far more polite than I'd be: "Sir, we're boarding rows 1 - 5. You're in row 324. I literally just made this announcement four seconds ago." And still, more people from other rows will attempt to board.
This happens endlessly, everywhere. "Please don't stand here." Someone will stand here. "Please step forward if you have a yellow ticket." Someone will say "But nobody called the yellow tickets?"
Perhaps I'm too attentive or perhaps I shouldn't be annoyed by this, but I am and I am.
My guess? There's no disincentive to ignore signs.
If you get in line for rows 1-5, and your ticket reads 324, your worst case scenario is standing in line until they call your rows. The best case scenario is guaranteed luggage space and convenience.
I think you greatly under-estimate people's economic or opportunistic sense of a good chance to get guaranteed luggage space and enough space around them to take off jackets, sweaters and whatever else they might need to feel comfortable sitting down on a plane.
You have trains with quiet cars? That sounded neat at first, until I realized that everyone where I live is quiet on the train anyways so it isn't a problem.
They may be quiet but I'm not sure it compares with the quiet car. On the quiet car, when all goes well, it is 100% silent. No one talks and there's just no noise at all. If your train of thought is broken for a moment and you take in the silence it's almost eerie. That's why even the slightest noise like someone typing can become so disturbing. I don't know, maybe the people on your train really are that quiet but I hope you get to experience a quiet car someday to know for sure because it really is great.
That describes pretty much every train I've been on in Austria, oh sometimes there is noise but it's the exception rather than the norm. The other strange thing is often people will rather stand than sit next to someone else. Coming from Canada where it is normal to have loud conversation from all directions on public transportation I found it a huge surprise but am overall a fan. Nice for reading or thinking.
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[ 3.2 ms ] story [ 280 ms ] threadIronic, in that what he was trying to communicate was some concepts regarding recognizing the moral reality of those around him, when, in fact, he was one of those clueless types who likely hadn't considered the possibility that his whacking-away at his keyboard was really annoying others.
As to why the "riff-raff" tend to be a little more considerate on public transport - One reason is usually because you don't want to piss somebody off and get a punch to the head. They tend to play things a little more roughly on Oakland public transport than they do on Amtrak.
On a positive note, it does a good job of showing how our perception of quiet can be different. I love going out into the nearby woods where you can't hear noise from the cars and trucks that make up so much of our town's noise. It's amazing how a plane going overhead seems so loud after being in the quiet for a few hours.
It's also pretty amazing how your ears adapt and if you choose to spend the night in the forest, you hear every small animal that scurries about.
Whenever I come across someone typing loudly in public, I am reminded of this scene from Up in the Air:
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZ7EUCBxc9s
I think that was his point.
In reality, he's probably a jerk that ignores others.
[1] http://www.thepaincomics.com/
This 'condition' is often exacerbated when you realize thinking is less "work" for you than it is the average person.
I totally support the quiet coaches. However, they do come loaded with the risk of confrontation between the quiet and the noisy, which is far more disturbing than mere hubbub.
I can filter out 50% of the noise at work, because it probably doesn't apply to me.
I can filter out 10% of the noise at home, because if my wife is talking or our cats are meowing, it's almost certainly directed at me.
IMO the only advantage of working from home is that you can control all those free variables that make you distracted: E.g. Get a quiet study where you tell your wife, cat(s) etc that you cannot/will not be distracted during work hours. Doing that at work can be tried but depending on the work place, may not be kosher.
I personally prefer working in the library. I have been most productive doing that back in school and sorely miss it.
Well, sojacques already addressed the cat point, so they only thing I have to add is that I live in Manhattan, in a very spacious place by our standards, but one that doesn't really come with a study - not unless I wanted to tear down everything in the closet, toss my wife's things into a box, and have a space the size of a desk to work in :P
* Americans speak louder than other people
* Something about the American accent means spoken American travels further and more piercingly than other languages
* People expect Americans to be louder, so there's massive selection bias at work...
Having travelled long and far, I suspect it's all three...
And where does one draw the line.. someone would call for a quieter car.
Interesting read but doesn't suggest anything other than it is hard to find silence in public places.
I am adversely effected by all manor of sensory offence — including motion in my peripheral, heat, smells, unpredictable vibration.
The real problem is that it's a downward spiral: if something is bothering me and I become agitated, I am far more likely to become aware of other things which conspire to keep me from being productive. Ultimately, I fall into a state of manic anxiety and get really down on myself for feeling so ineffective.
I really wish I could just put in earplugs. They irritate my ears.
I too would love for a few breakthroughs to make it possible to do one-time correctional procedures for stuff like this.
It can be just as loud as people talking and (IMHO) can be harder to tune out. After all, we're used to hearing people talk all the time.
Oh and while I'm in the mood for ranting, people who eat with their mouths open--particularly when it's something crunchy--or who slurp in any way are going to be first up against the wall when the revolution comes.
I don't catch long distance trains in the US at all. I sometimes take the subway but more often than not you're just standing for 10-15 minutes. In Germany, I don't recall having a lot of problems with noise (although, on one train back from Oberhausen, the smoke was so thick you couldn't see one window from the other in a very Cheech and Chong moment). England varied but was generally fine.
What I'm not looking forward to is when cellphones become usable on planes because you know someone is going to sit there and talk loudly for the entire flight.
One tip though: my Bose noise cancelling headphones are worth their weight in gold.
This would work especially well if your boss is willing to spring for quiet keyboards for them, and if they're willing to use 'em.
I'm sorry, from those of us who type loud, to all of you.
Anyone starting a Kickstart project for a better system can have my money.
[1]: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/chill/id421696351?mt=12
No need to reinvent the wheel: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00009LI4K
"you cannot hear what anyone is saying unless they shout, and even then, it is difficult to understand them." http://www.amazon.com/review/R20X9DNAJC9ZX3/
"I use to study while my 2 year old screams her head off (as long as someone else is watching her of course!)." http://www.amazon.com/review/R29TUUYEQY98W9/
"I use them while doing research in a library. It's unbroken silence despite screaming kids and adults talking into their cellphones. People no longer understand proper behavior in a library, but I don't care. I can't hear them. It's wonderful." http://www.amazon.com/review/RQBNEZ9CX3O19/
The pair I have are effective enough at cutting out most noise that they're basically earplugs even with no music on and I can wear them for entire trans-atlantic/pacific flights.
Where I am (Australia) OH&S regulations say workplace noise louder than 85dB averaged over 8hrs requires the employer to provide hearing protection[2]. The cabin of a 747 in flight is often louder than that, and for me it's usually a 13 or 14hr flight, so not using some form of hearing protection is almost certainly doing damage. But the best reason to wear protection is that I get off at the end of a 12+hr flight much more relaxed than when I don't have earplugs.
[1] big "DJ style" headphones with the cushions that surround/seal around the entire ear. [2] I've heard, but never seen any actual evidence, that airlines operating in Australia have negotiated exemptions from the standard OH&S rules which would require cabin staff to fly wearing hearing protection.
That said, holy hell I can't stand the sound. Nothing will make me flee a place faster than listening to someone slurp their food as they shovel it into their gaping maw.
Now, whats your point?
"Welcome back to the land of the Puritans," I thought to myself.
Does this happen in a jovial manner, or people really take serious offence to simple inconveniences?
The problem is that if you don't like it, you really don't like it. Meanwhile, if you don't mind it, people who do seem like jerks.
Imagine something more universally recognized as rude. E.g. Eating with someone who keeps making really smelly farts or picking his nose all the time. The disgust is visceral, and hard to rationalize away.
It's more like how you say it. "Hey Buddy, if you don't stop slurping, I am going to chew and then open my mouth wide to show you my handiwork." is very different from "I am leaving. You are so rude."
> The disgust is visceral, and hard to rationalize away.
The keyword is "friend" - someone who you can talk to; asking him not to do that as it is making you uncomfortable should be pretty easy.
After spending some time in Taiwan, I found myself slurping tea and hot pot by default. I came to realize slurping has it's advantages – in particular, you don't burn your lips and tongue on hot liquids.
Although I've re-Westernized when it comes to not slurping food, I do still slurp tea. Apparently, I'm not alone in thinking it's the best way to drink it. From the LA Times:
To taste tea, you must slurp it loudly, because tea needs oxygen to release its flavor. "Can we make some noise?" Spillane urged those who were drinking too politely. "You need to spray your entire mouth and draw air in with the tea to get a proper taste."
Slurping also makes it possible to drink very hot liquid without burning the mouth, and tea is at its best when hot. As it cools, it loses flavor.
http://articles.latimes.com/1998/aug/19/food/fo-14378
Slurping sounds generally annoy me, but I'll admit I slurp that first sip of coffee because I'm never quite sure exactly how hot it will be.
I think it's the repetition more than the actual slurp that bothers me, though. Any repetitive sound can send me into a rage after about a minute.
People generally talk loud enough to happily hear each other over any background noise. They tend not to notice, either.
As such, when businesspeople consider the quiet car somewhere for meetings because everywhere else has noise, everyone in the car hears exactly what they are discussing.
My iMac at work has a nearly silent keyboard and it drives me up the walls, being so used to developing in my spare time on a loud machine.
This is must be a somewhat American problem. I once was at a Cheescake factory there, where it was so loud we could hardly talk with each other. We hypothesized that they do this for a higher turnover.
The people in the Amtrak trains, subways or buses did not bother me -- it was more the screeching noises those old relics made. I would be extremely annoyed by music in a library though.
I can (anecdotally) confirm that many places do this. One place where my friend worked adjusted the background music volume based on the wait time, and I know of several restaurants by me where the waitresses will say that the music goes up as the place gets busy to persuade people to leave after eating.
And therefore you drink more.
I've heard that the loudness in restaurants isn't meant to increase turnover - it's actually used to attract people to the restaurant. The average restaurant-goer in NYC seems to have an aversion to places that are quiet enough to carry on a normal conversation. They apparently find the noisy environment to be stimulating and exciting. There are even special sound systems designed for restaurants that amplify certain components of the ambient noise if the natural acoustics of the room aren't noisy enough.
I agree there are many loud restaurants in Manhattan, but that is mostly a factor of the bar and/or a large space (e.g., Buddakan). Look for places not trying to attract attention (a full curtain on the window, rather than trying to advertise their popularity / bar scene).
My main point was probably that Manhattan != NYC. :)
Surely you must be joking?
I actually don't mind typing: to me, it sounds like ideas. It's also regular enough to become part of the background, whereas something like music isn't, because it's too variable.
>my Bose noise cancelling headphones are worth their weight in gold.
I'm going to be that obnoxious guy: Amazon lists Bose QC 15s (the model I have) as 7.4 ounces. The spot-price for gold right now is about $1,700 per ounce. Are they really worth $12,580?
I hate to be the other obnoxious guy that responds to the self proclaimed obnoxious guy, but I see the quite a bit lately, even paraded in XKCD. Is there a significant group of people that absolutely abhors all rhetorical figures of speech? Or is it only specific ones, such as metaphors and hyperbole, with simile being mostly OK? Just curious.
In medical circles it would be called "learning disability".
On a more serious note though, mocking people who use a lot of metaphors is a good way to try to make yourself look intellectually superior. I see it a lot these days and I find it very passive aggressive. Back in school people making those kinds of comments would be called smartasses and have their asses kicked for using that kind of language.
Could be a symptom of being a plain old nitwit, too, but not being a psychologist I wouldn't have any insight to offer beyond that.
I think the question is this: does a rhetorical figure of speech help the reader or writer see the things being compared or figurized in a new way? If the answer is no, then perhaps we should look at those rhetorical things as literal, in order to remind ourselves of the power of rhetoric.
I favor metaphors and hyperbole like politicians favor hand-shaking and baby-kissing. But it to be done well.
Your own little "Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra" moment.
Our minds are amazing machines.
"By using stale metaphors, similes, and idioms, you save much mental effort, at the cost of leaving your meaning vague, not only for your reader but for yourself. This is the significance of mixed metaphors. The sole aim of a metaphor is to call up a visual image. When these images clash -- as in The Fascist octopus has sung its swan song, the jackboot is thrown into the melting pot -- it can be taken as certain that the writer is not seeing a mental image of the objects he is naming; in other words he is not really thinking. "
"Never use a metaphor, simile, or other figure of speech which you are used to seeing in print."
Deal with that one.
I use a ThinkPad that has a noisy keyboard. When I type on a Macbook Pro, my typing is silent. The noise in my case is because of keyboard design, not because of my typing force, I prefer the audible feedback. If I'm in a shared space where all I can hear is my typing, I try not to type.
I have slight breathing problems due to a small nasal passage. When I eat, I sometimes have to breathe through my mouth. I try not to, because eating with your mouth open is considered rude.
Here in France all train cars are "quiet cars" and most people respect that.
Sometimes you come across somebody who insists on talking on their cellphone while seated (you're supposed to make your calls on the "platform" which is the space between cars), but it's rare and usually doesn't last.
I wish it were true... I took the train last week and was in the same wagon as 4 "rednecks" who ate their lunch while drinking wine, chewing loudly and laughing. The whole wagon could hear what they were talking about. The SNCF employees didn't even care... I am a regular train user and it is unfortunately pretty frequent occurrence.
(I've visiting from my laptop. Assuming mobile version probably doesn't look the same.)
Author Tim Kreider may be better known by some of us Internet folk as purveyor of the fine web-comic "The Pain": http://thepaincomics.com/
Without taking an objective measure of the decibels involved you might just be giving in to a stereotype?
Me, I find Buenos Aires to be particularly loud, but it's only occasionally people (usually groups of cacerolaceros, other piqueteros, or football fans); mostly it's the huge superchargers on the buses, the garbage trucks, the pneumatic actuators on the buses without silencers installed, the motorcycles without mufflers installed, the cumbia villera from the cellphones, and so on. In fact, the only louder city I've ever traveled to was Lima.
Ignorance is no excuse for being loud repeatedly after this is pointed out but I almost always travel in the quiet car and have found that conductors only infrequently make announcements explaining that the car has special rules-perhaps 25% of the trips I've taken.
I cannot blame someone for missing the sign that says, "Quiet Car" but I can place some responsibility on Amtrak for not making the quiet car and the rules that go along with it more obvious.
There will always be the people that do not feel the rules apply to them but most of the loud people I encounter in the quiet car did not realize where they were.
<p itemprop="articleBody"> We’re a tribe, we quiet ones, we readers and thinkers and letter writers, we daydreamers and gazers out of windows. We are a civil people, courteous to excess, who disdain displays of anger as childish and embarrassing. But the Quiet Car is our territory, the last reservation to which we’ve been driven. And we can be pushed too far. Our message to the barbarians who would barge in on our haven with their chatter and blatting gadgets like so many bulldozers is: <span style="color:#fff;"><em>#@$%&!</em></span> </p>
"shhh" == "fuck you" in the quiet car
The "message" at the end of the article was a graphic of a finger over a pair of lips. Presumably from the description in the article it is Amtrak's "Quiet Car" logo.
No idea how or why it ended up the way it did online.
I'm not saying that Here It Is, The Reason Suburban Living Is Better Than Anything Anywhere. I'm just saying, if you're one of those people who just can't imagine what anyone would find appealing about the lifestyle, but were also nodding your head in agreement with this piece... now you can.
Tokyo has a lot of these. It doesn't have a single "downtown", but rather a large number of busy centers, usually around railroad stations, and in many parts of central Tokyo, the "infill" between these is residential single-family housing or small apartment buildings. In many of those areas, streets are very narrow and windy, there's very little automobile traffic (people walk or bicycle), and it's often very quiet, to the point where one can sometimes hear people talking inside houses while walking down the street...
All is fine and dandy until one of those stupid delivery trucks shows up near my building at 6am blaring "Hidari e magarimasu, gochuui kudasai. Hidari e magarimasu, gochuui kudasai. Hidari e magarimasu, gochuui kudasai". For people unfamiliar with Japan, various trucks here are not only equipped with visual (light based) turn signals, but audio based ones as well. This means that whenever they are taking a turn, they are blaring from their speakers "Turning left, please be careful. Turning left, please be careful" ad nauseam.
Seriously, is that really necessary? Not to mention trucks with loudspeakers playing loud music promoting new bands and what not. I find Tokyo to be anything but a quiet city.
To make things worse, sound proofing is so terrible in Japanese houses and buildings (construction standards are really poor here compared to the ones we have in the west), that despite living on the 6th floor I can often make out contents of the conversations of loud drunk groups returning from izakayas at 1am.
But it's all concentrated on east-west streets (in my area). I live less than a block up from the main artery, and it's completely silent here. Ground floor apartment, window onto the street.
All in all, this is the same amount of noise I grew up hearing in a quiet suburban neighborhood.
Nowhere has the noise gotten to me like in suburbia. Two words: leaf blowers.
Worse! They blew everything directly into the bicycle parking row! Years' worth of dirt on my bike in one minute. Debris and filth in all the works. Earthworms. Had to completely detail the whole bike.
Meanwhile, leaves are some of the best compost available. Why do we blow them noisomely to rot on the "unused" areas of the pavement (i.e., bike parking, bike lanes)?
-- QFT
I spend a lot of time in airports, and I'm always amazed at how hard it is to find any space that is not subjected to either Fox/CNN or whatever insipid music they've decided would be "good for this space." I'm always grateful to find one of those ridiculous chapels that tries not to offend anyone of any religion while still being "spiritual." Because -- praise God! -- at least it's quiet.
Honestly, I just want to read and think. I respect those who would rather talk, or sing, or whatever; I can move away from that if it's bothering me. But how do you move away from environments that are deliberately designed to make sure you are never without noise?
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Other times you've got shrieking babies, large groups of school children on a field trip, people having inane conversations (loudly, to be heard over the background noise)... basically all the noise you could potentially find in a train car and more. Then there's the security announcements, unavoidable ads for products and the in-flight TV service... plenty of potential for distraction.
On a long flight, especially in the morning, it can be quite nice. But you also may be stuck next to the loudest baby you've ever heard, so loud that you cannot reasonably concentrate, for hours at a stretch.
I've had the same experience before. For some reason people think the signs and the announcements don't apply to them and it just boggles my mind how much self awareness they lack! There's been a guy I've seen on the quiet car twice last week who for some reason had his iPhone at full volume and texted for the entire hour I was on the train. The problem wasn't the texting but that the iPhones clickers clackety keyboard sounds were on. Is that really necessary? And on the quiet car no less? A woman did the same thing a few weeks back. Of course no one said a word but we were all very annoyed. And then you get the oblivious guy who doesn't read signs or listen to the 3 announcements who talks on his cell the whole ride. And don't get me started on the teenagers who seem to be visiting the city for the first time and for some reason need to scream at each other despite being centimeters from each others face in a car full of completely silent people. The signs are obvious. The announcement are loud, clear, and numerous. So what the fuck, man?!
That's life now. It seems we have a whole generation of people who are just completely lacking self-awareness and have a serious problem with entitlement. But it's not young people this is specific to. I'm only 26 and I'm good on the quiet car (though I have had my moments I'll admit). There are people of all ages,miracles, and genders who behave this way and though I think humans are like this by nature anyway I also think the Internet and cell phones have made it worse. It seems like a learned behavior.
I just blamed Internet and cell phones for a portion of the world's ills. I'm going to go think about how old that makes me sound now...
You probably don't encounter the same people all the time. There's enough people out in the world such that each one can "have their moments" when they're around you, and nowhere else, and you wouldn't know the difference.
I do sympathize with you though. I've got a sound sensitivity problem, and lots of noises bug me way way way out of the ordinary compared to most peoples' tolerance. I know this isn't specifically related to quiet cars on trains, but noises in general still bug me (even my own oftentimes). I'm sometimes shocked how I can be on an airplane, with gigantic engines blowing away at tremendous force just 20 feet from me, yet a person a row ahead of me chewing gum or chowing down on pretzels penetrates in to my brain.
Some noises bother me a lot. Anything that's repetitive will annoy me to the point that I basically cannot function and get extremely angry, and it only takes a minute or two to get to that level. Sometimes sounds (and not necessarily loud ones) are physically uncomfortable.
I have similar issues with some textures (in food, clothing, etc.) and am very sensitive to smells (the cause nausea and headaches).
All my life I have been told I need to "get over" this, which I have certainly tried to do, but there seems to be only so much I can do about it. People who don't experience this level of sensitivity just think I'm being difficult and that I do this by choice. Frustrating.
I think the term is hyperacusis, but that now seems to general. I'd found a more specific term for this condition I think I have, but haven't been able to find any doctors or therapists willing to deal with it.
in my case I'm not sure I get physical discomfort - it's more mental, or at least, that's how I register it.
It's so difficult to communicate to others the level of my sensitivity to repeated noises (esp. oral/eating) - and the level of my sensitivity seems so flat out absurd, unjustifiable and irrational - that I've basically suppressed and internalized it as far as humanly possible and have come to consider it a best-to-be-kept secret, dogged malady.
There are very few things I wouldn't give to see myself freed of the condition. It turns what would normally be sitting down and eating dinner with my lovely significant other into a quotidian session of repressed frustration and anger at having to listen to her (oh, the humanity) chew food and handle utensils.
Also 26 here. One of the great shortcomings of youth is not being able to understand that other people can be fundamentally different. Not better, not worse. Just different. This is something I'm only truly beginning to appreciate lately.
I had never realized until this thread that people could find typing annoying. Well, theoretically I mean I understood you could think "Oh that's annoying" and get on with life. But not the overwhelming, consuming pathos here.
Maybe the problem is less a lack of self-awareness and a serious problem with entitlement. Maybe the problem is this:
Their awareness of self leads them to different conclusions about what is and is not annoying. They don't see themselves as doing anything more entitled than breathing, because other people's typing bothers them about as much as your breathing.
Why are so many people so totally oblivious to so many announcements, signs, and otherwise?
You've all seen it: Boarding a plane, for example. "Ladies, and Gentlemen, we're boarding rows 1 - 5 now. Thanks." And as sure as Spring, there will _always_ be someone from row 324 who gets in line. The staff are far more polite than I'd be: "Sir, we're boarding rows 1 - 5. You're in row 324. I literally just made this announcement four seconds ago." And still, more people from other rows will attempt to board.
This happens endlessly, everywhere. "Please don't stand here." Someone will stand here. "Please step forward if you have a yellow ticket." Someone will say "But nobody called the yellow tickets?"
Perhaps I'm too attentive or perhaps I shouldn't be annoyed by this, but I am and I am.
Just yesterday I noticed that a single bus door had SIXTEEN warning signs on it. I dare suggest that nobody else noticed any of them that day.
If you get in line for rows 1-5, and your ticket reads 324, your worst case scenario is standing in line until they call your rows. The best case scenario is guaranteed luggage space and convenience.
People who have just arrived at the gate, and are a bit confused, and also afraid of missing the plane. Is this the last call?
Especially when you are rushing for your 4th connecting flight on a 30 hours trip.
I think you greatly under-estimate people's economic or opportunistic sense of a good chance to get guaranteed luggage space and enough space around them to take off jackets, sweaters and whatever else they might need to feel comfortable sitting down on a plane.
Ah, Dora the Explorer generation...